Or because he ran Spurs off a cliff in the last 12 months
Would you sack or keep Ole? (Poll reopened)
- Thread starter MrSingh2002
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OGS improved as a manager lately.
1. He now makes selection on merit (or at least more on merit than previously) - it simply stopped to happen that any particular player continues to demonstrate shit performances regularly and keeps his place
2.He totally discontinued playing dross such as Lingard (which was a big problem last season)
3. It happens quite often that his substitutes change the game in a good way
4. Lately, he appears to choose viable (and different) tactics depending on opposition strengths and weaknesses
5.He tries to rotate squad significantly which is very good (apart from Maguire)
As such, the trajectory of his managerial development is upward, now it would be good to strengthen the team in a couple of areas in January and also in the summer.
1. He now makes selection on merit (or at least more on merit than previously) - it simply stopped to happen that any particular player continues to demonstrate shit performances regularly and keeps his place
2.He totally discontinued playing dross such as Lingard (which was a big problem last season)
3. It happens quite often that his substitutes change the game in a good way
4. Lately, he appears to choose viable (and different) tactics depending on opposition strengths and weaknesses
5.He tries to rotate squad significantly which is very good (apart from Maguire)
As such, the trajectory of his managerial development is upward, now it would be good to strengthen the team in a couple of areas in January and also in the summer.
Yes and no. What you see now is the result of the work he has been doing from day one.
I didn’t see much of a system in our gameplay when he arrived. players were just ... driven, so to speak, but there was no system. Now there are signs of a system at least.
At the same time, if some of his work eventually started to yield positive results, how is it a bad thing?
Ok then, we should have given each of Moyes, LVG and Mourinho 6 years each before evaluating them.
Your narrative falls apart with one sentence, here it's! See how ridiculous it's ? Or are you choosing which manager that deserves 6 years first before evaluating, while will give whatever excuses you'll bring on for why Moyes got only 1 year out of his 6 years contract but Ole should get the full 6 years like SAF ?
SAF is a freak appointment and manager. There's nothing in his career that will get repeated with another manager. No manager will get 6 years before dominating the league again, and no manager will stay with us 27 years managing the club again. The club itself doesn't think this ridiculous way of thinking anyway, showing by how they dealt with the previous 3 managers within 2-2.5 years. It's just you assuming things on internet and nothing else.
So again, leave Fergie out of this crap.
I am not saying it is a bad thing, and fair play that you acknowledge the progress. I am just pointing out that progress would not happen if he wasn't doing a good job from the start. I don't buy that he "has improved" as much. He has been doing the basics right from the start. The reason you haven't "seen much of a system" is because it takes time to implement. He did not just stumble over how to do it.
Well at least all the Poch sycophants will have to trawl the PSG boards for the next few years now.
Good lord. The point rebutted was "crashing out of the CL group stages warrants sacking". It was a blanket statement that’s somewhat ridiculous.
SAF’s United were sent packing by Basel.
That’s a 100% valid point to raise. Talk of giving everybody six years has NOTHING to do with what’s being said here.
I'm not sure what's that has to do with the post, I'm replying on this point in one of his earlier posts :
And even though I went on an angry rant after the CL exit, I still didn't say "sack him now" in any post this season. I have said several times I'll wait for the end of the season and evaluate. Have a solid season with top 3 finish in the league and winning a cup or just reach a final, and he should keep the job. Get 4th only and no finals we can then discuss if this project deserves more time or not.
But under no circumstances should Fergie early years be brought in Ole's future discussions. Different time, different circumstance, and more importantly, Fergie is a freak manager in history. I have no problem if you think he even deserves 10 years before evaluating, but mentioning SAF is just ridiculous. The SAF period isn't gonna get repeated with Ole or anyone else, period.
Does it? Can't remember it took much time for Brendan Rodgers or Graham Potter to implement their style. Or Pep Guardiola, or Jurgen Klopp. And I'm pretty sure you will see Big Sam implementing his style pretty fast. Can it be that... Ole didn't know how to implement his style, or didn't have a clear style?
No manager is getting longer than 2 years with us without showing some significant improvement within that period. Same as every other club in the world.
You can forget 6
You can forget 6
Hopefully next year we can see a top manager take over without the squad and situation being in a bad mental state.
We might be able to challenge this year, but next year we can bring in a quality manager to take us to the big titles.
I guess there is a risk we stick with Ole to see that fail and move backwards in terms of fighting for the top trophies.
We might be able to challenge this year, but next year we can bring in a quality manager to take us to the big titles.
I guess there is a risk we stick with Ole to see that fail and move backwards in terms of fighting for the top trophies.
