Struggling to see where you get that I like José's bus from my post!?
Van Gaal
- Thread starter bond19821982
- Start date
He couldn’t get out of a piss poor group in the CL and finished fifth in the league.
He should’ve been sacked in Dec 2015.
Yeah his football was boring but I think it was more due to the players rather than systemic design. The intent was to dominate the ball which has its benefits like the whole opponent can't score without the ball thing, but the lack of cutting edge is what ultimately made it look like pointless possession. It's why teams would just park the bus, but tbf anytime the opponent would try come at us we would slice through - evident in how we played better against the better sides who wouldn't sit back.
At least we used to be able to hold the ball then, which weve been incapable of doing ever since.
His transfers were shite though.
At least we used to be able to hold the ball then, which weve been incapable of doing ever since.
His transfers were shite though.
Those were dark times.
Such boring games. I remember we played one game at OT, where our first shot at goal was after 80+ minutes. Absolutely shocking that LVG could claim that that was attacking football.
I thought the post was stupid enough that nobody would think I was serious.
I never know anymore on this site.
I thought he panicked. We were very very good in some of the earlier games. I think his inability or the club's inability to get a world class midfield player and a striker and the fact he didn't trust most of the players to play to his instructions was his downfall.
Our match against Spurs was one of his best matches I think. We simply took them apart.
Our match against Spurs was one of his best matches I think. We simply took them apart.
Juanfield was his best work, I felt. The minutes leading up to Mata's first goal was probably the best I've seen us play at Anfield ever.
Kroos was in the world cup remember? He was signed by Madrid after the world cup whereas Shaw and Herrera were signed before/during the world cup. It's quite lame to think Van Gaal could have done anything to stop such signings while he was busy thinking of his Dutch team. It's ridiculous to have thought he would entertain the thought of another team while he was with the Dutch team at the world cup. No one said the bad signings were the players' fault but the fact that majority of them were punts taken and such punts are always either a miss or hit. Majority of Di Maria's money was already recouped after he was sold to PSG as quick as he came in.
It's you who should get your fact right and stop coming up with a lie. Your God, Mourinho couldn't win a spoon with the same squad without having to reinforce it with his big money signings and had to bench the kids to accommodate his adult players yet with all the big money signings he made, what did he win? Carling cup and Europa cup while parking a large bus against a kiddo team such as Ajax.
To be honest, Van Gaal promoted Xavi and Iniesta.
He did same for Germany and Bayern when he promoted Muller, Kroos and revamped Schweisteiger game from a winger he was to a central midfielder. He signed Arjen Robben who said it was Van Gaal who convinced him to come to Munich. He also promoted Alaba and Badstuber. A shame injury ruined Badstuber and also, Alaba was constantly injured under him because if Van Gaal had had a fit Badstuber and Alaba to replace the ageing average old heads such as Altintop, Dimechelis, Van buyten, Pranjic, Tymoshchuks in his defence, Bayern would have fared better because there was nothing wrong with Bayern attack and midfield except for the defence. They also needed a grit in the midfield and that was why Jupp Hynckes had to bring in Gustavo in the midfield and revamped the whole defence, including the goalkeeper, except for Lahm and Alaba. In the following year, they had to break their transfer record to land Javi Martinez to replace Gustavo. He, Hynckes already had his work made easier with about five players (Muller, Schweisteiger, Kroos, Alaba, Robben) that Van Gaal either helped to mould their games or signed during his four years at Bayern.
Van Gaal has always been known for an attacking manager at the detriment of his defence hence it's quite funny to see people label him a defensive coach when we could all see with our very eyes the sluggish lethargic players in his midfield which made our possession play sluggish and boring. How could people see the likes of ageing sluggish Carrick, lethargic Fellaini and 'past it' sluggish Rooney yet expect a fast tempo play and creativity from this lots? It was always going to be boring. You can't give what you don't have! However, I know the next thing Van Gaal had in mind was to improve the midfield and bring in a mobile creative/playmaking midfielder in the summer. If the board had gone all in for Mane like he had wanted, our attack would have looked sharper regardless of our sluggish ageing midfielders.
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The person who made that post said it was a joke, so from my end the argument is done. Van Gaal might have promoted few players but Barca success has nothing to do with Van Gaal.
Van Gaal promoted them. How many players have Barca promoted into the first team since then? Only Busquet Pedro and maybe Roberto which was largely due to Pep. However, I know if Xavi and Iniesta weren't promoted then, Pep couldn't have promoted many players all at once. He would have preferred to splash money on players outside.
Van Gaal laid down the template for both Barca and Bayern and in extension to Spain and Germany. He gave Muller, Alaba, Robben, Kroos, a revamped Schweisteiger to Jupp hynckes when he came into Bayern and without these players, Germany may not have won the world cup and Bayern may not have won the CL. He didn't spend many years at Barca but spent close to four years at Bayern hence his works could easily be seen at Bayern than Barca however he did promote Xavi and Iniesta.
