Would you sack or keep Ole? (Poll reopened)

[Anustart89]

All pro-Ole arguments fall on their own logic.

Even if you say it's all about the squad and management, how do you explain that we're doing worse than last season (despite the new manager bounce) with a team consisting of three players that he bought? Does that mean that he's made the squad worse as a whole (with an unchanged management) despite signing players? What does that say for his prospects going forward?

 

[bonothom]

Ole could plunge us into relegation and it's still not his fault for some fans here

Absolutely right. The excuses Solskjaer came out with after the last game are pathetic. They have won 1 league game this year, against the worst team in the League Norwich. That's a pathetic 4 points out if the last 15. Failed to score in the last 3. We are heading for a mid table at best finish. If Spurs and Arsenal hadn't been even worse than United this season, we would already be in mid table. There are 5 points covering 6th to 14th and it's easily possible under this Norwegian idiot that 14th is where we'll finish. Still he will he pumping his fist at the Stretford end come the last day of the season saying job done, our premier league status secure for another year. The coaching setup at United is an absolute joke.

 

[Gehrman]

Can't we just hire the best avaible manager that pursues the ambitions and playstyle's that we want. Who was this guy before Ole was hired?

 

[Bilbo]

The proof is in the pudding, Ole.

You are an absolute shocker of a manager. How on earth anyone can defend this horseshit any longer is beyond my comprehension I'm afraid.

Lots of things are beyond your comprehension though. You're the same guy who said that pumping it long was "literally our only tactic" only to be presented with the fact that we were 20th in the league for long balls.

Forgive us if your views arent tainted by your agenda. You see exactly what you want to see, nothing else.

 

[anant]

I think it's fairly obvious what Ole is trying to do - build a team that is composed on the ball, can retain possession and be a potent attacking side. There has been reasonable progress on that front as well - we dont hoof the ball, we play the ball short and even when under pressure we try to pass the ball to the available options rather than hoofing it upfield. And that has worked against sides that attack us- the bigger sides.
However, for it to work against smaller sides, we need attackers who make intelligent runs. Creativity has been an issue, but not one attacker of ours makes runs behind the defence which makes it tough for our #10 to make that final pass (not saying Lingard or AP have it in them, but Mata still manages to make that pass when the attacking is fluid).
I'd give him this summer to sort these issues out, and if it doesn't work by October, I'd probably go Ole out.
Not saying that our point tally is justified, but I think Ole deserves time because we are shifting to a new system, and he's faced injury issues (partly his doing but one can justify it by saying that it is because we have no depth in the squad). We've done really well against the big sides which means that he isn't tactically clueless, but quite the opposite.
I'd give him time till 2nd international break next season to sort things out and if we are facing the same issues - then sure, he should be replaced.

 

[JoeyJoJoJrShabadoo]

The romance is long gone with Ole.

 

[Mainoldo]

I think it's fairly obvious what Ole is trying to do - build a team that is composed on the ball, can retain possession and be a potent attacking side. There has been reasonable progress on that front as well - we dont hoof the ball, we play the ball short and even when under pressure we try to pass the ball to the available options rather than hoofing it upfield. And that has worked against sides that attack us- the bigger sides.
However, for it to work against smaller sides, we need attackers who make intelligent runs. Creativity has been an issue, but not one attacker of ours makes runs behind the defence which makes it tough for our #10 to make that final pass (not saying Lingard or AP have it in them, but Mata still manages to make that pass when the attacking is fluid).
I'd give him this summer to sort these issues out, and if it doesn't work by October, I'd probably go Ole out.
Not saying that our point tally is justified, but I think Ole deserves time because we are shifting to a new system, and he's faced injury issues (partly his doing but one can justify it by saying that it is because we have no depth in the squad). We've done really well against the big sides which means that he isn't tactically clueless, but quite the opposite.
I'd give him time till 2nd international break next season to sort things out and if we are facing the same issues - then sure, he should be replaced.

You’ve made his style sound so mish mashed and confusing I actually agree with you.

He’s style isn’t for us and we need to hire an attacking coach in the summer. Hopefully Poch is still available. Allegri would come in and do a Conte job for us but might require too many personal changes and he’s not easy on the eye.

 

[AC1689]

We've done really well against the big sides which means that he isn't tactically clueless, but quite the opposite.

Quite the opposite?

