'Der Klassiker' : Bayern München vs. Borussia Dortmund

[Suedesi]

It's the first time I can recall as a Bayern supporter to have mixed feelings about my wishes for this game. I guess you United supporters would understand: if we win, we beat our current arch rivals and make a great step toward becoming German champions. Great. But we will probably also make a step toward keeping Kovac, a manager who, at least according to my personal conviction, is inapt and simply not fit to coach our team. If we lose (badly), it will probably help us get rid of this excuse of a manager. But we will probably hand the championship to Dortmund and there is still a possibility that Rummenigge and Hoeness don't draw the necessary consequences. So what do I do?

Kovač is not an inept manager - it's just that his style is a bad fit for Bayern. Bayern has been playing possession football since the time of LVG. Why did Hoeness/Rummenigge think that a counterattacking coach would be good for Bayern is a big mystery to me. IMO, he's a bad fit not a bad coach - similar to Sarri at Chelsea.

 

[Suedesi]

I do hope Dortmund win the match and the league. I will absolutely hate it when they do, but it would be best for the league and for german club football.

IMO, the situation is different. In 2013, Bayern had a strong core of German talent complimented by a few amazing foreigners, and I think that conveyor belt has not produced the same talents for a while (as witnessed by Germany's NT performance over the last couple of years).

You had Neuer at the peak of his powers, you had Lahm and Schweinsteiger who were exceptional and historicalk players, than you had Boateng, Alaba, Muller to the peak of their powers added to the immensely talented Ribery and Robben. Then Manzukic and Javi Martinez.

No way is Bayern recreating that anytime soon, win or lose Bundesliga, I'm sorry.

 

[GhastlyHun]

I think that conveyor belt has not produced the same talents for a while (as witnessed by Germany's NT performance over the last couple of years).

Yet somehow our NT won the Confederations Cup and the U21 EM in 2017, all without the 2014 world cup winners. Our NT's current situation is not down to a lack of talent, it's predominantly mismanagement.

No way is Bayern recreating that anytime soon, win or lose Bundesliga, I'm sorry.

Bit early for a statement like this, when we already made several significant signings for next season. Losing the league may push both the management and the players themselves to a much more motivated 19/20 season.

 

[Suedesi]

Interesting to read that from a Bayern supporter. I don't think I have looked forward to a match with as much anxiety as I have for this face off with your team. I consider myself a quite involved fan (as in reading a lot and informing myself about useless day to day stuff, not by travelling to matches a lot) but the last six years have kind of left me numb. I wish I could just stop caring and a lot of times I think I have temporarily succeeded. The league is just frustrating and boring and that is coming from someone who is actually invested in a participating club. I really understand where the "distinctive premier league snobbishness" is coming from, at least with regards towards the Bundesliga. Why would you want to watch this league? Dortmund is usually too weak to challenge for the title and the race for the CL has teams like Leipzig, Hoffenheim, Wolfsburg and Leverkusen. Sure, they play attractive football at times but it's not like they are commanding huge interest from fans outside of Germany (not even inside of Germany for that matter).

So this season possibly did the worst possible thing to me: it did give me some hope. I never felt like Dortmund were definitely winning the league but it felt like there was a proper chance. If this hope is once again crushed by Bayern with a comparatively shit team that is just going to be maximum disillusionment. Having to watch them for a seventh time do some little celebration while complaining that the season was crap would just be really hard to stomach. It would mean that this is pretty much the most excitement we can expect in this league, almost winning it. Because I expect Bayern to be stronger again next season.



I am not even sure this is the main point. I think the club are "angry" enough as is, at least they are willing to spend. What they would probably need above all else is to get some competent people for the administration (replace people like Hoeneß, Kovac, Salihamidzic), that might be more likely if they crash and burn at the end of the season. But I think the issue is of structural nature or if you want to name it directly: financial nature. The Bundesliga is simply not generating as much money as the PL through marketing and TV deals. Add to that the fact, that the 50+1 rule that I am a staunch defender of is keeping investors out and it is not hard to understand why the league is slipping. Unfortunately I don't think a league win by a different team than Bayern will necessarily change that trend but I am afraid them winning the next six titles as well will not exactly help either.

What a great post, thanks for the insight mate. As a neutral, I hope you win the title this season (and please sell us Sancho )

 

[Balu]

IMO, the situation is different. In 2013, Bayern had a strong core of German talent complimented by a few amazing foreigners, and I think that conveyor belt has not produced the same talents for a while (as witnessed by Germany's NT performance over the last couple of years).

It's really odd, it feels like it has been going on for years. But in reality we made it to the Euro 2016 semifinal and qualified for the 2018 World Cup with 10 wins out of 10 games. We also won the confederations cup 2017 and were clearly one of the big favourites for the World Cup last year. The German nationalteam sucks for about a year now, dropped massively from elite to 2nd tier in a truely short period of time.

You're obviously right that the talent pool in Germany isn't as great as it was 5 years ago, but more than that mismanagement really hurts the German nationalteam and Bayern right now. It's shocking how badly run both are at the moment.

 

[Swarm]

What a great post, thanks for the insight mate. As a neutral, I hope you win the title this season (and please sell us Sancho )

Cheers

Concerning Sancho I honestly believe he will stay for one more season. Dortmund have no reason whatsoever to sell him and so far it is extremely quiet here in Germany. Outside of this forum I have hardly seen anyone discussing him leaving Dortmund. Of course you can never know for sure in todays market.