Sorry, my mental filing system failed me, I was pretty sure I knew the exhange that had come before this
I should have checked, seeing as I was surprised considering you’ve been quite fair in your critique of Ole.Am totally with you that alluding to the start of Fergie’s reign is either disingenuous or confused. That said, football was far less competitive back then, and the margins were no-where near as fine, and United did not come with anything like the expectation and media pressure that it does now.
Great news about Poch.
No problem at all mate. You're welcome!Sorry, my mental filing system failed me, I was pretty sure I knew the exhange that had come before this
Am totally with you that alluding to the start of Fergie’s reign is either disingenuous or confused. That said, football was far less competitive back then, and the margins were no-where near as fine, and United did not come with anything like the expectation and media pressure that it does now.
Sorry to disappoint but unless United end up 10th or something, Solskjaer ain't going nowhere. And if for some reason we did get a new manager, I would expect him to win something in his first year because that's the whole point, right?
You're probably right in that he doesn't have a "clear style". Seems to be working quite well regardless, though. Can it be that "implementing a style" is not be all and end all of football management?
I am assuming things on internet?!?!
Infind
Personally i wouldn’t have given Moyes 6 years but LVG was on to something FA Cup, dominating matches, If he had been able to make a couple of class signings to bring creativity and goals we were on the verge of being good . Morinho second place with that squad a miracle, he should have been backed rhat summer but wasn’t and Mourinho was pissed and the rest is history. Ole is also building something but to me longer lasting potentially and building a young squad. With this will come inconsistency’s and miatakes, it takes time.
All Insay is SAF got 6 years and people like you so dont menrion that crap! Well it happenend and many wanted Fergie out at the time. This is fact but you say leave this important part of history out of it. Well I wont because it happenend and I was there. If was not all roses and many hated SAF ar the time. People like you.
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In the beginning, OGS simply didn’t know how to play. He was rushing about style-wise. Gradually, he apparently formed some understanding for himself and is now trying to implement it consistently.
Another factor is that he is trying to build a young squad that will last some time - we only have 3 old players in the team in Cavani, Mata and Matic, and neither is a cornerstone of the team. Rest is a younger bunch (with de Gea I think the oldest)
You're right about building for the future. We disagree a bit about wether he knows how he wants to play or not. I might read you wrong, but i don't agree that he just stumbles upon things that work. For instance, his best midfield today is the same as his best midfield at this exact moment last year, the difference is Bruno instead of Lingard/Pereira. His style is built on fast transitions, which has been evident the whole time. Last year he was ridiculed for it ("counter attacking" said in a spiteful manner), now, with better players, it's deemed entertaining.
but don’t you see a difference in how we approached a low block defence previously and how we do now? Previously we simply couldn’t do anything about it, now we consistently win in such matches, because we build attacks differently.
On the other hand, there is one glaring and escalating problem as well - we now defend very badly at set pieces. Why is that is hard to say, but the reasons are entirely managerial, of course.
I believe the problem with breaking down low blocks came down to players. There is a world of difference between Lingard/Pereira and Bruno, and after the latter arrived breaking down low blocks haven't been that much of a problem.
Set pieces being a problem I agree too, but it might come down to a couple of things. 1) The opposition has been more focused on set plays as a way to score against Untied 2) Other issues has been more important for the team in training (i.e. scoring goals from open play).
Not that it matters, but Klopp's Liverpool had the same issues in his first couple of seasons. Thing is, if the set pieces is getting fixed, United will start to be rather formidable. And that is a good thing.
If set pieces are fixed, on both ends - mind, we would be well within contention for the title. ( yes I’m getting carried away )
Why wouldn't you? I am optimistic too!
We just need 5 more people to change their opinion and we can hit 2000. Come on!
I have changed.
I voted for a change of manager a while back but surly now, Ole has earned the right to play out the season. Unless we fall off a cliff, back the boy!
A second place finish and a cup would be nice but a top three finish with a greater points total is progress, right?
66pts last season was awful regardless of where we finished.
Back him in the summer, truly back him, and then we'll see what he's made of. A manager that would have had the time to dispense of the deadwood, build a team of his own and push on to a title challenge.
As displayed against Everton, our whole squad is looking stronger, happier. Yes, we are going to lose games but we have come far since the early games of the season. The Champions League was a disappointment considering our position after 4 games but these things happen, I'm sury Ole will learn and be better for the experience.
All that said, don't think I'm some fan boy. I like Ole as a person but never thought he was good enough to deliver the good. I'm simply saying, surly he deserves the season.
