Whose career would you rather have had? Messi or Zidane

Jimmy_Bond said:
I can guarantee Barcelona's worldwide support is larger than the population of France and Argentina combined.
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Unverifiable, but even if so, a lot of those will be casuals and thus somewhat detached from the wins.

On the other hand, it's hard to find a casual World Cup fan, as they'll be supporting their country and thus will be extra passionate and patriotic, regardless of the sport. The fact that it comes around once every 4 years enhances those feelings even more.
 
giorno said:
From the guy who said valverde should drop one of messi or suarez for the sake of busquets
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I said away from home in the Champion's League they should drop one of Messi or Suarez (I'd suggest the latter) so that they aren't two players short when defending. An analysis I think most would agree with given the manner of their away result in the knockout stages of recent years. I know the local press here in Barcelona certainly do.

That's quite a bit different to what you just wrote isn't it? I understand given some of the articles you were quoting yesterday trying to suggest Messi had said things that he hadn't that you do struggle reading, seemingly in both English and Spanish.
 
Messi every day of the week and twice on Sundays. When the dust will settle on Messi's career he will be regarded quite rightly as the greatest player of all time. Zidane will always be remembered as a great player in the same fondness as say a Cruyff, Best, Beckenbauer.
 
He'sRaldo said:
Unverifiable, but even if so, a lot of those will be casuals and thus somewhat detached from the wins.

On the other hand, it's hard to find a casual World Cup fan, as they'll be supporting their country and thus will be extra passionate and patriotic, regardless of the sport. The fact that it comes around once every 4 years enhances those feelings even more.
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There are just as many casual international fans who only show an interest every time there is a major tournament. Much less than half the population of a country will be football fans, so I think it's pretty easy to find a "casual world cup fan." I came across a ton just last year when we got to the semis.
 
JPRouve said:
The reason why you said it is because I told you that you failed to understand the OP, which is still the case and why you are still complaining about people being biased when they answer a question that wants to know what their biased opinion is.
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And I told you that a large part the thread had turned into a debate about who has had the better career, something you are seemingly incapable of understanding.
 
Jimmy_Bond said:
And I told you that a large part the thread had turned into a debate about who has had the better career, something you are seemingly incapable of understanding.
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I understood it but you are the only one trying to change people's mind, calling them bitter, biased and getting upset because they aren't picking Messi's career.
 
JPRouve said:
I understood it but you are the only one trying to change people's mind, calling them bitter, biased and getting upset because they aren't picking Messi's career.
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Yawn.

You don't seem to understand how debates generally work. The thread would be a bit dull if everyone just wrote either "Messi" or "Zidane" wouldn't it?

You seem to enjoy coming after my posts. You should be thanking me for giving you something to be arsey about.
 
Question should have been whose trophy cabinet would you prefer.
 
Jimmy_Bond said:
That's quite a bit different to what you just wrote isn't it? I understand given some of the articles you were quoting yesterday trying to suggest Messi had said things that he hadn't that you do struggle reading, seemingly in both English and Spanish.
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Messi "i would trade everything i won for the world cup with argentina"

So how does it work, because he said it in 2009(after he'd won CL x2, league x2 and a treble) he never said it?

And i'm not the one who keeps struggling to understand the op here, but then again, i also don't have the IQ of a wall
 
Jimmy_Bond said:
Yawn.

You don't seem to understand how debates generally work. The thread would be a bit dull if everyone just wrote either "Messi" or "Zidane" wouldn't it?

You seem to enjoy coming after my posts. You should be thanking me for giving you something to be arsey about.
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No one asked you to simply write Messi's or Zidane's, the interesting part is to know what you value the most. There is so many aspects like being a one club man, travelling the world, winning an international trophy for a small country like Uruguay, earning lots of money, becoming a legend, putting your name on record books and many other things.

That's why in my initial post I said that between Messi and Zidane I wouldn't know because I like some aspects of their careers but some things are missing.
 
