[ExoduS]

Was surprised about Mou's turtling approach in the first half. He played fully into Guardiolas cards by doing so. The soaking up pressure method doesn't work against a Guardiola side, and inevitably leads into conceding.
Mou made the right calls going into the 2nd half to gain more stability, but the game was already lost by then.
What was pretty obvious is the apparent lack of cohesion, clear movement patterns and syncronization between between the squad segments compared to City. Guardiola clearly transmitted more of his football idea than Mourinho did so far.

Game wasn't lost by then. We got lucky and scored at the end of the first half which gave us a whole half to equalize. Tactics weren't even that bad to begin with in the first half but who would have thought that Lingard and Mkhitaryan would under preform like that? They were totally useless out there. It doesn't help that our most expensive signing ever didn't do anything special either. When you pay that much money for a player you expect them to make a difference out there on the field... Look at De Bruyne being a freaking star and look at Pogba being slow and ineffective. Game was lost because our players didn't rise to the occasion. We were slower, weaker and less intense. Second half was good, just couldn't create a good chance, because again Pogba didn't do anything worth mentioning. Don't tell me one player doesn't make difference. One player makes a lot of difference, Rashford is an example.

With Ferguson most of United players were over-performing, after he left all the players are under performing. You need a special manager to motivate players to give their guts out there and to play with confidence. I am waiting for Mr. Special to bring that difference. I have not seen today and I am very disappointed. Season is long and let's see what future brings but we need to perform better, faster and more intense.

 

[FlawlessThaw]

City battered us for two thirds of the game. The first half was embarrassing. They are a level above us at the moment. We need to play a 4-3-3 against the stronger sides if we want to compete for the title.

You're completely spot on.

Though it didn't half make me think of "We aspire to be more like City"

 

[Rooney in Paris]

Yeah you're right, just keep the paddles away from me. @Rooney in Paris is probably interested though.

Waitwat

 

[SwansonsTache]

Anyone have the post match interviews with Mourinho?

 

[kouroux]

Think thats the 17th time Pep and Jose teams have played against one another.
Pep 8 wins
Jose 3 wins and 6 draws.
Just saying....

Guardiola has always had the edge on Mourinho. His football increases chances of winning games much more than Mourinho's

 

[The Brown Bull]

Really has nothing to do with today though … just saying!

I disagree.

 

[Hugh Jass]

We needed an extra man in midfield today. It was fine in the previous games as the opposition was not as good. Today we were playing local rivals and rivals for the title. He should have realised that.

This a 100 percent. I would also say we needed Smalling in Defense.

 

[Art]

Anyone have the post match interviews with Mourinho?

 

[Freak]

Hope he didn't name the players... too early in the season for that

Nope, no names mentioned.

 

[moxdevil]

With hindsight playing Mikhi and Lingard were a mistake but before the match I saw it as a positive decision by Jose thinking of their potential movement. Even though City were the better side we could easily have drawn that game if Zlatan had taken either of the two good chances at 2-1. We have some fight about us now at least.

The first half our wide forward players were too lazy and the defenders were too passive. Started pressing in the second and had some success. The players looked leggy especially Pogba.

Still work to be done but I'm not too disappointed.

 

[Theonas]

I can't agree with that at all. Mourinho knew that City would play the likes of Silva and De Bruyne in pockets of space behind the defence. They've played the same formation all season.

We should have set up accordingly to combat them.

You seem to mistake me for a Mourinho apologist. Even if we had defended better today and a couple of our counters worked, I would have thought this was unacceptable for us. My point is not that Mourinho couldn't do any better, it is that there was no "outwitting". You seem to agree with this yourself when you say that he knew how Pep will set up. To me being outwitted implies an element of surprise, some sort of cunning plan that your opponent could not see so I was arguing that this did not happen.

What I think happened today is exactly what many of us feared when we got Mourinho. He does not build teams that can afford to play front foot football. He builds teams that are functional. This means that when he plays against average opponents, his teams are good enough to dominate them through sheer individual quality. When he plays against good opponents, his teams are not good enough to play front foot and therefore are forced to retreat back. On occasions, this works, on others it doesn't. It could have gone either way today as well and either way I would have thought it was an unacceptable way for the biggest and richest team in the country especially against a team that is not further in its development or bigger or richer.