 

[Suedesi]

Yet somehow our NT won the Confederations Cup and the U21 EM in 2017, all without the 2014 world cup winners. Our NT's current situation is not down to a lack of talent, it's predominantly mismanagement.

Bit early for a statement like this, when we already made several significant signings for next season. Losing the league may push both the management and the players themselves to a much more motivated 19/20 season.

Confederations cup aside, the distinct impression I get is that Germany doesn't have the same level of talents that emerged at the 2010 WC is South Africa and that grew, matured and developed into the WC winning squad.

Bayern signed a couple of players to replace Hummels/Boateng. Let's see how they replace Robben/Ribery and the middle of the park.

 

[Suedesi]

Cheers

Concerning Sancho I honestly believe he will stay for one more season. Dortmund have no reason whatsoever to sell him and so far it is extremely quiet here in Germany. Outside of this forum I have hardly seen anyone discussing him leaving Dortmund. Of course you can never know for sure in todays market.

I honestly think he's staying put also. Both him and United would want to mitigate away some of the risk - him joining a team that could miss CL and it's on the umpteenth revolution since Fergie, and us would want to mitigate away some of the risk that he's just a one-season wonder.

 

[Synco]

No, the best option is going on full throttle from the beginning, press like hell, and overrun them by our offensive Sancho, Reus, Guerreiro, Götze, Alcacer. Their defense is a mess and they will shit in their pants from the first minute, we should expose that and thats our advantage.

I think that, all circumstances considered, we may well see a rather conservative approach from Favre, but tomorrow we'll know.

 

[OutlawGER]

Do you guys think that Bayern will (finally) sack Kovac if they lose today?

I somehow doubt it, but you can only hope..

 

[do.ob]

Do you guys think that Bayern will (finally) sack Kovac if they lose today?

I somehow doubt it, but you can only hope..

I don't think so: results have actually been fairly good since the winter break and the league would be all but written off anyway, so unless there's a severe mutiny going on in the dressing room they will just finish the season with him, partially because a rash sacking might reflect badly on Hoeneß and Rummenigge. Dortmund haven't been in good shape since the winter break and now face a severe injury crisis, so I don't think a win for them is likely, let alone a devastating one.

 

[SportingCP96]

Really hope Dortmund can steal a win. Lovely clubs and lovely fans. They also have a great style of play. Looking forward to this game later.

 

[GhastlyHun]

I will miss most of it

 

[Borussin]

Do you guys think that Bayern will (finally) sack Kovac if they lose today?

I somehow doubt it, but you can only hope..

The season has only a few weeks left, they are out of CL anyway, but are going to easily qualify for next season CL. It'd be pointless to sack him. If they end the season badly, I guess they re-evaluate at the end of the season. Seems little point in doing so now.

Hopefully he'll still be coach next season though!

 

[Ronaldo's Mum Eh?]

I don't see dortmund scoring at all..

 

[Jacckk1985]

Can't stand Bayern, so I hope the BvB puts the end of their hopes today.

 

[strongwalker]

The season has only a few weeks left, they are out of CL anyway, but are going to easily qualify for next season CL. It'd be pointless to sack him.

Don'T think anyone suggested they might kick him out asap. *if* there are doubts about him, They would act *now* if they haven't done so already, because no coach fitting the profile will be sitting at home in July wondering what he should do next season (unless its Jupp). If word gets out they have a new guy, i imagine there is a chance Niko will go on holiday immediately, to avoid a lame duck situation, but they have been good at playing cards close to chest lately when Brazzo wasn't involved.

 

[Blackwidow]

 

[Br1_ovi]

Not sure about Reus as a #9. Put Alcacer as a 9 and Reus behind.

 

[OutlawGER]

Not sure about Reus as a #9. Put Alcacer as a 9 and Reus behind.

Alcacer is out.

 

[Tommy]

Bayern's stadium looks immense every time I see it.

 

[Mrs Smoker]

What's the procedure, using this thread or Bundesliga one? What you did last time around?

 

[Tommy]

Would expect Lewa to do better there. That first touch was terrible.

Nice to see Ed Miliband get a job as a Bundesliga ref.

 

[RobinLFC]

Are players instructed to stay down these days in order to make it more probable that VAR has a look?

Literally nothing in that from Lewandowski.

 

[OutlawGER]

what a counter

 

[Mrs Smoker]

We have a game! 1-0, Kovač magic!

 

[Tommy]

Too easy.

 

[RobinLFC]

Dortmund were warned in the first minute. Just too easy that.

 

[berbatrick]

ffs

 

[Tommy]

Coman is doing well so far. Causing a lot of issues on the left.

 

[GifLord]

oh Borussia

 

[Tommy]

Oof, Lewa

 

[Mister_Stubbs]

Dortmund absolutely bottling it. This isn’t a great Bayern side, we saw that in the champions league. Speaks volumes about the bundesliga at the moment. Sooner Sancho moves better for him.

 

[Mrs Smoker]

What an idiot.

 

[berbatrick]

title challenge

 

[SportingCP96]

Imagine being Dortmund and losing the title game by 2 goals both scored by...... ex Dortmund players ....

 

[El-Manos]

Shocking

 

[OutlawGER]

BVB shitting their pants commpletely and mistakes like that. gg easy

 

[Tommy]

Feck me, almost a third. He's in the mood now. That turn & touch

 

[NoLogo]

Congratulations to Bayern for the 7th Bundesliga title in a row.