Yeah but Ten Hag also says things like "we played well" and "I'm seeing a lot of improvements". Maybe he's got an opposite brain?Our manager says "clear penalty". Refs must love him. If it is 50:50 no problem giving it against us.
Yeah but Ten Hag also says things like "we played well" and "I'm seeing a lot of improvements". Maybe he's got an opposite brain?Our manager says "clear penalty". Refs must love him. If it is 50:50 no problem giving it against us.
They do, we just don’t get anywhereNot a penalty he’s played for it and won it, frankly I just wish our players had the street smarts to try this crap.
Of course you would, just like the Jesus one yesterday, these aren't worthy penalties according to folk on here. Whether or not Elliot "buys" it by putting his leg down is another matter, but he's lunged in and not got anywhere near the ball.Ultimately, if that was against us I'd 100% want a penalty.
I suspect most others would too.
Looks like AWB doesn’t touch him and curly throws his leg into him?Dalot's was never a penalty but this was pretty clear even if he played for it. It was a stupid lunge and he should know better.
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He didn’t wipe him out though. He slides in, completely misses and takes out Elliott because he sees him coming and leaves his right foot dangling behind to connect with Bissaka. Clever by Elliott and stupid of Bissaka. Not to mention this is after he has passed the ball to a teammate in a better position.Of course you would, just like the Jesus one yesterday, these aren't worthy penalties according to folk on here. Whether or not Elliot "buys" it by putting his leg down is another matter, but he's lunged in and not got anywhere near the ball.
There was also people looking for fouls on Rashford when he was outmuscled by Walker and the Forrest players brushing him off the ball. But sliding in and wiping a player out while also not getting anywhere near the ball is somehow not a penalty.
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At this point it would genuinely be a fairer system if refs weren't allowed to point to the spot themselves and VAR had to make the decision for them, because it's basically impossible for VAR to overturn any decisions if there is the tiniest bit of contact whether it is manufactured by the attacker or not.I'm just not sure about the Dalot one, and the fact VAR looked for so long makes me think they weren't either.
Never mind over ruling, how does VAR not chat to the ref and say “did you give that because you felt AWB took Elliotts leg?”Actually hadn't seen that angle, yeah should have been overruled.
Still fecking stupid to lunge like that though.
This is it isn't it? The discussions and the reasoning have to be available.Never mind over ruling, how does VAR not chat to the ref and say “did you give that because you felt AWB took Elliotts leg?”
Ref “yes I did”.
VAR “in THAT case, I recommend you go to the screen because he didn’t”.
This is where VAR is shit. It’s not just clear and obvious rule (which is stupid), it’s that VAR is not asking refs what the decision was for and then helping them. It’s not clear and obvious, it’s arbitrary.
If I was United, I’d ask for the audio of that discussion at the next press conference and play that video.
It’s arguably worse than the shit Chelsea were given, at least there was defender initiated contact for those (though both still never penalties).
These and the Fulham game and the Arsenal game have cost us several points and the media are still fecking moaning about Wolves and referencing Onana punch from the start of the season
It was a brainless lunge inside of the box, and the Liverpool player was without of the doubt looking for a foul but I don't understand why the VAR didn't call the ref over.Actually hadn't seen that angle, yeah should have been overruled.
Still fecking stupid to lunge like that though.
i think it was implemented after Taylor got demoted for his penalty decision against wolves that VAR didnt overturnThis is it isn't it? The discussions and the reasoning have to be available.
But they don't release them all to the public. Every single one should be released.i think it was implemented after Taylor got demoted for his penalty decision against wolves that VAR didnt overturn
You're winning 2-1 with about 5 mins left, it's absolutely stupid to dive into that tackle in the box. Elliott does dangle the leg, but even if he doesn't he's not avoiding contact with AWB.He didn’t wipe him out though. He slides in, completely misses and takes out Elliott because he sees him coming and leaves his right foot dangling behind to connect with Bissaka. Clever by Elliott and stupid of Bissaka. Not to mention this is after he has passed the ball to a teammate in a better position.
i thought there wasnt much in the Walker - Rashford situation, should have done better to stay on his feet, but when you see the level of contact for the penalties that Chelsea were awarded then you’d be daft not to question why Rashford got feck all.
What is the point of VAR if they don’t intervene there? Struggling to understand why teams don’t threaten to go on strike until it’s abolished, it’s been years now and it’s not getting better.And this is just ridiculous. To not send him to the monitor to look at it again ….
It’s getting to the point where a team walks off. I’ve never been a fan of things like that because I’ve always though stuff evens out and most calls are grey… VAR stopped that
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I thought the same but actually it wasn’t that bad an attempt, he was side on and tried to poke the ball away, then fell behind him. If Elliot didn’t throw his leg backwards and then flop forwards it would have been fine. Just a missed attempt at poking the ball, he wasn’t sliding into him or anything.You're winning 2-1 with about 5 mins left, it's absolutely stupid to dive into that tackle in the box. Elliott does dangle the leg, but even if he doesn't he's not avoiding contact with AWB.
It's brain dead defending and braindead defending has cost Utd 7 points in 3 games this last week.
his whole body turns following the ball then he angles his trailing leg into wan bisakka I don’t know how you can argue “he’s not avoiding contact” if that was true he wouldn’t have had to trail his leg like thatYou're winning 2-1 with about 5 mins left, it's absolutely stupid to dive into that tackle in the box. Elliott does dangle the leg, but even if he doesn't he's not avoiding contact with AWB.
It's brain dead defending and braindead defending has cost Utd 7 points in 3 games this last week.
