A serious look at Mauricio Pochettino

[ROFLUTION]

And you're wrong, I like Ole's tactics much better than what Poch had ever tried to do even with Spurs. In fact, it's back to our roots, our identity, and it's the start of the 2008 team that we are going for, and I love that idea. I respect Ole for trying to do something as exceptional as that team.

We have the youngest squad ever and we are fixing problems one by one. It's going to come quick and fast.

If anyone sets up like we did in 2008 it's probably Poch. Likes to play 4-2-3-1, likes to get the full-backs involved, likes strong individualists, has taken some promising youth products to great heights. He plays entertaining football and is probably the closest in setup to Fergie. Probably why Fergie likes Poch too.

If we're talking about what a good fit for us would be style-wise (we've always been known for attacking entertaining football since the Busby Babes), Poch's gotta be a candidate. I can't tell what Solskjærs tactics are when breaking middle teams down - Sometimes we simply fall short in creating enough chances, because we rarely flood the opponents areas with wing-backs and fast play, and I can only see what Solskjær is doing against big teams. We're piss-poor against midtablers.

We are fixing problems one by one - Yes probably, but we'd probably do that under any manager.

 

[VJ1762]

If anyone sets up like we did in 2008 it's probably Poch. Likes to play 4-2-3-1, likes to get the full-backs involved, likes strong individualists, has taken some promising youth products to great heights. He plays entertaining football and is probably the closest in setup to Fergie. Probably why Fergie likes Poch too.

If we're talking about what a good fit for us would be style-wise (we've always been known for attacking entertaining football since the Busby Babes), Poch's gotta be a candidate. I can't tell what Solskjærs tactics are when breaking middle teams down - Sometimes we simply fall short in creating enough chances, because we rarely flood the opponents areas with wing-backs and fast play, and I can only see what Solskjær is doing against big teams. We're piss-poor against midtablers.

We are fixing problems one by one - Yes probably, but we'd probably do that under any manager.

Think everybody will be brought down to earth when we struggle to beat everton this sunday.

 

[cjj]

Has danny rose played under Jose? Hope he googled Jose mourinho.

I think he played a few minutes in the league, and the full match against Olympiakos.

Danny's issue is well documented, and he seems to be a nice guy that has a bit of a chip on his shoulder (possibly from when Walker got a big move and he didn't). What's interesting is that he did that interview when Poch was still manager and said he would stay until "the manager" said he didn't want him, and is otherwise going nowhere. Now Mourinho has come in, I'm pretty sure he'll be far more brutal than Pochettino was capable of if he doesn't want him there.

I don't think Rose will have an out in any decent sides, though - his outspoken personality has gone him few favours in terms of attractiveness to other clubs, and although it's good that he was up front about mental issues, it will also count against him here. I can see Mourinho pushing him off to a team like Burnley (thinking mid table and "oop norf").

 

[VJ1762]

I think he played a few minutes in the league, and the full match against Olympiakos.

Danny's issue is well documented, and he seems to be a nice guy that has a bit of a chip on his shoulder (possibly from when Walker got a big move and he didn't). What's interesting is that he did that interview when Poch was still manager and said he would stay until "the manager" said he didn't want him, and is otherwise going nowhere. Now Mourinho has come in, I'm pretty sure he'll be far more brutal than Pochettino was capable of if he doesn't want him there.

I don't think Rose will have an out in any decent sides, though - his outspoken personality has gone him few favours in terms of attractiveness to other clubs, and although it's good that he was up front about mental issues, it will also count against him here. I can see Mourinho pushing him off to a team like Burnley (thinking mid table and "oop norf").

Don't you think he would be a better option than Jan on the left? Jan looks like his legs are gone.
Still surprised City didn't ask for Rose as well when they took Walker from spurs.

 

[cjj]

Don't you think he would be a better option than Jan on the left? Jan looks like his legs are gone.
Still surprised City didn't ask for Rose as well when they took Walker from spurs.

Playing with 10 men is a better option than Rose.

I've never seen a guy try so hard and yet be so detrimental as he has. His trick is to be absent defensively, but sprint at full pelt into the right side of the opposition's box whilst offering no end product. He's likely to be replaced by Sessengnon in the short term I guess, until Davies is back.