So tell me what doing really badly against the smaller/lesser sides means? Are they just anomalies?! Or do they in fact prove he is tactically inept? I think it would even be fair to say that we’ve done very badly against much worse opposition which means that he IS tactically clueless.

You can’t claim someone to be the opposite to tactically clueless when they lose against Burnley at home, as well as Watford, Newcastle, Astana, Bournemouth, West Ham, and Crystal Palace amongst others. Or when they only win 9 in 25. Or when they have us below a team in the table, who has a championship manager in charge of a much inferior squad, worth less than our most recent signing. Or when they manage to relegate Cardiff and get sacked when they have them languishing in 17th place in the Championship?

Or am I missing something?

 

[Amerifan]

Sack van Gaal. Not much has changed.
Sack Mourinho. Not much has changed.
Sack Ole. Expecting change.

We have 5-6 players capable of playing Champions league level football, the rest are midtable quality.

The same issues are present with Ole as they were with previous managers we had before him. Lack of coaching, no off the ball movement, etc.

So three different managers (two of which had a strong pedigree in the game) we hired had the exact same issues?

Pep after spending a billion pounds had Laporte out for a few weeks and couldn’t really cope.

I think Ole is a talented guy with a good idea about football and how he thinks it should be played though I doubt he can/will take us to the level of competing/winning titles.

But you’re wrong if you think sacking him would change much with this team.

You’d just post the same siht in threads with a different name.
“Poch’s lack of coaching”

Exactly. That’s why we also need to replace the owners and the CEO and the squad and the medical department and move to a new stadium. Then we can discuss starting a rebuild.

 

[anant]

Quite the opposite?

So tell me what doing really badly against the smaller/lesser sides means? Are they just anomalies?! Or do they in fact prove he is tactically inept? I think it would even be fair to say that we’ve done very badly against much worse opposition which means that he IS tactically clueless.

You can’t claim someone to be the opposite to tactically clueless when they lose against Burnley at home, as well as Watford, Newcastle, Astana, Bournemouth, West Ham, and Crystal Palace amongst others. Or when they only win 9 in 25. Or when they have us below a team in the table, who has a championship manager in charge of a much inferior squad, worth less than our most recent signing. Or when they manage to relegate Cardiff and get sacked when they have them languishing in 17th place in the Championship?

Or am I missing something?

If I'm getting your point right then you belong to that category of people who believe Ole is a "tactically clueless Norwegian PE teacher"? If that's the case how would you explain us beating City at Etihad twice (albeit the 2nd one was a lucky win), beating Sarri, Emery, Tuchel, Poch, Mou, Lampard in his 13 months as our manager. Add to that, we're the only team to have taken points off Pool this season, got a draw last year as well with an injury depleted squad.
I'm not claiming him to be the greatest tactical mind, and he is still figuring some things out but I believe with better players, we'd be able to break deeper defences with comparative ease

 

[Mainoldo]

If I'm getting your point right then you belong to that category of people who believe Ole is a "tactically clueless Norwegian PE teacher"? If that's the case how would you explain us beating City at Etihad twice (albeit the 2nd one was a lucky win), beating Sarri, Emery, Tuchel, Poch, Mou, Lampard in his 13 months as our manager. Add to that, we're the only team to have taken points off Pool this season, got a draw last year as well with an injury depleted squad.
I'm not claiming him to be the greatest tactical mind, and he is still figuring some things out but I believe with better players, we'd be able to break deeper defences with comparative ease

Did we out play them?

 

[dove]

Liverpool
Sacked Benitez nothing changed
Sacked Woy nothing changed
Sacked Dalghlish nothing changed
2nd with Rodgers, then nothing changed
Klopp now Liverpoll are the best team in the world.

Pfff, if only they stuck with Dalglish they would have been the best team in the galaxy now. Any manager can turn from crap to GOAT if he is given at least 4 years, it's simple.

 

[anant]

Did we out play them?

Apart from the City win this week and the PSG win, I think we deserved each win.

Spurs in the 1-0 win had more shots, but Dave didn't have to make any WC save.

 

[BlueHaze]

9 wins in 25 league games is shambolic. He had an amazing run when he had just came in but when that run ended it's been nothing but a never ending depressing downwards spiral. Blatantly obvious he will never achieve anything with this club other than consistent finishes outside top 4.

