Keep it runningWhen he becomes manager and drives up to the front door and just throws his keys to nobody
Television The Office, US Version
- Thread starter Wittmann45
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Same with How I Met Your Mother. No one needs to point out that Barney is a psychopath, but it’s worth highlighting how much of a dick Ted or Lilly is since we’re supposed to like them.
Boboddy...boboddy...what does the first B stand for?When he becomes manager and drives up to the front door and just throws his keys to nobody
Creed's part of some of the most memorable scenes tbf.When he becomes manager and drives up to the front door and just throws his keys to nobody
Running away from that murder mystery game, failing to recall what he did, not knowing names of colleagues, etc.
Yea exactly, or basically every character in Entourage being a prick.
two sides of a coin
-Although he flirted with Pam, and wanted her, clearly, he left the place because he couldnt have her.
-One of the eps says he has one of the best sales in the company
-Yeah, what he did with Karen was shitty, cos Karen was awesome.
-was this as co-manager or after it?
-The house thing, tbf, was before he got married
-Yeah thats a dick move.
Maybe cos its ongoing for me that im watching, and not reflecting, but Jim isnt somebody I hate or think is a total dick.
Also, creed is hilarious.
Asian Jim btw, is a great scene.
Asian Jim btw, is a great scene.
Angela is a thundercnut, has no redeeming qualities at all. Being nice for 5 minutes at the very end doesn’t make up for it.
Always find it weird that Jim has a good sales record since we never see him doing anything to justify it.
We have seen Phyllis, Stanley and Dwight work far harder to get sales and see the rapport they build up with client When we see Michael for all good faults freaking with clients he does appear to be really good at Sales
The only time I can remember Jim working hard was when Ryan was threatening his job and then he had to beg the client to the point of harassment.
Even then it was probably more down to Andy and Kevin that day at the golf course.
It is true what has been said that he will stand out as a bad person the more you watch it simply because he is portrayed as the hero of the show.
We have seen Phyllis, Stanley and Dwight work far harder to get sales and see the rapport they build up with client When we see Michael for all good faults freaking with clients he does appear to be really good at Sales
The only time I can remember Jim working hard was when Ryan was threatening his job and then he had to beg the client to the point of harassment.
Even then it was probably more down to Andy and Kevin that day at the golf course.
It is true what has been said that he will stand out as a bad person the more you watch it simply because he is portrayed as the hero of the show.
He has the day with Dwight as well when they apparently used to be a really good team together.
It'd be a pretty dull show as well if we kept seeing Jim make sales. In fact I recall Gervais saying that was part of the premise of the Office. They're selling possibly one of the most boring things ever (which both Tim in the UK and Jim in the US version mention.)
I'm re-watching currently and just watched the episode where he messes up quality control at the Mill and gets Debbie Brown fired for it. He has a whip round for her and pockets the money and throws the card awayWhen he becomes manager and drives up to the front door and just throws his keys to nobody
He's by far my favourite character in it, everything he does cracks me up.Some very introspective moment too amongst the comedy. Like when Michael is the only one to turn up at Pams Art show.
Another moment is when Michael chooses the company over Jan in the dispute because they both fecked him over, but he says you expect the company to feck you over.
Terrific show really.
Another moment is when Michael chooses the company over Jan in the dispute because they both fecked him over, but he says you expect the company to feck you over.
Terrific show really.
I think all the characters are great and all of them have their moments across the 9 seasons. That's why it's such a great show.
Same as Parks and Rec
Same as Parks and Rec
I'm re-watching currently and just watched the episode where he messes up quality control at the Mill and gets Debbie Brown fired for it. He has a whip round for her and pockets the money and throws the card away
Was there a scene where he pretty much confessed to killing the real Creed ?
I think the whole point about Jim's sales record is that it's not actually that hard for them to have decent sales figures. The only person in Scranton that outperforms him is Dwight, but they repeatedly acknowledge that Dwight has ridiculous sales figures and show on multiple occasions that he would probably quite literally die for Dunder Mifflin.
Stanley is incredibly lazy and doesn't work any harder than he has to, and he's also a bit of an elder statesmen there, so he probably gets by on the same set of clients. Phyllis is basically a shy old lady to start with, and then she flips to being this slightly batshit old lady. Andy is just shite at his job, and is repeatedly shown to make terrible decisions and say the worst thing possible. It's not hard to see how Jim outperforms all of them.