 

[bond19821982]

Spurs fans undermining Poch because he is not their coach anymore - Surprise !

Doesnt matter if you were already Top 6 or Top 8 - you guys were perennial bottlers until Poch instilled some grit and passion to the team. The whole reason why you are considered a serious challenger now is because of Poch.

 

[lysglimt]

Bro, I want Poch as our next manager, but you are writing english essays when you could just say Poch is a better manager than Ole and leave it at that. This 2 game streak has suddenly wiped our fans memories of a dreadful run since March. Do people realise that we have had our worst start in 30 years? The first step to being mediocre is accepting it. We are Manchester United and we need a better manager than Ole, period.

And the best you can find is a manager who lost 18 out of the last 36 matches ?

 

[macheda14]

And the best you can find is a manager who lost 18 out of the last 36 matches ?

It’s starting to look like the current trend with top level managers is they end with a massive blow out. Jose has done this famously at his last three jobs. Klopp did it at Dortmund. Pep seems to be doing it to some extent at City. Poch did it at Spurs. The level of intensity and tactical rigidity that top managers instill in players seems unsustainable. Therefore to not go for Poch because of his final stint at Spurs seems incredibly daft. Klopp lost 14 and drew 7 out of 34 games in the Bundesliga during his final season. By your metric we shouldn’t have tried to hire Klopp?

 

[cjj]

It’s starting to look like the current trend with top level managers is they end with a massive blow out. Jose has done this famously at his last three jobs. Klopp did it at Dortmund. Pep seems to be doing it to some extent at City. Poch did it at Spurs. The level of intensity and tactical rigidity that top managers instill in players seems unsustainable. Therefore to not go for Poch because of his final stint at Spurs seems incredibly daft. Klopp lost 14 and drew 7 out of 34 games in the Bundesliga during his final season. By your metric we shouldn’t have tried to hire Klopp?

Didn't Klopp have his best players sold from under him?

 

[always_hoping]

Didn't Klopp have his best players sold from under him?

Yes Dormund were forced to sell some of their top players which played a huge part in turning things stale. Klopp had won league titles with Dortmund before things turned stale.

Liverpool were a perfect fit for Klopps next adventure, a well run club and it was ideal opportunity for Klopp to deliver the success he had at Dortmund onto Liverpool.

 

[VJ1762]

And the best you can find is a manager who lost 18 out of the last 36 matches ?

If Liverpool had followed your reasoning, then Klopp would have never been appointed. Poch just came to the end of his cycle. Not everybody is Fergie, able to keep motivating players for decades.

 

[Bobcat]

Spurs fans undermining Poch because he is not their coach anymore - Surprise !

Doesnt matter if you were already Top 6 or Top 8 - you guys were perennial bottlers until Poch instilled some grit and passion to the team. The whole reason why you are considered a serious challenger now is because of Poch.

And they kept being that under Poch as well, hence their 0 trophies under his watch.

From 2009/2010 they finished 4th(70pts), 5th(62pts), 4th(69pts), 5th(72pts), 6th(69 pts) Poch takes over(14/15): 5th(64pts), 3rd (70 pts), 2nd(86 pts), 3rd(77 pts) 4th(71 pts)

Spurs has hovered around 70 pts in the league long before Poch took over and they kept doing so after he got there as well. The big exception being the 16/17 season where they were excellent and got 2nd with 86 points. Its also worth noting Kane broke through in 14/15, scoring 31 goals across all comps and won PFA Young player of the year, the following years he scored 25, 29, 30 and then 17 league goals

Poch deserves some credit for Kane, but most of it has to go to the Spurs youth/scouting setup which is simply excellent. Walker, Rose, Bale, Kane etc etc. They have scouted and graduated loads of good talent over the years

 

[VJ1762]

And they kept being that under Poch as well, hence their 0 trophies under his watch.