 

[JeffBoomTetris]

They are better at the moment as you say, only slightly. If we had played the first half like the seconds intensity, then it might have been different. I have said before, there is no saying they will be able to keep that tempo and pressing up for a season and we might be the team who still have legs at the end.

Well, City have a knack for finishing teams of in the first half. They're going to have to do just that against most teams.

As for us, there's no point in having fresh legs if we don't use them. We need high intensity players on the grass not on the bench. Ander-Pogba-Fellaini/Morgan should be the template for our midfield

This might be a knee-jerk comment but Pogba was lazy today. Fellaini can't do it all himself.

 

[Magnus]

Ok genius we were unbeaten until now with Fellaini in the midfield. Take your tinted glasses off, he was one of our best players on the pitch today.

Yeah right. We would have won our games with 10 men on the field. Fellaini is not a Manchester United midfielder. If you have to play him then play the fecking elbowing muppet upfront

 

[Shiva87]

I thought José was meant to be a master tactician? Got it terribly wrong here.

I knew we made a mistake going for him instead of Pep.

It's already a mistake is it? Fergie got it tactically wrong many times, and yet he was never a mistake. I didn't want Jose at United but now that he is here, at least stick by him. He made a tactical call and got outfoxed by his opponent. Period. Lets decide if it was a mistake closer to the end of the season.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

Agreed.How KdB's effort that hit the inside of the post in the second half stayed out is beyond me.

Also, the number of times Sane had the ball in acres of space on the right. Imagine us getting Martial in that kind of space. That's shows you how much better City were. We were largely hoping to score and someone to do something. City genuinely had us on the ropes when they attacked.

 

[Shiva87]

Yeah right. We would have won our games with 10 men on the field. Fellaini is not a Manchester United midfielder. If you have to play him then play the fecking elbowing muppet upfront

What game have you been watching?

 

[Nytram Shakes]

We needed an extra man in midfield today. It was fine in the previous games as the opposition was not as good. Today we were playing local rivals and rivals for the title. He should have realised that.

im not sure if it was just an extra man, we needed some one who was happy just to just sit and protect the back four... that isnt Fellaini or Pogba.

Not getting at either player, but that isnt their game

 

[DomesticTadpole]

Nope, no names mentioned.

Depends who he means as well. Mhki and Lingard's performances, especially Jesse's were not that surprising. That was down to him for picking them. I would imagine he was especially disappointed with Blind and Pogba and if he dares Ibra.

 

[Shiva87]

Also, the number of times Sane had the ball in acres of space on the right. Imagine us getting Martial in that kind of space. That's shows you how much better City were. We were largely hoping to score and someone to do something. City genuinely had us on the ropes when they attacked.

But a lot of that was because we were going hell for leather and playing 1 on 1 in the defense. It's what the game demanded. By and large (apart from the KDB shot) our 3 man urgency defense (Hererra, Blind and Bailly) did a good job. Only if Blind was switched on like that in the first half, the game would have been different.

 

[2ndTouch]

In fairness on an individual level, we have more better players that them, position for position.

No, you don't, and it became pretty clear today. Better in terms of physicality, maybe. Still that didn't prevent Silva and De Bruyne to act as they saw fit.
On an overall footballing skill level, City looked much better today.

 

[Hugh Jass]

Was surprised about Mou's turtling approach in the first half. He played fully into Guardiolas cards by doing so. The soaking up pressure method doesn't work against a Guardiola side, and inevitably leads into conceding.
Mou made the right calls going into the 2nd half to gain more stability, but the game was already lost by then.
What was pretty obvious is the apparent lack of cohesion, clear movement patterns and syncronization between between the squad segments compared to City. Guardiola clearly transmitted more of his football idea than Mourinho did so far.

The soaking up of pressure does work. Cue Inter Milan versus Barcelona home and away. But you need a good exchange from defense to counter attack. Second of all you have an extra man in MF, so it makes it harder for Guardiola to score. Thirdly your players have to be confident in defending. In the first half we were too afraid and too nervous.

The damage was done in the first half and we were nearly caught out on the counter about four times in the second half. So what you do is you soak up the pressure in a confident method and then let them make a mistake and you hit them and then you defend for the rest of the match.

