Who would you bring as a DoF or in the MUFC back office ?

[Plastic Evra]

Every second of every minute for a decade, someone furiously is typing a draft on RedCafé about MUFC lack of a structure sports side being the overarching, systemic issue that blunts all effect of trying to get a better team.

But who do you think would be a good example or template of the sort of person we'd need to be MUFC DoF (and other positions surrounding it) ?

 

[dcrompton]

Knowing this club they’d probably give it to Andrew Tait for the social media engagement

 

[Irrational.]

Phil Mitchell.

 

[Seven Seas Sardines]

1. Michael Edwards
2. Paul Mitchell
3. Marc Overmars (has to make an interview saying he won't send more dick pics)

Not many others I'd want to be honest.

 

[Jersey Heel]

Pep

 

[MyOnlySolskjaer]

OJ Simpson.

 

[Jersey Heel]

OJ Simpson.

I change my answer to this.

 

[Annihilate Now!]

Give it Giggsy

 

[Andycoleno9]

Someone who actually worked on that job.

 

[Laurencio]

The problem at Man Utd isn't qualified middle management, but the lack of decisive clear upper management. It is rumoured and has been reported that the owners need to sign off on everything - so ultimately it comes down to the ownership. From the outside looking in, it appears as if the daily management of the club is hampered by not having the authority to run the club. It has been reported several times that signings and sales are being denied by the owners (Caicedo, Van Dijk, Maguirre sale, etc).

It makes very little sense to hire a CEO and DOF and constantly monitor their every decision instead of trusting them to do their jobs - and replacing them if they don't work out - , but that is apparently where we are.

 

[Who's Kissing Cameras?]

Rangnick.

 

[Dannn411]

Somebody who's done it before and been very successful at it and then I'd give that person total control over transfers with the manager having zero ability to overrule him.

 

[Valencia Shin Crosses]

I’d hire everyone at Brighton

 

[OleGunnar20]

Dan Ashworth in a perfect world. He obviously smashed it at Brighton and now appears to be carrying on the good work at Newcastle. Probably unobtainable now of course.

Begiristain at City has similarly obviously done a great job. Clearly unobtainable.

Campos from PSG did well at Monaco and Lille. Seem to have been issues at PSG but they're as big a circus as us.

Maldini and Massara did brilliant work at Milan before being sacked for apparently falling out with the new owner.

Berta at Atletico is highly rated and has done a solid job of keeping them punching above their weight. Not a big fan of spending all that cash on Felix mind you.

Who knows exactly how much influence is down to these individuals and the overall structure above and below. What I would say is I'd back many out there to do a better job than our current lot. It's not like we're starting with the bar very high ..

 

[BuzzKillington]

Whoever the flavour of the month teams corresponding employee is. That or the ghost of Jimmy Saville which seems very on-brand for the club at the moment.

 

[Tango80]

I'd probably give our existing DoF a bit more time tbf.

 

[Bilbo]

Somebody who's done it before and been very successful at it and then I'd give that person total control over transfers with the manager having zero ability to overrule him.

So just changing one single point of failure to another, except the new option isn't anywhere near as close to the team as the existing one is.

 

[Dannn411]

So just changing one single point of failure to another, except the new option isn't anywhere near as close to the team as the existing one is.

The entire point of the DOF is for him to have the final say over anything related to football operations and the long-term on-pitch strategy of the club. So yeah, he would have final say over transfers and the fit of each target with the long-term strategy for the team. It is literally the DOF's job to ensure that the team rarely skips a beat regardless of who is in charge.

 

[Andy_Cole]

Rangnick.

The correct answer

 

[Redstain]

Edwards
Ragnick
Mitchell

All have made some poor decisions (Ralf's mostly on field) but they have in my opinion demonstrated what a director is supposed to do to the letter. Observing the Newcastle documentary the role of Dan Ashworth is interesting because what he does (assumably all others included) is have a very hands-on responsibility with recruitment where the information is fed down to the manager as opposed to the other way round. United have become specialists in role reversal which is from the manager up and it's a reason why the club has the highest NET spend in the league with absolutely nothing to show for it.

