CL 19/20 Group Stages: Week 6 (Last Round)
- Thread starter FootyGirl88
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So disappointing for Atalanta
First time teams from the Big 4 leagues always seem to struggle in their CL debut season
Thanks. I was pleasently surprised really. It all comes from our coach, he's doing absolute wonders with this team.
Why? Even on paper, there are better teams with better managers.
It's a big deal to play for the 1st team in CL. I'm sure they'll be much better in their next game.
What an excellent first round of games...
Chelsea lose
Pool lose
Barca draw
Real lose
Spurs draw
overall very enjoyable
Chelsea lose
Pool lose
Barca draw
Real lose
Spurs draw
overall very enjoyable
Brilliant to see a team from outside the 'major leagues' get a result like that.
Always raid Zagreb on FM, talent factory
.On paper?
They've arguably the best team in the world on paper.
Name the better teams on paper.
And Tuchel is a good manager.
Oh for sure. They just keep popping out. Can't imagine how good would it be if Croatian football system wasn't shambles.Brilliant to see a team from outside the 'major leagues' get a result like that.
Always raid Zagreb on FM, talent factory
There aren't that many better teams on paper tbh. They showed they could compete against Liverpool last season when everyone was fit and available
Liverpool and City both have better starting XI's on paper and that's just from England.
Tuchel is good but he's not Klopp or Guardiola level. There's no real reason they should be favourites.
City?
Not many, and they aren't far off the best at all when all are fit, but it's not like they are THE best on paper to the point where you can ignore their lack of CL progression in recent years or the fact that other teams have better, more successful managers at the helm.
I haven't ignored anybody. They have a good chance just like other teams. Successful managers mean not much in this, there is so much luck involved
Disagree about Liverpool. Rather have PSG's players, but Klopp completely maximizes Liverpool.
City is arguable.
"And that's just from England" You named just 2 teams. The only other team in world you can argue is Barcelona.
There's a lot of reasons for them to be favorites(one of the favorites, never said they're the MAIN favorites).
They've arguably got the best attacking duo in the world in Neymar and Mbappe. A great midfield. Players like Di Maria who can be the best player on the field when he's feeling it.
As a team, they're very good on the ball under Tuchel. Experienced defense. Great shot stopper in goal. Good depth.
Their problem is the collective mentality and if Neymar can stay fit.
And what have City done in CL to be favorites? There's a group of teams that can win it and PSG is near the top of it. That's all.
Ronaldo would have had 2 easy goals if Higuain and Danilo squared him the ball.
Liverpool have better fullbacks, central defenders, and a better keeper. PSG have a better midfield. I don't even think City is arguable, both starting XI and squad wise they have the edge.
PSG have better names in attack but Salah/Firmino/Mane is a perfect front 3 in terms of chemistry, you'd never see PSG do what Liverpool did in the Premier League last season. The feckers threw it away vs United ffs.
Oh, and I'd argue Juventus as well as Barcelona.
They're obviously up there but I don't see any reason to have them really pegged as the big favourites. I guess we'll see.
Klopp wasn't regarded by many here to be on Guardiola's level until he won the UCL last season, Tuchel did really well at Dortmund and I think can reach the level of Klopp if given time. Certainly is a very talented manager.
Re: the bold, sounds like you're saying ON PAPER PSG are better in attack.
I'd rather have PSG's midfield and attack than Pool's defense and GK.
Obviously football isn't played on paper though.
Juventus' XI isn't that strong to me on paper.
Barcelona I'll give you.
I didn't say City were favourites, I said they had a more talented team than PSG.
For me, Liverpool are clear favourites. Back to back finalists and winners last season, defeating Bayern and Barcelona on the way.
Very complete side and fantastic in knockout situations.
Klopp, even pre-CL win, had some feats which are way beyond anything Tuchel has achieved.
Tuchel may be talented but so far in his career he's not done anything which would make me think he's as good as Klopp. That can obviously all change quickly, it's football.
PSG literally always do this in the group stages. Feels like it happens every year then they manage to find a more incredible way to get eliminated in the knockouts than in the previous year.
On paper I'd rather have PSG's team which includes more than the first 11 over Liverpool. Easy choice really. It's just on paper though and we still haven't seen Neymar for them in the knockout stages on a consistent basis
As individuals better on paper, but when you put the three of salah/firmino/mane together I think they work better than neymar/cavani/mbappe or neymar/icardi/mbappe. I'd rather have the former front 3 than the latter.
I'd take having Van Djik & Alisson in a two legged tie over having verratti and marquinhos any day of the week.
That's also because Tuchel had only two seasons at Dortmund while Klopp had many more years to achieve what he did. In one of those two seasons, Tuchel gained more points (78) coming 2nd than Klopp did the first time he won the BL (75), let's also remember the juggernaut Tuchel came up against.
In his second season, Tuchel managed to win the DFB-Pokal, all while knowing he was going to be fired and having a disgruntled dressing room.
He might not have achieved the same success in absolute terms but he has shown enough to suggest he can.
