To be fair, if you saw England's game against Brazil and how they were already under pressure for most of the time, while actually having very competent passers of the ball in their back three, then you can sort of see Southgate's point. It's still idiotic how he put his point across though and fair play to Smalling not to give in.
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To be fair, if you saw England's game against Brazil and how they were already under pressure for most of the time, while actually having very competent passers of the ball in their back three, then you can sort of see Southgate's point. It's still idiotic how he put his point across though and fair play to Smalling not to give in.
There is no point playing CBs who are good on the ball if your team can't play possession game. England had around 30% possession against Brazil so they can forget about playing from the back.
But if you saw the Germany game it was very clear what Maguire brings to the side that Smalling doesn't.
There is an argument to have Smalling instead of Cahill as a squad option but in a back 3, Jones, Stones and Maguire should be first choice.
People criticise Southgate but I thought Smalling was as adventurous with the ball as he has ever been on Saturday.
Don’t let that header mask the fact that he’s still a shit footballer who can’t be trusted at the Elite level.
I will never change my mind on Smalling and Jones. Good form doesn’t change their attributes (or lack of). You look at Rojo and Bailly and you can see they have something special about them. With Jones and Smalling, it’s just midtable dross. No different to the likes of Shawcross and Cook, etc. Just average English “PROPER DEFENDERS” with no actual on-the-ball ability or intelligence to back it up. That’s not United quality.
I will never change my mind on Smalling and Jones. Good form doesn’t change their attributes (or lack of). You look at Rojo and Bailly and you can see they have something special about them. With Jones and Smalling, it’s just midtable dross. No different to the likes of Shawcross and Cook, etc. Just average English “PROPER DEFENDERS” with no actual on-the-ball ability or intelligence to back it up. That’s not United quality.
I'm not against Maguire, I like him and rate him highly. It's just that what Southgate said and what they achieved against Brazil was way off the mark.
Is this a troll? Jones is better on the ball than both Bailly and Rojo?!
Rojo is far better than Jones with the ball.
Bailly looks a bit awkward at times but for the most part he’s more comfortable and steady looking than the panicky Jones.
Bailly and Jones are our best defenders.
Agree with you that Smalling can hit a bit of form and look good, but he is not reliable long term. Jones, as we know is constantly let down by injuries. Jones is actually very good on the ball.
Disagree with your comment that there is something special about Rojo, he is a bit reckless on times, and like Smalling looks good in patches but I wouldn't put Rojo as an elite defender
I completely disagree. Jones is a better footballer than both and a better defender overall. I would say Jone's weakness is his rashness and being average in the air
Rojo is a good destroyer but limited on the ball.
Bailly is a strong front foot defender but is awful in the air and has fairly poor control of the ball.
Smalling is supreme in the air but a very poor footballer, as bad as you will see at the top level.
All are at a similar level overall but Jones is the most complete defender for me
Southgate's opinion that Smalling was not good enough on the ball was his polite and respectful way of saying Smalling is a soft defender and not good enough for England. He's obviously not going to destroy his confidence by saying what he probably really feels. Smalling is a brilliant squad player at Utd but the difference in defense when he plays instead of Bailly is pretty huge.
I have to say I’ve never heard anyone say Smalling is a soft defender. A shit footballer yes, but he can defend.
Southgate is an idiot.
Are there English Centre Backs that are better passes of the ball then Chris Smalling? Of course. Are any of the English centre backs the second coming of Franco Baresi? Feck no... so to rule out Smalling on that basis is daft.
Not only that, but there are times in games where you just need to see the game out, and throwing on your big tall centre back who can head/defend better then most English CB's is clearly a great option to have - why rule that out?
Oh yeah, I know why, because Southgate is a feckin' idiot.
Are there English Centre Backs that are better passes of the ball then Chris Smalling? Of course. Are any of the English centre backs the second coming of Franco Baresi? Feck no... so to rule out Smalling on that basis is daft.
Not only that, but there are times in games where you just need to see the game out, and throwing on your big tall centre back who can head/defend better then most English CB's is clearly a great option to have - why rule that out?
Oh yeah, I know why, because Southgate is a feckin' idiot.
You are oversimplifying it though. If you watched the game, you would surely see that the fact that Maguire and Stones were able to carry the ball out or pass it out even under huge pressure helped England not to concede a chance after chance a lot. Now with all due respect to Smalling, with him it would have looked different. (And it's not like the England defenders were shit defensively that game.)
While I don't get Southgate's criticism as in a lot of games playing Smalling surely wouldn't have been such a big deal and in some types of games he can easily be a big asset, his decision to play the back three he did against Brazil was hardly a cock up.