From 2009/2010 they finished 4th(70pts), 5th(62pts), 4th(69pts), 5th(72pts), 6th(69 pts) Poch takes over(14/15): 5th(64pts), 3rd (70 pts), 2nd(86 pts), 3rd(77 pts) 4th(71 pts)

Spurs has hovered around 70 pts in the league long before Poch took over and they kept doing so after he got there as well. The big exception being the 16/17 season where they were excellent and got 2nd with 86 points. Its also worth noting Kane broke through in 14/15, scoring 31 goals across all comps and won PFA Young player of the year, the following years he scored 25, 29, 30 and then 17 league goals

Poch deserves some credit for Kane, but most of it has to go to the Spurs youth/scouting setup which is simply excellent. Walker, Rose, Bale, Kane etc etc. They have scouted and graduated loads of good talent over the years

I think they generally have an excellent scouting system. I was surprised that even Becks played for their youth teams for a significant amount of time. Even West ham have a very good academy. They have brought through players like Lampard, rio, joe cole, carrick and more recently declan rice in the last 20 years.

 

[Allas8]

Spurs fans undermining Poch because he is not their coach anymore - Surprise !

Doesnt matter if you were already Top 6 or Top 8 - you guys were perennial bottlers until Poch instilled some grit and passion to the team. The whole reason why you are considered a serious challenger now is because of Poch.

But Tottenham is not a serious challenger now, and Poch went on the record saying it would take another 10 years for them to win the league.

 

[LilyWhiteSpur]

Spurs fans undermining Poch because he is not their coach anymore - Surprise !

Doesnt matter if you were already Top 6 or Top 8 - you guys were perennial bottlers until Poch instilled some grit and passion to the team. The whole reason why you are considered a serious challenger now is because of Poch.

Where is this happening? I am seeing spurs fans saying what they were saying for the past year. I loved the guy, I really wish he could have turned it round, but it was his time to go? We bootled 2 finials and 2 semis under Poch as well as failing to keep up with Leicester, what he brought was a real identity, consistency in the league and really united the fans behind him. He is a top class coach and I have no doubt he will be successful in the future, I am certainly not undermining him.

 

[Grande]

Where is this happening? I am seeing spurs fans saying what they were saying for the past year. I loved the guy, I really wish he could have turned it round, but it was his time to go? We bootled 2 finials and 2 semis under Poch as well as failing to keep up with Leicester, what he brought was a real identity, consistency in the league and really united the fans behind him. He is a top class coach and I have no doubt he will be successful in the future, I am certainly not undermining him.

At this point people are so used to Glaston projecting the image of ‘The Spurs fans’ that even when he’s not around, their imagination fabricates what he would have written subconsciously. It’s like phantom pains.

 

[LilyWhiteSpur]

At this point people are so used to Glaston projecting the image of ‘The Spurs fans’ that even when he’s not around, their imagination fabricates what he would have written subconsciously. It’s like phantom pains.

 

[Gasolin]

If anyone sets up like we did in 2008 it's probably Poch. Likes to play 4-2-3-1, likes to get the full-backs involved, likes strong individualists, has taken some promising youth products to great heights. He plays entertaining football and is probably the closest in setup to Fergie. Probably why Fergie likes Poch too.

If we're talking about what a good fit for us would be style-wise (we've always been known for attacking entertaining football since the Busby Babes), Poch's gotta be a candidate. I can't tell what Solskjærs tactics are when breaking middle teams down - Sometimes we simply fall short in creating enough chances, because we rarely flood the opponents areas with wing-backs and fast play, and I can only see what Solskjær is doing against big teams. We're piss-poor against midtablers.

We are fixing problems one by one - Yes probably, but we'd probably do that under any manager.

I so fully disagree. Sir Alex may like Poch but he liked Moyes too. Moyes who then fired Phelan and the whole staff, and didn’t play with speed when, Sir Alex said it himself, “Playing with speed never hindered our results. It was our way: energy and determination in the last third of the pitch.”.

Have you listened to Ole? It’s the same he’s been repeating over and over. We are getting there because Ole has a real vision and no the others will probably just play to save their ass. Is Poch good? Yes, and he became better by trying to be more pragmatic instead of forcing a system l’île his early days. What is Ole doing? He’s already being pragmatic with this squad because they don’t play like Molde at all but retains some of the key attributes that makes their strength.

And Poch is still a gamble. We should let Ole develop their team. He has the dressing room for a reason: it’s because they buy his plans. Spurs did not follow Poch anymore.

And don’t even get me started with his biography where his wife is explicitly
recommending him to not stay too long in a club and leave as soon as he reaches some height. This is a guy who doesn’t deserve top class clubs. Let him jump ships as he likes.

