'Der Klassiker' : Bayern München vs. Borussia Dortmund
- Thread starter OutlawGER
- Start date
This thread is always my half yearly reminder what an awful job the German media/sports public has done creating those nonsensical artificial catchphrases like "Der Klassiker" or "Die Mannschaft".
Cheers!
Iirc, die Mannschaft is a crime by the DFB officials.
yep, as if the Bundesliga didn't have its own heritage to be proud of. Dortmund really wasn't very prussian ever, either (i know they *were* at some point, but who wasn't). the "clasico"-stuff is media-driven, though. Not that #ZSMMN is any better.
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Smartest move by Dortmund should be parking the bus + counters + hopefully a draw.
Bayern will go in for the kill.
Bayern will go in for the kill.
No, the best option is going on full throttle from the beginning, press like hell, and overrun them by our offensive Sancho, Reus, Guerreiro, Götze, Alcacer. Their defense is a mess and they will shit in their pants from the first minute, we should expose that and thats our advantage.
Isn't he out as well?
It's the first time I can recall as a Bayern supporter to have mixed feelings about my wishes for this game. I guess you United supporters would understand: if we win, we beat our current arch rivals and make a great step toward becoming German champions. Great. But we will probably also make a step toward keeping Kovac, a manager who, at least according to my personal conviction, is inapt and simply not fit to coach our team. If we lose (badly), it will probably help us get rid of this excuse of a manager. But we will probably hand the championship to Dortmund and there is still a possibility that Rummenigge and Hoeness don't draw the necessary consequences. So what do I do?
Could be. After the press conference with Favre I guess its 50/50. I hope not, it would hurt us if he is out.
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Get a plane to fly banner "Kovac Out"
I do hope Dortmund win the match and the league. I will absolutely hate it when they do, but it would be best for the league and for german club football.
"Der Kringeiker"
Come on Dortmund, win this league.
If Bayern lose the league to Dortmund, They are just going to buy Dortmund's key players (and other bundesliga talents) and dominate the league for 5 years. Rinse and repeat.
Reus fit? If so, BVB got a chance.
You want your team to lose?
There isn't much they can or would buy from Dortmund. They will buy from other Germany teams though. Still, I think Leipzig also have a good chance next year, along with Dortmund whom I assume will be at their current level.
On a rational level, yes. I already said I will hate it if it happens.
What do you think Dortmund even winning the title achieves?
Der klassiker is a name that should be banned 
Media generated rubbish.
Anyway, I look forward to the game, as much as it's possible to at this stage of the season.
Media generated rubbish.Anyway, I look forward to the game, as much as it's possible to at this stage of the season.
I think their focus this summer will be on raiding Leverkusen sadly and Leipzig. No one from Dortmund this time around. Their biggest focus should be on a new coach, but hopefully they stick with Kovac a bit longer.
Yes he is, he missed the last game because of becoming a father for the 1st time!
Make my club angry and accelerate its return to form, see 2011-2013.
I think they're already angry.
angry and arrogant, a dangerous combination
They can spend as much as they wish, but as long as Kovac is coach, they will struggle to be elite in Europe as they where under Heynckes. Yes, they'll win the Bundesliga again, because they'll have spent 200m Euros on new players, but so what. Is Kovac going to have them competing in CL semi finals and finals each year? I don't think he is, not with his brand of football and his love of excuses.
Fiat play. I think it being such a close race between 2 historic clubs has made a lot more people follow the league this season (myself included!)
Dortmund will win or draw, i really dont see them losing.
Sounds good to me.
Has a distinctive second tier feel to it - maybe because both teams bowed out of Europe relatively quickly.
this post has a distincitve premler league snobbishness feel to it
Neuer, Akanji, Alcacer, Reus, Sancho, Hummels, Witsel, Goretzka, Götze, Kimmich, Alaba, James, Alcantara, Lewandowski are not second tier players. Allianz Arena is not a second tier stadium. The fans won't produce a second tier atomsphere. And Favre isnt a second tier coach.
Who knows what the match will end up being like, goodness knows a lot of hyped up ones dont always live up to it, although this one often does. But second tier it aint.
Well, both teams were made to look second tier when playing English teams in the CL, so enjoy the night out.this post has a distincitve premler league snobbishness feel to it
Neuer, Akanji, Alcacer, Reus, Sancho, Hummels, Witsel, Goretzka, Götze, Kimmich, Alaba, James, Alcantara, Lewandowski are not second tier players. Allianz Arena is not a second tier stadium. The fans won't produce a second tier atomsphere. And Favre isnt a second tier coach.
Who knows what the match will end up being like, goodness knows a lot of hyped up ones dont always live up to it, although this one often does. But second tier it aint.
