Adisa
likes to take afvanadva wothowi doubt
It's a systemic problem and has been since Mourinho arrived. I'm not even sure he thinks it's a problem.
At least 99 is a huge improvement from weekend and we're within 20% of every other team who played in the CL last night.Distance covered by teams yesterday.
CSKA - 117
Shakhtar - 116
Madrid - 113
Hoffenheim - 113
Ajax - 113
Juventus - 111
Bayern - 111
Lyon - 111
Athens - 109
Roma - 108
Young boys - 107
Benfica - 107
ManCity - 106
Valencia - 104
Viktoria Lizen - 104
ManUtd - 99
Shocking effort.
Interesting numbers. The small difference in distance covered and very low overall distance in the united game go a long way to show what a shite match it was.Distance covered by teams yesterday.
CSKA - 117
Shakhtar - 116
Madrid - 113
Hoffenheim - 113
Ajax - 113
Juventus - 111
Bayern - 111
Lyon - 111
Athens - 109
Roma - 108
Young boys - 107
Benfica - 107
ManCity - 106
Valencia - 104
Viktoria Lizen - 104
ManUtd - 99
Shocking effort.
That doesn't say a lot I'd say as I think it's pretty similar for a lot of PL teams when playing City. Yet they are unable to cause so many problems as Hoffenheim did with so many injuries. So hats off to them, but not because of their distances covered. Rather than how, when and where they ran.Interesting numbers. The small difference in distance covered and very low overall distance in the united game go a long way to show what a shite match it was.
Hoffenheim on the other hand with a textbook example of how to play a Pep team, outrunning them by impressive 7km.
99 sprints? Is that what we racked up against Valencia?At least 99 is a huge improvement from weekend and we're within 20% of every other team who played in the CL last night.
No, it's 99 kms (distance covered) for entire team, which is very low.99 sprints? Is that what we racked up against Valencia?
If anything, a big difference between that game and the one against West Ham is even more damning on the (lack of) effort from our players as that rules out tactics being the reason we run so little, seeing as there was zero evidence of any difference in the tactics used in those two matches.
These are not sprints and rather total distance covered in KMs.At least 99 is a huge improvement from weekend and we're within 20% of every other team who played in the CL last night.
Someone posted a clip from Valencia game from few years back. There were a few striking differences but on of them was the intensity. Anderson, Cleverly, Nani, Berbatov, Rooney all ran. Now we usually have one runner...they guy with the ball.Sprinted less than every other team in the PL at the weekend, covered less distance than every other team in the CL this week. Could the players be any more obviously on strike? What's next? Lining up outside OT shouting "scab" at the fans queuing to get in?
Isn't the same issue dating back two years now? If so that's the managers instruction.Sprinted less than every other team in the PL at the weekend, covered less distance than every other team in the CL this week. Could the players be any more obviously on strike? What's next? Lining up outside OT shouting "scab" at the fans queuing to get in?
I and I suspect many others here played football at various levels (mine quite low unfortunately).It's a systemic problem and has been since Mourinho arrived. I'm not even sure he thinks it's a problem.
I refuse to believe we run less than every other fecking team in the CL because our players are instructed to sit deeper than every other CL team. I could handle being “way down on these list” but right at the very bottom is a piss take.You don’t tend to run that far if your entire game plan is to sit back.
Weird, because I’ve feel the majority of the players we have would suit an intense pressing game. Mourinho won’t change his tactics though so we’ll always be way down on these lists.
Matić and Fellaini are ones to cover the most distance for us year in year out so try again.I don't get why people are so surpised by our distance covered stat,
1. we don't press at all, not high up the pitch, not while in our low block defensive line.
2. Fellaini, Matic, Lukaku(when plays as a striker/targetman), our CBs don't run much.
3. We hoof it much more than all the clubs in the list.
Spurs have one of the tallest teams in the league and they are usually at top end when it comes to distance covered. I think it's do with how we set up and what coach demands.The majority of distance covered in a team is done by the midfield. Ours is usually, Fellaini, Matic and a sometimes lazy Pogba. You are not going to get a lot of distance from them. Up front, we have another big guy.
I'd like to see the correlation between distance covered and the size of team.
I don't think our squad is inherently lazy. We might have some lazy players but I think this problem is multi-factored.
We have seen games were we played well and also didn't run much. We've been consistently near the bottom of this stat for Mourinho's period here. I'm not sure he sees it as an issue.
It's just an angle. I don't think our squad is lazy. I just think Mourinho doesn't demand it.Spurs have one of the tallest teams in the league and they are usually at top end when it comes to distance covered. I think it's do with how we set up and what coach demands.
Four random games Chelsea against Cardiff in 2013-2014, United against Young Boys 2017-2018, look at the heatmaps of areas occupied by the fullbacks in particular if you compare it to Liverpool against Chelsea this season and Liverpool against Southampton in 2016-2017.Has anything changed though?
This has been the case since Mourinho arrived. Lots of people dismissed it as tactics and the fact we ended up 2nd meant we were doing fine.
It's clearly not 11 (or 22) men purposefully doing feck all out there. I mean, just think about it for a second - what's the easiest thing to do in football even if you're devoid of talent? Run around like a headless chicken.
I'm honestly shocked people think it's purely down to having lazy players or something.
You can't have watched the match the other night and still think this?Sprinted less than every other team in the PL at the weekend, covered less distance than every other team in the CL this week. Could the players be any more obviously on strike? What's next? Lining up outside OT shouting "scab" at the fans queuing to get in?
Of course yes. How else are there are distinctive playstyles that different top level coaches are associated with and which their teams adopt and embody. The collective movement of the players on the pitch is what makes it, and that means you do not run or not run every time you think it's a good idea, but you and your team mates practice movements as instructed by the coach where basically every individual movement needs to be synced with the other guys.I and I suspect many others here played football at various levels (mine quite low unfortunately).