The top down approach is the most sustainable because it forecasts consistency in an event where the manager is sacked. The team is then not predominantly bombarded with the managers signings (as witnessed with every manager post SAF) so another manager can easily work with the profile of players the club has recruited so long as the manager matches the philosophy the club intends to maintain and achieve.

The issue with United for me is it feels like no one in the hierarchy wants to take responsibility. There's no mission statement, no vision, no statement of intent. Murtough (nor Arnold) to my knowledge has said nothing about what they protract for the club over the next 5-10 years which is absolutely shocking. For all the recruitment structure changes and reorganization after repeated failure surely a statement ought to have been released "we intended to revolutionise our recruitment having reviewed past failures over the last decade XYZ changes have been made for United to be the best in the business at all levels of recruitment from U16 to senior level"

But it's funny how the only time United release a statement is to address an issue revolved around something that's negative. The club proverbially is like a kite caught in the wind blown about in any direction on the basis of circumstance and weak sentiment.

United need a Ragnick personality someone who can drag all the various levels of operations by the scruff of the neck and give them a directive. "This is what we set out to do and why, compounded by time repetition gets you closer to the objective". These are basics in business failure to plan is planning to fail just look at the club's recruitment what is the plan ? Additionally, to Ragnicks credit he's almost singlehandedly given the blueprint in methodology to the Redbull establishments and they continually maintain hoarding some of the most promising talent in Europe having sold arguably the most promising defender in the world for a substantial fee.

That's what United is lacking they have all the right pieces by way of job descriptions and statuses, but there's still no definitive direction. You'll find sole-traders and small sized businesses that run their establishments better than United. If it wasn't for the club's history and prestige the Glazers would have run this club into the ground a long long time ago. The only thing keeping everything together is the club's reputation.

 

[Flying high]

Nobody with a good reputation in this area would join United with the glazers here.

It's such a bad role that I'd question the credentials and judgement of anyone who took it.

 

[Sky1981]

A good DOF would

1. Be extemely efficient in handling Greenwood case. They'd made a better and more decisive statement to the very least.

2. Would not give extension to Martial

3. Would not sanction Antony for 80M as the man has a very visible weakness it doesnt take a genius to see.

4. Sanction 80M for Maguire, same reason as no. 3

5. Would not hire Phil Jones as U18 coach. The man hasnt got much experience in continental teams which is the bread and butter and the technical aspect of teaching kids. He's been here too long to only knew the Fergie way which is too outdated. We're far from established to offer jobs for the old boys

6. Would give ETH and earful as to what his actual game plan is and what tactics he's trying to pull and help him prioritize his purhcase.

So i dont think we even have DOF with footballing power it all comes back to ETH.

Plus if FM taught me anything a DOF has alot of customizable parameter. One DOF might have different authorities than another DOF.

I also doubt poaching just the DOF of a successful club would do anything much.

It's like having Schumacher drives a Camry. We also need the academy, the coach, the scouts, everything filled with the right people first and foremost in order for the DoF to be able to perform

 

[Don_Johan14]

Mateu Alemany.

Berta at Atletico is highly rated and has done a solid job of keeping them punching above their weight. Not a big fan of spending all that cash on Felix mind you.

Who knows exactly how much influence is down to these individuals and the overall structure above and below. What I would say is I'd back many out there to do a better job than our current lot. It's not like we're starting with the bar very high ..

Atletico Madrid fans and journalists are very critical of him.
The club can hardly sign because it has an unsustainable wage bill, players like Saul, Llorente or Morata are on €7-8M net.
This summer they needed a 9 and a 5 and they did not sign them, not even on loan.

 

[Redivy]

Paul Mitchell is a great candidate. He has worked across all leagues in England, and had a stint in Germany and now France.

He has proven success at all clubs and he is not as controversial as other DoF such as Campos.

 

[Someone]

The DOF market is a bit of a grey area for me. But the least we could do is get someone with an excellent CV. It makes no sense that one doing the job for us now has never done it at another club before. Get someone with a proven track record, and with the resources we have they'll do a good job.

 

[jeepers]

Rangnick or City’s one, but only after the Glazers have fecked off.

 

[Sky1981]

Rangnick or City’s one, but only after the Glazers have fecked off.

Rangnick gave a fair report and most of us here laughed him out.

