Youssoufa Moukoko

Oly Francis

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I wonder. Did you validate each of these yourself to confirm your reasoning?

I imagine most would be unlikely to supply a birth certificate to some random tourist having a walk up to them and demanding one.
Don't know if his story is true but as of 2020, 66% of childen in cameroun (where Moukoko was born) didn't have a birth certificate.

https://www.aa.com.tr/fr/afrique/cameroun-plus-de-66-des-enfants-sans-acte-de-naissance-/2047782

French source but this was reported in pretty much any language.
 

stefan92

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Finally his debut for the German U21 tonight. It's only San Marino, so Germany is 5-0 up at halftime, two goals by Moukoko already.

He was already part of the squad that won the tournament in the summer, but could not play due to injury.
 

stefan92

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Given how few good strikers we have in the national team I feel like a promotion to the first team asap wouldn't hurt.
But I also think this would only make sense if he really performs that well. So far his actual performances in the Bundesliga are not better than what the other options do. But I do hope that this will improve during the season, at least it looks like he will rotate a bit with Haaland and Malen for two spots in Dortmunds team, so he should get minutes.
 

do.ob

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The lad already faces a mountain of pressure, a premature promotion to Die Mannschaft, before he's even established himself in Bundesliga, is the last thing he needs.
 

NoLogo

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But I also think this would only make sense if he really performs that well. So far his actual performances in the Bundesliga are not better than what the other options do. But I do hope that this will improve during the season, at least it looks like he will rotate a bit with Haaland and Malen for two spots in Dortmunds team, so he should get minutes.
The lad already faces a mountain of pressure, a premature promotion to Die Mannschaft, before he's even established himself in Bundesliga, is the last thing he needs.
Musiala had his first game for the national team in his early 18eens, so not much older than Moukoko is right now. I'm not suggesting he should be an immediate starter, just invite him for a couple of qualification games and get him a couple of sub games. I think it's always worth it to introduce major talents to the national team at an early age.
 

do.ob

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Musiala had his first game for the national team in his early 18eens, so not much older than Moukoko is right now. I'm not suggesting he should be an immediate starter, just invite him for a couple of qualification games and get him a couple of sub games. I think it's always worth it to introduce major talents to the national team at an early age.
I don't think those two compare, because Moukoko has been getting irresponsible amounts of nation wide attention and expectations since he was 12. The fact that you're demanding him to get a call up with a grand total of three goals and about 600 minutes played at senior level to his name speaks to that. I doubt it's going to help him when he gets an invite with insane expectations, when he's clearly not ready to play such a role.
 

stefan92

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I don't think those two compare, because Moukoko has been getting irresponsible amounts of nation wide attention and expectations since he was 12. The fact that you're demanding him to get a call up with a grand total of three goals and about 600 minutes played at senior level to his name speaks to that. I doubt it's going to help him when he gets an invite with insane expectations, when he's clearly not ready to play such a role.
Exactly. Let's just hope he has a decent season at Dortmund and let him lead the line of the German U21, that should be absolutely enough for the next 10 months/this season. If everything goes well for him than there is still enough time to make him part of the national team ahead of the world cup.
 

Blood Mage

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We should wait to see how Sancho does here before deciding to buy any more players from Dortmund.
 

yumtum

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This was posted in the Bellingham thread, was impressed by the dribbling ability of Moukoko, always assumed he was a poacher rather than what that clip suggests going off his youth record.

First time seeing anything of him, but that little dribble was tasty!

thanks @stefan92 for letting me know who that was!

 

Lay

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Yeah the dribble was nice. How has he played for Dortmund this season?
 

Blackwidow

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124 minutes in 9 matches in the Bundesliga, 20 minutes in the Champions League, 45 minutes in the Europa League...
 

yumtum

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124 minutes in 9 matches in the Bundesliga, 20 minutes in the Champions League, 45 minutes in the Europa League...
And Dortmund apparently getting another young forward in Adeyemi, might be tike for Moukoko to go out on loan.
 

FrankDrebin

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Yep, he was impressive in his appearance.

That Rangers wide player looked great too.
 

stefan92

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And Dortmund apparently getting another young forward in Adeyemi, might be tike for Moukoko to go out on loan.
To be fair we should acknowledge that Moukoko was quite unlucky that he picked up several little injuries during the last year, which had an impact on his playing time. He was at least subbed on and got a few minutes when he was fit.

And if he keeps developing well I see no problem in using him and Adeyemi together.
 

ti vu

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And Dortmund apparently getting another young forward in Adeyemi, might be tike for Moukoko to go out on loan.
Weird if Dortmund loan out their supposed top prospects. They're supposed to be the nursery ground for these type of players, even when they recruit a few more from outside.
 

