Who is the current best player in the world?

do.ob

Full Member
Joined
Jun 19, 2010
Messages
8,543
Location
Germany
Has to be Lassina Traore.
 

Schneckerl

Full Member
Joined
Jun 17, 2016
Messages
2,626
It's like claiming LeBron isn't the best player in the NBA just because he's now 35. He's still the best and will be until he retires - same applies to Leo.
Not every athlete's performance ages the same. People still accept LeBron as the best player in the NBA because he backs it up on the court.
Not saying Messi can't turn it around, but his start of the season isn't "best player in the world" level.
 

RoyH1

Full Member
Joined
Jul 22, 2014
Messages
3,005
Location
DKNY
It has to be Lewandowski on current form. I still think Messi has enough gas in him to be the best player in the world, but he's not going to do for Bartomeu's Barcelona.
 

Canagel

Full Member
Joined
May 26, 2016
Messages
12,696
Neymar
 

Zehner

Full Member
Joined
Mar 29, 2018
Messages
2,976
Location
Germany
Supports
Bayer 04 Leverkusen
It's boring but it's still Messi or maybe Neymar.

Let those guys play in Bayern's or Liverpool's team and nobody would mention Lewandowski. Think people underestimate the influence the team has on the individual performance.
 

Blackwidow

Full Member
Joined
Oct 8, 2011
Messages
6,499
It's boring but it's still Messi or maybe Neymar.

Let those guys play in Bayern's or Liverpool's team and nobody would mention Lewandowski. Think people underestimate the influence the team has on the individual performance.
Just if individual and team work together. Sometimes that just does not fit. Lewy has learned that the more he plays for the team, too - the more the team works for him in other situations...
 

Pocho

Gayer than Marcosdeto (according to Marcos, who sh
Joined
Jun 13, 2006
Messages
928
Put Messi or Cristiano in Liverpool, Bayern or Citeh and they'd still be the best. Their teams ar shite.
 

odrzut

New Member
Newbie
Joined
Feb 1, 2019
Messages
3
Supports
Górnik Łęczna
Messi is a system player, requires the whole team to change to make it work, and the system isn't that good anymore. In particular Messi would make Bayern worse. He doesn't press, he hogs the ball for too long, he doesn't help much with counterattacks, he's too slow for high line defence. Muller is what Messi should play like to work well with Bayern, but he wouldn't.

Barcelona spent hundreds of millions of euro on making the system work again and it wasn't enough, and Messi isn't getting younger. Maybe he could work at Man City because Pep is obsessed with this system anyway (and can't make it work without Messi).

Cristiano is much more universal than Messi - any team could use a good winger/striker hybrid. But he's also not top 10 player anymore. I see no reason to think he would be better at Bayern than he is at Juventus. Both teams dominate their leagues, and yet Ronaldo isn't looking as good as Lewandowski or Haaland.

Messi and Ronaldo are only mentioned in this conversation because of stuff they did 3-10 years ago, not now.
 

GameOn

Full Member
Joined
Feb 3, 2014
Messages
316
It's boring but it's still Messi or maybe Neymar.

Let those guys play in Bayern's or Liverpool's team and nobody would mention Lewandowski. Think people underestimate the influence the team has on the individual performance.
Put Messi or Cristiano in Liverpool, Bayern or Citeh and they'd still be the best. Their teams ar shite.
Interesting that that suddenly the team is so important for Messi and Ronaldo, when their fans actually got really defensive every time somebody said that they score so much, because they play in an all-conquering and perfectly oiled super-team, a few years ago.

It's the same with them and Lewandowski: If your team is merely "good", they will still score a lot, but not those outrageous numbers.

You see it with all those three in their national teams, which is actually a good comparison (team, that is not well-oiled, way less automatisms etc.):

Messi: 70 goals in 138 matches (0.51 goals per match)
Ronaldo: 101 goals in 165 matches (0.61 goals per match)
Lewandowski: 63 goals in 114 matches (0.55 goals per match)

Right now I don't see how anyone can put Messi or Ronaldo above Lewandowski. Of course that could all change again, if Lewandowski regresses or Messi/Ronaldo somehow find their otherworldly form from a few years ago again, but for the past year and a half Lewandowski has been the best in the world.
 
