Where does Cristiano Ronaldo rank amongst the pantheon of greats?

[Robaldo]

Cristiano and Messi are the top two in history, in my opinion.

I'd always had Messi above him but I'm considering it for the first time in years right now.

People that call Luis Ronaldo the 'Real Ronaldo' can have a day off

 

[Moby]

Certainly behind Pele and Maradona, comparable to the rest.

 

[Vialli_92]

That's rather surprising.
From your initial criterion for Zidane being better than Ronaldo I think you need to reserve quite a few spaces in your top 5 for players like Laudrup and whoever else fits it.

Well I never seen Laudrup play he was before my time, I can only judge players on who I have watched

 

[KirkDuyt]

Perhaps, apart from nostalgia, another factor is the amount of coverage we get today. We see every match every presser everything they do. In the nineties and before we only saw our local team and the highlight of some of the others. We never saw the boring 0-0 games where Zidane might’ve been anonymous, we saw his volley in the CL final. Seeing only a few glimpses of someone makes them mythical. There’s no myth today. When Ronaldo farts we know about it before it even smells.

 

[Robbo's Shoulder]

There have been better all round players than Ronaldo but very very few as effective. I rate Ronaldo alongside Messi as the 2 best i have seen in 46 years of watching football and i include Maradona in that. I do believe that Van Baston would have been in their company if injuries hadn't curtailed his career.

 

[Maagge]

Perhaps, apart from nostalgia, another factor is the amount of coverage we get today. We see every match every presser everything they do. In the nineties and before we only saw our local team and the highlight of some of the others. We never saw the boring 0-0 games where Zidane might’ve been anonymous, we saw his volley in the CL final. Seeing only a few glimpses of someone makes them mythical. There’s no myth today. When Ronaldo farts we know about it before it even smells.

Do you think Ronaldo is a farter? I can't decide.

 

[BusbyMalone]

Since I've been watching football (early/mid 90s) he's the second best layer I've known. He's second behind, yes, you guessed it, Messi. I've obviously never watched Maradona or Pele etc., so i can only go on what i've read and heard about them, and the reverence shown to them by the people who have watched them, and i absolutely think Ronaldo deserves to be in the same category as them.

The thing that puts Messi ahead for me is the joy that he brings. I don't get that with Ronaldo. I have a huge admiration and respect for him and his ability to remain as consistent as he has been at the top is incredible, but i don't get much joy from watching him. That goal last night aside, obviously. That was fecking ridiculous. But everything is just so mechanical and robotic about him. He is a goal machine and his stats are incredible, but it's a little joyless imo.

I know it sounds incredibly churlish to criticise him for being a "goal machine" but I'm just judging him by ludicrously high standards. And it's all subjective at the end of the day.

 

[Gio]

Perhaps, apart from nostalgia, another factor is the amount of coverage we get today. We see every match every presser everything they do. In the nineties and before we only saw our local team and the highlight of some of the others. We never saw the boring 0-0 games where Zidane might’ve been anonymous, we saw his volley in the CL final. Seeing only a few glimpses of someone makes them mythical. There’s no myth today. When Ronaldo farts we know about it before it even smells.

Works both ways. We get to see every glimpse of the quality they produce every week. When their teams are so stacked, the opportunity to show off their quality is greater than in many a generation.

 

[KirkDuyt]

Works both ways. We get to see every glimpse of the quality they produce every week. When their teams are so stacked, the opportunity to show off their quality is greater than in many a generation.

True, the competition is less spread out today than it was 30 years ago that's for sure. Imagine Messi or Ronaldo playing for Napoli now. Would never happen.

 

[2mufc0]

Pele still the GOAT imo, key player in 3 world cup wins is unheard of, backed by a robust domestic career and the overall package just in terms of nearly all attributes as a footballer.

Ronaldo is top 5-10 for me.

 

[Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber]

On a serious note, where does Cristiano now rank? IMO comparisons to you-know-how have always been unfair, despite him putting in a serious effort.. IMO there still remains an overall class differential but taking him out of the equation, where should Cristiano generally rank at this stage of his career.

