UEFA’s 3 Step Racism Protocol v Zero Tolerance

koop

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Didn't watch the England game.

Can someone enlighten me on the racism that took place please?

Ta
 

tomaldinho1

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Should be a one step protocol.

If there is organised racist chanting like last night. Team on the pitch decides if they want to walk off (automatic 2-0 win) or continue.

Then, let's say this is Bulgaria given last night, their next match cannot take place in Bulgaria. They will effectively have their next home game automatically changed to an away game - they can choose to forfeit the game (counts as a 0-2 loss) or accept. No Bulgaria fans will be allowed to purchase tickets. If racism continues at the matches in Bulgaria after this, their next two home games become away fixtures and so on. This would cripple the countries FA financially very quickly and punish all fans but I'd wager you'd see a dramatic improvement if the rule is enforced.
 

Andersonson

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To stop racism isnt only on UEFA. What about the clubs? Or the countries?

Atleast UEFA does something. It aint enough, no, but there are nations and clubs who do nothing. The refeere during the game against Bulgaria ( Croatian ref? ) was brilliant. He handled it really well and Southgate praised him for it.

I dont think stop playing is the answer, for me they win when we let it go that way. They should be identified and punished by the authorities
 

sammsky1

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The majority of crowds at northern European league games are white,working class males,most of whom have witnessed mass immigration to their countries and don't like it,good luck with trying to force Kick It Out down their throats.
Honestly this it's the culture there and you are not gonna change it by trying to impose more authority on them, if anything it'd make it worse and end up in protests about mistreatment
I agree with the OP. Take away what they love. Punish their team by enforcing total stadium attendance bans. Keep doing that until they police themselves.

If they want to protest, let them. Then scan their faces for a racists database and jail anyone who smashes up public property.

The issue still exists in British football so I don’t agree with the sole pile on onto Bulgaria. I was at West Ham stadium a few weeks back and there was plenty of racist talk around me. Goes on at every ground I’m sure.

Should be a zero tolerance policy.

The challenge is identifying these people when they make such acts. Not sure how you do that, without physical evidence and only verbal witnesses.
 

Raees

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To stop racism isnt only on UEFA. What about the clubs? Or the countries?

Atleast UEFA does something. It aint enough, no, but there are nations and clubs who do nothing. The refeere during the game against Bulgaria ( Croatian ref? ) was brilliant. He handled it really well and Southgate praised him for it.

I dont think stop playing is the answer, for me they win when we let it go that way. They should be identified and punished by the authorities
At the moment they are winning, they get to see the game, as well as get to be racist... win win. If the game gets cancelled, in which way will they win exactly? there will no longer be any BAME players paraded in front of them to abuse.
 

GenZRed

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The majority of crowds at northern European league games are white,working class males,most of whom have witnessed mass immigration to their countries and don't like it,good luck with trying to force Kick It Out down their throats.
Same way most countries worldwide wouldn't like mass immigration being imposed on them, especially from countries that are very different culturally.

For example: You hear a lot of noise about USA and illegal immigration and how evil Americans supposedly are for being opposed to said immigration. I wonder if the people who accuse Americans of being racist for their views on illegal immigration have bothered to look up Mexico's immigration policy.

Spoiler alert: Mexico doesn't accept illegal immigration. No 'pathway to citizenship' in that country.
 

njred

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Same way most countries worldwide wouldn't like mass immigration being imposed on them, especially from countries that are very different culturally.

For example: You hear a lot of noise about USA and illegal immigration and how evil Americans supposedly are for being opposed to said immigration. I wonder if the people who accuse Americans of being racist for their views on illegal immigration have bothered to look up Mexico's immigration policy.

Spoiler alert: Mexico doesn't accept illegal immigration. No 'pathway to citizenship' in that country.
Don't know what that has to do with this but anyway I have noticed one thing in the States. For all it's nutty gun people and racist people, I've never heard anything racist in the stadiums ever and I have been everywhere and watched every sport except maybe Nascar racing.
 

calodo2003

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Team walk off after being racially abused.

Abusing country is heavily fined for first abuse (more than the pittance to Montenegro).

Banned for a year for next abuse. Ratchet up to the death penalty if abuses continue.

The death penalty shook things a bit in American college football & has only been levied once to SMU. There’s an argument that the penalty worked (although SMU’s infractions were of a slightly different ilk to abject & systemic racism), such a penalty needs to be on the table vs. racism.
 

Meep

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Should be a one step protocol.

If there is organised racist chanting like last night. Team on the pitch decides if they want to walk off (automatic 2-0 win) or continue.

Then, let's say this is Bulgaria given last night, their next match cannot take place in Bulgaria. They will effectively have their next home game automatically changed to an away game - they can choose to forfeit the game (counts as a 0-2 loss) or accept. No Bulgaria fans will be allowed to purchase tickets. If racism continues at the matches in Bulgaria after this, their next two home games become away fixtures and so on. This would cripple the countries FA financially very quickly and punish all fans but I'd wager you'd see a dramatic improvement if the rule is enforced.
This! No reason why not. No reason. No. (But backhander to UEFA execs..)
 

christinaa

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The hypocrisy in all this is coming from Jordan Henderson who is now up in arms but forgets that he was wearing the Suarez t-shirt after Suarez was found guilty of racially abusing Evra!
 

UnrelatedPsuedo

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Same way most countries worldwide wouldn't like mass immigration being imposed on them, especially from countries that are very different culturally.

