Would Pep/Tuchel win the title with the current United squad and Ole with the current City/Chelsea squad?

Tuchel or Pep or Klopp would win, or at the very worst, put up a very strong PL challenge with the current Utd squad. Ole in charge of City would probably finish 3rd or 4th.
 
I think whether it's Pep, Conte, Tuchel, Klopp or whoever... they would prioritise the signing of a very good DM and then put a very strong title challenge.

I can't tell if they would win it, cause you never know. But they certainly could win it.

I think Pep is the least likely to make it work, because he needs specific players to work his style. Apart form the DM, the RB and GK will not suit him either and he would change those too. But I think with this team and good DM Conte would be the most likely to win it.
 
They are all hypothetical and doesn't really say much since some of the players we have might not fit Pep, Klopps or Tuchel's style.
A better question will be would any of them have won with the time, wages and money afforded to Ole?
With regards to the other half of your question, No, Ole wouldn't be appointed or perhaps would have been sacked by either team.
 
Pickle85 said:
Wait, so you think that Ole would finish between 6-8 with city's squad which is (imo) better than ours. Despite the fact that he finished 2nd last year with ours?

Logic.
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Well I said he'd never be given the job at those clubs, but I don't think our squad is that much worse than city's. I was also talking about this year not last year in regards to finishing worse.
 
If Pep/Tuchel were appointed today, probably not.

If they were appointed 28-months ago and allowed to spend 444mm Euros (net spend 344million) then the answer might have been different.
 
sullydnl said:
Nobody would definitely win the title win any of those sides as those teams all have flaws and face tough competition.

Obviously the vast majority of people would say Pep & Tuchel (and indeed Klopp) would be more likely to win the title with those teams than Solskjaer, as they're proven (to varying extents) in a way he isn't isn't. In truth there are few teams in the league whose fans would think bringing Solskjaer in would be an improvement.

We know this though. If you're backing Solskjaer to be a top level manager then (unless you're detached from reality) you know you're doing so against the tide of opinion among football fans. You might be right or you might be wrong but you can't reasonably think that on paper he matches up to them in a way anyone other than a Manchester United fan would think comparable. Instead you're hoping he's a better fit for this particular club than those managers would be in a way that has yet to fully materialise on the pitch.
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This, I think, is the most reasonable way of looking at it. We are essentially gambling on Ole's ability to grow into the role or to bring something unique, something intangible.
 
Tom Cato said:
1) Donny could have left on loan if he wanted to. He chose to stay. Clearly he does not feel mistreated. Man management is about keeping your staff and players happy and motivated. That they feel they have someone who's got their back and will help them achieve their goals. Manchester United enjoys a very happy squad, for the first time in nearly a decade
2) Lingard left on loan. Lingard is on 75k a week. West Ham have not wanted to pay a fee for Jesse. We can't sell players unless we get bids. Ole does not sell players, it's not his job. He did yeet Sanchez, Smalling and Fellaini out of the club at first opportunity though.
3) He's clueless tactically. Maybe worst manager in the Premier League. Except for making a habit of beating both Pep and Tuchel nearly every time we play their teams. You don't PE teacher your way into doing that. Some of our games are not great, I'm going to blame the players on the pitch

As for who could have won the prem with this team: Klopp, Pep, Tuchel, Dyche, Potter and Moyes could all win the league with this squad.

We got 2nd in the league last season, third before that. Are you saying that Manchester Citys squad is that much worse than ours in those seasons? I don't understand this placement argument
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Ole doesn't sell players? No but he decides who plays and he played lingard a week ago instead of a 35 million signing from the year before. The excuses he gets for failing to get rid of deadwood is hilarious. Always woodwards fault despite everything being shown that any decision involving players is made by the manager.

Maybe i shouldn't have stated where city would finish with him as manager because he would be fired about a bad stretch of games (like we have every year) before the season ended, but if miraculously he survived the season (this season not last), he'd finish around there. City's squad is worse than last year. Other teams across England are better. Not to mention the media would tear him apart if he were at any other club ultimately affecting his teams' performance
 
Any half-competent manager can win the league with City's squad and backing. Chelsea i think is at a similar level to United.

Pep, Tuchel & Klopp could all win with United's squad, just as Ole can.
 
We would play better and I imagine the young players would develop more too (especially under Klopp)
 
City would end up back in the Mark Hughes days, probably still have Hart and Richards though
 
I don't know about Tuchel as this is gonna be his first full season in PL but Pep ? Absolutely. He'll dominate the league with us.
 
Hypotheticals are always a safe ground for the football fan. Can't ever be proven wrong. I do find it humorous that many will completely undervalue or ignore that our 'terrible' manager is the one that actually built this squad we're trying to pimp out to other managers
 
Flytan said:
Ole doesn't sell players? No but he decides who plays and he played lingard a week ago instead of a 35 million signing from the year before. The excuses he gets for failing to get rid of deadwood is hilarious. Always woodwards fault despite everything being shown that any decision involving players is made by the manager.