No one here degraded english teams as second tier clubs when Bayern outclassed them mostly with ease for the past few years. Also, Bayern made it almost every season into top 4, even last year, so this is their first season in ages to go out that early. A few seasons ago there was no Premier League team in the top 16 if i remember correctly. So i agree with that "distincitve premler league snobbishness" comment.
However, every team and league has its cycle. The Premier League was poor for quite some time, now the Bundesliga has hit its worst and the Premier League is good (mostly because of the former Bayern and Dortmund managers btw). Cylce will move again. Over and over.
oh my. never heard that one before.
Solksjaer never managed in Germany.
Bayern have the same problem as United - lacking creativity & holding on to some average players.
Kind of a useless rant - I simply said this tie this year has a second tier feel to it because both teams underperformed in Europe. I don't need a history lesson, or discussion of cycles, it's irrelevant. No need to get oversensitive because a lad in a Man Utd forum you've never met doesn't care Der Klassiker this weekend
Interesting to read that from a Bayern supporter. I don't think I have looked forward to a match with as much anxiety as I have for this face off with your team. I consider myself a quite involved fan (as in reading a lot and informing myself about useless day to day stuff, not by travelling to matches a lot) but the last six years have kind of left me numb. I wish I could just stop caring and a lot of times I think I have temporarily succeeded. The league is just frustrating and boring and that is coming from someone who is actually invested in a participating club. I really understand where the "distinctive premier league snobbishness" is coming from, at least with regards towards the Bundesliga. Why would you want to watch this league? Dortmund is usually too weak to challenge for the title and the race for the CL has teams like Leipzig, Hoffenheim, Wolfsburg and Leverkusen. Sure, they play attractive football at times but it's not like they are commanding huge interest from fans outside of Germany (not even inside of Germany for that matter).
So this season possibly did the worst possible thing to me: it did give me some hope. I never felt like Dortmund were definitely winning the league but it felt like there was a proper chance. If this hope is once again crushed by Bayern with a comparatively shit team that is just going to be maximum disillusionment. Having to watch them for a seventh time do some little celebration while complaining that the season was crap would just be really hard to stomach. It would mean that this is pretty much the most excitement we can expect in this league, almost winning it. Because I expect Bayern to be stronger again next season.
I am not even sure this is the main point. I think the club are "angry" enough as is, at least they are willing to spend. What they would probably need above all else is to get some competent people for the administration (replace people like Hoeneß, Kovac, Salihamidzic), that might be more likely if they crash and burn at the end of the season. But I think the issue is of structural nature or if you want to name it directly: financial nature. The Bundesliga is simply not generating as much money as the PL through marketing and TV deals. Add to that the fact, that the 50+1 rule that I am a staunch defender of is keeping investors out and it is not hard to understand why the league is slipping. Unfortunately I don't think a league win by a different team than Bayern will necessarily change that trend but I am afraid them winning the next six titles as well will not exactly help either.
Even underperformed is hard to tell. Bayern played one of the best teams in Europe, which could go all the way. With a luckier draw they could have gone into top 4 again.Kind of a useless rant - I simply said this tie this year has a second tier feel to it because both teams underperformed in Europe. I don't need a history lesson, or discussion of cycles, it's irrelevant. No need to get oversensitive because a lad in a Man Utd forum you've never met doesn't care Der Klassiker this weekend
And Dortmunds squad lacks international experience. In 2012 they went out in group stage to (who was it?) Marseille? in a comparable situation. Even though they were one of the best teams in Europe at this time, which they proved just a year later. I don't want to say that they will do the same again, but they are better than they did against Tottenham. Especially in both first halfs of their games against Spurs they looked much better than them but somehow they failed to score and fell apart then.
Dortmund without:
Paco Alcacer, Guerreiro, Pulisic, Phillip and Hakimi(out for the rest of the season).
Diallo and Piszczek are back from injury but unlikely that both will start.
So BVB have to start with Bruun Larsen and Götze and have no attacking option on the bench.
Paco Alcacer, Guerreiro, Pulisic, Phillip and Hakimi(out for the rest of the season).
Diallo and Piszczek are back from injury but unlikely that both will start.
So BVB have to start with Bruun Larsen and Götze and have no attacking option on the bench.
Without being overly apologetic for Dortmund's performances I would add that Spurs played them in the worst spell of their season. Both form dropped and a couple of key players were missing due to injury. Yes I am aware that Tottenham were missing some of their most important players as well, I just think that the results don't really do the season Dortmund have had justice. And I say that knowing that we have had quite a lot of unconvincing wins as well this season and are by no means as strong as some were making us out to be by the end of last year.
Yeah Klopp showed the blueprint how to choke Bayern at home.