For example: You hear a lot of noise about USA and illegal immigration and how evil Americans supposedly are for being opposed to said immigration. I wonder if the people who accuse Americans of being racist for their views on illegal immigration have bothered to look up Mexico's immigration policy.

Spoiler alert: Mexico doesn't accept illegal immigration. No 'pathway to citizenship' in that country.
Spoiler alert : Mexico doesnt have a ruling class that freely employs illegal workers in order to keep them from doing shit they could do themselves.

Americans LOVE their current state of affairs. Pay a Mexican person Fcuk all, off the books, for work they don’t want to do.

Its disgusting. Modern day Slavery of another name. It gets reframed many ways, but the suggestion that Mexican immigrants are not absolutely exploited by Americans is insane.
 

TrustInOle

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Can't create a new thread yet, and I would presume this would match up, kind of, to the thread. Yesterday, during an FA Cup Qualifier, Haringey played Yeovil at Yeovil's ground I think, only for the goalkeeper of Haringey, who was Cameroonian decent, recieved a load of vile racist abuse, Missiles thrown towards him, as well as groups, not just an individual, but groups of supporters trying to spit on him.

My question really is, what kind of steps have the Fa put into place to tackle this? Because, in my current understanding, Haringey's Manager decided to have his players leave the pitch and abandon the game only for them to find out they could be kicked out of the cup for it, which would be totally disgtaceful.

Here is the Haringey's manager post game.

 
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Walters_19_MuFc

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Its disgusting. These animals need to be stopped!

It will be interesting to see what happens with Haringey, regards walking off the pitch.
 

TrustInOle

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Its disgusting. These animals need to be stopped!

It will be interesting to see what happens with Haringey, regards walking off the pitch.
Agreed, I feel a rematch is the only appropriate action, but will be very telling how the FA decides to approach this, and will show how hard they want to tackle racism, down to the grassroots.
 

Walters_19_MuFc

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Agreed, I feel a rematch is the only appropriate action, but will be very telling how the FA decides to approach this, and will show how hard they want to tackle racism, down to the grassroots.
Yeah. Think this is where it gets interesting, though.

If it is a rematch, then that means starting the game again, although Yeovil were winning at the time. If they remove Yeovil from the cup, it means any fan can go into a game and racially abuse someone, with the hope of that club getting removed.

They have some hard decisions to make. Hopefully, whatever they do decide, it turns out to be the right decision.
 

Sjaakmeoff

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There was a terrible incident in the second division in Holland yesterday, where a player was racially abused. Especially the aftermath was so so bad. The abuse was denied bij the club (with an excuse about sounds they always make...bullcrap). The abused player scored after the game was paused and celebrated his goal in front of the crowd which abused him. The manager of the opposite team called him a miserable guy for doing this after the game and on TV.

These things happen. I'm not saying it's ok these things happen, but they do. There are a lot of bad/dumb people in the world and footballstadiums are no exception. The only thing the club had to do was to say how sorry they were and to let everyone know they would do anything to find these people, make sure they'd never set food in a stadium again and report them to the police. In stead they opted to play the whole thing down. And that's very worrying.

Anyway. Wijnaldum spoke about this in the press conference today using very wise words and made this statement. And that made me proud.

 

Fracture90

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Not really racism 'per se' but here's a video of England fans chanting "Serbs are bastards, everywhere they go" during their match against Kosovo*.

 

dbs235

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Not really racism 'per se' but here's a video of England fans chanting "Serbs are bastards, everywhere they go" during their match against Kosovo*.

Going to play devil's advocate and say would anyone care if "Serbs" was replaced with "Scouse" in a game vs Liverpool?
 

manutddjw

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To me that video has bad connotations. I don’t want to get into it and talk about past histories, but look at what that guy is doing with hands and if you know anything about the history, there’s a hatred there.

It doesn’t bother me, but if you want to come down on things, this should be no exception. I’d imagine if American fans chanted “all ( pick one of the many countries they’ve went to war with) are bastards everywhere they go” there would be a massive uproar.
 

Fracture90

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Going to play devil's advocate and say would anyone care if "Serbs" was replaced with "Scouse" in a game vs Liverpool?
Everyone should care but that is more of an internal England issue, in this instance we got people from one country far from home, chanting insults towards entire nation.
 

Cloud7

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Going to play devil's advocate and say would anyone care if "Serbs" was replaced with "Scouse" in a game vs Liverpool?
As is always the case when it comes to ethnic groups, as well as nationalities, you can’t view it in isolation, when most of the weight of these words is defined by their historical significance.
 

krautrøck

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Zero tolerance! Unless the culprits represent the rich and powerful FA.
 

KirkDuyt

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I think the extreme measures FIFA has taken are encouraging. Taking a team photo underneath a cardboard cut out with the text:"say no to racism" is bound to end racism any day now. Right?

Just ban anyone being clearly caught being a racist cnut for life and report him to the police. And yes, a ban for life is harsh, but luckily you can easily avoid said ban by not being a racist prick.
 

RedCurry

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Step 1: Allow the team who has been victim of racial abuse to field one or two extra players. Abandoning the match altogether is unfair to so many fans who may have paid to watch the game.

Step 2: Stadium ban for life for the culprits
 

Le Red

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Worked how exactly? Did you see the comments of the Bulgarian manger after the game?

How was England staying on the pitch whilst racism was still heard in the second half a triumph? It just panders to racism and informs nations that they can be racist to a certain extent and still avoid match getting abandoned. Would be interested to know your ethnic background because your comments are ridiculous.
The irony of making several rants about racism only to signal that you judge people's opinions on their ethnic background rather for their real value.