Last edited:

jesperjaap

Full Member
Joined
Jun 23, 2014
Messages
2,871
Still Messi and Ronaldo at the moment. The thread is "who is the current best player" not the "in form performing" player

Lewanndowski and Haaland have obviously been excellent the last season and a bit but that is goal scoring not overall play, same with Salah.

If we are talking overall play DeBruyne deserves a shout
 

Zehner

Full Member
Joined
Mar 29, 2018
Messages
2,976
Location
Germany
Supports
Bayer 04 Leverkusen
Interesting that that suddenly the team is so important for Messi and Ronaldo, when their fans actually got really defensive every time somebody said that they score so much, because they play in an all-conquering and perfectly oiled super-team, a few years ago.

It's the same with them and Lewandowski: If your team is merely "good", they will still score a lot, but not those outrageous numbers.

You see it with all those three in their national teams, which is actually a good comparison:

Messi: 70 goals in 138 matches (0.51 goals per match)
Ronaldo: 101 goals in 165 matches (0.61 goals per match)
Lewandowski: 63 goals in 114 matches (0.55 goals per match)

Right now I don't see how anyone can put Messi or Ronaldo above Lewandowski. Of course that could all change again, if Lewadowski regresses or Messi/Ronaldo somehow find their otherworldly form from a few years ago again, but for the past year and a half Lewandowski has been the best in the world.
Might be interesting for you, for me it's not because I never argued that way. I defended Ronaldo before he won four CLs with Madrid and I defended Messi after Barcelona slowly detoriated after Pep's departure.

Lewandowksi scores like crazy, yes, but he's a pure striker. Even more so than Cristiano in his late years. But until he's as good a passer and dribbler as Messi is and has the same impact on the game, he's not on his level. Honestly, it baffles me how anyone who watched both players last season can claim that Lewandowski was better. It's mind blowing, really. Messi's output might have taken a hit but he still does things nobody on this planet can reproduce on a regular basis.

I miss the times when people actually watched football and didn't go by stats and titles. I guess today the Ballon D'Or would go to Eto'o over Ronaldinho and van Nistelroy over Zidane. I'm still going by that and consequently, Lewandowski doesn't even make the top 5 for me.
 

Zehner

Full Member
Joined
Mar 29, 2018
Messages
2,976
Location
Germany
Supports
Bayer 04 Leverkusen
Just if individual and team work together. Sometimes that just does not fit. Lewy has learned that the more he plays for the team, too - the more the team works for him in other situations...
Might be true but then again, Messi's the most progressive passer in the world and is leading almost every metric in that regard since over a decade with the only player able to keep up over a short period being Özil. If anything, Messi has become more of a team player in recent years and sacrificed individual glory for that. This season is the best example. His stats are underwhelming but he's already at three or four insane pre-assists this season that went unnoticed.

Anyway, if you want to see it like that, it doesn't make sense to speak about players as individuals at all. And if you do, there might be other players who proved to be more important for Bayern than Lewandowski. Thiago or Kimmich are the first to come to mind.
 

odrzut

New Member
Newbie
Joined
Feb 1, 2019
Messages
3
Supports
Górnik Łęczna
Lewandowski have been the top scorer AND top assister last season in Champions League. This season in Bundesliga he has 10 goals and 5 assists in 5 games (and 1 almost-assist). He's crucial for Bayern's build-up play when going from defence to attack - Neuer or Alaba makes a long pass, Lewandowki wins the header and holds the balls to let people come forward or speeds up the counterattack with a first-touch pass. His first touch and ball control is outrageous and he passes better than any striker I've seen.

Yet people say he's "pure goalscorer and does nothing else". It's clear to me these people don't watch Bayern.
 

Pocho

Gayer than Marcosdeto (according to Marcos, who sh
Joined
Jun 13, 2006
Messages
928
Interesting that that suddenly the team is so important for Messi and Ronaldo, when their fans actually got really defensive every time somebody said that they score so much, because they play in an all-conquering and perfectly oiled super-team, a few years ago.

It's the same with them and Lewandowski: If your team is merely "good", they will still score a lot, but not those outrageous numbers.

You see it with all those three in their national teams, which is actually a good comparison (team, that is not well-oiled, way less automatisms etc.):

Messi: 70 goals in 138 matches (0.51 goals per match)
Ronaldo: 101 goals in 165 matches (0.61 goals per match)
Lewandowski: 63 goals in 114 matches (0.55 goals per match)

Right now I don't see how anyone can put Messi or Ronaldo above Lewandowski. Of course that could all change again, if Lewandowski regresses or Messi/Ronaldo somehow find their otherworldly form from a few years ago again, but for the past year and a half Lewandowski has been the best in the world.
Messi is not a goalscorer, he scores, yes, you can't measure him by that.
 

