This current team has huge issues...
- Thread starter Sam
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He didn't point out we started well, I don't think he's alone in feeling Chelsea were outplaying us and looking very good before the red card for Invanovic.
We don't seem to be able to control games especially when we are ahead. Far too careless at times.
So the way to discuss a game is ignore the first 30 minutes where we were superb, went 2-0 up and could have scored more, focus on a spell where Chelsea put us under pressure and pulled us back, say decisions saved us (ignoring the first sending off was completely justified and given when we were getting a foothold in the game and were through on goal to retake the lead), say we were getting battered with 11v10 (for about 5 minutes), lie and say they looked like beating us with 9 men, invent a scenario where with 11v11 they'd have definitely beat us (again, ignoring the only reason why it wasn't 11v11 is because one of their players denied one of ours a clear goalscoring opportunity, and that if they hadn't gone down to 10 we'd likely have been 3-2 up), and then top it off with a bit of griping about how shite we are?
I'd rather listen to Niall Quinn if I'm honest.
No and I never said that, I said there were things to discuss other than the result and that the thread was for that, as I said he didn't make a great opening shot of it but saying we were getting outplayed and were lucky is hardly grounds for hanging just because some don't agree, and starting well and then surrendering a two goal lead is surely a point worth discussing.
Can we seriously leave this for another day? The amount of times we've went there and been robbed by officiating is criminal enough. I think we'll come to different conclusions if we actually watch the match again. I can't see how anyone who isn't a neutral could have properly analysed that match! It was mental!
dear oh dear. big issues my arse. stamford bridge is a hell of a hard place to go to and get something. we played top stuff for 30 minutes, palyed them off the park. we sat back when they started to gain alot of posession, and then Rooney gave away a silly freekick in a dangerous area....game on.
Heads dropped a bit, we needed a leader out there and to control the ball better, we got sloppy. Cleverley found it hard going today, few passes went astray.
The amount of times we've played well and got nothing against the top 6, and once we play one or 2 below par and still win, we are immediately "fecked". calm down.
Heads dropped a bit, we needed a leader out there and to control the ball better, we got sloppy. Cleverley found it hard going today, few passes went astray.
The amount of times we've played well and got nothing against the top 6, and once we play one or 2 below par and still win, we are immediately "fecked". calm down.
My feelings exactly.
it's our possession usage that was questionable.
The team does have issues and we might not have won without the refs help, but this isn't an easy place to go and even an in form defence would've struggled to keep that attack out today. At the end of the day we've won away in the league at Stamford Bridge. Massive win for us and the positives outweight the negatives.
Absolutely delighted with the result.
As for the performance, we played well for about 20 or so minutes particularly on the break but its a bit worrying that we spent the rest of the game (until the ref murdered chelsea) parking the bus. I don't think Chelsea are that good that we need to basically stop playing and put 10 men behind the ball in our own half. I doubt Arsenal or City will do that there. Hopefully it was because of our recent defensive woes rather than a general lack belief in our abulities to match them.
But feck all of that, today was all about the result
As for the performance, we played well for about 20 or so minutes particularly on the break but its a bit worrying that we spent the rest of the game (until the ref murdered chelsea) parking the bus. I don't think Chelsea are that good that we need to basically stop playing and put 10 men behind the ball in our own half. I doubt Arsenal or City will do that there. Hopefully it was because of our recent defensive woes rather than a general lack belief in our abulities to match them.
But feck all of that, today was all about the result
People are forgetting that we are slow starters to the EPL and we always get better after xmas.
Last season we did stumble a bit in the latter stages.
Anyways, I agree with Souness's opinions today when he said United defence has been in shambles, as Jones/Smalling/Vidic is out and Vidic has been massive for us. I think we've coped well and we're still 2nd which is a good indication that we're still not at our best.
Imagine our defence getting stronger with this current line of forwards, I still think we have what it takes this season to do wonders.
How many teams in the last 10 years have dominated at Stamford Bridge for 90 minutes straight? I can't think of (m)any. It doesn't happen, so I was fully expecting Chelsea to get back into it after we went 2 goals up. In the circumstances I was happy to see United defend pretty well under immense pressure, even allowing for the goals conceded. A win at Chelsea is a fantastic result and when you throw in the away wins at Liverpool and Newcastle it is hard to complain. Especially considering United often look sluggish in the Autumn months of a season.
He didn't just not make a great opening shot of it, he continued in the same vein even when told to wise up. So given the fact his first post was bollocks, and he then compounded it all by continuing to spout bollocks, I'd say the fact that he was told he was talking bollocks is just about fair. In my opinion, obviously.
We were brilliant on the break in the first 15 minutes but after 2-0 we stopped playing football (happens so often with United). It took some time for Chelsea to recover from the initial shock so we were still quite comfortable up to the minute mark or so.
After that, Chelsea completely dominated the game right up until the first red card. Constantly giving the ball away and committing stupid, stupid fouls could have been our downfall quite easily, if not for that delightful Van Persie pass to Young out of nothing. I still don't get why referees blow for a foul every time a defender runs behind the attacker who falls over but I'm glad he did this time.
I'd still say it's worrying that we fecked up a two goal lead and needed to rely on two red cards to get us out of jail. We really should be a lot better at controlling games though at least our matches cannot be called boring this season. That's good.
After that, Chelsea completely dominated the game right up until the first red card. Constantly giving the ball away and committing stupid, stupid fouls could have been our downfall quite easily, if not for that delightful Van Persie pass to Young out of nothing. I still don't get why referees blow for a foul every time a defender runs behind the attacker who falls over but I'm glad he did this time.