Yeah. It's the first CL match, they lost their last game 4-0, I can totally see why he went with Baumgartlinger to get a sense of security and build confidence, especially since the first choice alternative - Demirbay - is out injured. Favre does this all the time as well, starting with Witsel + Weigl/Delaney, taking a risk averse approach, trying to build momentum and tire the opposition via possession, only introducing a more attacking CM later on if needed.
A lot of people will pick on Bosz's subs, but Bellarabi, while lacking end product, was probably still Leverkusen's best attacker today.
Amiri was terrible against Dortmund and didn't accomplish a whole lot when he was eventually brought on for Baumgartlinger either.
The most questionable thing perhaps was not bringing on Weiser, who offers a lot more in attack than Bender.
People are so happy to throw around "found out", but I think it's mostly a question of individual quality. At the moment they don't convert the chances/spaces that his football creates and they make costly mistakes at the back. The game against Dortmund for example was relatively even and decided by Leverkusen's players messing up their counters, while Dortmund didn't hesitate to punish Leverkusen's/Wendell's misplaced passes.
His football can be quite demanding on his players and at the moment they can't deliver consistently enough for it to work. Of course it's fair to ask whether he needs (and is able) to make adjustments to lower that kind of exposure (e.g. introducing Baumgartlinger), but I wouldn't say he's been found out.
It's just the nature of such an approach that in the end you have to rely on individual quality. Even Klopp and Guardiola had some defensive issues, before they spent hundreds of millions on their defense.
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Owen is so stupid
Fair enough, you clearly have more knowledge than me when it comes to the Bundesliga.
Isn't the issue with Tuchel he seems to clash with the higher ups? Or was that purely a Dortmund thing?
Really? They turned it on in the knockouts (though I’ll argue that Barca bottled it big time) but even then they had 3 losses in the group stages and qualified on goals scored - not even goal difference. It was so tight. Napoli and PSG cancelled each other out with two last minute draws, if it was a win each Liverpool would have easily played Europa League last season.
Same for Tottenham really, Inter bottled it against PSV.
I’d be surprised if Liverpool go past semis this season, they will probably win the league though.
Groups are the groups, quite a few times we've seen teams struggle a tad and then win the competition. As long as you get past the groups it doesn't really matter how, we finished ahead of Madrid the year they won it and it didn't do us much good!
They went and comfortably beat Bayern in their own backyard (in the first game, the german champions were playing park the bus football and then as soon as they had to open up got ripped to bits by liverpool) and then to be honest should never have been 3-0 down against Barcelona. Very unlucky in that first leg and then somehow won the second leg 4-0, before (sadly) comfortably winning the final. They also reached the final the year before so I'd say it's pretty clear: Once Liverpool get to the knockouts they're one hell of a nut to crack.
With us, we deserved to go through in 2nd place. Inter fluked 3 points against us and in the first game vs PSV we had a goal wrongly chalked off. Stuff goes for/against you in the groups but overall we managed to pull it together after a hard start.
I wouldn't be surprised at all if Liverpool went on to win it again. They have all the confidence in the world now when they get to the knockouts and they're basically unbeatable at Anfield.
Honestly, they lost to Napoli, Zvezda and PSG in the group stages and were in clear danger of not qualifying, so all I'm saying is they qualified by the tiniest margins from the group stages.
I think defeating Bayern turned their season around.
fecking Kovac.
They do generally struggle away from home in Europe. Aside from that Bayern game.
But my god do they make up for it at Anfield. It's the hardest place to go in European football at the moment.
We (Mainz) only had trouble with him once he wanted to leave. Our management told him 'no, you have a contract' and clashed with Tuchel after he started negotiating with Schalke behind their backs. He finished the season, getting us into the EL qualifiers, then spent the final year of his contract on gardening leave.
In purely sporting terms I'd rate his performance with us higher than Klopp's tbh. He's an absolutely outstanding coach.
Pool spanks both PSG and City in the knockout rounds if they meet. Liverpool are giants in Europe and the others are weak minded wannabes
Group A
I could only watch the highlights but wow Real Madrid looked really terrible
Group B
A shame that Neuer's mistake hasn't led to a goal
Group C
Dinamo Zagreb have lost 22 of their last 24 CL games therefore that result is a massive shock.
It will be interesting to see which club will get the 2nd place.
Group D
Interesting that Atletico Madrid and Juventus are now a bit shit in the defence
And typical Leverkusen
I could only watch the highlights but wow Real Madrid looked really terrible
Group B
A shame that Neuer's mistake hasn't led to a goal
Group C
Dinamo Zagreb have lost 22 of their last 24 CL games therefore that result is a massive shock.
It will be interesting to see which club will get the 2nd place.
Group D
Interesting that Atletico Madrid and Juventus are now a bit shit in the defence
And typical Leverkusen
I'll give you that.
He's a very good coach, and in Leonardo he'll find a sympathetic DOF who will allow him to do his work in peace. I think they are genuine contenders this year.
They didn't have 4 entries so I left them out. 1 win from 3 I think.
Fair points, just very strange to see. Barca's group being all draws in particular helped in it ending up as it did.
Garcia at least made the bench. I can understand not throwing him in this game. But I do hope he gets some game time. There’s not much point in buying Rodri to give Fernandinho a rest if Dinho ends up playing centre back all season.