A few years ago. many wouldn't have even had him in the top ten but by sheer force of will and the increasingly clutch nature of his performances means anything outside the top ten is ludicrous and he's got to the point where it might seem terribly biased to not even have in the top 5 all time list.

For me he's still behind Pele, Messi, Maradona and Beckenbauer (best defensive/midfield player) but he has reached the point where one could validly argue he's edged ahead of guys like Cruyff, Van Basten and R9.

Di Stefano? I don't know arguably not but where do you think he should be ranked. I think a greater appreciation needs to be shown towards his standing in the game because how often is it, you get two possibly top 5 candidates in the same generation of football. It is time he got the love he deserved.. probably the most unloved 'great' footballer there has been IMO which is a damn shame.

He and Messi sit level with Di Stefano. But still behind the top 3. Beckenbauer, Pele and Maradona.

 

[K2K]

Top 5

 

[tenpoless]

Nostalgia is a powerful thing, when both Ronaldo and Messi retired, people will then talk about how They were the GOATs and better than Maradona and Pele. I personally think both him and Messi deserve to be in the Greatest of All Time list and ahead of the players from older generation.

Football has evolved so much that Sport science is becoming a norm. Ronaldo is not only very, very talented but also has the desire and personality to be on top, add Sport Science to that and He's pretty much a robot footballer you see him now today. Definitely better than all the great players from the past, him and Messi both.

Now I could try to answer which one is better between him and Messi (which is a really fair comparison because They are in the same era of football) but then I'd ruin this thread and turn it into Ronaldo vs Messi all over again.

 

[harms]

Close but not as good?

Better, in fact. And you can't really have a better career than Pele did, be it from the goalscoring or the trophies or any other aspect, his is really 100/100.

And Gerd Müller would still be the ultimate goalscorer — his international stats are much better, plus the winning goals in the World Cup and European Championship's finals. Ronaldo is a better player than him though, and he will be rightly put in the higher tier if we were to create such a list.

 

[harms]

Pele still the GOAT imo, key player in 3 world cup wins is unheard of, backed by a robust domestic career and the overall package just in terms of nearly all attributes as a footballer.

I love Pele and he is the GOAT for me, but he wasn't at all key for Brazil in 1962. Not his fault, and he probably would've won it by himself if he was fit, but he got injured early and it was Garrincha who had won them the tournament. Such a shame, as this was probably the best possible version of Pele — more mature than in 1958 and better physically than he was in 1970

 

[RedRonaldo]

In terms of greatness? Just marginally behind Pele and Maradona, about same tier as Messi

 

[2mufc0]

I love Pele and he is the GOAT for me, but he wasn't at all key for Brazil in 1962. Not his fault, and he probably would've won it by himself if he was fit, but he got injured early and it was Garrincha who had won them the tournament. Such a shame, as this was probably the best possible version of Pele — more mature than in 1958 and better physically than he was in 1970

Agree he wasn't the best player but did contribute, like you said it was a shame he was injured, still manage to score goals and create some moments of brilliance.

 

[meninred]

He can claim to be the 4th greatest player ever though he may have few competitions.

 

[JPRouve]

He is in the highest tier, the problem with rankings is that they are kind with goalscorers and very harsh on the rest.

 

[Dennis Viollet]

the greatest I ever seen in 30 years.

 

[SalfordRed18]

Goat.

 

[adexkola]

Who's better? C Ronaldo or Baresi?

 

[Bastian]

Imagine if we had some clauses in that deal at the time, like 100K for each goal scored. Thought we sold him on the cheap at the time and he's done nothing but illustrate that since. They must have recouped the outlay in 1-2 years from marketing alone. What a player.

 

[montpelier]

1) Tiers are the best idea for this, because it facilitates a go-around of the problems presented by different eras, skill-sets and different positions.

1a) Keegan is several tiers too high in that one, though.

The Cristiano question always makes me wonder what role his phenomenal heading ability plays in this. Without it, his goal haul would be significantly less & his medal-haul would be even more significantly less - given the ''crucial-ness'' of some headed goals without which some (quite a few, possibly) trophies would not have been won.

