That Pereira's tackle on Felix wasn't a red card and Case's was is completely ludicrous.
Just impossible to know what will and won't get reviewed.
VAR and Refs | General Discussion
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) was joined by comedian Ali Woods to look back at the best and worst moments of a rollercoaster season with the annual United Hour Awards.
Has Ten Hag been sacked yet? We're not sure and we hope not, but it's looking more likely as the days pass.
Who should replace him and why is it taking so long to make a decision?
Just impossible to know what will and won't get reviewed.
Agree with this, and the orange card part.
I would love to know how there was only one minute added on at the end of the 1st half. The fecking VAR decision took nearly five minutes!
Just think that "United are getting favored" and then every decision would start making sense from their perspective.
Just saw the pen. Surely to feck the rules are for making a challenge or making or sort of sliding block? It means you’re literally allowed to dive down and save the ball with your hands because that’s exactly what the defender did
Yep, with this clear and obvious nonsense they’re basically telling him he’s made a clear and obvious error, so he basically has to change his mind. It’s not a maybe look at this kind of chat as that wouldn’t be clear or obvious.
mariner has seen an opportunity to get Casemiro sent off because studs touched a shin pad, he’s then slow mowed that exact contact point.
Then we have poor clattering a wolves player in the box which is an obvious pen and it’s not looked at.
Seriously makes me think they want to narrow the gap between us and the rest for entertainment.
Doubt they wven know at this stage.
A few weeks ago it couldn't intervene against Carroll.
Also couldn't intervene when Fabinho took out Ferguson.
But today it could, even though the ref gave the free kick and the yellow.
Couldn’t agree more. It’s a disgraceful use of the system today and it’s cost us (again).
The ref saw it and gave the yellow. You surely have to think he’s made an absolute clanger to suggest he’s made an error in this instance?
Either Taylor needs sacking for not knowing the rules and giving a yellow for a red card challenge or Marriner needs sacking for not understanding how to apply the VAR correctly.
Whichever way you look at it one of them is utterly incompetent and should be fecked off.
Especially because you can see Pereira adjust his leg mid-tackle to make contact further up the leg! It's a total crapshoot at this point - and while that could be somewhat understandable if the officials were different it's the same fecking tosser who's apparently done a 180 over the past 24 hours?
Exactly. We can analyse and dissect these incidents but there's no consistency to them, no conspiracy for or against teams (looking at you, silly corruption thread). It's a great system in theory; just very poorly managed and implemented by our referees. If anything VAR has magnified their own deficiencies.
Christ knows what to think any more man. It's infuriating because these decisions are completely altering the course of matches.
Yeah the more you think about it the more bent the whole process was today.
You’ve essentially got the VAR refereeing the game and changing standard on field decisions.
Yeah that's exactly my issue. I get the whole "arm supporting your bodyweight" argument when you're making a sliding tackle or a block, because it's a completely natural thing to do.
But there was nothing natural about the defenders position in the first instance. Like, he's gotten down on all fours and used his arms to block the cross. It's honestly laughable.
Yep it's shocking how they have fecked this up so comprehensively when the implementation has been relatively straightforward in the WC and in the CL/EL - and that nothing has improved years in.
This red needs appealing just out of principal. Is the extra game for frivolous even a thing now. Need to make a point out of this.
We had 4 pen shouts today. We got zero. 3 of them are absolutely stonewall.
Id definitely be asking for clarity on the decision and why the VAR interfered.
Especially when the same kind of challenges were ignored 24 hours ago in different fixtures.
Seems to me that there's a concerted effort to deny us top 4. Casimero is obviously being targeted as he's one of our most important players. When you see refs instantly giving pens for City and Liverpool for dubious incidents yet ours are always denied. They have found in the clear and obvious rule an excuse to change the course of games. They know if they give a soft pen for one team it won't get overturned and can deny blatant ones and face no repercussions. The Pope incident is probably worse as they have gifted Newcastle 3 points. Sky have just made an excuse for the var official that he's inexperienced, dear me. Our players are consistently being kicked all over the pitch with no bookings but will usually pick one up instantly for a first foul, especially in big games. It's getting pathetic now and am feeling like there is a cloud hanging over the integrity of the league.
Really feels like it's added nothing besides process error on top of human error.
I just wish we could hear the VAR discussion in-game. Frustrating thing is the double-standards in the game with respect to some decisions.
Scissor tackles are so dangerous and so many players get broken ankles, sprains, damaged ligaments from them etc etc. It's just as dangerous as Casemiro's tackle, but it's one of those ones that will never, ever get punished. KWP got the ball cleanly in his tackle but injured Garnacho in the process because of how he tackled. I just don't see how the difference between that tackle and Casemiro's can be 'no foul' and 'red'.
Then you have Southampton's win at Chelsea, where the Southampton player does an overhead, misses the ball and knocks Azpilicueta out. That's so dangerous and a clear red in my eyes. But those ones seem to go into the "no intent, accidental" category and never get punished.
Felix's first game and red vs Fulham was such BS too. OK, his foot is raised but he had literally no force and there is a 0% chance of injury there. It's all just way, way, way to inconsistent and right now it's impossible to know what will/won't be reviewed.