 

[Red Dreams]

Give Ole a proper squad instead of the paper thin one he has and he will start winning trophies.

 

[Mainoldo]

Give Ole a proper squad instead of the paper thin one he has and he will start winning trophies.

In your red dreams.

 

[UnofficialDevil]

Give Ole a proper squad instead of the paper thin one he has and he will start winning trophies.

Not this again

 

[bdspeedy]

Well that's sort of my whole point...?

If we're going down the same path as them, and we obviously are with Ole's appointment, then it's better to recycle these crap managers faster than they did. Maybe we won't have to wait so long.

I like where your head's at with this idea. Let's try a manager a week then. We'll have it sorted by the summer.

 

[Gehrman]

Give Ole a proper squad instead of the paper thin one he has and he will start winning trophies.

Give Man Utd a better squad AND a better manager.

 

[Judas]

Build Manchester United's future around under qualified, underperforming, underwhelming Ole. Recipe for success.

 

[AC1689]

If I'm getting your point right then you belong to that category of people who believe Ole is a "tactically clueless Norwegian PE teacher"? If that's the case how would you explain us beating City at Etihad twice (albeit the 2nd one was a lucky win), beating Sarri, Emery, Tuchel, Poch, Mou, Lampard in his 13 months as our manager. Add to that, we're the only team to have taken points off Pool this season, got a draw last year as well with an injury depleted squad.
I'm not claiming him to be the greatest tactical mind, and he is still figuring some things out but I believe with better players, we'd be able to break deeper defences with comparative ease

I would first of all like to point out that 3 of the 6 managers you mentioned have since been sacked, so hardly a great claim. Also find it laughable you’ve included Lampard with the likes of Mourinho and Tuchel . He is up there with the giants of football management in your eyes then? And claiming beating Emery at Arsenal as an achievement is also somewhat outrageous.

I would also like to point out that Steve Bruce with Newcastle has beaten Ole, Lampard and Poch, so is he a far better manager than them? He also managed to hold Pep and City to a draw so does that put Bruce on par with Guardiola? (All whilst having a far inferior squad to Ole’s United by the way) That’s how it works using your logic surely.

I certainly do not think he is a “tactically clueless Norweigan PE Teacher”. I think he’s a tactically naive, underperforming, League One level manager. He’s already proven he can’t manage in the Championship. And he’s doing a pretty good job of proving he can’t manage in the Premier League, for the second time. There is literally ZERO evidence to prove he is a good, or even average manager. It all points to him being poor, if not terrible.

We need better players? To get more than 35 points (9 wins) in 25 games? So if I’m getting your point correctly then you belong to that category of people who believe no manager could get better results from this squad (so even Pep and Klopp couldn’t) and that we just need to keep throwing money and new players at Ole? Is that what Leicester did with Rodgers? Or Sheffield did with Wilder? No it wasn’t

DDG, AWB, Lindelof, Maguire, Williams, Matic, Rashford, Martial, Pogba, Fernandes, Fred and Greenwood for example wouldn’t get into the Burnley/Sheffield/Everton/Leicester/Wolves/Southampton squads? A squad of those players shouldn’t be performing better than all of the above teams?! Don’t mention injuries as an excuse, because we were just as terrible with Pogba/Rash/McT fit when we lost to Palace at home (1-2) and drew to Wolves (1-1) and Southampton (1-1) early season.

Another Ole In ******* who believes he’s about to miraculously transform into a hybrid of Fergie and Klopp, and have us as World Beaters after a few more transfer windows.

 

[Forevergiggs1]

Sir Alex Ferguson. Manchester United.
25th Feb 1989–3rd Feb 1990
38 games played.
9 games won.

And before any of you wet your knickers, no I am not comparing Ole to Sir Alex.
But maybe back then if the internet was around, some of you would have been calling for Sir Alex's head.

People need to chill. It's going to take time to fix this mess.

If SAF had of taken over a multi billion pound industry with one of the best youth academys around how long do you think it would of taken him to turn things around? There's absolutely no comparison that could be made between Ole and SAF that could justify Oles tenure with United. Nothing, nada, zilch, res.

 

[Adisa]

The percentage of people that want him gone asap is falling.

 

[UnofficialDevil]

I would first of all like to point out that 3 of the 6 managers you mentioned have since been sacked, so hardly a great claim. Also find it laughable you’ve included Lampard with the likes of Mourinho and Tuchel . He is up there with the giants of football management in your eyes then? And claiming beating Emery at Arsenal as an achievement is also somewhat outrageous.

