You couldn’t make this up, even with the caveat it’s hilarious!!
Unpopular Opinion | Not sacking Ten Hag
- Thread starter Nickelodeon
- Start date
He has to go. Simple as. The lack of a footballing identity, his crazy signings and crazy/inconsistent decision making is alone enough to send him to the guillotine.
Conversely cults stick to endless bottom feeding for some individual who usually is a con artist. You know like this thread OP has suggested in his "yeah let's watch our club burn more cause I love Hag" thread.
If Ineos do decide to keep him on for one more season, it's likely it'll be on the proviso that he has zero say (or next to zero!) on any new signings or sales.
His recruitment (signing players he's coached before who he should know inside-out and back-to-front and who turn out to be shit) and inability to identify the areas of the team that need strengthening (signing players we don't need) has been disastrous and probably the biggest indictment of his tenure at the club.
His recruitment (signing players he's coached before who he should know inside-out and back-to-front and who turn out to be shit) and inability to identify the areas of the team that need strengthening (signing players we don't need) has been disastrous and probably the biggest indictment of his tenure at the club.
Also you seriously believe anyone sane should opine still that Hag deserves more time? I mean if you do, please do also reveal which club you support.
Well yes, that's mostly what I'm saying. Everyone wants a new squad but it's not realistic. We've bought and sold plenty under Ten Hag. The argument is that for some reason people believe Ten Hag staying means that then, and only then, we will overhaul the squad and kick out underperformers. When in reality we'll likely change the squad more if a new manager is hired as well.
I still sometimes think about those 30 minutes against Palace under Rangnick and wonder what it could have been.
May be we can lure him back. The added advantage with him would be that he can also play DOF until Ashworth is appointed.What players did his competition at Ajax have during those years?
Recruitment did the job of aligning with the manager's vision at Ajax, however, he couldn't select players himself to align with his vision? That's a bit strange, no? 9 of the players that started the last game were bought or brought up by ETH but still we lost 4-0 to Crystal Palace. We looked as disorganized as we have this entire season. And we can't even use the excuse that we used for a better part of last season of him not getting enough time on the training pitch because of games coming thick and fast. For more than half of this season we have played one game a week and still we don't even see glimpses of this great football philosophy. Or is that it is only dependent on Martinez being fit and Frenkie de Jong in the midfield? Because if that's the case then we are in deeper trouble than we though. Martinez may never fully recover from his injury and Fdj might reject us like he has 10 times already.
Between, you still didn't answer if you can see us challenging with ETH.
I think this argument holds more weight under the previous regime. Getting the likes of Berrada, Wilcox, Ashworth etc should remove that whole "clean slate" argument.
Our problem has been that we're constantly trying to find the next SAF to build us into something. Hopefully with a proper footballing structure fit for the modern era we can move forward in such a way that recruiting a manager is just the final piece in building a winning team, because the vision, strategy and recruitment should be driven more by the hierarchy that see the long term picture, and not only be driven by the coach who's sole responsibility is delivering results in the coming weeks.
Now maybe EtH will have more sway over recruitment, or the next manager will have more power and control, I don't really know the ins and outs. But I'm assuming that people like Berrada, Wilcox and Ashworth are not coming here for show, they will have crucial roles as we step forward into the modern age as a club. Therefore, we should not see this whole "clean slate" or "reset button" style club management.
Like them or hate them, Chelsea did this well during the Abromavich era. They had so much success with numerous coaches and in periods of great managerial flux. Our failing has been that we've been too reliant on the manager to bring success.
I prefer no manager then eth.
Shocking thread from the Ten Hag in ****
The alternatives arent great and it means starting over again. We need another year to rebuild everything behind the scenes anyway so just give him his last year. Firing him isnt cheap either.
I also want to see a third season from him. I feel it will benefit us in the long run because I believe some manager out there will make the job theirs given that kind of time. I think EtH will ultimately be undone by his seemingly Dutch influenced inability to adapt.
I can give 2 reasons not to sack ETH - one is the injuries and the second is the development of young players. But when you come to the stage that you don't want to watch United-games - that's when a manager has to go.
No, it doesn't. Stop making things up.
This is entirely fair, and why on balance he probably does have to go. It was a similar situation with LVG.
This kinda stuff is why we beat you lot in the war.
In the real world though, it does. Because otherwise he'd be so undermined at the first tiny wobble next season it'd be an even bigger shitshow than post-Coventry or post-Palace.
If they decide to keep him it's almost 100% they'd trigger his extension before the season starts. Even if they didn't, we would not get more than 2 months into the season without him either being sacked or that extension being triggered.
I still sometimes think about those 30 minutes against Palace under Rangnick and wonder what it could have been.
What players did his competition at Ajax have during those years?