However, I never needed the coach to tell me whether to run or not. It is instinctive and a basic part of the game.
Now, at the elite level where you are a top professional playing in a top team are you suggesting that the manager/coach is responsible for controlling how much his players should run or sprint during a game ??
Of course not.
The other night when we ran less distance than every other team in the fecking competition? In match where they should have been desperate to give a good impression after the shit show against West Ham. That certainly didn’t shake any suspicions that the players have (consciously or subconsciously) downed tools.You can't have watched the match the other night and still think this?
Aside from Lukaku (and I'm still not convinced this is all down to him), most were working hard and looked up for it. Just a real lack of quality play on show.
Yes, plenty of effort and toil, but an almost complete lack of quality, to the extent it is practically embarrassing to watch for a club like United. As Paul Scholes said, 100% effort , commitment, workrate etc is the absolute bare minimum any player should give.You can't have watched the match the other night and still think this?
Aside from Lukaku (and I'm still not convinced this is all down to him), most were working hard and looked up for it. Just a real lack of quality play on show.
But we know for a fact that managers exist that dictate exactly what they want their players to do in each phase?I and I suspect many others here played football at various levels (mine quite low unfortunately).
However, I never needed the coach to tell me whether to run or not. It is instinctive and a basic part of the game.
Now, at the elite level where you are a top professional playing in a top team are you suggesting that the manager/coach is responsible for controlling how much his players should run or sprint during a game ??
Of course not.
Wheather pressing or defending there are always players to mark and spaces to fill and balls to chase.
Anything less than 10km per player in over 90 minutes is pathetic and clearly shows the lack of effort most of our players are putting in.
Sorry but there are no excuses.
But again, why are you convinced this is not due to how Mourinho wants the team to play (or stop the opposition)? Does Mourinho ever mention these numbers or even refer to 'work rate'?The other night when we ran less distance than every other team in the fecking competition? In match where they should have been desperate to give a good impression after the shit show against West Ham. That certainly didn’t shake any suspicions that the players have (consciously or subconsciously) downed tools.
All you need to do is look when this thread was started to see that our players running less than most other teams is not a new phenomenon. And that has to be down to how the manager wants them to play. Earlier on we were discussing possible reasons. As well as his preference for a compact defensive shape it might be about protecting players considering how he rotates his first XI much less often than most other managers.But again, why are you convinced this is not due to how Mourinho wants the team to play (or stop the opposition)? Does Mourinho ever mention these numbers or even refer to 'work rate'?
I said it already - running around like a headless chicken is fecking easy. Working hard (alone) is not what players get paid big money for. I personally refuse to believe the entire team (including Mourinho's buys) are just a bunch of lazy sods.
As an aside, you should have known there would be no dramatic reaction anyway - West Ham was the reaction to losing to Derby.
I would agree mostly. Simply putting it down to players being lazy is just not true. I do think that some players may have had enough of the manager and are, perhaps unconsciously, half arsing it, but the lack of workrate or any sort of press is tactical. We always allow a team to play. Our default mode is to sit deep and wait for opposition to make a mistake, or tackle them on the edge of our box. This often leads to us being too deep to counter. It's been like this for 3 seasons now, so it's obviously a systemic problem.Has anything changed though?
This has been the case since Mourinho arrived. Lots of people dismissed it as tactics and the fact we ended up 2nd meant we were doing fine.
It's clearly not 11 (or 22) men purposefully doing feck all out there. I mean, just think about it for a second - what's the easiest thing to do in football even if you're devoid of talent? Run around like a headless chicken.
I'm honestly shocked people think it's purely down to having lazy players or something.
Of course we can run and sprint less, it depends on how far players move from their defensive and attacking positions, since our set up demands that players don't leave their area much, no one has to make big distances. In order to make the system work, they need to perfectly and efficiently execute their respective roles not go outside of them.All you need to do is look when this thread was started to see that our players running less than most other teams is not a new phenomenon. And that has to be down to how the manager wants them to play. Earlier on we were discussing possible reasons. As well as his preference for a compact defensive shape it might be about protecting players considering how he rotates his first XI much less often than most other managers.
Whatever, the one thing I refuse to accept is that we can be in such an obvious crisis yet we're still fecking rock bottom. Even if we're being very compact and disciplined, I don't understand why players can't sprint back into position when they need to. Or why attacking player can't make more runs when we're in possession. If they were really digging deep to get us out of our current woes, surely we can't be still sprinting less and running less far than every other team out there?
It's not even worse, it's in the same range. The difference is that last season people mitigated the glaring issues with the results.We weren't known for covering much distance last season but it's even worse now simply down to the fact the players don't give a feck.
That makes sense.Of course we can run and sprint less, it depends on how far players move from their defensive and attacking positions, since our set up demands that players don't leave their area much, no one has to make big distances. In order to make the system work, they need to perfectly and efficiently execute their respective roles not go outside of them.
They might not to make big distances but surely they could make short distances quickly by, you know, sprinting?Of course we can run and sprint less, it depends on how far players move from their defensive and attacking positions, since our set up demands that players don't leave their area much, no one has to make big distances. In order to make the system work, they need to perfectly and efficiently execute their respective roles not go outside of them.
We never played with intelligence. We'd have still lost, looking lile utterly headless chickens insteadThey might not to make big distances but surely they could make short distances quickly by, you know, sprinting?
It's not as though we have a brilliant shape anyway. West Ham and Valencia got loads of joy on our flanks. I refuse to believe that more effort/pace getting back into position couldn't have helped us in those scenarios.