I would also like to point out that Steve Bruce with Newcastle has beaten Ole, Lampard and Poch, so is he a far better manager than them? He also managed to hold Pep and City to a draw so does that put Bruce on par with Guardiola? That’s how it works using your logic surely.

I certainly do not think he is a “tactically clueless Norweigan PE Teacher”. I think he’s a tactically naive, underperforming, League One level manager. He’s already proven he can’t manage in the Championship. And he’s doing a pretty good job of proving he can’t manage in the Premier League, for the second time. There is literally ZERO evidence to prove he is a good, or even average manager. It all points to him being poor, if not terrible.

We need better players? To get more than 35 points (9 wins) in 25 games? So if I’m getting your point correctly then you belong to that category of people who believe no manager could get better results from this squad (so even Pep and Klopp couldn’t) and that we just need to keep throwing money and new players at Ole? Is that what Leicester did with Rodgers? Or Sheffield did with Wilder? No it wasn’t

DDG, AWB, Lindelof, Maguire, Williams, Matic, Rashford, Martial, Pogba, Fernandes, Fred and Greenwood for example wouldn’t get into the Burnley/Sheffield/Everton/Leicester/Wolves/Southampton squads? A squad of those players shouldn’t be performing better than all of the above teams?! Don’t mention injuries as an excuse, because we were just as terrible with Pogba/Rash/McT fit when we lost to Palace at home (1-2) and drew to Wolves (1-1) and Southampton (1-1) early season.

Another Ole In ******* who believes he’s about to miraculously transform into a hybrid of Fergie and Klopp, and have us as World Beaters after a few more transfer windows.

Boom! excellent post by the way.

 

[Eriku]

@Eriku, you do surely realise I said last 3 decades so that the poster wouldn’t try to invoke Fergie? Literally the only manager that anyone can recall has ever managed it, 30 years ago, a man that had proven his worth at both Aberdeen AND at United before doing so.

Quite clearly Fergie is the exception, not the rule.

Who’s trying to make him the rule? He was simply answering your question, and the streak went into 1990, so it did fit your criteria. You seriously cannot fault his answer. C’mon, don’t get overly defensive about this. Modify the question with "other than Fergie" and move on.

 

[Anustart89]

Give Ole a proper squad instead of the paper thin one he has and he will start winning trophies.

If anyone needed to know how out of ideas the Ole defenders are, there's your answer.

Who are these top players making up a proper squad who will join the club under Ole's stewardship? I'm guessing you mean Haaland, Sancho and the likes, but we've already seen one snubbing us because of the mess we're in.

 

[Big Ben Foster]

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I'd like to see where 35 points would put us in the table after 25 games each season. With that tally in 2013-14 we'd have been in 10th place!

 

[elnorte]

Give Ole a proper squad instead of the paper thin one he has and he will start winning trophies.

Not a chance.

If there was a school for football managers he'd be bottom of the remedial class.

So only in your wildest dreams (very apt given your username) would he have a hope in hell of winning any trophies.

 

[Rash Decision]

If anyone needed to know how out of ideas the Ole defenders are, there's your answer.

Who are these top players making up a proper squad who will join the club under Ole's stewardship? I'm guessing you mean Haaland, Sancho and the likes, but we've already seen one snubbing us because of the mess we're in.

Why do people expect Sancho to join us anyway?

 

[Big Ben Foster]

The percentage of people that want him gone asap is falling.

Only explanation I have is that people have given up on this season and want him gone in the summer. Because if yesterday persuaded people to switch to "keep" then I'm at a loss for words.

 

[UnofficialDevil]

I'd like to see where 35 points would put us in the table after 25 games each season. With that tally in 2013-14 we'd have been in 10th place!

We are only 4 points of 13th as it is..

 

[Big Ben Foster]

Give Ole a proper squad instead of the paper thin one he has and he will start winning trophies.

Only trophies we'll be winning with him in charge are League One and the FA Trophy

 

[Andycoleno9]

Give Ole a proper squad instead of the paper thin one he has and he will start winning trophies.

Based on what? His time in Molde and Cardiff? Or based on this one year in charge in United? Based on what you think that he can do anything with better players?

