Was the Casemiro signing a mistake?

[sullydnl]

Curious to see where general opinion currently is on this.

Only a few months ago it seemed like few held this opinion, with him having played a key part in us finishing in the top four last season. Seeming justification for those who argued that signing him was a no-brainer as he was a "winner" who would instantly improve the team.

However, at this point with his poor form and now being injured until after Christmas, I see more people here arguing that he's shot. Seeming justification for those who argued that spending £60m+ on a 30-year old DM was stupid and short-termist.

So where do you currently stand? And if we were in that same position again, able to sign a 30 year old who would immediately fix a major hole in the team but with the risk of being a short term fix, would you still want us to take it? Or should this profile of signing be avoided entirely?

 

[UnofficialDevil]

He is going to be 33 and on 350.000 a week in a couple of years so yes.

 

[Dr. Dwayne]

20/20.

 

[GazTheLegend]

I think it was a panic buy after we failed to sign de Jong. It bought us Champions League football at least so I consider it a mixed success and he's still a first team player so... maybe not a failure exactly. A success with reservations. Ten Hag's second best signing so far, after Martinez.

 

[Ali Dia]

I didn’t want him last season. Short term. Nothing left to prove. Massive money all round. I thought he’d become another Matic which would stop us buying a more suitable young player for x amount r of years. Then he proved me wrong by being our best player in patches. Also the young lads needed some leadership in the squad.

This season has proven my initial thoughts to be correct but he definitely is still a good player he just doesn’t seem fit yet for whatever reason.

 

[Jaae]

Endomorph athletes don’t age well. Spending £60m on a 30yo Kroos or Modric is another thing altogether.

We should have taken one look at Casemiro’s fat cheeks and turned away.

 

[UnitedSofa]

Bad run of form and he’s immediately a “bad buy” - when the majority of the forum were singing his praises during last season.

Football fans are a fickle bunch.

 

[Lay]

Short term solution, long term problem.

If we can offload him at the end of the season, then I wouldn't worry too much about it

 

[Leftback99]

Yes, was always likely to go this way. Was never a fan of it.

 

[Bobski]

Short term signings can make sense for pushing a team over the edge in competing for major trophies, and no the league cup don't count. Adding them to teams in transition when they are invariably going to need replaced by the time the team gets to the level needed is questionable. Varane also falls into this question. Not just about age, have to be hungry, when you add guys who have won everything and have little to prove you are asking for trouble.

 

[Greyfog]

Endomorph athletes don’t age well. Spending £60m on a 30yo Kroos or Modric is another thing altogether.

We should have taken one look at Casemiro’s fat cheeks and turned away.

 

[noodlehair]

Hes been a good signing. His form really hasn't been that poor considering he's been in midfield on his own a lot of the time and has still performed better than anyone else we've put there, and is currently also our best forward.

Our team also invariably looks worse on paper and plays worse when he isn't in it.

The caf has this thing where if things aren't going well the players who actually are better than the mess unfolding around them seem to become targets, on the basis they're incapable of playing enough like a super human to do much about it.

 

[Garnacho's Shoelaces]

Endomorph athletes don’t age well. Spending £60m on a 30yo Kroos or Modric is another thing altogether.

We should have taken one look at Casemiro’s fat cheeks and turned away.

Endomorphism is a myth.

 

[DavelinaJolie]

It was a short-term signing that helped the team get Champions League for a season, but I think the mistake is it wasn't a short-term outlay or contract.

I guess we'll see where it goes, but I'm concerned it was a quick fix at a position that will require further attention in the next few windows.

 

[bosnian_red]

Depends. I still think he can be a quality player in the right set up. Ten Hags current set up asks far too much of him.

Generally speaking, a squad that is far away from challenging should take a long term view, and not make their most important piece a 30 year old arguably best in the world DM where the system falls apart if he's no longer best in the world level. That's a bad system.

 

[gormless]

I think he goes to Saudi at the end of the year. If so, then he’s been a great short term signing.
If he sticks round and continues to decline then it’s probably a mistake but would still have a role to play on occasion.
Reminds me of Matic in so many ways. World class midfielder signed years too late. Gives us a good year then declined

 

[Eric_the_Red99]

He obviously played a key role in last season’s success - we probably wouldn’t have won a cup and made it to the Champions League without him - and so from that point of view it’d be silly to say it was a mistake.

But his signing points to the more general problem of us spending big on either stopgap measures or low percentage punts, instead of properly building something for the future.

 

[Champ]

Quality signing last season, hasn't got going this season.
Usually takes him a few games to get up to speed and what with our poor run of form it seems like he hasn't been able to get himself going.
The longish term injury is unfortunate.

 

[Zoo]

Wouldn’t have got CL without him. Not his fault season 2 under United manager is going pear-shaped yet again.

 

[BootsyCollins]

No not at all, the mistake was not buying a younger cover for him.

 

[AnotherLondonManc]

He's been in bad form this season and everyone is losing their minds.