 

[cyberman]

If Liverpool had followed your reasoning, then Klopp would have never been appointed. Poch just came to the end of his cycle. Not everybody is Fergie, able to keep motivating players for decades.

They might win a trophy though? Also this is a false equivalency, Klop was a two time league winner and CL finalist.
Poch is a much larger leap of faith

 

[GlastonSpur]

I so fully disagree. Sir Alex may like Poch but he liked Moyes too. Moyes who then fired Phelan and the whole staff, and didn’t play with speed when, Sir Alex said it himself, “Playing with speed never hindered our results. It was our way: energy and determination in the last third of the pitch.”.

Have you listened to Ole? It’s the same he’s been repeating over and over. We are getting there because Ole has a real vision and no the others will probably just play to save their ass. Is Poch good? Yes, and he became better by trying to be more pragmatic instead of forcing a system l’île his early days. What is Ole doing? He’s already being pragmatic with this squad because they don’t play like Molde at all but retains some of the key attributes that makes their strength.

And Poch is still a gamble. We should let Ole develop their team. He has the dressing room for a reason: it’s because they buy his plans. Spurs did not follow Poch anymore.

And don’t even get me started with his biography where his wife is explicitly
recommending him to not stay too long in a club and leave as soon as he reaches some height. This is a guy who doesn’t deserve top class clubs. Let him jump ships as he likes.

Pochettino was at Spurs for 5 and half years …. far longer than the average managerial tenure in the Prem. Moreover, he didn't jump ship - he was fired.

 

[Gasolin]

Pochettino was at Spurs for 5 and half years …. far longer than the average managerial tenure in the Prem. Moreover, he didn't jump ship - he was fired.

He was fired because he said BS during the C1 final that made the players understand he could leave if they won it, or some BS. And it all comes back to a state of mind his wife seems to promote to him.

 

[GlastonSpur]

He was fired because he said BS during the C1 final that made the players understand he could leave if they won it, or some BS. And it all comes back to a state of mind his wife seems to promote to him.

Doesn't change the falsehood of your attempted portrayal of Pochettino as some sort of short-tenure, serial jumper from club to club.

 

[romufc]

And the best you can find is a manager who lost 18 out of the last 36 matches ?

We will see what your view is when we play mid - lower table teams and can barely create chances.

What Poch done for Southampton and Spurs was brilliant. Get your short term glasses off and look where Spurs were before Poch came in and where he left them. He had no money to spend last year and still managed to have a decent season.

 

[ROFLUTION]

I so fully disagree. Sir Alex may like Poch but he liked Moyes too. Moyes who then fired Phelan and the whole staff, and didn’t play with speed when, Sir Alex said it himself, “Playing with speed never hindered our results. It was our way: energy and determination in the last third of the pitch.”.

Have you listened to Ole? It’s the same he’s been repeating over and over. We are getting there because Ole has a real vision and no the others will probably just play to save their ass. Is Poch good? Yes, and he became better by trying to be more pragmatic instead of forcing a system l’île his early days. What is Ole doing? He’s already being pragmatic with this squad because they don’t play like Molde at all but retains some of the key attributes that makes their strength.

And Poch is still a gamble. We should let Ole develop their team. He has the dressing room for a reason: it’s because they buy his plans. Spurs did not follow Poch anymore.

And don’t even get me started with his biography where his wife is explicitly
recommending him to not stay too long in a club and leave as soon as he reaches some height. This is a guy who doesn’t deserve top class clubs. Let him jump ships as he likes.

Can you please let us all know what Ole's great tactics are against midtable teams. I'm all ears. A pragmatic approach that has led us to very few points?

Also: Every manager has the dressing room in the first period of time. It's easy to say he didn't have the dressing room now as he was fired, but he had it for the first many years until players got mentally tired from his high demands, and probably because there were not much change in personnel at Spurs (Poch didn't get what much he asked for from Levy). You could make the same argument about not having the dressing-room in the end for Ole at Cardiff or any manager.

 

[Gasolin]

Can you please let us all know what Ole's great tactics are against midtable teams. I'm all ears. A pragmatic approach that has led us to very few points?