 

[Freak]

Depends who he means as well. Mhki and Lingard's performances, especially Jesse's were not that surprising. That was down to him for picking them. I would imagine he was especially disappointed with Blind and Pogba and if he dares Ibra.

I think mainly lingard, Micky and blind.

 

[Random Task]

im not sure if it was just an extra man, we needed some one who was happy just to just sit and protect the back four... that isnt Fellaini or Pogba.

Not getting at either player, but that isnt their game

Indeed.

We should have started in a 4-3-3, which is easy to say with the benefit of hindsight, but I've felt this formation would suit us best ever since we acquired the services of Paul Pogba.

 

[NK86]

No, you don't, and it became pretty clear today. Better in terms of physicality, maybe. Still that didn't prevent Silva and De Bruyne to act as they saw fit.
On an overall footballing skill level, City looked much better today.

They did because of the tactics. First half we just let them do whatever the feck they wanted and Silva and KDB ripped us apart. Second half, they played on the counter but didn't really control the midfield.

 

[MadDogg]

I'd say Mourinho made two mistakes going into this match.

1) Playing Lingard and Mkhitaryan. This one I've got no problem with, as it's just him still learning his players. I can definitely see why he played them. Lingard for his workrate and pace, which is what you want hitting a Guadiola team on the break (plus he does tend to play better in the big games). And Mkhitaryan to basically do the same as Mata normally does, but with more pace. I'd say Mourinho learnt more about these players from this match than he has in the past month. Lingard is a good little player, but he simply doesn't have the quality to be first choice for a team looking to do what we are. And Mkhitaryan has so far this season and pre-season been great off the bench, but he's struggled when starting. He's also historically been a slow starter at new clubs. Combined with the international break and him getting injured, in hindsight it wasn't the best match for him to make his first competitive start.

2) Playing Fellaini and Pogba in a two man midfield against a team that will look to dominate possession and has the quality to make it count. This is one where I do think Mourinho simply fecked up, and hopefully he'll learn from it going forward. It's a midfield which might work against most teams, but it's simply not solid enough against better teams and I for one don't think we'll ever get the best out of Pogba in a two man midfield. He's not someone who will dominate and control the flow of games, which is what you want in that position. Rather, he's someone who you want injecting himself into games at the right moments and creating havoc. Don't get me wrong, he'll always need to do his fair share of the 'dirty' work in midfield (both in possession and defensively), but I just don't know if he'll ever reach his potential in a two man midfield.

 

[Theonas]

Also, the number of times Sane had the ball in acres of space on the right. Imagine us getting Martial in that kind of space. That's shows you how much better City were. We were largely hoping to score and someone to do something. City genuinely had us on the ropes when they attacked.

Mourinho's teams are about individuality up front. He works on getting the team solid and leaving the attacking to individuals. This is a very British trait which is one of the reasons we regularly see our front creative players being nullified time and time again. Guardiola works much more on creating space through movement for the attacking players to exploit and unlike LvG, he is very very good at it which is why when his teams are on song, there is no stopping them.

 

[#07]

That os actully Jose's philosophy, the less time you have the ball the less mistake you make.

Yeah but when Inter did it they had a level of self-belief and confidence in the plan. Daley Blind was hardly Walter Samuel today, you know what I mean? Scared mate. Half a dozen of em got frit.

 

[CS@SG]

Pogba shld have done much much more. He just disappeared.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

But a lot of that was because we were going hell for leather and playing 1 on 1 in the defense. It's what the game demanded. By and large (apart from the KDB shot) our 3 man urgency defense (Hererra, Blind and Bailly) did a good job. Only if Blind was switched on like that in the first half, the game would have been different.

That's my point. City having those 3 on 2/4 on 3 situations just highlighted how much in control of this football match they were. The only thing close about it was the shots at goal and the scoreline. They were, otherwise, in terms of quality of football and control of proceedings, easily the better team.

And I also don't think one mistake by one player was the difference. Maybe we could have lucked out in another scenario. But in general they were comfortably better than us, as was Pep than Jose, and the team that deserved to win, did.

 

[rimaldo]

Bravo is much better than this. First game in a new league is all.

nah. he'll get bullied like feck every corner and free kick now.