Jimmy_Bond said:
There are just as many casual international fans who only show an interest every time there is a major tournament. Much less than half the population of a country will be football fans, so I think it's pretty easy to find a "casual world cup fan." I came across a ton just last year when we got to the semis.
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For the most part, that's how international sports works. So, in that case, they'd just be normal fans, not really casual fans. They definitely won't be detached from a win in the way club casuals can be.
 
He'sRaldo said:
For the most part, that's how international sports works. So, in that case, they'd just be normal fans, not really casual fans. They definitely won't be detached from a win in the way club casuals can be.
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Eh? I'm talking about people who don't even care about football until there is an international tournament. I think these people are pretty detached from it, much like people during the Olympic Games stop caring about the Swimming 500m Free-stroke Gold Medal the moment Coronation Street starts.
 
Great thread and question. Initially I was all Zidane and was baffled to why people found it shocking he was getting picked. So double checked how much Zidane had won, only 1 league title in Spain!? Feels like he left a larger legacy than that as the peak Galactico. Damn.... Now I'm starting to question myself.

Think I'd still pick Zizou. Those national trophy wins make the difference. He probably doesn't have to pay for any nights out in France for the rest of his life.

James Hunt was content putting in his all to win 1 world title and that was enough for him, he didn't want to be a slave to his craft. I'd rather be the maverick artist who turns up and goes home than the likes of Messi and Ronaldo who are obsessed with being the best. Credit to them but I don't have the will power or drive.
 
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Gringo said:
Great thread and question. Initially I was all Zidane and was baffled to why people found it shocking he was getting picked. So double checked how much Zidane had won, only 1 league title in Spain!? Feels like he left a larger legacy than that as the peak Galactico. Damn.... Now I'm starting to question myself.

Think I'd still pick Zizou. Those national trophy wins make the difference. He probably doesn't have to pay for any nights out in France for the rest of his life.

James Hunt was content putting in his all to win 1 world title and that was enough for him, he didn't want to be a slave to his craft. I'd rather be the maverick artist who turns up and goes home than the likes of Messi and Ronaldo who are obsessed with being the best. Credit to them but I don't have the will power or drive.
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That's the beauty of it, the answer to the question reveal a little bit about us.
 
Gringo said:
Great thread and question. Initially I was all Zidane and was baffled to why people found it shocking he was getting picked. So double checked how much Zidane had won, only 1 league title in Spain!? Feels like he left a larger legacy than that as the peak Galactico. Damn.... Now I'm starting to question myself.

Think I'd still pick Zizou. Those national trophy wins make the difference. He probably doesn't have to pay for any nights out in France for the rest of his life.

James Hunt was content putting in his all to win 1 world title and that was enough for him, he didn't want to be a slave to his craft. I'd rather be the maverick artist who turns up and goes home than the likes of Messi and Ronaldo who are obsessed with being the best. Credit to them but I don't have the will power or drive.
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Your answer reminded me Walter Röhrl in WRC, I would definitely rather be the maverick.
 
Gringo said:
Great thread and question. Initially I was all Zidane and was baffled to why people found it shocking he was getting picked. So double checked how much Zidane had won, only 1 league title in Spain!? Feels like he left a larger legacy than that as the peak Galactico. Damn.... Now I'm starting to question myself.

Think I'd still pick Zizou. Those national trophy wins make the difference. He probably doesn't have to pay for any nights out in France for the rest of his life.

James Hunt was content putting in his all to win 1 world title and that was enough for him, he didn't want to be a slave to his craft. I'd rather be the maverick artist who turns up and goes home than the likes of Messi and Ronaldo who are obsessed with being the best. Credit to them but I don't have the will power or drive.
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Well at least a few people are getting it! As @JPRouve said, there are other motivations for some players. Totti, Gerrard and others could well have ‘achieved’ more at other clubs, same with Shearer, but they clearly valued some other things more highly.
 
Shamana said:
HGH treatment just gives he the hormones he is not producing naturally. He just has the same levels as the rest of us who produces it naturally, so it gives him no advantage.
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Same advantage diabetics have when they take insulin.
 