Timelines are way off. If not Van Gaal, maybe someone else would have promoted considering how talented these players were.
How many have been promoted at Bayern since then? Only few coaches has time for kids. Even Pep is scared of doing such and if it wasn't for the fact that he already had a settled world-class team at Barca, he wouldn't have promoted Busquet nor Pedro. Iniesta and Xavi were even touted as small players who wouldn't have made the grade if not for Van Gaal.
And he freshened up that midfield by signing those midfield dynamos Schneiderlin and Schweinsteiger.
Iniesta was rated very highly and would have made it, no matter who promoted. Van Gaal deserves credit for promoting them (small one btw) but nothing to do with the success Rijkaard, Pep and others had.
With Schweisteiger, we were hovering around the top of the league table before December until he was injured. Schweisteiger would have been a steal for that money if not for his ageing crock self.
Anyway, the fans and I bet the boards who signed Herrera were saying Herrera was a creative playmaker and Van Gaal didn't know how to use him. Funny how the supposedly playmaking creative midfielder became a defensive box-box midfielder in the end.
I bet many young players are highly rated in La masia today. Let's not even forget the fact that Iniesta was more or less used as a utility player under Rijkaard until Luis Arangones euro 2008 team. Being highly rated doesn't mean you would make the grade. The two Alcantara brothers were highly rated, where are they today? One is at Bayern and quite inconsistent to the extent that Bayern are planning to replace him.
Was he dynamic or was he past it? Where did he leave United for?
What’s funny about it exactly? His best form for United came under Mourinho. He tried to turn Rooney into a midfielder too and he was fecking shit at it.
Plenty of players made debuts and didn't make the grade either. Just because Van Gaal gave his debut doesnt mean he defined Iniesta's career. For a record, he played around 500 mins under Van Gaal.
Also for Spain, he made his debut in 2006, was a sub player in world cup but post that he was starter in European qualifiers. Again not sure what that has to do with Van Gaal who was sacked in 2003 Jan.
The debut and some good amount of playing times at a big club are the main thing for a young player to build upon because many players wouldn't have had better careers without that. For example, the likes of Lingard would have found himself in the championship without Van Gaal giving him a debut. Likewise Cleverley without Fergie giving him a career. A shame that injury ruined CBJ.
The point is Van Gaal promoted Xavi and Iniesta and Xavi especially, was one of the core of Van Gaal's team. Moreover, Xavi was the core of both Barca and Spanish midfield. Once he left, everything became shambles.
Yeah, so Rijkaard is the reason why Barca won 4 CLs since he gave debut to Messi. Should track who gave debut to Aguero, so that we can credit him with 2-3 PL titles.
He was a crock and I wouldn't say he was past it. If the board had backed Van Gaal, he would have brought in a younger playmaker but they couldn't even back him to get Mane and forced Herrera on him!
Herera was a defensive midfielder in a counter attacking setup under Mourinho. In a possession based setup where his defensive prowess is of little use, he basically useless. His movement, positioning, creativity are awful. In fact, Fellaini had a better movement and positioning than him but lacks the technique and the vibrancy. It's no wonder a midfield of Carrick, Fellaini and Herrera/Rooney could work well but a midfield of Carrick, Rooney and Herrera were in shambles because we had two players who's got horrible movement and positioning in both Herrera and Rooney. It's of little wonder that many managers (Moyes, Van Gaal, Mourinho, Belgium's coach) loved Fellaini despite his lack of techniques and mobility, he was an intelligent player.
I actually quite liked the chess football of Van Gaal. I thought after Moyes it was great to have a more intelligent approach. If Schweinsteiger was in his prime I think it might have been worthwhile to give the manager another season if only to bed in a passing style which the next manager could tweak to become more dynamic. Instead, we ripped it up once again and started from fresh as we are doing now with Ole.
What a post, full of inaccuracies.
It was not the style of play Van Gaal wanted to implement that made him a bad fit at United. It was his stubborn inability to recognize that he didn't have the players to do so and refused to adept to that. Which has been the problem of quite a few Dutch trainers like Koeman, De Boer and Bosz, though I have to say Koeman has done quite well. These people fail to realize that the world of football doesn't end outside of the Netherlands. What works at Ajax doesn't necessarily work at Inter or Manchester United. And while the "Dutch" way is great to watch when executed properly, it's by no means the only "proper" way to play football. It's certainly not the best way, because if it were, I'd say we'd have one at least 1 world cup. I think in the end Van Gaal's style of play could be implemented at any club, just not by him and not in a year or 2. If that makes any sense at all.
Inaccuracies by the fact that Pogba was brought in to replace Herrera in his supposed creative role while Herrera had to make a living in a defensive role in Mourinho's counter attacking setup?