 

[Massive Spanner]

Pogba shld have done much much more. He just disappeared.

Like your vowels.

 

[NK86]

What did Jose say?

 

[2ndTouch]

Game wasn't lost by then. We got lucky and scored at the end of the first half which gave us a whole half to equalize. Tactics weren't even that bad to begin with in the first half but who would have thought that Lingard and Mkhitaryan would under preform like that?

They sucked, true. But that wasn't your main problem. City had complete control over the center midfield, hence they could build up pressure as they desired.
And yes, chasing for an equalizer against a Guardiola side is almost a Mission Impossible. Just take a look at his stats, and how many leads he actually gave away. Not feckin many.

 

[hobbers]

In terms of concentration he's clearly talking about Lingard and Blind. Blind was the most at fault for both goals while Lingard was totally out of the game bar two instances of bad control and a hand ball.

Playing Mkhitaryan on the wing was tactically the wrong decision but he wasn't a total failure. But you can't have players coming short on the half way line to get the ball, with three opponents surrounding them at times, and expect miracles. For that to work Valencia either had to be free to bomb past or Rooney and Fellaini had to be more mobile in supporting him, and as we know neither are mobile.

 

[MadDogg]

Think thats the 17th time Pep and Jose teams have played against one another.
Pep 8 wins
Jose 3 wins and 6 draws.
Just saying....

Most of those matches were when Pep was in charge of arguably the greatest football team of all time. Obviously he played a significant part in making them that good, but it's foolish to ignore how 'lucky' he was with the personnel he had to work with.

 

[markhrad]

We have to find a way to best utilize Pogba. Its his team now and we have to organize the team around him . He is world class but as we saw in the Euros he is wasted when he plays too far back in midfield.
I also think that its time to bring back Smalling, his physical presence and ability to bring the ball forward will enable Pogba to play further forward.
I am still hoping that Pogba and Mkhitaryan will form a bond leading to smart skillful interplay that will help to set up Zlatan and Rashford.
I always thought that Wellback as a local lad was over-rated, bambi on ice, however, Rashford looks like the real deal.
Rooney was ok today but he still does not look for his striker, at least not in open play, moving him to right wing in the 2nd half at least made him have to look for other options besides his trademark long pass to the said wing.

 

[Shiva87]

That's my point. City having those 3 on 2/4 on 3 situations just highlighted how much in control of this football match they were. The only thing close about it was the shots at goal and the scoreline. They were, otherwise, in terms of quality of football and control of proceedings, easily the better team.

And I also don't think one mistake by one player was the difference. Maybe we could have lucked out in another scenario. But in general they were comfortably better than us, as was Pep than Jose, and the team that deserved to win, did.

I don't think that's right. They weren't comfortable anytime after the first 40 mins. They did deserve to win because of how they started the game, but by the end, we had enough 'situations' to have used them better. Some of the shots Zlatan took were just unnecessary. Plus, Jose missed a big trick with benching Martial. The boy showed last season that he is made for these kind of games. If he had to bench Martial, it should have been for Rashford (not Lingard).

 

[Walters_19_MuFc]

People will blame the loss on certain individuals today, but that's wasn't the problem, in my opinion. Yes, players like Lingard and Mkhitaryan weren't great, but the formation did not help, and was the reason we lost the game today. Had we started with a 433, even with Lingard and Mkhitaryan, I'm confident we wouldn't have lost the game today.

 

[Nytram Shakes]

Indeed.

We should have started in a 4-3-3, which is easy to say with the benefit of hindsight, but I've felt this formation would suit us best ever since we acquired the services of Paul Pogba.

but who do you play at the base of the 3?
Carrick? i think he would have been run ragged today.
Schniderlin? maybe if he could regain his southapton form, but so far at united hasn't seemed the same player
Blind? wasn't great today, but has genrally been sensational since xmas, making all his doubters(myself been one of them) seem silly.

i just don't think we have an obvious DM in the squad

 

[2ndTouch]

They did because of the tactics. First half we just let them do whatever the feck they wanted and Silva and KDB ripped us apart. Second half, they played on the counter but didn't really control the midfield.

Well, they had the lead, they didn't have to exert full control anymore. And still they looked more cohesive and organized going forward.