Somewhere out there, Daniel Levy is licking his lips.
Dele 'Muhammad' Alli | Walker takes the finger from Dele | FIFA open disciplinary proceedings
- Thread starter theyneverlearn
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I thought this too. Was a bit over the top with his challenges considering the occasion.
And I think the deflection on the shot was enough to take it over lloris.
And your comment lacks substance. Do you dispute any of the four things that I stated? If so, which and why?
Pogba is a not a DM, so you are comparing apples with oranges. Which 21 year old DMs have more potential than Dier?
You implied that Alli has the same sort of potential as Pogba.
He doesn't. I don't need to dispute anything, it's just clearly very, very obvious that he doesn't.
You only need to see that cameo performance from Pogba to see he is an elite talent. Something which Alli is not.
It's not at all obvious, for the four reasons I stated. Was Pogba playing better than Alli at the age of 19? Like hell he was ... he'd only made 3 Prem appearances. Alli has already exceeded that by far.
You only need to see Alli's performance in the same game to see that you are talking bollocks.
It's clearly obvious just by watching them play for feck sake.
Get in the real world.
One game where he did well, put himself about a bit and scored a good goal. Pogba came on and immediately started dictating the game, his talent is obvious. Alli will be a good player but it's silly to think he is a similar talent.
Pogba being at the ages of 20 (a year older than Alli) and 21 was instrumental for the Serie A title winners and also guided them to the Champions league final. Pogba is regarded as one of the most talented players in the world.
P.S - I am not writing off Alli as an average talent, but you have to wait to reserve judgement on his potential.
As I've said, Alli is 3 years younger than Pogba. He's shown at least as much potential as did Pogba at that age: the latter didn't get a senior France cap until he was older than Alli and made just 3 Prem appearances for United. In contrast, Alli already has 4 England senior caps and 1 goal, plus 10 Prem appearances and 2 goals ... not to mention outstanding performances against both City and Arsenal.
I'm holding this dirty bastard responsible for Martial on crutches.
He played well though.
He played well though.
Alli's talent is also obvious and played a key part in England's win. If you're looking at the game tonight - and it seems that you are - then it's impossible to convincingly argue that a 19 year-old Alli had less impact than 22 year-old Pogba. I say again, Alli has shown at least as much potential as did Pogba at the same age.
Didn't this exact discussion happen last week with regards to Martial vs Kane? Just the other way round from certain people.
So not only is Dele Ali the new Pogba, Eric Dier is also the best young DM?
Really starting to like this player a lot. Old type box to box player. Got more or less everything. Got an aggressive streak to his game as well.
No he hasn't and Alli wouldnt be playing for France yet. England have weaker CMs and injuries
Pogba is physical, technical and added consistancy to be the total package.
Alli is currently a physical player who needs to improve his technique, as is the case with most 19 year olds. But when you're comparing him to one of the best in the world, in this area he comes up short
Knew he was good when he took us apart with MK Dons.
He looked very good, as he has done for Tottenham all season. I don't see the point in comparing him with Pogba tbh, it's far too soon for Alli and they're not even similar players. They merely share the same position.
Pogba has been nominated for the Ballon d'Or twice, Alli is just breaking through. Both are exciting.
Pogba has been nominated for the Ballon d'Or twice, Alli is just breaking through. Both are exciting.
I've said that Alli has shown at least as much potential as Pogba did at the same age. I also think that Dier is right up there as amongst the best DMs of the same age.
Glaston just can't help himself, can he?
The stats (which I've given) show otherwise. And so do performances on the pitch: at 19 Alli has shown more - and against class opposition - than did Pogba aged 19.
The discussion was about comparing potential, not about comparing Alli with a player who is 3 years older.
And Pogba's potential comes from the fact he is a very good athlete, very technically skilled and also has a good mentality. Thats why some managers have been calling him the best midfielder in the world.
Ali doesn't tick the box for technical skill - not yet anyway. So no he definitely doesn't have the same sort of potential as Pogba
He has about as much in common with Pogba as he does with 19 year old Jermaine Jenas who was young player of the year
You've completely ignored everything I've said about a Pogba when aged 19 compared to Alli (aged 19) now. Well done.
Unlike Alli, Pogba was not dominating Prem midfields at the same age. In fact, he barely featured.
The way you are measuring it is assuming that potential comes to fruition at exactly the same rate for every single human being. Some people tap into their juice tanks at an earlier age than others. Theirs might only be half full though and ceilings will be hit earlier as well.
