So how is that turning out then? I'm struggling into to name one good performance ever since Zlatan got injured(Celta away).
The "Zlatan hinders our gameplay" brigade
- Thread starter KM
- Start date
Blessing in disguise , meh..
Whilst i don't agree with the statement, since you asked our best performance of the season was Chelsea home.
This...
Also it´s not like Jose has been playing our strongest team in the PL lately..
Close thread
Technically Chelsea was before the injury but that was some performance by us.
I'm 100% pro-Zlatan though; and his a wonderful flicks and passes in the final third make the best of Rashford, Martial and Micky, imo. It's a little frustrating that he was losing 9 of 10 sprints to defenders, but that's it.
I'm 100% pro-Zlatan though; and his a wonderful flicks and passes in the final third make the best of Rashford, Martial and Micky, imo. It's a little frustrating that he was losing 9 of 10 sprints to defenders, but that's it.
I love Ibra too, just wish Jose rotated him more with Rashford, it varies the play and both styles are effective.
I never thought Zlatan was the reason the players around him weren't performing to their full potential, I still don't. This "issue" may as well be chalked down with the Tevez or Berbatov, Chicharito or Welbeck debates now though anyway since he's clearly finished.
His hold up play and strength, gets more out of the players around him imo.
I think the arguement was that we shouldn't resign him and try to get somebody more dynamic to replace him ratther than saying we simply dont need him, but it was never my opinion.
He's sorely missed and not just because of his goals. We're just a much better team with him in our line-up. Big decision ahead regarding how we cope without him next season.
He wasn't injured for that match. Secondly, it was an exceptional performance where everybody performed to their best. It hasn't been the case since that.
Also I'm not talking about the results. I'm talking about our style. Even though we were missing chances, we were still creating feck loads. How many did we create in the last three match?
He played a role in that game to be fair but you're right in that the best of the performance came before he was subbed on.
I don't subscribe to the theory that he's a hindrance but I think we've probably missed other players more. I'd have never predicted it at the start of the season but Rojo has been a huge miss, and being without Mata and for a period Pogba was our biggest negative.
Zlatan IMO was a key part in all our chances created per game, him and Pogba too. It becomes very clear when one of them or both got absent lately how the team struggles to create.
His dropping deep to hold the ball and link up with other attacking players helped them to take dangerous positions up front and helped us in building the attack. He was the only valuable target for Pogba's long balls up front and his positioning in the box was insane. He was getting all these chances at his feet because he's always at the right place to receive the ball. He was a key part in our game plan.
Obviously this doesn't mean Rashford isn't doing a good job. He's doing great at the moments and stepped up but Zlatan's importance in our game plan would have never been clear till he becomes absent.
His only problem is he lacks pace which Caf members decide it as the most important criteria ever in any footballer !
Last edited:
He also got injured at home against Anderlecht.
My own personal opinion (when he was playing) was that a lot of the 'break down' in play came from a real lack of understanding between him and the players around him. He get criticised a lot for bad touches and passes - some were justified. A lot of the time though, he had the right idea but the other forwards were just not on the same wavelength.
My general point is, he's a quality forward and none of our other strikers seem to be anywhere near his level. I don't even need to mention to his goals.
My general point is, he's a quality forward and none of our other strikers seem to be anywhere near his level. I don't even need to mention to his goals.
There's two types of people, those who think Zlatan hinders our play and slows everything down and those who think Zlatan is the greatest player ever. The reality is somewhere in between. In games we're expecting to dominate he's great to have, I do think in more open games where there are spaces in behind the opposition it'd be better to play pace. That's why the Chelsea game was great as we played it perfectly and had the pace.
The truth is we've played pretty poorly with and without him at times, until our whole team improves overall there's not much point worrying about whether Zlatan does this or that to our play. We struggle to score goals and he's a goalscorer in fairness to him even if he does miss chances too. All strikers do this.
The truth is we've played pretty poorly with and without him at times, until our whole team improves overall there's not much point worrying about whether Zlatan does this or that to our play. We struggle to score goals and he's a goalscorer in fairness to him even if he does miss chances too. All strikers do this.
Don't disagree with what you are saying but there also has to be some context. Last few matches we haven't had much to play for, injuries, tiredness and Jose tactics esp vs Arse, Spurs and second half against Celta haven't helped.
Though i agree Zlatan is a miss, but like i mentioned above mixing it up with Rashford would have been better for us. Can't remember Jose even subbing Ibra off.
I agree with all of this. Great post. People pick up on minor but evident and immediately frustrating deficiencies like lack of pace or the occasional misplaced pass which looks bad, and then extrapolate from this to claim that Zlatan's (though this could apply to a number of players) overall value to the team is low. It's semi-understandable until those people start ironically writing off the most visible but also most pertinent of Ibrahomovic's outputs: scoring goals.
Basically, we miss him loads and it should have been immediately obvious that we were going to miss him loads.
If those are the 2 types there are more than 2 types, there's a ton of us who think he improved us without being Swedish Jesus or whatever.