Also: Every manager has the dressing room in the first period of time. It's easy to say he didn't have the dressing room now as he was fired, but he had it for the first many years until players got mentally tired from his high demands, and probably because there were not much change in personnel at Spurs (Poch didn't get what much he asked for from Levy). You could make the same argument about not having the dressing-room in the end for Ole at Cardiff or any manager.

Sure, Ole is s*** and we will be doomed, happy now? I am tired of having to explain again and again, Ole's games are changing, and the scores prove that. Don't confuse the defensive nervousness with the inability to score against low defenses. Why can't people just do their tactical analysis of the games themselves? If you're too lazy, just read what the others have done. It's out there, there's no secret.

 

[90 + 5min]

We will see what your view is when we play mid - lower table teams and can barely create chances.

What Poch done for Southampton and Spurs was brilliant. Get your short term glasses off and look where Spurs were before Poch came in and where he left them. He had no money to spend last year and still managed to have a decent season.

Please do check what squad he had and where Spurs were couple of years before he came. While you do that you can check what and who he bought.

Then you”ll see that Spurs were very good team and despite that he even bought players.
People need to stop with the nonsens that Spurs were some shit club before Poch came.

 

[Gasolin]

Please do check what squad he had and where Spurs were couple of years before he came. While you do that you can check what and who he bought.

Then you”ll see that Spurs were very good team and despite that he even bought players.
People need to stop with the nonsens that Spurs were some shit club before Poch came.

Exactly. All that stretch to say that Ole is s***. No way to enjoy a brilliant week!

 

[romufc]

Please do check what squad he had and where Spurs were couple of years before he came. While you do that you can check what and who he bought.

Then you”ll see that Spurs were very good team and despite that he even bought players.
People need to stop with the nonsens that Spurs were some shit club before Poch came.

Okay here goes.. Prior to Poch's arrival spurs finished 5th and 6th the seasons before.

His finishes then was 5th, 3rd, 2nd 3rd but hey that is not any achievement.

He got into a Champions League final, but hey that again is no achievement.

Squad before his arrival - Kane, Defoe, Adebayor, Soldado, Townsend, Lamela, Chadli, Sigurdson, Bentaleb, Eriksen, Paulinho, Waker, Naughton, Sandro, Vertonghen, Llrois, Kaboul, Dawson

Signings
Son, Alderweireld, Trippier, Sissiko, Wanyama, Jansenn, Moura, Sanchez, Aurier.

No one said Spurs were a shit club but they were never challengers, they were always fighting for top 4. They are now challenging, world class players.

Yes ofcourse they were a good team, no one is saying he worked a miracle bringing a championship side to compete.

Manchester United have always had a good side, so are we not challenging? We can't even get into the champions league, let alone even challenge.

We have a WC keeper, £180m defence, £150m midfield, and £50m attack.. Now you go look to see how much he spent to get that team to challenge.

 

[romufc]

Exactly. All that stretch to say that Ole is s***. No way to enjoy a brilliant week!

We can all enjoy good wins but they do not cover the cracks. So why is it that this team is complimented so much beating City and Spurs but when we talk about top 4 it isnt good enough?

Ole can play well and beat the Cities and spurs but if we dont beat 2/3 of the other teams what good is that? Good on Ole to get the team prepared for these games but we look totally out of sorts againsts any team below 6th.

 

[90 + 5min]

Okay here goes.. Prior to Poch's arrival spurs finished 5th and 6th the seasons before.

His finishes then was 5th, 3rd, 2nd 3rd but hey that is not any achievement.

He got into a Champions League final, but hey that again is no achievement.

Squad before his arrival - Kane, Defoe, Adebayor, Soldado, Townsend, Lamela, Chadli, Sigurdson, Bentaleb, Eriksen, Paulinho, Waker, Naughton, Sandro, Vertonghen, Llrois, Kaboul, Dawson

Signings
Son, Alderweireld, Trippier, Sissiko, Wanyama, Jansenn, Moura, Sanchez, Aurier.

No one said Spurs were a shit club but they were never challengers, they were always fighting for top 4. They are now challenging, world class players.

Yes ofcourse they were a good team, no one is saying he worked a miracle bringing a championship side to compete.

Manchester United have always had a good side, so are we not challenging? We can't even get into the champions league, let alone even challenge.