Aside of that there are outside factors such as chance (what club do you play for, does the manager see it in you, who are you competing with in your position, etc), different rate of mental and physical growth, etc.
You'd be better off comparing potential by using your eyes than looking at who did what at the same age. It never works that way and I surely won't have to bore you with examples of footballers who were just another average joe/talented player between the ages of 18-22 who grew into legends and ''the next....'' type of talents who simply hit a wall. In fact I can't resist.
Just look at what the likes of Rooney and Raul have accomplished at a young age compared to C. Ronaldo at that age. Who is by far the better player now with all the records?
What was your very own Harry Kane doing at 19 and how did he compare last year at 21 with other strikers of his age group in the world who were outperforming him in every way 2 years back? What was Zidane doing at 19?
Just looking at the attributes and seeing them play the game, the neutral will say Pogba trounces Alli and will go on to become the better player when all is said and done. United fans have nothing to gain from bigging up this Ihni binni dimi diniwiny anitaime, we'd rather he suck.
Glaston needs to put out his rose-tinted glasses when it comes to Spurs player really.Alli doesn't have enough in his locker to match Pogba's talent.It's that plain simple.Not really a good comparison though since they're not playing in a same position.
This amounts to saying that the argument that Pogba has more potential than Alli is - at the very least - unproven. Sure, Alli may not go on improve drastically further, but then again he might for all anyone knows. And Pogba may have have hit his ceiling - again for all anyone knows.
The simple point I'm making is that a 19 year-old Alli is showing more than Pogba did at the same age ... nothing more, nothing less.
Which again amounts to very little too as you seem to agree that such a way of measuring potential is shite... so what do you really think when you watch them play and look at their attributes?
That is where to form your opinion and judge.
No, it amounts to showing that the claim that Pogba has more potential than Alli is - at the very least - unproven. And that is the claim that I originally responded to.
If he's still at a club like Totenham Hotspur by the start of next season, I think it would be fair to assume he has less potential than Pogba.
I've been following the discussion from the beginning, and you've been making sense, but if anything's unproven, it's Dele Alli's ability/potential. He could very well become better than Pogba, but he is the unknown quantity here. Pogba has demonstrated a lot already. I know you're comparing with a 19-year old Pogba, but it's useless as we all know how he lived up to his potential already.
It's also unproven that Alli has less potential than Zidane and nobody can refute my claim that my future son could potentially be better than Messi.
Interesting style of saying just enough to coax the masses and at the same time accomplish to say feck all just in case.
Apparently Pogba thought something similar about United ... so he left.
I'll jump on the train early and believe in your son, Kevin. Please coach him well, I'm expecting god-like levels no less.
All very well, except, as I've said several times (and no one has disagreed), Alli has shown more than Pogba did at the same age. To which fact the dragging in of Zidane and your future son is entirely irrelevant.
@dead joe Vegeta's power level measuring glasses thing says Super Saiyan mode 6.
Amazing isn't it, connecting dots, seeing a picture and realization dawning.
All very well, except that very mantra you are exhausted of repeating was originally posted by you with the note that you contest the fact that Pogba has more potential. What I am trying to convey to you is, and I am repeating myself, the vast majority will think you deluded and that the one argument you're making to back up your claim equals Zidane and my future son.
Amazing isn't it, connecting dots, seeing a picture and realization dawning.
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Will he be able to do it on a rainy monday night at Stoke though ?
I am certainly not a huge Pogba fan. I think he is quite overrated. Still it is obvious, why people are getting so excited about him. He is fantastic on the ball (passing, dribbling, shooting) and has very quick feet similar to those midget Spaniards. At the same time he is 190cm and can match anyone in natural strength. He is also pacy with good acceleration. It is just great to see someone with his natural attributes being so agile and have such delicate movement.
Alli simply doesn´t have the same natural ability. Neither in terms of technique nor as an athlete. It is also very unlikely that he can improve enough to match Pogba´s natural ability.
Pogba´s big problem is decision-making and consistency while Dele Alli seems to be a lot more solid right from the start.
I also think that Dier is a bigger talent compared to Dele Alli, who is a fantastic youngster himself.
Not sure about alli; but Dier is a rare talent.
On occasion we played with 3CB's & sometimes with 5 defenders. A DM who can be that 3rd CB is a very rare trait.
On occasion we played with 3CB's & sometimes with 5 defenders. A DM who can be that 3rd CB is a very rare trait.