Zehner

Full Member
Joined
Mar 29, 2018
Messages
2,976
Location
Germany
Supports
Bayer 04 Leverkusen
Messi is not a goalscorer, he scores, yes, you can't measure him by that.
Nor does that statistic factor in that Poland and Portugal get to play cannon fodder teams in the EC qualifiers. Messi's average level of opponent is much higher than the ones Cristiano and Lewandowski faced with their national teams. And that's just one argument for why that comparison is apples and oranges.
 

GameOn

Full Member
Joined
Feb 3, 2014
Messages
316
Might be interesting for you, for me it's not because I never argued that way. I defended Ronaldo before he won four CLs with Madrid and I defended Messi after Barcelona slowly detoriated after Pep's departure.

Lewandowksi scores like crazy, yes, but he's a pure striker. Even more so than Cristiano in his late years. But until he's as good a passer and dribbler as Messi is and has the same impact on the game, he's not on his level. Honestly, it baffles me how anyone who watched both players last season can claim that Lewandowski was better. It's mind blowing, really. Messi's output might have taken a hit but he still does things nobody on this planet can reproduce on a regular basis.

I miss the times when people actually watched football and didn't go by stats and titles. I guess today the Ballon D'Or would go to Eto'o over Ronaldinho and van Nistelroy over Zidane. I'm still going by that and consequently, Lewandowski doesn't even make the top 5 for me.
Because you're simply biased against Bayern and overrate certain aspects of the game (flashiness, technique etc.), while underrating other aspects (workrate, pressing etc.) .

Nobody claims that Lewandowski is better than prime Messi and Ronaldo, but currently he's better than both of them.
 
Last edited:

jem

Full Member
Joined
Jan 14, 2010
Messages
6,936
Location
Toronto
Utmost respect for CR7 and Messi, but they're the past. It's time to move on.

There isn't any single player reaching the peak those two had, but there are several world class stars with similar top quality. If one needs to be picked, it should probably be Mbappe.

Mbappe, Sancho, Sterling, Gnabry, Mané, Salah, Pogba, Bruno, TAA, VDV. I realize that KDB's omission is controversial, but in my opinion he's performing far above his actual skill because of Pep's system.

Next generation: Greenwood, Davies, Fati, Camavinga, Bellingham, Mejbri, Mengi, Chekri, Gravenberch. Maybe Haaland... but in my opinion he's just an in-form Lukaku.
I can’t see any way pogba could be above KDB.
 

GameOn

Full Member
Joined
Feb 3, 2014
Messages
316
Might be true but then again, Messi's the most progressive passer in the world and is leading almost every metric in that regard since over a decade with the only player able to keep up over a short period being Özil. If anything, Messi has become more of a team player in recent years and sacrificed individual glory for that. This season is the best example. His stats are underwhelming but he's already at three or four insane pre-assists this season that went unnoticed.

Anyway, if you want to see it like that, it doesn't make sense to speak about players as individuals at all. And if you do, there might be other players who proved to be more important for Bayern than Lewandowski. Thiago or Kimmich are the first to come to mind.
Thiago was one of their least important players last season (at least from their starting 11).

He was out for nearly the entire second half of the season and they didn't miss a beat.
 
Last edited:

Zehner

Full Member
Joined
Mar 29, 2018
Messages
2,976
Location
Germany
Supports
Bayer 04 Leverkusen
Because you're simply biased against Bayern and overrate certain aspects of the game (flashiness, technique etc.), while underrating other aspects (workrate, pressing etc.) .

Nobody claims that Lewandowski is better than prime Messi and Ronaldo, but currently he's better than both of them.
I'm not denying I don't like Bayern but I'm able to look past that when judging players. I mean, you can find posts of mine where I claim that Robben was the third best player of his generation or that prime Boateng was the best CB I've seen in my lifetime. Credit where credit is due. My assessment of Lewandowski, too, has nothing to do with him playing for Bayern. I'm simply a strong advocate of not only looking at scorers. You can convince yourself of that in the Messi vs. Ronaldo thread.