Or the fact that after Schweisteiger got injured, our season turned worse and our top 4 run hope was finally dent as soon as Herrera replaced Fellaini who was out against Westham after he got a card in the previous Leicester match. Only Fellaini was out and if a midfield of Carrick, Fellaini and Herrera had onced looked good, why the midfield shambles against Westham despite the fact it was only Fellaini that was out and Herrera was back into
the fold to replace him alongside Rooney and Carrick in the midfield?
Rather than spew inaccurate nonsense, come up with something to back up your claim?
Go and check under whom Herrera played before moving to ManUtd.
When you post so much nonsense, it's hard to correct every time.
Herrera played as a no 10 for Athletico Bilbao but how many assists did he have? Just 5! As a no 10!
Now what were you saying?
I was saying you post lot of nonsense.
His last 2 seasons and the positions he played.
https://www.transfermarkt.com/ander...11&verein=&liga=&wettbewerb=&pos=&trainer_id=
https://www.transfermarkt.com/ander...12&verein=&liga=&wettbewerb=&pos=&trainer_id=
I’m lost as to what point it is you’re making about Herrera. If he was desperate for a creative midfielder then why the hell did he sign Morgan Schneiderlin?
Your right he was going to have a new midfielder starting every week as his creative hub, his name Wayne Rooney. The ideal solution to our sluggish midfield.
@roonster09, I don't think you actually checked your stats before posting it because it actually lay credence to my claim that Herrera was awful as an AM because that was where he was mostly deployed and don't tell me Athletico didn't have good strikers because they had quality forwards in Adruitz, Llorente and Munian.
In his last season, he was moved around different because he had an awful season which majority of athletico fans believed was due to his head being turned by us. The fans were crossed with him before he left for manutd because he had a bad season.
Point is, at no time did Herrera look quality either as a AM or CM. He hardly had a position and was more or less an utility 'hustling' midfielder which is what he is today, yet was forced on Van gaal while many blamed Van gaal for failing to get the best out of him. The amount of vitriol that was laid on Van gaal because of Herrera was something else.
In his last season, he was moved around different because he had an awful season which majority of athletico fans believed was due to his head being turned by us. The fans were crossed with him before he left for manutd because he had a bad season.
Point is, at no time did Herrera look quality either as a AM or CM. He hardly had a position and was more or less an utility 'hustling' midfielder which is what he is today, yet was forced on Van gaal while many blamed Van gaal for failing to get the best out of him. The amount of vitriol that was laid on Van gaal because of Herrera was something else.
He wanted two CM. One a defensive midfielder while the other a creative one but the budget given to him was little.
There was no use playing schneiderlin when we had little creativity in the midfield and Bastian was out.
He didn't play only as AM. He played as CM/AM under Belsa, so saying he will be useless in possession based systems is nonsense. If Van Gaal didn't like Herrera then shame and his loss. Him not liking Herrera and then signing Schneiderlin was just laughably poor decision .
At least, Schneiderlin has a position, which is a defensive midfielder whereas Herrera doesn't have any until he became a defensive midfielder under Mourinho who had preferred splashing huge money on Pogba to play his creative midfield role than bank on a utility player such as Herrera.
And you need to check the amount of games played by Herrera in the AM role. Also, Bielsa isn't possession based coach. His style is similar to Klopp. Eccentric with quick pressing style and despite that, Herrera's best season came in the AM role which wasn't even good enough if we were to go by the standard. When he was moved to the CM role, he was even more awful before he left for Manutd and this was the player our fans wanted to rip off Van gaal's head for?
But a tactical genius should’ve been able to spot that Herrera was a defensive midfielder then and therefore he wouldn’t need Schneiderlin. His budget being little is news to me.
The speculation regarding Kroos was that LVG didn’t want him and that’s why the deal fell through or that he didn’t want to play for LVG. This gets ignored or dismissed because it doesn’t fit the narrative but other speculation is deemed to be fact and the board get blamed because that makes LVG sound better.
None of us know what was true and what was false, not even you but you can’t pick what you do and don’t like (often from the same Sources) and try and pass it off as fact.
@Kaglish10
Your amazing mate. Keep going. Alot of us would enjoy talking about these things if we hadn't already done before - only to be stopped by these guys who are just as strong 'anti-fans' of LVG as we are respecters and fans of him.
I wish we could have a thread where we could talk positives of LVG amongst ourselves - but in this world we don't always get what we want.
Your amazing mate. Keep going. Alot of us would enjoy talking about these things if we hadn't already done before - only to be stopped by these guys who are just as strong 'anti-fans' of LVG as we are respecters and fans of him.
I wish we could have a thread where we could talk positives of LVG amongst ourselves - but in this world we don't always get what we want.