A good DOF wont last the scrutiny doing the right thing. Can you imagine if Rangnick veto the signing of Antony? And god forbid he has 1 good season in Holland?

Fergie would he hounded out in year 3 and sacked long before he won the league.

Can you see ETH selling Ince or probably Bruno / Rashford as the modern equivalent?

 

[manichester]

Anyone with a shotgun instead of a scattergun.

 

[Bilbo]

The entire point of the DOF is for him to have the final say over anything related to football operations and the long-term on-pitch strategy of the club. So yeah, he would have final say over transfers and the fit of each target with the long-term strategy for the team. It is literally the DOF's job to ensure that the team rarely skips a beat regardless of who is in charge.

Okay. That all sounds great on paper, but what assurances can you give that a DOF is any more or less likely to get it wrong?

 

[Dannn411]

Okay. That all sounds great on paper, but what assurances can you give that a DOF is any more or less likely to get it wrong?

You can't 100% guarantee success of course but if the person has a strong track record of building a quality team at decent cost, then I'm comfortable with taking that chance. Which is why I mentioned that I preferred it to be someone who has done it before and been successful at it.

 

[elmo]

Nothings going to change as long as the leeches are still around. They literally don’t understand it’s cheaper to rebuild the whole team’s structure than it is to keep making constant short term fixes.

Rangnick basically gave them a whole list of things that’s needed to be done for us to start our journey back to recovery but they decided it was too much money and gave the excuse that Ten Haag didn’t want to work with a DoF despite him working with one at Ajax.

Most people on here clowned Rangnick too despite them wanting the pressing football that Rangnick helped install into Red Bull and finally admitting that he was right and we basically needed an overall of the first team.

 

[Bilbo]

You can't 100% guarantee success of course but if the person has a strong track record of building a quality team at decent cost, then I'm comfortable with taking that chance. Which is why I mentioned that I preferred it to be someone who has done it before and been successful at it.

What happens if a DoF has a couple of windows, and makes some signings we like but also one or two that we don't like. What happens then - do we get rid and bring in a new one?

 

[Plastic Evra]

The DOF market is a bit of a grey area for me. But the least we could do is get someone with an excellent CV. It makes no sense that one doing the job for us now has never done it at another club before. Get someone with a proven track record, and with the resources we have they'll do a good job.

That's what I made the thread because we constantly harp on DoF but it's not a transparent part of operations and I was curious if some here had a better lay of the land and give some names to get an idea.

Okay. That all sounds great on paper, but what assurances can you give that a DOF is any more or less likely to get it wrong?

What happens if a DoF has a couple of windows, and makes some signings we like but also one or two that we don't like. What happens then - do we get rid and bring in a new one?

I think it's part of parcel of football. You miss recruits, or you choose to pass a player who turns out to be doing great elsewhere.
I don't think it would be more or less different than now. Players signed. Hype and moan. People debating EtH astuteness in picking preferred targets. Doesn't mean we fire a DoF for it, just like EtH isn't on the block for that (yet).

Yeah sometimes it doesn't work and they're fired too from a club.

 

[Bilbo]

I think it's part of parcel of football. You miss recruits, or you choose to pass a player who turns out to be doing great elsewhere.
I don't think it would be more or less different than now. Players signed. Hype and moan. People debating EtH astuteness in picking preferred targets. Doesn't mean we fire a DoF for it, just like EtH isn't on the block for that (yet).

Yeah sometimes it doesn't work and they're fired too from a club.

Thats where i was leading with my questions. I've long had an issue with fans thinking a DoF is the answer to all of our problems. We take umbrage at giving too much power to a manager, and the solution is to instead give too much power to someone else, but that's okay because they have a fancier title

 

[AneRu]

Edwards
Rangnick
Mitchell

All have made some poor decisions (Ralf's mostly on field) but they have in my opinion demonstrated what a director is supposed to do to the letter. Observing the Newcastle documentary the role of Dan Ashworth is interesting because what he does (assumably all others included) is have a very hands-on responsibility with recruitment where the information is fed down to the manager as opposed to the other way round. United have become specialists in role reversal which is from the manager up and it's a reason why the club has the highest NET spend in the league with absolutely nothing to show for it.