On the eyes-based judgement side though, I don't think that this phenomenal heading ability gets any credit from us really. No one is going to say, I'm rating CR7 above x & y because he can jump a lot higher are they? I'm meaning really, that perhaps we ought to be saying that, it's an undervalued skill maybe. It would also be the only reason I could find for getting him ahead () of Messi on anybody's list, tbh.

Maradona tops for me, key factor - consistent delivery of brilliant goals & assists in World Cups.

 

[sullydnl]

Second best player player in my lifetime, with nobody else remotely close to those two. In the discussion for the greatest of all time.

 

[Kinsella]

There's not a great deal of difference between a few of the greats in that respect. Puskas, Pele, Muller and Romario are all in the 700-800 range when you exclude friendlies from their totals. Eusebio, Zico and Di Stefano all roughly around the 500-600 mark, which is where Ronaldo and Messi are now. There are a few others up there, but for the sake of simplicity I've not included anyone from the pre-war or amateur eras.

So we can use the statistics argument, but it doesn't necessarily put today's two ahead of that half dozen.

This, this and more this!

Bravo Sir!

 

[Boycott]

Some older players are going to be or have already been harshly treated by history I think. Take Luis Figo for example - a magnificent footballer. He had awesome balance, vision, close control, and a powerful yet elegant runner. However he did not score many goals. Figo did win the WPOTY yet I don't remember him being put in the pantheons of all time greats. On the flip side after eight months Mo Salah is being put up with Messi. On the basis of a pure numbers game.

Ryan Giggs is another. Only had 5 double digit goals seasons in 24 years. A lot of people point to his greatest asset as longevity which is bullshit because if you're old enough to have watched a young Ryan he was an otherworldly talent.

Eden Hazard conversely has been the main man behind Chelsea's two league titles yet he gets panned for not producing more. He's scored 87 goals in five seasons + this one. Only once not got into double figures. It just shows how Ronaldo and Messi have reset the switch with their incredible goal returns. Once upon a time a 20 goal a season striker was actually not all that common. Scoring 0.5 goals a game was a good return. Now to be a top striker you're expected to be in the 0.7 goal/game mark and wide men have the task of aiming for 0.5 goals/game.

 

[Ronaldo's Mum Eh?]

For years he was #2 for me... now he's #1 due to his big game moments and constantly making the best defences in the world, a mockery.

GOAT.

 

[SAFTHEGREAT]

There is no comparison. We definitely cannot compare one's play to another based on just facts. There were eras where goal posts were square and many hit them and came out rather than going on. There were times when off-side calls were not a thing and there were also times when VAR was far from reach. Football has grown to amazing levels and these players have to be given a lot of credit to keep learning. Imho, i love both Messi and Ronaldo, think they both have a lot of different tools in their kit and can exploit weaknesses so well. We just need to appreciate and enjoy great football instead of pointing fingers and arguing about who's better or who's not.

Everyone has their moments that define their greatness and at 33, a fantastic bicycle kick. Juve fans applauded it, period.

 

[harms]

Agree he wasn't the best player but did contribute, like you said it was a shame he was injured, still manage to score goals and create some moments of brilliance.

Come on, he played one full game in the group stages Brilliantly, but his influence is minimal, Garrincha dominated the rest of the tournament on his own.

 

[TsuWave]

he’s goat.

at the very least, he should be 2nd in most people’s list

 

[acnumber9]

So all historians are able to basically bear witness to every single moment of say a given time period or individual they are studying? or all artefacts and all materials written on that subject? Yes they will apply great rigour to their subject, but quite a few of us on the Caf have actually spent time looking through most if not all the historic games that the old great players played in. Exactly if you haven't watched it or listened to it, don't offer an opinion. I have watched Pele play and watched substantial amounts of footage on him, therefore I can offer an opinion. Do you see where I am going with that?

It would be different if I was comparing him to say Leonidas of Brazil of the 1930's but Pele played in the television era, thanks to the internet - there is vast swathes of footage on him playing.

http://footballia.net/

Great website above, which has links to all sorts of games for historic matches.

As for Pele, here is a recent post on him:

Auction-Trade Madness Draft - QF: Raees/Invictus vs Skizzo

A truly complete player beyond compare IMO.