We can use Sir Alex as a comparision of sorts. Because back then there were people wanting him fired. People who thought they knew better. People use Oles lack of trophies and say that's absolute proof he can't win anything here. There is nothing to base that on. You would require hindsight. And we're in another Semi final but we're against City, and then probably Spurs. So it's not an easy or given path to the final. If lucks with us, we might win a trophy this season. But we've seen with Moyes, LVG and Jose how BAD it can be. How diabolical it can be. We're challenging at a time probably too soon for this squad. There is very little winning experience in this squad but it's coming together. Not helped by no supporters. Not helped by spoilt agents.
The board know Ole is their best bet because they can hide behind Ole and youth will come through. There's never been a sign of him getting fired. It's a 'project' not sticking a plaster over everything. It's peoples attitudes towards, how we've improved that needs re-evaluating. Many people speak like we've not improved. There was a time, it was hard for most of us to think who the first 11 really were. That's not the case right now. We do have an identity on the pitch but it's a process. The board didn't bring in Sancho. But we have bought in some interesting players and we just have to wait. If you think about it, Martial and Greenwood probably have another gear or two in them. So we have the potential to improve in the second half of the season but when we talk about luck - Rashfords injury in the second half of last season ended his momentum and maybe ours in those criitcal games.
The board know Ole is their best bet because they can hide behind Ole and youth will come through. There's never been a sign of him getting fired. It's a 'project' not sticking a plaster over everything. It's peoples attitudes towards, how we've improved that needs re-evaluating. Many people speak like we've not improved. There was a time, it was hard for most of us to think who the first 11 really were. That's not the case right now. We do have an identity on the pitch but it's a process. The board didn't bring in Sancho. But we have bought in some interesting players and we just have to wait. If you think about it, Martial and Greenwood probably have another gear or two in them. So we have the potential to improve in the second half of the season but when we talk about luck - Rashfords injury in the second half of last season ended his momentum and maybe ours in those criitcal games.
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What the feck even is this?
Has someone posted the sixteen-hour series of lectures Bielsa delivered on how he believes Ole disrupted his (Bielsa's) tactics?
I wish more people read the part about Bielsa admitting that Ole outwitted him with playing 2 centre mids in McTominay and Fred. Unbalanced the hell out of Kalvin Phillips and led to Leeds' demise.
thank you. Glad to see someone seeing the bigger picture rather than just sticking to his opinion in here. Over the last couple of months I’ve seen arguments from both sides trying to justify their position regardless of what was actually happening on the pitch. I read a post yesterday where someone was blaming Ole for Liverpool’s CL win a couple of year back! That’s how deluded some has become.
what you said is true. The board and owners need to truly back him this summer. Give him what he wants. He’s on to something! He’s progressed the team well. I really hope we win something this season. 1- that’s because we are manchester united and we have to be winning things. 2- to put more faith in this manager who has been different than Moyes, LVG and Mourinho and more progressive. The summer signing, though probably not bad, were not what Ole wanted. Back him properly in the summer, maybe get in a player in January and let’s see the progress.
i think Ole is maturing in his role. Probably fans say he is not good enough, you also think this way, but I think he is maturing in his role (as you said he’ll learn). Why not the right person if the team is progressing, the right signings are made, players’ harmony is good, football is exciting... why not him?
but again, great post mate
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I'm diagnosed with schizophrenia and one thing that helps me going through it is United. He may not be the best manager around but it has been years we haven't play so well
Hey, no spoilers I was only on season one episode eight.
Threads like these remind me that most fans know feck all about football beyond social media and youtube clips, and would rather spout absolute garbage behind the guise of anonymity rather than enjoy the spectacle and journey of watching their team. Genuinely feel sorry for you sad fecks.
Ole is doing a pretty good job. Anyone who tries to downplay it is a muppet of the lowest order.
Ole is doing a pretty good job. Anyone who tries to downplay it is a muppet of the lowest order.
If I knew how to post GIFs, I’d post the Michael Scott “Thank You!” GIF. There has been some absolute shite being posted here the last few pages with one person who is clearly a WUM and too many people biting!
I have and he also said that the pass Martial made for the second goal was impossible. A man big enough to admit he was out thought by Ole who got spot on.
I hope he does the same tomorrow too. Also be mindful of what happened to Leeds in they got caught attacking us and was counter attacked by us. Leicester is good at counter attacking too. Their defense can be got at and we have one of the best if not the best forward line in the PL.
Bielsa admits he got outwitted by Ole. Redcafe “experts” and WUMs “Ole out! He’s lucky! Etc etc and other nonsense.
this is murder and I don't know how anyone can come back from this. kudos!
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