 

[UnofficialDevil]

Why do people expect Sancho to join us anyway?

Same way they expected Haaland to, after all Ole had managed him at Molde and had taken it upon himself to ensure United don’t miss out

 

[AC1689]

Same way they expected Haaland to, after all Ole had managed him at Molde and had taken it upon himself to ensure United don’t miss out

So player who played under Ole previously, shuns playing for Ole again at a much bigger club? What does that say

 

[anant]

I would first of all like to point out that 3 of the 6 managers you mentioned have since been sacked, so hardly a great claim. Also find it laughable you’ve included Lampard with the likes of Mourinho and Tuchel . He is up there with the giants of football management in your eyes then? And claiming beating Emery at Arsenal as an achievement is also somewhat outrageous.

I would also like to point out that Steve Bruce with Newcastle has beaten Ole, Lampard and Poch, so is he a far better manager than them? He also managed to hold Pep and City to a draw so does that put Bruce on par with Guardiola? (All whilst having a far inferior squad to Ole’s United by the way) That’s how it works using your logic surely.

I certainly do not think he is a “tactically clueless Norweigan PE Teacher”. I think he’s a tactically naive, underperforming, League One level manager. He’s already proven he can’t manage in the Championship. And he’s doing a pretty good job of proving he can’t manage in the Premier League, for the second time. There is literally ZERO evidence to prove he is a good, or even average manager. It all points to him being poor, if not terrible.

We need better players? To get more than 35 points (9 wins) in 25 games? So if I’m getting your point correctly then you belong to that category of people who believe no manager could get better results from this squad (so even Pep and Klopp couldn’t) and that we just need to keep throwing money and new players at Ole? Is that what Leicester did with Rodgers? Or Sheffield did with Wilder? No it wasn’t

DDG, AWB, Lindelof, Maguire, Williams, Matic, Rashford, Martial, Pogba, Fernandes, Fred and Greenwood for example wouldn’t get into the Burnley/Sheffield/Everton/Leicester/Wolves/Southampton squads? A squad of those players shouldn’t be performing better than all of the above teams?! Don’t mention injuries as an excuse, because we were just as terrible with Pogba/Rash/McT fit when we lost to Palace at home (1-2) and drew to Wolves (1-1) and Southampton (1-1) early season.

Another Ole In ******* who believes he’s about to miraculously transform into a hybrid of Fergie and Klopp, and have us as World Beaters after a few more transfer windows.

Lampard and Emery were mentioned because they manage/managed top 6 clubs. Also, FYI Sarri wasn't sacked!
Secondly, with Bruce- that hasnt been a consistent thing, most wins were lucky ones than tactical masterclasses but at the same time one has to admit that he has been performing admirably well.
Thirdly, how a manager performs with a team that is just shite and how he performs with a team aiming for top 4 doesn't have a high correlation. Klopp got relegated, Zidane's win record at Castilla was in 30s and one can point to many more such examples. And how is beating nearly every decent manager he's faced so far enough proof that he isn't naive tactically.
As far as your 4th paragraph is concerned, I literally said that in my earlier post that the point tally isn't justified, but the examples you've quoted are really poor. We were good in those games, missed 2 penalties and had a goalkeeping howler in the 3 games. It was just an unlucky game. You can definitely quote better examples.
And you've got to start reading people's posts before you start quoting them. The last paragraph is something that I've addressed previously so that I don't have to type it out again!

 

[Rash Decision]

Same way they expected Haaland to, after all Ole had managed him at Molde and had taken it upon himself to ensure United don’t miss out

Sancho is from City right? Wouldn't rather go back or join any one of the other big clubs than come to us...

Googled Sancho and the first links that came up were Chelsea and Liver.

 

[mu4c_20le]

So player who played under Ole previously, shuns playing for Ole again at a much bigger club? What does that say

Even he recognizes the problem is with the board, not the manager

 

[thejtrain]

You see exactly what you want to see, nothing else.

The irony of this one.

 

[Escobar]

If SAF had of taken over a multi billion pound industry with one of the best youth academys around how long do you think it would of taken him to turn things around? There's absolutely no comparison that could be made between Ole and SAF that could justify Oles tenure with United. Nothing, nada, zilch, res.

It gets on my nerves. People want to compare Ole to SAF but SAF was actually a top manager before joining United. Oke is not and never will be, no matter how much time we give him