I'd still say it's worrying that we fecked up a two goal lead and needed to rely on two red cards to get us out of jail. We really should be a lot better at controlling games though at least our matches cannot be called boring this season. That's good.
I don't think it's been too true in recent years. Mourinho's raised the bar and we've realised we need to start better to make sure we don't fall behind. I don't quite have the same 95/96, 96/97, 2002/03 even 2001/02 (when we didn't win anything eventually) feel in recent years. It's far more even.
Obviously I hope we improve certain elements. Certainly at the back once we have more options. We'll come unstuck eventually if we don't get that right.
I thought we defended pretty terribly and looked panic-stricken to a man. They very nearly scored about 5 times before Mata's free-kick.
I am so fecking disappointed the last 25 years, we have been useless in the leagur, Champions league and the FA cup, we lost the league last seasonby a huge margin. THis year we have no chance getting out our Champions league group, and we are miles off the pace in the league. I hope we get relegated so we have a chance to win the championship
Perhaps it looked panic-stricken, but that was mostly because Carrick and Cleverley offered very little protection so most of our defending was last-ditch in our penalty area. Evans and Ferdinand stood strong and Rafael had a great game. It's no surprise to me that Chelsea had chances today, I'm sure they will against most teams. They had so much of the ball after we went 2-0 up that I feel we did fine in the circumstances - both goals were hard to stop (allowing for Rooney's foul).
I see it the opposite way. Carrick and Cleverley got overrun for a while but that's the part I think is expected and understandable against Chelsea's packed midfield and brilliant attacking midfielders. Less acceptable was us looking totally shambolic at corner after corner for about 15 minutes.
If we won each game 6-0. We would be complaining about the roughness of the bog rolls in the loo
Specifically corners? Yes, I agree with that. We are not defending corners at all well this season general, plus Chelsea had some decent delivery.
You just said it yourself, Chelsea have brilliant attacking midfielders and when they're running at you from all angles with little protection from your midfielders a certain amount of panic is inevitable. The way Ferdinand dealt with most of those situations was crucial, and Rafael stepped up too.
Like I say, I think when you go 2 goals up away from home against a great side it is unavoidable that the game will swing back the other way at some point. Look at the Etihad match in the FA Cup last season. Chelsea had the players to make it uncomfortable for us but only scored from a free-kick and a great cross from Oscar.
Teams dont lie down when they play us they usually raise their game, wherever they come from games ebb & flow and players make mistakes
It's more than team spirit. We've got some supremely talented players in our squad and although we are weak in some areas, overall, we're a good bet for the league title again. I don't think we're good enough to win the European Cup, absent a huge slice of luck, but once our injury problems are sorted out, we'll be there or thereabouts.
We've got Smalling and Jones on their way back, and Vidic should be back in training before much longer. Evans has really done well and Rafael is shaping up to be one of the best defenders in the league. Kagawa looks impressive and Chicharito is starting to look the player he was in his first year here. As for CM, I doubt Fergie will buy in January so we'll have to manage.
Have you ever wiped your arse on Izal medicated toilet paper? Now that stuff was rough.
In the Phils got to bring ypur own maybe you get one sheet for a few pesos even in modern shopping centres
Holt's bitter and Izal bog roll are what made Britain Great.
The use of one followed the use of the other.
brilliant
IF the ref had actually did his job, we would have been 2-0 up against 10 men for the second half. No way in hell we'd not have won that.
Also, by far the better side? The only thing that made them go down to 10 men at all were us cutting through them like butter through knife. We were under the kosh for the last 10 minutes of the first half, before that we were amazing. And after their equalizer, WE actually showed great character to turn the game back and should've had a goal when we played Young clean through.
It was more than 10 minutes. We were excellent for about 20 minutes, they started coming into it over the next 5 or 10, and the last 15 or 20 of the first half they were battering us relentlessly.
Like frozen butter through a plastic knife from Kentucky Fried Chicken?
I thought they created their first opening on the 35 minute mark, when Evans put the ball into his own post. I might recall this wrongly, but before that they didn't do squat and we looked devastating on the counter.
I could feel the unease in our entire team when they started having those corners in a row. But before that, we looked as comfortable as you'll ever see a team looking at the Bridge bar Barca.
The second half was strange, as we clearly pushed out a little further up the pitch from the start to not get that enormous pressure mounting on us, then they scored through what I felt was a bit sloppy defending. Then van Persie cut them to shreds and Ivanovic was sent off, and the game went ape shit.
So well, yeah, for about 15 minutes at the most Chelsea looked like the better side. Bar that, referee decisions apart, we looked the better side IMO.
This team is something I've never seen from a SAF side. They're bottlers. And they're in danger of becoming the ultimate bottlers.
Previously, going 2-0 up would allow us to relax as fans (much like going 8 points clear in a run-in). It never does with this lot. Age only goes so far as an excuse at a club that made a mockery of Alan Hansen's infamous claims.
Previously, going 2-0 up would allow us to relax as fans (much like going 8 points clear in a run-in). It never does with this lot. Age only goes so far as an excuse at a club that made a mockery of Alan Hansen's infamous claims.
The bottlers who have came back from losing positions in most of our matches?
We still do not have a midfield. All the decent teams seem to easily bypass our midfielders, putting our defenders under extra workload to defend. In fact given how much pressure was coming at them yesterday due to our midfield being non-existent, I would say our defense did pretty well.
Perfectly summed up by Moriarty.
Yeah, our midfield is weak and our defence is sloppy, but we just beat chelsea at the bridge. Stop being so emo