What to do with Wayne Rooney?
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik @Rood and Imran @Annihilate Now! start with the good news by celebrating Manchester United Women's emphatic FA Cup win over Spurs at Wembley and the future of manager Marc Skinner.
Then it's the bad news and the ever worsening form of our Men with losses to Arsenal and Palace.
Finally the main debate - ETH Out now or keep him until the end of the season - if not longer. Are you Team Nik or Team Imran?
Play Rooney up top and give him adequate service and he will get the goals for us.
Put a necklace on that gives him electric shocks whenever he strays out of position too much as a striker.
He's here for the long hall now. for better or for worse.
Play him up-front and provide some competition for the starting spot.
Getting rid of him doesn't make any sense, but since this is Caf at it finest, let's sell fat bastard and give RVP a chance to walk himself around for the whole season.
Getting rid of him doesn't make any sense, but since this is Caf at it finest, let's sell fat bastard and give RVP a chance to walk himself around for the whole season.
From Jewish kid at Christmas to abused spouse, a United Hallmark movie can't be far off.
So will Berahino.
It's never going to happen but I'd sell him. He in no way justifies the wages he's on and I really do fear that if we go into next season with him as our main striker we won't be winning anything. He just isn't that good anymore, he'll have the odd run of games where he plays well but it never ever lasts and then he'll go on one of his routine 7 or 8 weeks without scoring.
Seeing as though I think we're stuck with him and Van Gaal will always play him he has to be up front. Not just off the striker and certainly not in central midfield.
Seeing as though I think we're stuck with him and Van Gaal will always play him he has to be up front. Not just off the striker and certainly not in central midfield.
Every year this discussion comes up as to whether he's still got it etc and mind you this has been far from his best season but hasn't been his worst either with having done decently as captain for the first time. The talks about rejuvenating our attack(forwards) makes sense when the players we've already purchased perform to their fullest capacity, not when our star attacking signings hardly perform. Last year, on paper with the likes of Di Maria, Falcao, RVP most on here thought Rooney was done for and would be outshone by others but unfortunately football at United doesn't work like that these days. The strongest players on paper look the most out of place on the pitch and the players the fans wanted out (Young, Fellaini) came back to claim their rightful place in the starting XI by playing better. Optimally, I would prefer if it Van Gaal brought the best out of his strongest players as opposed to resurrecting squad players' careers because they seemed to fit the system better.
The point being, in this state of transition where most of the squad from a couple years back is vanishing and with newer players coming in, keeping Rooney for 1-2 years more seems wise. Hopefully if Depay or Di Maria becomes our new star player this season, I think Van Gaal would be much more comfortable with the idea of letting Wayne go to bring in younger legs at the tip of the attacking spear.
The point being, in this state of transition where most of the squad from a couple years back is vanishing and with newer players coming in, keeping Rooney for 1-2 years more seems wise. Hopefully if Depay or Di Maria becomes our new star player this season, I think Van Gaal would be much more comfortable with the idea of letting Wayne go to bring in younger legs at the tip of the attacking spear.
FFS
Antics aside Wayne Rooney deserves his place it the squad. He was our best forward last season and when played solely upfront he has a lot to offer.
I think he will have a great season next, I predict 20 goals+ and I'm not really sure who else is available to offer us that.
I'll be happy to see him break Bobby's record he has worked hard. You don't become uniteds all time top scorer without giving it your a all. Fair play.
I think he will have a great season next, I predict 20 goals+ and I'm not really sure who else is available to offer us that.
I'll be happy to see him break Bobby's record he has worked hard. You don't become uniteds all time top scorer without giving it your a all. Fair play.
Play him up front and no where else. If he can't hack it - put him on the bench. Get a good back up and/or someone good enough to compete with him. Think LVG is getting Rooney psychologically wrong - you make him feel too secure and he loses that drive and aggression. Give him some competition and watch him get fired up and wanting to prove something. I've observed Rooney being like this a few times, so I think it's an effective tool. At the moment, making him untouchable is causing him to lose his 'edge' just a bit which unfortunately is not what we want from him.