Zidane because even after his retirement as a player, He still makes a shitload of money and becomes a legendary manager (winning CL back to back)
 
He'sRaldo said:
Winning titles in Barcelona gives joy to only those in Barcelona. Winning a World Cup for France gives joy to the whole nation. So IMO a World Cup win trumps every other feeling.

Just take a look at Iniesta's reception to every football stadium in Spain after his World Cup goal, even those of his rivals. That's something special that a league title cannot achieve.
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Barcelona are supported by people from all over the planet as is Messi himself.

Besides, why is your career merely for someone else ? Is a tennis player's career pointless from that metric? I think team achievements are the ultimate however if we're talking about career I assume we also take into account the individual excellence one has accomplished. So yeah, I'd rather have been this absolutely phenomenal genius of a footballing anomaly rather than one or two more team tropgies to me name (and France have won a WC since really). Unless we're only looking at it in terms of trophies but I don't see why? I career isn't defined merely by trophies (although Messi has boatloads).
 
red4ever 79 said:
Messi every day of the week and twice on Sundays. When the dust will settle on Messi's career he will be regarded quite rightly as the greatest player of all time. Zidane will always be remembered as a great player in the same fondness as say a Cruyff, Best, Beckenbauer.
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He will be forever regarded below Pele and Maradona for sure, because despite his amazing achievement at club level he can't replicate that at NT. Same story with Di Stefano who won 8 La Ligas and 5 CLs but was never considered on the same level like Pele and Maradona because his lacked achievement at NT.
 
The age old debate of Club Career vs National Career I see

Never get these debates

Club Career wins every time, it’s the dominating part of ones career!

80% of a players career is Club based, 20% international based

Messi’s Club Career dwarfs Zidanes quite simply along with all the individual accolades and records he’s also broken along the way

Internationally Zidane has been in 2 World Cup Final’s Winning 1 and Winning 1 Euros

Messi has been in 1 World Cup Final and 1 Olympics Final Winning it.

Hardly a reason to put all the eggs in one basket for Zidane. It’s like casting aside the main side of their careers, the 80% side :lol:

World Cups etc are great, and of course prestigious, but are they really any “tougher” than our European Club Competitions? Nah, in reality, not really

Any aspiring footballer would dream to have Zidanes career, it’s glittering for sure

But

Messi’s career all day wins for me
 
giorno said:
Yeah i mean, nobody remembers Zinedine Zidane :lol::lol::lol:

He's only the guy half the current pros grew up idolizing :lol:
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and Messi is the guy all current pros, decades down the line, will be idolozing.
 
TheLiverBird said:
The age old debate of Club Career vs National Career I see

Never get these debates

Club Career wins every time, it’s the dominating part of ones career!

80% of a players career is Club based, 20% international based

Messi’s Club Career dwarfs Zidanes quite simply along with all the individual accolades and records he’s also broken along the way

Internationally Zidane has been in 2 World Cup Final’s Winning 1 and Winning 1 Euros

Messi has been in 1 World Cup Final and 1 Olympics Final Winning it.

Hardly a reason to put all the eggs in one basket for Zidane. It’s like casting aside the main side of their careers, the 80% side :lol:

World Cups etc are great, and of course prestigious, but are they really any “tougher” than our European Club Competitions? Nah, in reality, not really

Any aspiring footballer would dream to have Zidanes career, it’s glittering for sure

But

Messi’s career all day wins for me
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Please don't mention the Olympics. You'd better talk about his Copa America finals
 
ekestubbe said:
I'm old enough to have followed Zidane's career from the beginning, and for me it's an extremely easy pick. Messi's every day of the week. I'm also assuming you mean player-career.
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It's an easy pick?

Zidane won the World cup in his own country and also the European championship. I'd say those two trophies catapult him ahead of anything Messi has achieved.

Player wise Messi edges it though, he's an absolute genius whilst Zidane was and still is the best midfielder that's ever played.
 
TheLiverBird said:
The age old debate of Club Career vs National Career I see

Never get these debates

Club Career wins every time, it’s the dominating part of ones career!