He's not finished as a top DM yet, and I'd be surprised if he's not at least a very useful squad player for the rest of his contract.

Expensive? Sure. But a mistake? There are a lot of players here who fit that description better than Casemiro.

 

[Yorkeontop]

First thought, "we've made worse."

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Himself and Eriksen got us into the Champion’s League. At which point we should have beefed up our squad from a position of strength, able to offer CL football to ambitious, world class footballers. To spend as much money as we did and end up with only a very raw young striker, Mason Mount, Amrabat and Andre Onana seems like a horrible waste of that opportunity. Which, in turn, makes a gamble on a short term investment like Casemiro look worse than it is.

I also think there’s an element of unpredictable, old fashioned bad luck here. Plenty of very good footballers don’t decline as quickly as Casemiro seems to have. For this to happen after Rooney, RvP, Sanchez, Schweinsteiger and Falcao all hit a wall at as similar age seems desperately unlucky to me.

 

[USREDEVIL]

He was so good last year, at least most of it. We were praising him regularly for putting steel into the midfield. If he can comeback after Christmas and do it again i say no. If not, then yes.

 

[Walrus]

He did better than I expected last season, he paying that money for a 30+ year old was never a great investment. It was a question of when his legs went, not if - I had thought we would get another year or two out of him at least.

 

[mu4c_20le]

Yes, it was always going to be a short term solution.

 

[lex talionis]

Was the Casemiro signing a mistake?

No.

Imagine had we stuck it out with McFred or Eriksen as our CDM last season. I seriously doubt we would have even made the Europa League again.

 

[RG77]

I do think you should have paid more.

 

[Leftback99]

Rice would have been a far better signing.

 

[2 man midfield]

Yes. I said at the time it’s more short term thinking, and we’d need to replace him a couple of years down the line when we should be working on other areas of the squad. It’s like playing whack-a-mole - how can you plug all these holes when the same ones keep popping up? It’s like when we bought Matic for 40m, we got one good season out of him, and then needed another DM as his legs had gone.

So while this upcoming summer should be spent trying to find Casemiro a midfield partner, we’ll be after his direct replacement.

 

[El Zoido]

He was amazing for most of last season, a joy to watch. God knows how last season would’ve gone without him. So on those grounds, no, it was not a mistake. He’d probably have been a lot better this season had the entire team not been a disjointed mess.

 

[Reiver]

I don't think it can be fairly judged one way or another just yet. But so far, definitely no.

 

[Cantonagotmehere]

No not at all, the mistake was not buying a younger cover for him.

This. There is no way he should have been asked to play so much for United.

 

[DJ Jeff]

I don't see the point of a short term signing to achieve nothing in the short term, with no chance of achieving anything in the short term. He was gonna give us 2, 3 years tops. What were we ever going to win of significance in that time?

 

[Scandi Red]

Endomorph athletes don’t age well.

That's endomorphist!

 

[tomaldinho1]

Ask this at the start of next season.

First, he might rediscover a run of form and, secondly, we might be able to shift him for big money to Saudi.

 

[simonhch]

Casemiro is the player you buy when your other two midfield pieces are in place and you need a steady, high quality, experienced anchor for an otherwise young but ready midfield. He is not the player you buy to build your midfield around. Not at that stage of his career. Signing him wasn’t a mistake but spending 60m plus on him was. The Mount and Casemiro money should’ve been spent on a world class or on the cusp of being world class #8, to partner Bruno. If we were spending huge money on a holding player we’d have been better off not signing Casemiro or Mount and instead getting Rice for 100m.

That would’ve given us Rice, Bruno plus one other. Mainoo would fit nicely in there, and you’ve still got McTominay, Hannibal and Eriksen from the current squad. That would be proper squad building. You don’t spend 65m on a 30 year old holding midfielder. It’s short sighted as feck.

 

[Ayoba]

In the words of turnback tony

"Fifty fifty, fifty fifty"

 

[tomaldinho1]

I don't see the point of a short term signing to achieve nothing in the short term, with no chance of achieving anything in the short term. He was gonna give us 2, 3 years tops. What were we ever going to win of significance in that time?

This is United recruitment all over.

Murtough: 'Guys, I'm really excited about this window and showing you what I can do.'
Arnold: 'Great, what's the plan?'
Murtough: 'We've given Erik a few familiar faces as he's a new manager but now De Jong is off the table, I'm looking forward to showing my worth and finding a DM replacement'.
Arnold: 'Definitely, just remember the profile of player we're after with Erik's Ajax background and ideally we don't have another Cavani, Ronaldo, Matic type signing right? Maybe someone more dynamic and less expensive!'
Murotugh: 'Yes boss, leave it with me'

Signs Casemiro for £70m on £350k a week.

 

[Lash]

Endomorph athletes don’t age well. Spending £60m on a 30yo Kroos or Modric is another thing altogether.

We should have taken one look at Casemiro’s fat cheeks and turned away.

His dad wasn't fat though, so there was conflicting evidence. It was a calculated risk.