Maybe i shouldn't have stated where city would finish with him as manager because he would be fired about a bad stretch of games (like we have every year) before the season ended, but if miraculously he survived the season (this season not last), he'd finish around there. City's squad is worse than last year. Other teams across England are better. Not to mention the media would tear him apart if he were at any other club ultimately affecting his teams' performance
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No one is making excuses, I'm just pointing out how real life works. But, since you know a lot about this particular field feel free to do a case for me:

Sell Phil Jones, Jesse Lingard and Juan Mata. Tell me how you do it. Go on.
 
It's still stupid
Flytan said:
Well I said he'd never be given the job at those clubs, but I don't think our squad is that much worse than city's. I was also talking about this year not last year in regards to finishing worse.
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Saying that Ole would finish sixth to eighth with city is a bit much, isn't it?! I mean they're probably the best squad in the Prem, if not the world.
 
I can tell you one thing. Sir Alex would win the title by 10 points minimum this season with the current squad.
 
Pickle85 said:
It's still stupid

Saying that Ole would finish sixth to eighth with city is a bit much, isn't it?! I mean they're probably the best squad in the Prem, if not the world.
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I think their squad is tailored to pep and that if ole had the same players his style of play would result in them being much worse. Maybe i am delusional, I don't know, I just don't think ole is a remotely decent manager tactics wise.
 
sullydnl said:
Nobody would definitely win the title win any of those sides as those teams all have flaws and face tough competition.

Obviously the vast majority of people would say Pep & Tuchel (and indeed Klopp) would be more likely to win the title with those teams than Solskjaer, as they're proven (to varying extents) in a way he isn't isn't. In truth there are few teams in the league whose fans would think bringing Solskjaer in would be an improvement.

We know this though. If you're backing Solskjaer to be a top level manager then (unless you're detached from reality) you know you're doing so against the tide of opinion among football fans. You might be right or you might be wrong but you can't reasonably think that on paper he matches up to them in a way anyone other than a Manchester United fan would think comparable. Instead you're hoping he's a better fit for this particular club than those managers would be in a way that has yet to fully materialise on the pitch.
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You are massively disregarding the context when saying those bolded part. When United were at their lowest of the low with Jose and Ole was hired, all of these opinions were already formed mainly because of his Cardiff time cause that's what most of the english football fans would know and then used as banter, and not based on his performance over the last two years. I'm not saying he's become a top level manager in the two years, but he's become a good - very good manager. And of coooourse, football fans (esp oppo fans) are known to change their opinion based on the evidence instead of continuing with the banter. Yeaaah, suuure. I can guarantee you, most of those fans would have a different opinion if it was someone like Poch with the same performance and I can even guarantee the majority of those fans will continue having the same opinion even if Ole wins the league (saying the world class team won the league not Ole's managerial ability).

So I wouldn't base anything on other team's fans' opinion, esp when it comes to United as we have basically ruined most of their childhoods.
 
Tuchel has only won the league with PSG who were head and shoulders above any other team in Ligue 1, he never won it at Dortmund and he is yet to have a full season in England. It’s hard to assess him in that regard.

As for Pep, this team is really anti thesis of what he wants from his side so not sure.

Klopp would be the closest I think.
 
Tom Cato said:
No one is making excuses, I'm just pointing out how real life works. But, since you know a lot about this particular field feel free to do a case for me:

Sell Phil Jones, Jesse Lingard and Juan Mata. Tell me how you do it. Go on.
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You think the club made him re-sign Mata? Jones isn't his fault and I wouldn't hold that atrocious contract against anyone. But yes, lingard would be shipped out by almost any other manager with how far down he is in the squad. Even if we have to pay some od his wages
 
Pickle85 said:
Wait, so you think that Ole would finish between 6-8 with city's squad which is (imo) better than ours. Despite the fact that he finished 2nd last year with ours?

Logic.
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This is the thread you can say whatever you want to, you can never be proven wrong.

Ole with City's squad will win quadruple easily. Pep might struggle to finish top 4 with this ManUtd team.
Not sure if anyone believes that
 
Tom Cato said:
No one is making excuses, I'm just pointing out how real life works. But, since you know a lot about this particular field feel free to do a case for me:

Sell Phil Jones, Jesse Lingard and Juan Mata. Tell me how you do it. Go on.
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Set transfer list and offer to clubs. If that fails add a manager at another club and make them bid on your player and then quickly resign.
 
Kag said:
For all you know Ole desperately wants a midfielder and has no issue with ‘yeeting’ the likes of James and Lingard (Mata’s role is markedly different at this stage of his career). But Ole isn’t in charge of the finances; he doesn’t sell the players.

By this time tomorrow it’s very possible that the aforementioned players are no longer at the club.