80% of a players career is Club based, 20% international based

Messi’s Club Career dwarfs Zidanes quite simply along with all the individual accolades and records he’s also broken along the way

Internationally Zidane has been in 2 World Cup Final’s Winning 1 and Winning 1 Euros

Messi has been in 1 World Cup Final and 1 Olympics Final Winning it.

Hardly a reason to put all the eggs in one basket for Zidane. It’s like casting aside the main side of their careers, the 80% side :lol:

World Cups etc are great, and of course prestigious, but are they really any “tougher” than our European Club Competitions? Nah, in reality, not really

Any aspiring footballer would dream to have Zidanes career, it’s glittering for sure

But

Messi’s career all day wins for me
Click to expand...
WC is the most prestigious trophy for any player more than even UCL. Pretty sure even Messi himself will be more than happy to trade his 5CLs for 1 WC trophy.
 
TheLiverBird said:
The age old debate of Club Career vs National Career I see

Never get these debates

Club Career wins every time, it’s the dominating part of ones career!

80% of a players career is Club based, 20% international based

Messi’s Club Career dwarfs Zidanes quite simply along with all the individual accolades and records he’s also broken along the way

Internationally Zidane has been in 2 World Cup Final’s Winning 1 and Winning 1 Euros

Messi has been in 1 World Cup Final and 1 Olympics Final Winning it.

Hardly a reason to put all the eggs in one basket for Zidane. It’s like casting aside the main side of their careers, the 80% side :lol:

World Cups etc are great, and of course prestigious, but are they really any “tougher” than our European Club Competitions? Nah, in reality, not really

Any aspiring footballer would dream to have Zidanes career, it’s glittering for sure

But

Messi’s career all day wins for me
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It's not a debate, just share what you would like. The question is more about events and journeys than it is about toughness.
 
Sky1981 said:
Kids that plays football : dreams of becoming Messi , pretends that they're messi
Old man in the internet behind the screen : Pretends that Zidane is better than messi
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Completese these ;)
Kids behind the screen :.................
Old man that play football:...............

Messi is better than Zidane, there is no doubt about that. I just prefer Zidane's career (being successful for clubs and country)
 
I'm surprised everybody is picking Messi.

What happened to the "Messi and Ronaldo would trade all their ballon d'or for a World Cup" crowd?

The were pretty vocal all of last year, claming a WC is worth more than 4 CLs and 5 ballon d'ors.
 
WC's (and Euro's to a lesser extent) do shape football history. Football fans over the world know who Roger Milla is and his last game was like 25 years ago. But don't ask those same people what clubs he played for (i'm sure some of you do but don't be a smartass).

If Van Basten's goal in the Euro Final happened in the Eredivisie, even in a very important title deciding game, would it be so remembered?

Loads of examples like that. Being at the very summit of both club football and international football (Zidane won WC, Euros, CL, Serie A and La Liga in the space of 5 years) at the same time is what it is all about for me. It enhances your legacy.
 
POF said:
:lol::lol::lol:

Surely you're not serious. 10 league titles and 3 champions leagues vs 3 league titles, one champions league a world cup and a European championship. Messi must really envy Zidane's intertoto cup win!

This thread is just bizarre. One has dominated European football for a decade, producing goalscoring numbers year after year never seen before. The other looks good in youtube videos to orchestra music.
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Wow, just wow.

Zidane was outrageously good, maybe not Messi good but still outrageous in his own right.

To say he looks good in YouTube videos to Orchestra music is insulting to him.
 
Ramos said:
WC's (and Euro's to a lesser extent) do shape football history. Football fans over the world know who Roger Milla is and his last game was like 25 years ago. But don't ask those same people what clubs he played for (i'm sure some of you do but don't be a smartass).

If Van Basten's goal in the Euro Final happened in the Eredivisie, even in a very important title deciding game, would it be so remembered?

Loads of examples like that. Being at the very summit of both club football and international football (Zidane won WC, Euros, CL, Serie A and La Liga in the space of 5 years) at the same time is what it is all about for me. It enhances your legacy.
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Don't know who Roger Milla is to be honest.
 
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