Recruitment did the job of aligning with the manager's vision at Ajax, however, he couldn't select players himself to align with his vision? That's a bit strange, no? 9 of the players that started the last game were bought or brought up by ETH but still we lost 4-0 to Crystal Palace. We looked as disorganized as we have this entire season. And we can't even use the excuse that we used for a better part of last season of him not getting enough time on the training pitch because of games coming thick and fast. For more than half of this season we have played one game a week and still we don't even see glimpses of this great football philosophy. Or is that it is only dependent on Martinez being fit and Frenkie de Jong in the midfield? Because if that's the case then we are in deeper trouble than we though. Martinez may never fully recover from his injury and Fdj might reject us like he has 10 times already.
fair point, but I think it was the closest we've been to a recognisable style of play that we've seen here - so I'm holding on to it!Well in the CL some pretty impressive ones beating Real and Juve. In the league PSV had players like Gakpo, Dumfries, Malen who are European level. Feyenoord had Senesi and Sinisterra who are doing well in the Prem. It's not as cut and dry as most people think, they didn't even qualify for the CL before he came in. I have no problem in saying how shite he's been here, but not sure why we're so dismissive of what he did previously all of a sudden.
No, it happens all the time. Klopp didn't want Salah, he wanted Brandt and the DOF stepped in and the rest is history. I think we could see improvement with a better reshaping of the squad, that doesn't mean I am not appalled at how we played against Palace and not concerned with his decision making and set up with what he has.
He is clearly stubborn, much like LVG, but LVG isn't a bad manager and with the players in his vision he has had success. Now much like LVG, is that vision how United want to play? I think Ten Hags is closer to a United style that LVGs ever was, but if Wilcox agrees with the principles Ten Hag espouses, then we have to believe he can purchase players to suit that. It does mean not letting him pursue De Jong again and probably investing in a CB good enough on the ball as Martinez, because we can't rely on him to be fit.
Again, I will repeat, this doesn't mean I want him to stay at all costs. I would prefer Tuchel and we buy players for Tuchel and the agreed vision. I do NOT want to sack him to bring in Potter or Southgate to do that.
Not only is that conjecture, it's nonsense. Managers go into seasons in the final year of their contract all the time, usually with the aim being to have them earn an extension. It's why the +1 is there in the first place. As for the whole tiny wobble argument, that would happen whether the manager (whoever that may be) has 12 months on their deal or 12 years. It's inconsequential.
You're inventing a bogeyman scenario from thin air.
The irony of you submitting posts that are literally ban-worthy in accordance with forum guidelines is quite delicious if I do say so myself.
Good video. Thanks for sharing.
The bit that stood out for me is where it said INEOS will recruit players that suit their style of play, not the managers.
As it stands, we don't really know what type of players INEOS want. More importantly, we don't know whether it'll coincide with what ten Hag wants, as he wasn't an INEOS appointment.
It could be that INEOS want to play a complete different style to ten Hag. As a result, that could lead to the dismissal of ten Hag. Although, if that was the case, like Bayern and Barcelona, you'd imagine we'd have announced it already.
In my opinion, I think ten Hag is someone who INEOS want. I think, he's very much up to date with modern football, i.e. playing from the back, high press, etc. However, I just think it needs to be refined. As the video said, we need an overhaul and the players we bring in need to suit our long term style of play.
The fundamental question is this:
Is it incredibly difficult to transition to success from a frankenstein squad in a broken footballing operation and a club that's been pillaged by the Glazers for almost two decades?
Or
Is ETH just really shit at doing the above.
I think the answer is a bit of both. I would put it around 75/25. But a coach who is good at this kind of transition is a very specialised role. He might be the best we will get.
Is it incredibly difficult to transition to success from a frankenstein squad in a broken footballing operation and a club that's been pillaged by the Glazers for almost two decades?
Or
Is ETH just really shit at doing the above.
I think the answer is a bit of both. I would put it around 75/25. But a coach who is good at this kind of transition is a very specialised role. He might be the best we will get.
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We've just changed abround 60% of this squad under Ten Hag, there's only 10 or so players left form 2022. And half of those are likely to go this summer as well. After we bring in 4-5 players this summer the squad will be sitting at 75-80% new players as compared to Solskjaers last squad that finished 2nd.
I don't see us challenging for the title next year, so do we just ditch Ten Hags squad and start again?
How many threads on EtH do we need?
Ten
Noting the injuries, and the poor structure of the footballing side behind him and giving him some leeway for that, what is he doing that indicates he is ever going to be good enough to manage Manchester United?
Why are you being so passive agressive about this? This is an online forum where people can discus topics but it seems like you just want an echo chamber of your own opinion?