We leak goals against top sides when he's in the team. Against teams outside the top 6 he looks very good. In big games you see Jones and Bailly diving in as if their lives depended on it. You rarely see that with Smalling although he's decent and aggressive when it comes to defending set pieces with his head.
Totally leak goals with Smalling right. 1 goal in 3 games with Smalling in. He was very good in those games as well.
You must be thinking about the Chelsea game last season. He was clearly injured and should not have played that one so I put that on Mourinho mainly.
Since when has that been a measure of good defending?
Rio never dived in like his life depended on it either.
Why are there so many posts in this thread after a game which he played well and scored a goal? 
Usually has Kane in his back pocket. So he's good in at least two of the top 6 games.
As for diving in, Rio managed an entire career of not diving in. In fact most really top level central defenders don't need to dive in.
Smalling is one of those players who are essential in our league, he doesn't play and we look very suspect again the more physical teams. He's not top class but he's a very good defender in this league and the system we play suits him.
You measure a defender on whether they are rock solid in most big games or not. Rio was rock solid. Smalling is not though at times can be
I was referring to big games where he's very inconsistent and often shakey hence not being in the first XI at Utd when everyone fit and not being in an England squad that has not exactly world beaters Stones, Cahill, Maguire ahead of him
If Southgate is true to his word that his defenders are to be comfortable with the ball, then the three players are infinitely better than Smalling is at playing football. I wouldn’t put any of those significantly ahead of Smalling in out and out defending.
-Maguire’s Leicester bubble has burst
-Cahill and Chelsea’s backline has been breached enough this season to suggest he isn’t particularly amazing
-Stones is part of arguably the best footballing team in Europe at the moment
I’m not a huge fan of Smalling, but he’s not a weak defender. That much I’m certain of.
I think he'd start at LPool and potentially Arsenal. He's definitely not a world class CB and I'm not his biggest fan at all but your post was just way over the top.
Basel 1:0 Man Utd
Played well today. One bad challenge in the box otherwise solid. His passing was better today. He plays better on the right.
So no teams with the prospect or realistic ambition of winning major trophies would want Smalling. Seems like you agree with my post.
Overall, good game again today.
By 'top teams' i mean teams that stand in the way of United winning major trophies again.
Couldn't care less if he'd get games at Arsenal or Liverpool. He'd not get a look in a City, Chelsea or the European Clubs likely to win the ECL
Standards at United have fallen a long way.
Smalling and Rojo were good. Surprised by Rojo, a bit of a sluggish start and then came on to an excellent game. The midfield and full backs left them so exposed in the second half, even Matic when he came on was crap.
Smalling does look far more comfortable on the ball when playing RCB.
Smalling does look far more comfortable on the ball when playing RCB.
Him and Rojo looked good. One of the positives that did well all game. He is in good form now and hope he can keep it up and stay away from injuries. He seem to be one of our most fit defenders at the moment though.
Good game and looked composed on the ball. I wonder if Mourinho has enouraged him a bit with his passing to prove a point, because he was moving it around with far more intent today.
Why not Chelsea?
Solid enough performance, him and Rojo did all they could.
Yeah thought he was decent. I think hes a fantastic defender in the box and much better on the right of defence.
Given you've changed the wording....no
As much as we dislike them, LPool and Arsenal are top teams
Top teams to me means teams at the top of the sport and likely to win trophies. It's not a matter of having a dig at Liverpool or Arsenal - it's about accepting that if United want to win things again they need to get real. Starting by not accepting players that no other top teams would consider to be of an adequate standard.
It's not personal against Smalling, Jones or whoever - it's fact that this calibre of player will come unstuck against the elite players in the game... and lets not forget this is Manchester United, the standards at this clubs should be as high as Real, Bayern, Barca. No excuses.
Lol I thought I was the only one who noticed. I was actually chuckling a few times because it was so obvious he was trying harder to play it out more. The thing is, he actually done quite well and it's a bit shameful, it took a bit of calling out from Southgate for this to happen.
Defended well but he was caught positionally when the defence got exposed; he chases the ball out wide when he should be holding his ground more.
Decent enough, not at fault for the goal.
Thought he was good, him and Rojo, and I guess Romero.
Was above solid versus Newcastle and tonight despite playing with different set of fullbacks, managed to continue good run of form.
If that makes him improve that part of his play, then well done Southgate.
As for his positioning, Darmian was all over the place, so Smalling had to cover for him. It must be difficult having to play with a new partner on both sides every match, and then switching sides at centre back as well. I think he did very well. Rojo was even better though.
His ball playing skills are poor, as is his movement with the ball. I just dont see him as a starting defender for us
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