My hunch is that we’d have a new midfielder if the club had the stomach to bring one in.
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Everyone always makes excuses for Ole but at the end of the day we've sat and watched over 2 years of McFred, he doesn't even pick his best midfielders at the club - including one he spent nearly 40m on. Ole is clearly so far out of his depths and thankfully this season should be the one to finally expose that so we can move on from this mediocrity.
 
MichaelRed said:
Everyone always makes excuses for Ole but at the end of the day we've sat and watched over 2 years of McFred, he doesn't even pick his best midfielders at the club - including one he spent nearly 40m on. Ole is clearly so far out of his depths and thankfully this season should be the one to finally expose that so we can move on from this mediocrity.
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Who are they?
 
Impossible to definitively state whether they would or not, but one thing I would say is that I don't think their chances of doing so would be talked down anywhere near the amount that our fans talk down our chances. Of course we have weaknesses, but we have a bloody good squad on our hands here.
 
The roles are different.

Switch 'em just like that - and both could flop.

In a hypothetical scenario where I own a generic modern football club with a squad of X players which can't be changed, and I need to hire a "head coach" right now - I'd hire Tuchel.

But what does that say?

Nothing, really.

It's apples and oranges.
 
My view of Guardiola is that anyone could win what he wins with the squads he has, so that includes Ole.
Pep with United, no chance.
Tuchel with United... Yes if 92-93 points could cut it, I dont see anyone getting 100ish with this squad.
 
MichaelRed said:
Everyone always makes excuses for Ole but at the end of the day we've sat and watched over 2 years of McFred, he doesn't even pick his best midfielders at the club - including one he spent nearly 40m on. Ole is clearly so far out of his depths and thankfully this season should be the one to finally expose that so we can move on from this mediocrity.
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You aren’t willing us to do badly with the best squad we’ve had in years are you?

Come on man, we’ve even got Ronaldo coming…
 
Whether Ole could win it with their squads I'm not sure as his in game management is dodgy, I certainly don't think he could win it with City's as it's a Strikerless system. Pep, Klopp and Tuchel would never go into a season with the crap midfield options we have so it's hard to say, but if they were dropped directly in now I don't think so as that midfield is so poor, which would be impossible for Pep as that is his most important component.
 
I really like Ole but I was thinking about something similar the other day. It was more of SAF had this squad what would be my expectations. The only answer I had for myself was actually close to winning it all. We truly have a squad of exceptional players and depth.

But then I asked myself what are my expectations for Ole with this squad and I had lowered my standards remarkably. He should be competing for the league. Think Champs league is out of touch because I just don’t think he has it to get the team playing proper trophy winning football.

It got worse because I can’t help but feel LVG would do better with the squad we have. Mainly he just had a better structure. However there is no doubt Ole has changed something at the club which can’t really be quantified. The mood, personal and everything just seems so much better and happier but yet to be convinced that long term he has it in him. Hopefully we’ll see the team improve how it plays this season.
 
The question is missing more in-depth meaning. It's not fair for Pep and Tuchel to work with players that Ole has hand-picked.

The better question to assess them is probably: "if all 3 were given the same amount of money and time, who would do better with the squad since Ole took over?"
 
Lentwood said:
No manager in world football would have achieved better league positions with the players Ole has had at his disposal.

That's not to say I believe Ole is the best manager in the world, just that I fail to see how anybody else could have toppled this City squad with such obvious deficiencies in our squad.
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Funny isn't it. We've only had a relatively strong squad for 3 games. Prior to that there have been many gaping holes. Now it's only really DM we are missing.
 
Certainly Ole or Pep wouldn't win the title for sure. The teams aren't built to suit their style and only way Ole wins the title with city is if the players carry on playing like they did with Pep. With Tuchel, I don't really know.
 
Isotope said:
The question is missing more in-depth meaning. It's not fair for Pep and Tuchel to work with players that Ole has hand-picked.

The better question to assess them is probably: "if all 3 were given the same amount of money and time, who would do better with the squad since Ole took over?"
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Unfortunately the answer regardless of the question is the same one - it depends on the last game (or at best last five games). If one had asked this after the Leeds game people would have answered in different ways. 'Knee-jerk Caf' at its best.
 
CG1010 said:
Unfortunately the answer regardless of the question is the same one - it depends on the last game (or at best last five games). If one had asked this after the Leeds game people would have answered in different ways. 'Knee-jerk Caf' at its best.
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True in some way. If Ole won the League or big Cups in any season before, the last 3 games wouldn't make much difference.
 
Isotope said:
True in some way. If Ole won the League or big Cups in any season before, the last 3 games wouldn't make any different.
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While it would make a difference with some people who are looking at actual facts, with most people it is like partisan camps and unless a manager does really bad (like Mou in his last season) or wins the PL, I don't have hopes of fanbase uniting over this.
 
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