We don't see any of the characters do much actual work because that would make for a very boring show. Jim is basically incredibly apathetic to his job, but doesn't know what else to do, so he does enough to pay the bills and not be flagged up for performance issues, and goofs off the rest of the time. We see that Karen is pretty much comparable to Jim in terms of performance and attitude (with her being more inclined to stay with the company), which is how they both end up in the running for the job at corporate that Ryan ends up getting.
You can't compare anyone to Michael because the entire point of his character is that no one really understands how he gets any results. He's incredibly lazy, monumentally stupid, and has almost no idea how to read social cues, but somehow has an amazing sales record and an office of employees that perform well enough, despite many not taking him at all seriously. There's even that episode where David Wallace wants to find out what Michael's secret is, and it becomes apparent very quickly that Michael doesn't even know how he's good at his job.
There were a couple of occasions where you see Jim work hard (or at least care about his job), of which the golf sale is one, but I'm not sure you can put the golf course sale down to Kevin and Andy when Kevin spent the whole time making stupid bets, and Andy literally turned up with gloves full of vaseline and drove his golf buggy into a bunker.
Jim and Pam (moreso Jim) are the "normal" people in the office. Oscar a little as well, which is why they have the "coalition of reason" together. Pretty much everyone else is a very exagerrated personality type turned into a person.
I'm sure there was an episode where it was said at least half the clients of the office were originally signed up by Michael so I would assume he have the best ones to Jim when he became manager as he always wants to be friends with Jim more than Dwight.
Michael has his big rolodex of client notes that Dwight has during the Michael Scott Paper Company phase, where literally every note means don't talk about this thing:
"Green means go. So I know to go ahead and shut up about it. Orange, means orange you glad you didn't bring it up. Most colors mean don't say it."
I seem to remember that he kept a fair amount of clients for himself, because he ends up giving them to Andy when he leaves and Andy loses pretty much all of them.
Those were two great Michael moments for completely different reasons.
I also liked the "DID I STUTTER' but with Stanley and Michael.
Good point this. Michael has some redeeming features. I see him as a bit of a tragic character.
From series 2 onwards he's shown as a nice enough guy just an idiot really. He usually wants what's best for the staff and does care for them (gives Jim advice about pam, pams art show etc) it's not like Brent who has almost no redeeming qualities
That was US Tv bosses who made them make him more likeable and acceptable to US audiences
I'm re-watching The Office at the same time that I'm watching The Wire for the first time.
When Idris turns up in The Office, my head just immediately thought of Stringer, and then vice versa.
Erin.
I hear it was Ricky Gervais who suggested that they needed to make that change. He's a better character for it.
Probably I'm sure he knew it would work better in US i know him and Merchant did advise to make Jim and Pam the heart of the show from the start
Andy was always my favourite until they decided to do a complete 180 on his character and just change everything about him. When Andy starts to become a dick is usually when I stop watching. Will never forget how they massacred my boy.
Yeah different writers and Mindy Kaling and BJ Novak were leaving too and they wrote a lot of episodes during the peak years.
Still could be worse they were really going to have Jim and Pam divorce which no matter what you think of them having them split would have ruined tge show
And best for himself especially the relationships he has. Jan was ugh, but Holly was great.
S1-3 great. 4-5 good. After that, it was okay. Mainly got by on the love you had already built for the characters.
Speaking of heartfelt moments. I loved when Jim comforted Dwight when Angela got engaged to Andy. I just wish Jim had stayed when Dwight turned to hug!
I also loved how, when Jim was trying to repay Dwight for saving him against Pam's ex, and Dwight wasn't having any of it, he sees his fling with Angela and tells the camera that him keeping shush will be his way of repaying him.
I love the more serious/emotional moments in this show.
Speaking of heartfelt moments. I loved when Jim comforted Dwight when Angela got engaged to Andy. I just wish Jim had stayed when Dwight turned to hug!
I also loved how, when Jim was trying to repay Dwight for saving him against Pam's ex, and Dwight wasn't having any of it, he sees his fling with Angela and tells the camera that him keeping shush will be his way of repaying him.
I love the more serious/emotional moments in this show.
I agree with the consensus that Jim is a bit of a knob, but I think after trying to paint him as the super good guy for a few seasons, the show became aware that he's a dick. Charles Miner having none of his shit was probably the start. I like the bit when they visit the pre-school, and the guy there verbally bitchslaps Jim and Pam when he says "maybe you're not as charming as you think you are". That sums up their whole story arc. I think Dwight becomes more likable after this period too, particularly once the Dwight/Andy/Angela affair is out of the way.