The footage you watch of Pele is highlights. A low sample of them at that. Playing against players who you have no idea whether they were pub level or not. It’s an opinion that can only be held by listening to others opinions and legend. With players you watch regularly you see the good and the bad and you know who they’re up against.

 

[Josep Dowling]

Great box player and goalscorer but he falls short in other area's compared to some of the best

A player who mostly has 1-2 touches when he receives the ball can not be a better player than someone like Zidane

Zidane dragged the team forward and when things were not going well he would take the ball and drive the team forward

Ronaldo is entirely team dependant, if Real are being outplayed and not getting the ball forward he won't be able to drag his team forward and make plays

As a goalscorer he's the second best I have seen and overall as a player he's in the top 5 I have seen in my lifetime

But this is the current Ronaldo. When he played for United he did push on the entire team with his brilliant turn of pace and skill. I preferred that Ronaldo but the way he has adapted as he has lost pace with age is unbelievable. His longevity at the highest level for me makes him the GOAT along with Messi.

Pele only gets named as the GOAT because he won 3 World Cups. Clearly a great player for his time but honestly how many games are people making an assessment of him considering his whole club career was in Brazil and the US? His GOAT stamp is purely based on games in the World Cup.

 

[Eckers99]

I've chosen not to watch anyone other than Chris Smalling, who I give my full, undivided attention to in the few games I bother watching. So, by that rationale, he's probably somewhere between 2nd and 50th.

 

[adexkola]

I've chosen not to watch anyone other than Chris Smalling, who I give my full, undivided attention to in the few games I bother watching. So, by that rationale, he's probably somewhere between 2nd and 50th.

This is actually the logic a lot of posts in this thread are based on, sadly.

Ignorance isn't an excuse.

 

[SadlerMUFC]

People who take the piss at CR7 do it because they don't like him, and they can't separate the man from the player. If everyone is honest with themself then they will have to admit that CR7 and Messi are the two greatest players to ever play the game and even though their style of play is different and each is better at different aspects of the game, there really isn't a right answer as to who is better. Perhaps if Pele and Maradonna played today they would have the fitness to be as good or better but it's a different era of sport. So as it stands, CR7 and Messi are the greatest players of all time, and it will take someone very special to ever achieve more than they have...

 

[Vault Dweller]

But then he should be called GIHESL (greatest I have ever seen live) and not GOAT (greatest of all time)?

Touche I think I will adopt the name GIHESL-GOAT for him, he is THE man after all

 

[Apocalypse]

Comfortably makes the top 10, and has a great claim to be the most dangerous footballer ever, but he lacks the same kind of genius that makes Maradona and Messi stand out as the two absolute best, players that simply take your breath away with how they influence a game around the pitch. They transcend beyond the stats and figures, more so in Maradona's case as Messi still has those to rival even the great Gerd Muller.

 

[TsuWave]

I also feel like there’s this reluctance to give Ronaldo his dues because of how people perceive him to be personality wise. I think if he wasn’t this metrosexual highly confident individual, that people often mistake for arrogance, more folks would have him as goat or at least #2.

People reducing him to just goal scorer is kinda sad, doesn’t the dude have the most assists or close to in the CL? and it’s like people forget the different phases to his game, at United he was the best player in the world and it wasn’t because of just “goal scoring”. Complete player. Technique, dribbling, speed, power, aerial prowess, vision, and the touch of genius that people often attribute to the likes of Maradona.

Him being able to adjust and adapt his game to remain at the top for over a decade should be seen as a strength for him rather than a weakness, I mean, many of the players people mention in these lists only really done it for a fraction of the time Ronaldo has managed to. Besides he has reigned in different countries and over what’s been generally understood as the two best leagues for a while.

what a fecking player.

 

[Offside]

Thought he would decline a little after 2014 where he had won everything in England and Spain and when Messi was on top of the world in 2015. The way he has reinvented himself to become this absolute big game machine in the Champions League on a ridiculous level, whilst also getting success with Portugal may even put him above Messi. I’ve ever seen such a constant deliverance in massive games than what he is doing at the moment. He’s been a completely different footballer at different stages in his career from being a tricky winger to a goal machine striker, and he’s been the best in the world at it all.

Certainly Ronaldo is the most complete footballer of all time. I’d still have Messi ahead of him though.