Yes but we've got Rooney and havent got Berahino in our squad.
I dont want him or something but every PL striker will score 20 goals when he's in a well gelled team who creates lots of chances. Even Danny Welbz. Why pay him 300k while many other could do the job he could? If you pay a player that money, you expect him to make the difference, he should force things, he should be our catalyst. Rooney isnt really more.
Play Rooney as the first choice striker. Simple. There's not many better ones out there that you can buy. He'll score goals, guaranteed.
Being our best forward last season wasn't the biggest of achievements when you are competing with RvP and Falcao in the states they were in. The Rooney of 2009/12 is the calibre of striker we should have as our #9 right now. The Rooney of 2012 till present is not good enough to be our lone striker if we want to get back into the elite tier of clubs in Europe again. I predict he will get somewhere between 15-20 goals next season, the days of him getting 20+ are behind him imo. That being said, we have no options right now except to play him as the #9 but boy oh boy if he gets injured we are in trouble!
Can't change his wages anymore. He will stay at United, get his enormous wages and will score goals for us. No other club in the world will/can pay him his current wages so he wont leave. Better use him as our main 20+ goal striker instead of putting him on the bench and buy another multi million pound striker with huge wages.
I think he is still a very decent striker, he might not be worth the wages he currently gets and he may not be as good as everyone hoped he would become when he signed but he is still one of our better players and captain.
Also he has still value for the club. When you see Wayne Rooney you think of Manchester United. When you see Manchester United you think of Wayne Rooney. He has a big marketing value since he is still considered a bit of a superstar player.
He is not going anywhere especially that he is now at his most marketable with his imminent breaking of all-time records.
My only hope is that he would no longer hold the role of our main player but that also is not going to happen. No other team realistically wants him for his football skills so we are stuck with him until his contract is up or at least until he breaks the records.
We are shafted because he is not good enough to lead us to victory of any kind and no really top player is going to come to us knowing he will be second fiddle to Rooney.
So, in conclusion, prepare yourselves for a continued trophy drought. Thank God Liverpool is not good enough to capitalise on it
My only hope is that he would no longer hold the role of our main player but that also is not going to happen. No other team realistically wants him for his football skills so we are stuck with him until his contract is up or at least until he breaks the records.
We are shafted because he is not good enough to lead us to victory of any kind and no really top player is going to come to us knowing he will be second fiddle to Rooney.
So, in conclusion, prepare yourselves for a continued trophy drought. Thank God Liverpool is not good enough to capitalise on it
Sell. I'd rather we selected other players; individuals that can be dropped if not performing well.
Sign competition, stop treating him as an untouchable star.
I think the whole "unstoppable" thing was a confidence move from LVG. He recognised that Rooney needs to be loved and needs to be he star man which is probably a fair assumtion.
I think the whole "unstoppable" thing was a confidence move from LVG. He recognised that Rooney needs to be loved and needs to be he star man which is probably a fair assumtion.
That would be ideal, but indeed theres no way realistically that we're selling him. But cant stand the get him decent service and he'll score you 20 goals argument, so he's class. I think almost every PL striker who starts could get that. Other than that, Rooney has scored over 20 pl goals just twice in his career, I doubt he'd even get that so easy said, would be a genuine challenge for him, as he isnt even as good as he used to be. Hope he surprises me tho.
Yeah good comment. The problem with giving him too much 'love' is that it makes him a tad complacent - that's my big issue with all this because I don't think it benefits him in the long run. He's not especially driven like Ronaldo - who likes to obviously be the 'main' man but at the same time he channels that in the right way i.e. it adds more belief that he can achieve what he sets out to do. Rooney is not like that - he needs a different approach imo.
Tripe and the fact you went as far to mention Welbeck is laughable. Many thought Danny would prove us horribly wrong last season and he ended up looking exactly as he did for us in a very well functioning Arsenal team. Get the right balance in the team and the righ players around Rooney and he will be up there with Costa and the likes. Funny you mention Aguero, who is undoubtedly an amazing player but has spent the last years being served by Silva and Toure who people refer to as the best in the League in their positions on a regular basis. Rooney has had to fill in so many roles that we can't possibly rule him out as a top striker, indeed he has proven time and again that his finishing is still on point.