For one thing it's one player at least on the team with a set of grapefruits
Zlatan created the 2nd most chances in our team (1st being Pogba) before he got injured. He is in the same league of creativity as Pogba, Mata, Hererra. There are very few strikers better than Zlatan in Jose's system, those talking about a lack of pace have no idea the requirements of a no.9. You need to be strong to hold-up play, you need to make intelligent runs, you need to create goal scoring situations out of nothing. Pace is a bonus for a no.9.
The games where we've missed Ibra and Pogba have been horrendous alright. Mata's and Rojo's absence has been less of a hindrance because their replacements aren't such a big step down in quality. I don't think they've been missed anywhere near as much as our two summer signings. Ibra, in particular, has been at the centre of all our best attacking football this season and there has been a lot of quality attacking football, despite all the draws/missed chances. And that quality attacking football has almost completely dried up since he got injured.
EDIT: I say "almost" because there has been some nice spells within games. Everyone lost their shit about the second leg of the Celta game because we were so poor in the second half but for most of the first half we actually looked quite good going forwards. That sort of football's been few and far between in Ibra's absence though.
Aye, he's a bit of a nuisance is Zlatan....the way he scores goals is so annoying....at least without him we can get our game together and score less goals. Less goal scoring is definitely the way to win more matches.
Reality of the situation was that it was naive to think this side could thrive long term this season without Zlatan but at the same time it's naive to think he's the right CF for us and someone we needed next year.
We need new CFs full stop.
We need new CFs full stop.
Not only the first half of the second leg we were all over them in the first leg too and should have won by 2-3 goals.
I'm not sure what @MemphisDepay has been smoking if he thinks there are only two types of people when it comes to Zlatan.
Zlatan aged 29 was the Swedish Jesus, but even at his age now he improved us alot and as you say, he adds some much needed balls to the side.
No, you're wrong, as you can see Martial and Rashford are scoring plentiful nowadays that the overrated oaf is injured and we've got a very fluid and quick attacking setup up front.
or something
Agreed.
He's simply a top quality centre forward. Not just a lump up front to hoof balls to like some people were thinking.
It's beyond me how ppl genuinely think he hinders our play - our attacking play has been pretty dire but Ibra is usually one of the few bright sparks that tries to make things happen.
My only issue is that he never got subbed - makes sense, especially if we're winning as we tend to sit in (hence why we always concede and draw at home) to bring on pace up top as a get out ball + make sure Ibra is slightly fresher for the next game.
My only issue is that he never got subbed - makes sense, especially if we're winning as we tend to sit in (hence why we always concede and draw at home) to bring on pace up top as a get out ball + make sure Ibra is slightly fresher for the next game.
He certainly does help with the hoofing though, these past few games have had me tearing my hair out, we don't even contest our hoof balls without him.
Mourinho doesn't trust us at set-pieces though, that's why Ibra stays on and a big reason Fellaini get so many minutes.
Judging by yesterday, the manager aint wrong.
Yeah, that was good too. Basically, when Mikhi's on top of his game we seem to miss Ibra less. Although the problem of not converting chances persists, with or without him in our team.
It is working out exactly the same. We are 6th and still trying to win the Euro Cup.
A team full of Zlatan's attitude to football and even half of his class and we'd be 10 times the team we are now.
I think Rojo is a big loss, not only because of his own performance but the general stability that he and Bailly seemed to provide. Jones and/or Smalling seem to make others around them nervous and the whole defensive unit suffers.
I don't disagree that Ibra has been a huge loss, but I do wonder how much better we might have coped if we'd had a stable defense and midfielders able and willing to play the kind of through balls that Rashford relishes. Fellaini in particular had several opportunities to play Rashford in (I think v Celta?) and instead turned back and played sideways.
You're right though, the quality attacking play has definitely dried up.
We drew many games vs poor teams with Zlatan in the team and struggled in big games away from home too. And our best game at home came withouit him in the starting XI. Arsenal at home was a very good performance too.
Our best away game of the season came without him - Celta. We created many chances and could have won with 2-3 goals. We struggled at home against them but it was the same with Zlatan against Anderlecht.
Our results in the league are worse without him but that's easy to explain: the fixtures are more difficult and we decided to give up on the league (not least because of the many drawn games against shit opposition in which Zlatan missed many chances).
All in all, I don't see any reason to think that we miss him too much, especially when we play with our best team (and we didn't vs City, Arsenal and Spurs - because of injuries and rotating).
We're going to miss him in the final. I can't understand how people called his injury a 'blessing in disguise'. 28 goals he scored for us this season and he dragged us out of the final against Southampton.
Mate you just don't understand. Zlatan doesn't have the PACE required at a top team!!!1!!1 We need to only play Rashford and Martial as they are PACEY and as we all know PACE is the only important attribute in any sport ever. Also, if he starts ahead of either of them as a striker for even a single game their development is ruined and that makes Zlatan evil!1!!
>the anti-Zlatan posters in a nutshell
>the anti-Zlatan posters in a nutshell
Apologies, missed the word 'mostly.'