Scissor tackles are so dangerous and so many players get broken ankles, sprains, damaged ligaments from them etc etc. It's just as dangerous as Casemiro's tackle, but it's one of those ones that will never, ever get punished. KWP got the ball cleanly in his tackle but injured Garnacho in the process because of how he tackled. I just don't see how the difference between that tackle and Casemiro's can be 'no foul' and 'red'.
Then you have Southampton's win at Chelsea, where the Southampton player does an overhead, misses the ball and knocks Azpilicueta out. That's so dangerous and a clear red in my eyes. But those ones seem to go into the "no intent, accidental" category and never get punished.
Felix's first game and red vs Fulham was such BS too. OK, his foot is raised but he had literally no force and there is a 0% chance of injury there. It's all just way, way, way to inconsistent and right now it's impossible to know what will/won't be reviewed.
2 questions need to be asked of Marriner.
Why did he intervene when the referee had already seen it and given a card?
Why did he edit the video to start after the bit where Casemiro won the ball?
Agree with this. The risk of losing an additional game is worth making the point that the decision to go from yellow was arbitrary. A yellow had been given, and there was nothing clearly and obviously wrong with that decision that required going to red after VAR review.
This is what fecks me off. Shows literally the 0.01s of his foot going into the player's leg and not the whole build up where he got the ball and his foot bouncing off the ball into that direction.
They did the same trick with Casemiro's other red. Dozens of angles showing that he was grabbing the shirt collar, and they take all the time in the world to find and cherry pick a half second loop of the only angle where it looks like he's strangling him.
Absolutely and transparently fecking bent.
Tbf my country probably have some of the most shocking ref performances ever in the world with numerous match fixing scandals. But at least here we know because someone bought them. I have no idea why the refs in the supposedly best league in the world could have the same quality as the refs in my shithole country.
I’ve argued that they should have mics aired when using VAR. it’s done in literally ALL other sports . Rugby, Cricket etc.
If someone is going to interfere then let’s hear what they are up to. Be transparent.
The fact they won’t do it further highlights a lack of integrity.
Not transparent at all mate - just FECKING bent!
In this case by 'transparent' I only mean in the sense that they don't even hide how much of a stitch up it is with the selective camera angles etc. Of course there's no actual transparency in the decision making process itself
VAR is supposed to overturn clear and obvious errors by the ref, the ref obviously saw the tackle because he booked him so what did he miss that made it a red?
They're never missing an opportunity to feck us over.
Infuriating how almost all 50/50's are consistently given against us as well.
Infuriating how almost all 50/50's are consistently given against us as well.
Surely you should show many angles to give the ref the best chance to make an informed decision? Second time they done this to us.
Why can't we hear the VAR discussion? As a viewer we deserve to know the thought process of decisions.
Once they have made up their mind, they then try to pursuade the ref. This doesn't seem the correct way to approach arriving at the correct decision.
Only showing one angle to the ref today was baffling. He should be shown every available angle to get a full picture.
Yeah it's bonkers that they don't do it. I watch rugby a lot more these days given that I'm Irish and we're doing so well, but the TMO is generally much more consistent there.
Of course they miss some here and there, but at least you can here the refs, the logic and a lot more emphasis is placed on the "on-field decision".
Exactly. We would also be able to hear what possible justification there is for Not referring tackles like Pereira and Amartey yesterday but doing so today for Casemiro. If there is some magical reason that distinguishes them, I'm sure the players, coaches, and fans would love to know so they can actually understand what the rules are again because currently it seems like a toss of a coin would be more consistent. When you watch an NFL game, the rules analyst is generally correct on what decision the refs will come to probably 75-80% of the time. With VAR currently, it is quite literally a guess.
Im not saying there is a refereeing conspiracy against us but its getting ridiculous how many big decisions are going against us these days, last week almost every big decision went against us including at least 3 possible red cards (Nunez, TAA, and Fabinho and 2 penalty shouts and today in addition to the red there were 4 seperate penalty shouts today that went against us without even being given a 2nd luck by the ref or VAR.
With VAR currently it's who they are favouring and who they don't want to make it to the CL.
The arbitrary nature of what is clear and obvious is making the game a complete mockery. They need to explain the difference between that tackle and those from the Leicester game yesterday or Fabinho against Brighton.
Yeah, we live in this bizarre world where VAR have to act like they're in an episode of law and order and have to present evidence for what they think should happen... Instead of giving refs the full picture.
I still fail to see how VAR can pick and choose what they want to look and what they don't.
It is having far too much influence on games imo. It is bording on corruption and match fixing. Especially with how they show clips to the ref, they can make something look 100x worse with the angle, speed and loop starting point.
It is a disgrace.
It is having far too much influence on games imo. It is bording on corruption and match fixing. Especially with how they show clips to the ref, they can make something look 100x worse with the angle, speed and loop starting point.
It is a disgrace.
Dunno about bent. It’s just one of the many reasons VAR is so shit. The video ref will inevitably make the onfield ref focus on the bit of the footage that looks most egregious because they’re trying to justify their decision to undermine his onfield decision, as quickly as possible. They can’t/won’t take the time necessary to show the ref all the different angles and talk through how to best interpret what happened. Because football is all about fast paced non-stop action and VAR time outs have already slowed the game down far too much. No chance of slowing it even further to use it properly.
Football as a sport was never suited to all this bollox being landed on it. So the absurdity of VAR in action is really just the inevitable consequence of human nature and unnecessary technology combined. VAR is the issue here. Not corruption.