It's simple, we need to get a proper functioning midfield with depth and creativity to ensure Rooney doesn't need to fill in there anymore, getting Schneiderlin and someone in the mould of Gundogan and allow Herrera or Mata play closer to goal would, in theory be perfect. Get 2 wingers who are quick and capable of playing on the inside and outside (which we on paper have in Di Maria, Depay and even Mata at a push. Personally I hope Janujaz can really step up next year because he'd be perfect for this role even if his future lies as a no 10.
The fact is our team hasn't been functioning for a few years now and Rooney has had to play a multitude of roles. Now compare that to the teams Ronaldo, Messi, Aguero (fair enough currently City are struggling a bit), Benzema, Costa etc.have found themselves in and it's no wonder Rooney has performed worse. Despite this he has been consistently out best attacker since RVP has lost his touch.
Edit: this ties hand in hand with the constant bitching we have had for years about the state of our current squad and we have been regressing since the year we lost Ronaldo.
I said at the time we should of just sold him, but Moyes was allowed to give him that 5 year deal. The new contracts we gave Nani and Rooney at the time were massive mistakes.
Rooney isn't a top level striker anymore. He wouldn't be a starter for any other side in the top 4.
Rooney isn't a top level striker anymore. He wouldn't be a starter for any other side in the top 4.
And how do you explain RvP's world class season when he was surrounded by Cleverley, Nani, Valencia, Kagawa and the likes? A world class player shouldnt be as over reliant as you're talking. Suarez lifted Liverpool to a higher level, you want United to lift Rooneh to another level. That's the difference. Even when we played Rooney as a striker, some of his performances were horrendous and he wasnt a big goal threat. Rooney jas a lot of qualities, but in recent years he just hasnt portrayed them enough imo.
If everything around you has to be right before you can perform, I doubt you are really world class tbf.
Btw, didnt Welbeck get us a solid return during Moyes his stint? Honestly dont really rate him, as he has the same problem as Rooney. I dont think they get themselves in goalscoring positions enough for their club.
I think he would
Play behind Costa for Chelsea, next to Aguero for city and ahead of Giroud for Arsenal
Do we need this thread? Should it not be merged with some other old Rooney discussion thread. Nothing new here. Just a thread title that seem sensational.
Should be locked IMO.
Should be locked IMO.
Bullshit. Certain fans have had an agenda against him since he pulled his contract shit. The same type of fan's who claim Pogba was just a money grabbing cnut and his leaving had nothing to do with playing time. Gotta love those internet top reds, even when most of them have never been to a game.
Play the man up front, in his proper position. Give him the proper support and tell him to focus all his energy on scoring. None of this "strikers need to be attacking midfielders capable of threading passes through to other players instead of focusing on scoring" nonsense.
@kidbob makes some good points I feel - but as others have stated, a "good" striker can thrive when given plenty of chances by a functioning and creative midfield/wingers. An "excellent" forward can score plenty of goals even without that luxury, and the likes of Aguero, Suarez and Hazard (as recent PL examples) definitely fit into that category, and have generally been instrumental in the success of their respective teams (obviously in Liverpool's case, coming second rather than winning the league still represented a major achievement for them).
It is that star quality that we have lacked. If the likes of Di Maria and Depay deliver in a big way next season, then the burden on Rooney will definitely be lower and I am sure he will be a decent part of the team, but as things stand I cant see him being that star player for us, but just another cog in the machine. Put it this way, in very few if any of his seasons at the club could you argue he was one of the best players in the league (he won it once in 09/10, but that is it).
It is that star quality that we have lacked. If the likes of Di Maria and Depay deliver in a big way next season, then the burden on Rooney will definitely be lower and I am sure he will be a decent part of the team, but as things stand I cant see him being that star player for us, but just another cog in the machine. Put it this way, in very few if any of his seasons at the club could you argue he was one of the best players in the league (he won it once in 09/10, but that is it).