Pam is more likable than Jim overall for me, but I thought the episode where she gets a new job and a payrise illegitimately was a strange turn for her character. I think it's a major plothole of the whole mockumentary gimmick too, since she goes through the whole - fraudulent - process infront of the camera crew. Though the mocumentary set-up really starts to crumble after the first 2-3 seasons anyway. Plot holes galore.
Pam is more likable than Jim overall for me, but I thought the episode where she gets a new job and a payrise illegitimately was a strange turn for her character. I think it's a major plothole of the whole mockumentary gimmick too, since she goes through the whole - fraudulent - process infront of the camera crew. Though the mocumentary set-up really starts to crumble after the first 2-3 seasons anyway. Plot holes galore.
They did a 180 with a few characters.
Andy was almost Michael Lite, in that he was a bit of a buffoon that just wanted people to like him, and they turned him into some power mad dickhead that didn't care about anyone but himself.
Phyllis was very shy and unassuming, and they made her some crazy, bitchy mafia-wife.
Erin's happened very early on, but she went from being socially awkward and naive to a straight up moron.
They also decided that Jim was suddenly this uncaring arsehole at the end, which led to that shite sound guy storyline.
It would never work really as a mocumentary for many reasons. Dwight would be fired once it aired for basically screwing the company out of money by firing Pam and Jim (and he'd also be fired/in prison for having weapons in the office, being on camera willing to petrol bomb another company building etc), they're all shown as pretty unemployable throughout the show as well.
With the Jim stuff I think it's meant to be he's a normal guy and we're looking at it thinking how he puts up with these people, agan as the show goes further on they exaggerate his character a bit and it probably makes him slightly worse of a person.
Regarding Phyllis one it seems a bit of a play on the fact she's given such an unimportant role (head of party planning) and lets it get to her head almost as if she is Tony Montana or something when in reality it means very little organising parties for a small paper company. It does work quite well as a parody....I have worked in offices where they give someone the role of organising Christmas Dos/Events etc and they get really into it when the reality is no one is actually that arsed.
The Andy one is the worst the character change is to dramatic and happens just to suddenly, he goes from a dick at the start to a nice guy to being an even bigger dick than ever before then ends being a nice guy again (and has one of the best lines in the show at the end.)
Wasn’t the Andy character change a punishment for going to film the hangover?
I heard that but apparently on Pam and Angela's podcast they said it's not true and they were all supportive of him doing it.Wasn’t the Andy character change a punishment for going to film the hangover?
I think they just wanted another Michael it just didn't work at all with Andy to be honest, I think the show was coming to a natural end anyway and they were running out of ideas. Most the characters being way OTT by Series 9, even the last episode wasn't the best really, it did have some good moments though.
The earlier seasons were the best. It was a very tired and sloppy show once Michael left (which is understandable). Seasons 8 & 9 were pretty poor and were more about ‘moments’ rather than anything substantial.
They could've just ended it when Pam sees Michael off at the airport. That would've been a solid ending. Leave the documentary part of it totally ambiguous. It didn't really need wrapping up.
S8 and 9 are tough to watch. Robert California, whilst being a great character and well portrayed by James Spader, just doesn't fit in to the vibe of the show at all. Nate is one of the few bright spots of S9. Andy's story arc in the final season is just awful. The in-episode pilot of The Farm - which ended up never happening anyway - is just so jarring and weird. When I rewatch, I usually bail after S7.
S8 and 9 are tough to watch. Robert California, whilst being a great character and well portrayed by James Spader, just doesn't fit in to the vibe of the show at all. Nate is one of the few bright spots of S9. Andy's story arc in the final season is just awful. The in-episode pilot of The Farm - which ended up never happening anyway - is just so jarring and weird. When I rewatch, I usually bail after S7.
The mockumentary bit also falls apart when you consider that no channel is commissioning a show that requires seemingly 24/7 filming, in multiple locations, over the best part of a decade, so that at the end of that decade they can put out a single series of it.
Nate is great - shame he was under utilised.
Fully agree with Andy. They butchered the character. The writing was shambolic in the final couple of seasons. The whole thing with Pam and the boom guy was so stupid. Ryan and Kelly also leaving meant the show suffered too.
You can tell a show is on its last legs when it becomes a caricature of itself, and in the end they were all just walking caricatures rather than 'real' people.