It's weird because I can see why the ref gave them both, and in real time I called the AWB as not been a pen, and the Dalot one as dead cert for one, where in reality I think the Elliot one was just about a pen, whereas the Dalot one I don't think it was, so I can see why the refs have such a hard time with it.At this point it would genuinely be a fairer system if refs weren't allowed to point to the spot themselves and VAR had to make the decision for them, because it's basically impossible for VAR to overturn any decisions if there is the tiniest bit of contact whether it is manufactured by the attacker or not.
We won't get any more penalties ourselves, but at least the bar would be a bit higher for penalties against us. The Madueke and Elliott dives are particularly annoying, because they had either run out of space, or overrun the ball and even if they had actually been fouled they weren't in dangerous positions at all. The punishment really doesn't fit the crime in these situations and given that diving in the box is now basically fair game, surely indirect free kicks would be a better punishment for players running away from goal and taking a tumble.
Imagine the outrage if Liverpool conceded 3 penalties like that in a week. Against Chelsea, Van Dijk made 2 tackles in the box that were clearer penalties than anything we've seen over the past few days and there was barely a peep about them not being given after the game.
We're bad enough already without also having to play against divers, gullible refs and the media.
i don’t think anyone has argued it wasnt absolutely stupid to dive in? Still doesnt change the fact that Elliott trails his leg and even moves it towards Bissaka. You can clearly see how he shifts his body to go down. If he doesnt do it and gets taken out by Bissaka, then by all means…but everyone is able to see what actually happensYou're winning 2-1 with about 5 mins left, it's absolutely stupid to dive into that tackle in the box. Elliott does dangle the leg, but even if he doesn't he's not avoiding contact with AWB.
It's brain dead defending and braindead defending has cost Utd 7 points in 3 games this last week.
Dalot tripped and took their man down.It's weird because I can see why the ref gave them both, and in real time I called the AWB as not been a pen, and the Dalot one as dead cert for one, where in reality I think the Elliot one was just about a pen, whereas the Dalot one I don't think it was, so I can see why the refs have such a hard time with it.
I'll never understand why the ref can't be sent to the screen for virtually every pen that is given, they were the ones who know what they think they have seen, so let the screen comfirm it (or otherwise), but we're left in the stupid position where they are only sent to the screen if it's a blatant clear error, so we all know the only outcome is that they are going to change their mind.
It is obvious that VAR wasn't sure about the Dalot one, but were too weak to follow through on that doubt.
Stay on your feet and don't dive in.I thought the same but actually it wasn’t that bad an attempt, he was side on and tried to poke the ball away, then fell behind him. If Elliot didn’t throw his leg backwards and then flop forwards it would have been fine. Just a missed attempt at poking the ball, he wasn’t sliding into him or anything.
Odd.It's weird because I can see why the ref gave them both, and in real time I called the AWB as not been a pen, and the Dalot one as dead cert for one, where in reality I think the Elliot one was just about a pen, whereas the Dalot one I don't think it was, so I can see why the refs have such a hard time with it.
I'll never understand why the ref can't be sent to the screen for virtually every pen that is given, they were the ones who know what they think they have seen, so let the screen comfirm it (or otherwise), but we're left in the stupid position where they are only sent to the screen if it's a blatant clear error, so we all know the only outcome is that they are going to change their mind.
It is obvious that VAR wasn't sure about the Dalot one, but were too weak to follow through on that doubt.
Which FA law says a silly decision by a defender = a penalty?Stay on your feet and don't dive in.
Simple rules for defending inside the box that kids get thought at u10s.
I love moaning about referees and VAR as much as the next person, but AWB has no business going to ground there. The game the way it is any contact and it is a penalty and VAR do not overturn where there is contact, whether it's engineered or not. It's easy to blame the referee here, but I'd blame poor defending more so. Anotny the other night, gets caught wrong side, knee to knee contact it's a penalty. Same as Dalot, gets turned on the wing gets caught wrong side and falls into the player from behind while trying to recover. Soft penalty perhaps, but it's bad defending that's led to that situation in the first place.
Players need to be smarter and not give the referees a chance to give those decisions.
The thing with it is that the Chelsea player didn't go down with contact that tripped up Dalot, yet did with contact from an arm that most people could easily run through.Dalot tripped and took their man down.
Am I missing some doubt with that one?
Does AWB need to touch him for it to be a penalty?The foul on Elliott is a clear penalty.
If Wan Bisaka stays on his feet then it doesn't happen.
Elliott is looking for it, but it's no different to the penalties that Ashley Young and Martial used to 'win' week in week out under Solskjaer.
He misses the ball then brings him down with his other leg?Does AWB need to touch him for it to be a penalty?
There's no law, it's just common sense.Which FA law says a silly decision by a defender = a penalty?
We’d end up without tackles and the game is getting diluted too much already
I just about agree, but I bet if the ref didn't give it in real time then it wouldn't have been given afterwards.The foul on Elliott is a clear penalty.
If Wan Bisaka stays on his feet then it doesn't happen.
Elliott is looking for it, but it's no different to the penalties that Ashley Young and Martial used to 'win' week in week out under Solskjaer.
nopeHe misses the ball then brings him down with his other leg?
And if you do dive in, you have to get a foot to the fecking ball. Otherwise it’s penalty.There's no law, it's just common sense.
Don't dive in in the box unless you absolutely have to. He didn't have to, he made contact with the player, referee gave a penalty, VAR doesn't over turn anything where there is contact.
Like I said, it's easy to blame the referee and VAR, it's easier for AWB just to stay on his feet, but that would require a brain, it's a stupid decision to go to ground and he's cost his team 3 points.