So far you want someone banned because of this topic/opinion, called that person a bottom feeder, call people who dont share you opinion insane and say those people cant be Manchester United fans. Ofcourse ******* had to be mentioned too because when you arent making vitriolic ETH out posts then you are a ETH *******.
I believe that you are supposed to back your opinion up with (football) arguments and not by getting personal with other posters or attacking those other posters.
Perhaps Manchester United is unmanageable? It sounds like a rich cancer patient switching doctors. "But the guy in the next room down got better. I want his doctor instead."
Loitering in 8th in the league.
Conceding 20-30 shots to even the crappest teams every week.
Not one signing that can be considered a success, weighing up the overall picture of output/price/injury/availability.
Falling out with players.
Not one player looking better this season than last.
If all of the above isn't enough for it being to change the manager, what on earth would be?
Conceding 20-30 shots to even the crappest teams every week.
Not one signing that can be considered a success, weighing up the overall picture of output/price/injury/availability.
Falling out with players.
Not one player looking better this season than last.
If all of the above isn't enough for it being to change the manager, what on earth would be?
A lot said there, however, here is one point I will make, the team mirrors the manager. It's that simple. So if you have a soft Susan manager, that will be reflected in the team, likewise if you have a Roy Keane type, that will be reflected in the team. Second, I don't see progress with this team. Why are they stagnant, why is the on field setup and game plan so flawed? It has been mentioned that McClaren has absolutely no input on training and Ten Hag is controlling it all. That in itself gives to culpability and if true should be all that is required to dictate an exit.
Where things go awry with continual manager changes, each manager brings in a player that suits what he is setting up on the field. Each change over means you go back to square 1 and creates a new need for transfers. There needs to be a due diligence approach to choosing ETH's replacement with a long term plan.
Jamie Jackson reckons INEOS will hang on to Ten Hag because there is no suitable replacement available.
https://www.theguardian.com/footbal...d-lead-erik-ten-hag-staying-manchester-united
https://www.theguardian.com/footbal...d-lead-erik-ten-hag-staying-manchester-united
If they keep him and next season starts in exactly the same way that this season is ending then Ineos will lose all credibility.
And in 100 out of 100 of the scenarios where a manager has a 3+1 contract that +1 is activated at the start of year 3 at the very latest. Almost always earlier. The only managers who go through with jobs on the last year of contracts are ones who are safe as houses and thinking of retirement.
The notion that you can give ETH next season leaving his contract to whittle down to zero is another redcafe myth that doesn’t stand up to any scrutiny, same as the notion that keeping ETH will somehow cull the squad faster when the reverse is actually true.
The whole discussion is pointless to begin with, common sense should tell you that the players have all given up on him because they already think he’s cooked. The board clearly don’t want to give him any extensions, and commit another £9m to someone who has failed in their remit so spectacularly. So keeping him next season is obviously doomed to fail when the owners don’t rate him enough to at least commit to him.
"Bascially I dont have a clue and this is my best guess at this moment" -jamie jackson
I don't know if Ineos will keep him or not, but the idea that there are no managers available to replace him is nonsense.
Ok. I can't argue with you so we'll leave it at that.
There is a strong logic to this argument and I wouldn't be at all unhappy if that was the outcome.
But I don't believe it will happen in a million years. ETH is toast after the cup final as any fool can see. Because...
Oh dear, thats 10 to many
My main issue is that he never admits any mistakes on his front on anything. All problems are down to the referees, injuries or the players not following his instructions. It’s hard to support a manager who’s not remotely humble and then actually is dreadful at getting teams to play semi-decent football or results.
He called us the team that played the most dynamic and entertaining football in the league. Imagine how deluded one has to be say that and how disastrous it would be to give him more time, essentially rewarding failures.
Further, injuries are always excused as bad luck. There needs to be an investigation into his training methods as it can’t be all bad luck. What if we have another season of injuries like that? I don’t think it’s that unrealistic for it to happen. We could be in relegation spots if he can’t deal with injuries and adapt his tactics.
The other concern is he still wants vetoes on transfers and no doubt he’ll be looking to sign mediocrity (like Amrabat, Antony) from the clubs he’s managed before while continuing to reward Rashford. How’s this all a recipe for success?
He called us the team that played the most dynamic and entertaining football in the league. Imagine how deluded one has to be say that and how disastrous it would be to give him more time, essentially rewarding failures.
Further, injuries are always excused as bad luck. There needs to be an investigation into his training methods as it can’t be all bad luck. What if we have another season of injuries like that? I don’t think it’s that unrealistic for it to happen. We could be in relegation spots if he can’t deal with injuries and adapt his tactics.
The other concern is he still wants vetoes on transfers and no doubt he’ll be looking to sign mediocrity (like Amrabat, Antony) from the clubs he’s managed before while continuing to reward Rashford. How’s this all a recipe for success?