Oh dear. If 30 or almost 30 is past a player’s peak, 30+ year olds Cristiano Ronaldo, Sergio Ramos and Marcelo better not suffer heart attacks during the final. It’s also interesting that the 30 year old world class players of Milan, who went on to win the CL again in 2007, are considered past it because of their age whereas Ramos and Marcelo are not.
Milan also had very fine players like Rui Costa, Serginho, Ambrosini and Costacurta on the bench. Not to mention Filippo Inzaghi in the stands. Three of those played a central role in Milan’s 2007 win, despite/because of their age. Real has a great bench now, but you cannot include Ceballos, Nacho, Vasquez and genuinely past it Bale on a list of superb substitutes, yet completely disregard Milan’s equivalents who went on to win a CL final.
I clearly said that guys like Cristiano and Benzema are past their prime. The team that won the final in 2007 and the one that played 2005 final had different starters for almos half of the team. Still, to say thay Maldini at 37, Cafu at 35, Stam at 35, etc are not past their prime would be false, and yes, Rui Costa, Serginho, Ambrosini and Costacurta were good, but not as good as Madrid's bench, and yes, including Vasquez (the top assister lf the team in the last 3 seasons) and Bale (injured and whatever, just look at his numbers)
They won a CL final, and 2 in 11 years also. Madrid is 1 game from winning 4 in 5 years.
Well, a "past-it" Benzema creates nearly as much assists + pre-assists per 90 in LaLiga as prime Messi this season...
Top 20 LaLiga players with the biggest participation in creating goals by assists + pre-assists per 90.
Benzema's goalscoring output may be poor, but is still a phenomenal player nonetheless and has been influential in many of RM's goals this season.
Benzema has had a terrible season bro, specially if you compare their old seasons where he always scored more that 20 goals only in the Liga, this year he has only scored 5.
Also, he is not even the best assister in the team, the last 3 seasons including this one, Lucas Vazquez has been the top assister of the team and he wasn't even a starter.
Yeah, they only won a domestic double.
Football is essentially a flukey and volatile game. The nature of a knockout competition amplifies it even more.
So when you have someone with not much knowledge of the game, and the phenomenon of an overhyped knockout competition, the results are posts like this.
And a season after that they won only the Copa del Rey. In 2013 they also won the domestic double and in 2014 they won the amazing total of 0 trophies.
If you knew a little bit of history of football, you could see how most of the teams that win everything in a season, in the next one they perform worse, thats why there was not team winning the CL in consecutive times for example.
But man, when you refer to the UCL, the most important and prestigious club tournament in the world woth the best teams in the world, as 'an overhyped knockout competition' , for me makes it clear that I won't discuss anything with you about the sport.
Why are you focussing on age and physical fitness so much? Overall, at the end of it, in 5 years time, that AC Milan which is stock full of GOAT in almost all positions will be looked back as a better team.
Oh come on, why are you bringing up titles when you know Calciopoli took place during that time?
Do you know ANYONE from Liverpool at all? How old are you? Every Liverpool fan who has seen Dalglish will tell you that he is the best player ever for them.
Did you know that Dalglish was voted the best player in their history by Liverpool fans? Do your own research.
Sorry but you really don't know much about football. Seriously you sound like 16 years old.
Calciopoli only took place in Italy, not in the UCL, so yes, we can talk about titles. And they didn't won more titles in Italy not because of Calciopoli, but because first Juve (best team in Europe in that time alongside Madrid) and then Inter were better teams than them.
About the GOATS, what are yout talking about?
The only GOATS I see in that team are Maldini and Cafu. The rest of them were great players and some absolute legends, but definitely not goats in their positions. And then, Cafu was 35 and Maldini 37, VERY past their prime.
So NO, they won't be seen as a better team never, not now and clearly not in some years. They can have a lot of legends (you have to be retired to be seen as one, expect this Madrid team to be full of them in some years), but the best teams in history earn that titles winning important trophies, and that Milan side is not even near to the actual Madrid team in that.
A team that won 1 Serie A and 2 UCLs in 11 years won't be remembered never as a better team than a team that may win 4 UCLs in 5 years (3 in a row), stop talking crap.
8 years on a row in UCL semifinals, 4 finals in 5 years and maybe 4 UCLs won in that time, Supercups, CWCs, etc...
And then, more that the half of this Madrid team are under 25 years old so they will be making bigger their own legend in the next seasons. Completely nonsense.
You can also be sure that players like Ramos, Marcelo, Cristiano will definitely be remembered as GOATS in their respective positions when they retire.
About Dalglish, no I clearly didn't saw him playing on his best moment as I was born in 1987, but I've done my research and thats why I can talk about it.
When you search 'Liverpool's best player ever' you get a lot of different polls from different sources, and almost all of them have Gerard as 1st and Dalglish as 2nd (Telegraph, Talk Sport, Bleacher Report, Ranker, The Top Tens, etc...) except one. So maybe you are the one that should be doing his research about how the people rank them, and not only the persons that are over 50 years old. You will get surprised for sure.
Still, I couldn't care less about Liverpool and their history. This started because someone said that the actual Liverpool team is much better that the one of 2005, and I didn't agreed with that, that team had Gerard (the best or 2nd best player in their history, I don't care), Xabi Alonso, etc. it was my opinion.
4 European Cup finals in 5 seasons hasn't been done in a long time. But that Milan side was top, top drawer. They simply did not care as much about League, and there was also Juventus (and the whole corruption scandal) to contend with there. They were a real force in Europe.
2002/2003 - winners
2003/2004 - quarter finalists
2004/2005 - finalists
2005/2006 - semi final
2006/2007 - winners
Should probably have progressed further than they did in 2003/2004 (blew a 4-1 lead vs Deportivo), and should have of course won in 2004/2005. Lost to the eventual champions Barcelona in 2005/2006.
And to call some of those you said were 'washed up' by then is folly.
Up until 2005, Shevchenko was arguably the best striker in Europe. Henry had more panache, Ronaldo - the Brazilain one - at his absolute peak (even then in his more chubby/rotund self) was better but was more unreliable, and Shevchenko performed on the big stages in Europe.
Crespo was also top drawer around this time.
Maldini and Cafu were old, but far, far, far from washed up (as they proved again later).
Dida was arguably the only 'weak link' in that Milan side.
Complacency and a rapid fire six minutes in the second half did Milan in in 2005 - but that Milan team was one of the best teams put together individually. That they didn't win more than they did is an absolute travesty really.
I agree with you that they were an absolute top team. Just not as good as the current Madrid side.
Maldini and Cafu weren't washed up, but they were pretty far from their best, and weren't the best defenders in the world in their position anymore.
Crespo was good but never one of the best in his position in the world.
Shevchenko was one of the best strikers, but wasn't the best in Europe. In 2001/2002 he scored 17 goals in all competitions. In 2002/2003 he scored 10 goals in all competitons. 2003/2004 29 goals (Ballon D'Or), 2004/2005 26 goals.
Benzema in Madrid had almost every season more less the same number of goals than Shevchenko at his best in Milan (and gives much more assists), and he has never seen as the best striker in Europe. Not even top 3. That is the problem of comparing players that are still playing with players that have retired. We usually see the retired players better than they were.
Don't get me wrong, Shevchenko was class, but wasn't in the same level in that time than Ronaldo, Henry, Ronaldinho, Etoo, Raul, etc... (maybe only in 2004)
Remember in that times there were some amazing strikers like Ronaldo, Henry, Etoo, Raul, Del Piero, Van Nistelroy, Tevez, Klose, Morientes, Trezeguet, Vieri, etc, so saying he was better that all of them all that years isn't true at all.