Your post holds no content, what exactly is bullshit? He hasnt made an completely delusional point.
Play him up top in a 433 he will score goals
Play him up front in a well functioning team where he doesn't need to be moved around in order to help where he isn't a specialist. He still has that drive and hunger and he although he's lost a step, isn't really as washed up as some will lead you to believe. If he fails to impress in a well functioning team then we can flog him.
Sadly there really isn't a better striker available to us on the market. All the other strikers that are clearly better than him are unattainable to us as they play for teams that wouldn't sell them to us so simply replacing him isn't a real option.
We somehow expect our strikers to produce in teams where the supply is sometimes non existent for long periods of time. Change that then we can put all the blame on them not getting it done.
In attack we have depay and Di maria who could give him the support he needs due to the variety the both present to the team. One is a strong ball carrier and creative influence while the other is a big goal threat, has great hold up play due to his strength. If di maria continues to be a bust, then we can through Mata in there. Sort out a decent looking midfield behind them that doesn't include the likes of Fellaini then we could be heading somewhere.
Sadly there really isn't a better striker available to us on the market. All the other strikers that are clearly better than him are unattainable to us as they play for teams that wouldn't sell them to us so simply replacing him isn't a real option.
We somehow expect our strikers to produce in teams where the supply is sometimes non existent for long periods of time. Change that then we can put all the blame on them not getting it done.
In attack we have depay and Di maria who could give him the support he needs due to the variety the both present to the team. One is a strong ball carrier and creative influence while the other is a big goal threat, has great hold up play due to his strength. If di maria continues to be a bust, then we can through Mata in there. Sort out a decent looking midfield behind them that doesn't include the likes of Fellaini then we could be heading somewhere.
Case closed
Rooney is still a good player but, I feel he plays better when he is partnered with another striker who is great at hold up play(Van Persie aside). As such, I feel getting another striker will manage to get the best out of Rooney.
However, I also feel that we will never go to the next level(champions league glory) as long as Rooney is in our main man. He lost all his explosive footballing ability that is needed to reach that level and he is now a more intelligent, calculable player that is perhaps only good enough to challenge and even win a domestic cup or league. As such, I would play to other players strength and rely less on Rooney being the main man in our team going forward.
Schneiderlin - Herrera
Di Maria - Rooney - Depay
Kane/Benteke
However, I also feel that we will never go to the next level(champions league glory) as long as Rooney is in our main man. He lost all his explosive footballing ability that is needed to reach that level and he is now a more intelligent, calculable player that is perhaps only good enough to challenge and even win a domestic cup or league. As such, I would play to other players strength and rely less on Rooney being the main man in our team going forward.
Schneiderlin - Herrera
Di Maria - Rooney - Depay
Kane/Benteke
1/2
Reason being, we'll most likely need another striker, as it looks like Van Persie will be leaving.
I think the striker that comes in should be good enough to rotate with Rooney when he is either:
Question is, who's going to be happy being rotated, because you'd expect Rooney to play the majority of games, whether that be up top or as a 10.
Reason being, we'll most likely need another striker, as it looks like Van Persie will be leaving.
I think the striker that comes in should be good enough to rotate with Rooney when he is either:
- Injured/rested
- Played in the 10 position
Question is, who's going to be happy being rotated, because you'd expect Rooney to play the majority of games, whether that be up top or as a 10.
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Benteke in my opinion is good enough to start and also not that good enough that he should be put in the starting lineup every game. He might be the player that would be a good rotation option for Rooney in the main striker role. Sort of like Bony or Dzeko at City.
On his day he can do what few people can. Although his genius is evidently more and more fleeting, I still live in hope tbaqt LVG can guide him to those heights regularly. Time is running out though.
Play him up front because he's far worse in midfield or anywhere else. No accommodating him anymore, if he can't cut it up front move him on and bring in a striker.
Those players were decent back then and not the punchlines they became later. And you forgot to mention Rooney who often was the one setting up RVP that season.