The top down approach is the most sustainable because it forecasts consistency in an event where the manager is sacked. The team is then not predominantly bombarded with the managers signings (as witnessed with every manager post SAF) so another manager can easily work with the profile of players the club has recruited so long as the manager matches the philosophy the club intends to maintain and achieve.

The issue with United for me is it feels like no one in the hierarchy wants to take responsibility. There's no mission statement, no vision, no statement of intent. Murtough (nor Arnold) to my knowledge has said nothing about what they protract for the club over the next 5-10 years which is absolutely shocking. For all the recruitment structure changes and reorganization after repeated failure surely a statement ought to have been released "we intended to revolutionise our recruitment having reviewed past failures over the last decade XYZ changes have been made for United to be the best in the business at all levels of recruitment from U16 to senior level"

But it's funny how the only time United release a statement is to address an issue revolved around something that's negative. The club proverbially is like a kite caught in the wind blown about in any direction on the basis of circumstance and weak sentiment.

United need a Rangnick personality someone who can drag all the various levels of operations by the scruff of the neck and give them a directive. "This is what we set out to do and why, compounded by time repetition gets you closer to the objective". These are basics in business failure to plan is planning to fail just look at the club's recruitment what is the plan ? Additionally, to Ragnicks credit he's almost singlehandedly given the blueprint in methodology to the Redbull establishments and they continually maintain hoarding some of the most promising talent in Europe having sold arguably the most promising defender in the world for a substantial fee.

That's what United is lacking they have all the right pieces by way of job descriptions and statuses, but there's still no definitive direction. You'll find sole-traders and small sized businesses that run their establishments better than United. If it wasn't for the club's history and prestige the Glazers would have run this club into the ground a long long time ago. The only thing keeping everything together is the club's reputation.

Agree with this but it seems we are always preoccupied with the myth of the manager, as if we can recreate a Fergie like character. We need Rangnick, he doesn't play around with what needs to be done and will lead the clear out knowing that he has enough contacts in world football to replace the no hopers at a fraction of the cost.

 

[Plastic Evra]

Thats where i was leading with my questions. I've long had an issue with fans thinking a DoF is the answer to all of our problems. We take umbrage at giving too much power to a manager, and the solution is to instead give too much power to someone else, but that's okay because they have a fancier title

In theory a good DoF would bring a higher and longer view, the manager already being busy with coaching, and work full time on recruitment issues.

I do wonder if the ownership is content with the manager being part time recruiter because they save up on the wages of a few football executives you'd expect to have otherwise.

 

[Dannn411]

What happens if a DoF has a couple of windows, and makes some signings we like but also one or two that we don't like. What happens then - do we get rid and bring in a new one?

No we don't. The DOF's track record and the fact that he has a long-term strategy would make me less-inclined to getting alarmed because he would make many more good decisions for each bad one. Can't expect perfection from human beings.

 

[Offside]

Rio would solve all our problems.

 

[AneRu]

Nothings going to change as long as the leeches are still around. They literally don’t understand it’s cheaper to rebuild the whole team’s structure than it is to keep making constant short term fixes.

Rangnick basically gave them a whole list of things that’s needed to be done for us to start our journey back to recovery but they decided it was too much money and gave the excuse that Ten Haag didn’t want to work with a DoF despite him working with one at Ajax.

Most people on here clowned Rangnick too despite them wanting the pressing football that Rangnick helped install into Red Bull and finally admitting that he was right and we basically needed an overall of the first team.

The funny thing is that they have gone and blown the best part of half a billion quid only to come up with Licha Martinez as the only guaranteed long term option, Casemiro looks done, Malacia may never be good enough, jury still out on Hoijlund, Mount looks like a poor version of Cleverley etc.

The decision they needed to make was to replace Murtough with Rangnick but they are too loyal to mediocrity.

 

[AneRu]

Thats where i was leading with my questions. I've long had an issue with fans thinking a DoF is the answer to all of our problems. We take umbrage at giving too much power to a manager, and the solution is to instead give too much power to someone else, but that's okay because they have a fancier title and a proven track record of doing something similar elsewhere.

Corrected that for you, after a billion thrown away you still don't see the importance of taking recruitment away from the manager and entrusting it to a specialist? After watching the shit show Murtough and ETH pulled in the summer? Really?