Thiagoal

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A couple of great dribbles but also overdid it a few times which led to a Rangers goal. You need a lot of patience with kids like this
 

roonster09

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Didn't read the article but the tweet is not looking good.
 

cyberman

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Saw this on reddit


So, I'm one of the suckers who did and the DailyFail (lmao, gottem), is basing this on "reporting" by Laola1.at, which in turn is citing sport.de, where no article about this topic can be found. So, yeah.

On the other hand, if this made up shit makes English clubs back away from him, I don't mind it. I couldn't care less if he's 18, 23 or 45 as long as he plays well.
 

Blackwidow

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Didn't read the article but the tweet is not looking good.
Actually a German journalist got the "real birth certificate" from his "father" with a birth date July 17th 2000 in September 2022 with the name Youssoufa Mohamadou - but Moukoko let the publishing get stopped by a court...

The German wikipedia page lists all this controversies (right now - might be changed), the English does not.
 

stefan92

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Bit odd this is all coming out after he refused to sign the contract
Except it isn't. As the post above yours already mentioned it was discussed in Germany (again) in September when everybody expected him to sign the new contract shortly after his official 18th birthday (which was in December)
 

mu4c_20le

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Except it isn't. As the post above yours already mentioned it was discussed in Germany (again) in September when everybody expected him to sign the new contract shortly after his official 18th birthday (which was in December)
It is outside of Germany, where clubs might be interested in his signature.
 

BalanceUnAutreJoint

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This controversy has been going on for years hasn't it?

I think he should have done a bone age assessment to put an end to the controversy for good.

But maybe he didn't want to give that satisfaction to his critics.
 

Blackwidow

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Bit odd this is all coming out after he refused to sign the contract
Not really. Seems that he has problems with his "father" (or the one that used to be his father). With Yousoufa getting 18 the legal power over him and his contracts and the money ended...
 

stefan92

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It is outside of Germany, where clubs might be interested in his signature.
Yes, but saying it's coming out makes it sound like this is news - it isn't, it just started to become interesting outside Germany.
 

Oly Francis

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This controversy has been going on for years hasn't it?

I think he should have done a bone age assessment to put an end to the controversy for good.

But maybe he didn't want to give that satisfaction to his critics.
Even wrist MRI aren't that reliable if applied to an individual case (too many variables).

There's no real way to put an end to controversies like that so the only solution is to buy the player for what he is without relying too much on his progresson since it's possible he's far closer too his peak age than what the papers say.

A pretty influential agent from Cameroon is a client of mine, they have to run pretty thorough backround checks when they send a player to europe to verify his age is genuine (or to make sure the european club won't find out it's not).

Pretty sad but that's unfortunately how it works.
 

Red the Bear

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This is so bizarre.

Still aside from the legalities of defrauding his contractors it shouldn't matter as long as he plays well.
 

fck

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Even wrist MRI aren't that reliable if applied to an individual case (too many variables).
That's my understanding as well and sadly many don't know (or care) about this fact. It's like be asked to do a lie detector test and being told that it's just 60% accurate. Nobody would agree to something like this. Then there is also the element of pride. Let's just say if I was in his situation and the age was real I wouldn't do a test either.
Anyway there is definitely some room for speculation but some people are a bit unfair to the guy (some, of course, deliberately).
 

Bojan Djordjic

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This is so bizarre.

Still aside from the legalities of defrauding his contractors it shouldn't matter as long as he plays well.
I think it matters if you buy an 18 year old prodigy with a 15 year career to share together at a premium but to actually have bought a mediocre 28 year old that is about to start declining in value.
 

Red the Bear

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I think it matters if you buy an 18 year old prodigy with a 15 year career to share together at a premium but to actually have bought a mediocre 28 year old that is about to start declining in value.
Well the claim is that he's 22 so not that big of a gap.

But yeah there will definitely be lawsuits if he actually faked it.
 

Bojan Djordjic

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Well the claim is that he's 22 so not that big of a gap.

But yeah there will definitely be lawsuits if he actually faked it.
It kind of is though. I mean Moukoko is seen as one of the best prospects in European football because he's doing what he's doing at 18. It's not nearly as unique if he's actually 22. This is factored into transfer and contract valuations.
 

fck

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It kind of is though. I mean Moukoko is seen as one of the best prospects in European football because he's doing what he's doing at 18. It's not nearly as unique if he's actually 22. This is factored into transfer and contract valuations.
Yes it makes a huge difference. If he's 22 he's really nothing special. But the good news for Dortmund is that the story is likely BS.
 

stefan92

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Yes it makes a huge difference. If he's 22 he's really nothing special. But the good news for Dortmund is that the story is likely BS.
If he doesn't extend his contract it doesn't even matter for Dortmund