Thing is, chance creation is IMO much harder and much more important for success than chance conversion. And last season Messi was leading almost every statistic measuring offensive impact, be it successful dribblings, key passes, chance conversion, through balls, goal impact, packing rate and so forth, like he's done throughout his whole career. He's simply a freak of nature and playing in a tier of his own. Lewandowski is a great striker, quite possibly the best of his generation (although Suarez also has a strong claim on that title) but he's just not that good. It's tough for the stars playing at the same time as he does but it's simply the way it is.

Thiago was one of their least important players last season (at least from their starting 11).

He was out for nearly the entire second half of the season and they didn't miss a beat.
Because they don't need him in the league anyway. Kimmich could rupture his ACL right now and they would still dominate almost every game, too. That doesn't mean Kimmich isn't important.

Just look at the final. Thiago was the best player on the pitch that day. The amount of pressure he absorbed and the progressive passes he made were really, really remarkable. In general, Bayern's team is a very cohesive and well drilled unit but Thiago is one of the few players who stood out. Lewandowski does, too, but I simply struggle to rate a player so highly if his contribution outside of goals is so low. That's also why I never really warmed up to the late version of Cristiano who for me was much better during his late United and early Madrid years and why I thought that the Ballon D'Or for Modric was deserved. That's actually a very good comparison, now that I think of it. If a player beats the pressing of the opponent time and again, ensures you dominate the other team and sets up the attackers frequently, that's worth more than a goal for me. To me that player is more important than the one who's at the end of the assembly line. I mean, we're talking about a player that makes maybe 50-70 good plays a game against one who maybe makes 10. It just happens that the latter affects the scoring sheet more prominently.
 

Mogget

Full Member
Joined
Nov 27, 2013
Messages
5,200
Supports
Arsenal
A good way to think about this: if you had absolutely one shot at having someone in a team right now to win you a football match, who would it be? Answer becomes very clear
Using this criteria I'd probably say Neymar.
 

RashyForPM

Full Member
Joined
Jun 25, 2020
Messages
1,378
Lewandowski atm. People saying Messi :rolleyes: He’s one of the best ever but if you only became a football fan from the beginning of last season, which is a good timeframe, then he’d struggle to make your top 5.
 

InterFan1998

New Member
Newbie
Joined
May 8, 2019
Messages
161
Supports
Internazionale
Might be interesting for you, for me it's not because I never argued that way. I defended Ronaldo before he won four CLs with Madrid and I defended Messi after Barcelona slowly detoriated after Pep's departure.

Lewandowksi scores like crazy, yes, but he's a pure striker. Even more so than Cristiano in his late years. But until he's as good a passer and dribbler as Messi is and has the same impact on the game, he's not on his level. Honestly, it baffles me how anyone who watched both players last season can claim that Lewandowski was better. It's mind blowing, really. Messi's output might have taken a hit but he still does things nobody on this planet can reproduce on a regular basis.

I miss the times when people actually watched football and didn't go by stats and titles. I guess today the Ballon D'Or would go to Eto'o over Ronaldinho and van Nistelroy over Zidane. I'm still going by that and consequently, Lewandowski doesn't even make the top 5 for me.
The only way FIFA would give an award to Eto'o over Ronaldinho is if he changed his name to Etoinho
 

Zehner

Full Member
Joined
Mar 29, 2018
Messages
2,976
Location
Germany
Supports
Bayer 04 Leverkusen
Lewandowski atm. People saying Messi :rolleyes: He’s one of the best ever but if you only became a football fan from the beginning of last season, which is a good timeframe, then he’d struggle to make your top 5.
Honest question, how often did you watch both players last season?
 

marktan

Full Member
Joined
Aug 28, 2017
Messages
3,295
I don't rate Lewandowski as highly as some do, they had an easy run to the CL last year and players score for fun in the Bundesliga. Over the last 5 years hes often been missing in the big games in the CL.

I wouldn't give it to one player but say its a mix of the likes of Messi, Ronaldo, Neymar and KDB, all for various different attributes. Which is more due to the former 2 getting older than anything else.
 

Dog Walker

New Member
Newbie
Joined
Oct 14, 2020
Messages
2
Why is KDB regarded as a better overall footballer than someone like Mane for instance. KDB is obviously a better passer of the ball but what else does he do that makes him better. Mane is a more effective goal scorer, more effective defender, better at heading, better at dribbling, is both faster and fitter with less injuries. What is it that makes KDB a better overall footballer?