We have a WC keeper, £180m defence, £150m midfield, and £50m attack.. Now you go look to see how much he spent to get that team to challenge.

Exctly. Spurs were always there near Champions League places. He took them little step forward. Not like it was jumping over a canyon.

Only those signing? What about putting to your list: Yedlin, Alli, Dier, Fazio, Stambouli, Vorm, Davies, Wimmer, Njie, Janssen, Nkoudou, Foyth, Llorente, Gazzaniga, Clarke, Ndombele, Sessengon

 

[alexthelion]

Okay here goes.. Prior to Poch's arrival spurs finished 5th and 6th the seasons before.

His finishes then was 5th, 3rd, 2nd 3rd but hey that is not any achievement.

He got into a Champions League final, but hey that again is no achievement.

Squad before his arrival - Kane, Defoe, Adebayor, Soldado, Townsend, Lamela, Chadli, Sigurdson, Bentaleb, Eriksen, Paulinho, Waker, Naughton, Sandro, Vertonghen, Llrois, Kaboul, Dawson

Signings
Son, Alderweireld, Trippier, Sissiko, Wanyama, Jansenn, Moura, Sanchez, Aurier.

No one said Spurs were a shit club but they were never challengers, they were always fighting for top 4. They are now challenging, world class players.

Yes ofcourse they were a good team, no one is saying he worked a miracle bringing a championship side to compete.

Manchester United have always had a good side, so are we not challenging? We can't even get into the champions league, let alone even challenge.

We have a WC keeper, £180m defence, £150m midfield, and £50m attack.. Now you go look to see how much he spent to get that team to challenge.

What exactly are they challenging?

They came third in a two-horse race with Leicester and bottled a (very lucky) CL appearance.

Under Poch they've never come close to winning anything, his points toatals in the league are about where they were before he joined.

What a great job!

 

[cjj]

Exctly. Spurs were always there near Champions League places. He took them little step forward. Not like it was jumping over a canyon.

Only those signing? What about putting to your list: Yedlin, Alli, Dier, Fazio, Stambouli, Vorm, Davies, Wimmer, Njie, Janssen, Nkoudou, Foyth, Llorente, Gazzaniga, Clarke, Ndombele, Sessengon

Not just near. When you go beyond the cherry picking (as you have with signings), we finished 4th twice in the seasons prior (one of them being victims of that dodgy rule that was temporarily in place that gave Chelsea our CL place)

If you were to take away the Juande Ramos seasons, where he was awful in the league but won a cup, the average finish has been 5th (4.857th) prior to Pochettino, and is 6th (5.8888th) with those two Ramos seasons:

Where it is very difficult to examine is just how much is down to Kane, and just how much is down to Poch.

Furthermore, just how much is down to the inconsistency of other teams? As can be seen, the same points in 2015-16 for 3rd was matched by Redknapp's Champions League qualifying season (70pts). Also, AVB's 72 point season (which is higher than 3 of Poch's 5 seasons) only resulted in 5th, but it would have been enough for 2nd place in 2015-16.

To add another factor in, you only have to look at the top scorers and see another trend - in recent years, most 'lesser' teams have been able to hold onto key performers, as all the clubs are pretty wealthy now and don't need to sell. If Poch had the same team 5+ years earlier, would we have been selling off Kane to Man Utd rather than Berbatov? Dele instead of Carrick?




There's no doubting what we have been able to achieve whilst Pochettino was manager, but it's difficult to know just how much is because of him and how much is in spite of him. If there is anything we can say, it's that Pochettino has not helped towards the mentality that turns "competitors" into "winners" - evidenced by his nonsense around the CL Final and what he has said about winning the league. That's the biggest issue that will affect his next club, imo.

 

[kidbob]

FFS it's very simple. Poch came in at a time when Arsenal, Chelsea and particularly United went through bad times. Of course he got top 4 more when the best team in England and the only constant in the CL spots for 20 bloody years decides to become shite. United faltering opened an extra space to these competitions that what unheard of for years. Newsflash Leicester also don't win the League if Ferguson is still at United too. Of all forums to have to explain this it's surprising this is one. You do remember that United were a powerhouse unprecedented in most Leagues for 20 plus years so when we fell it left a vacuum for others to fill.

Poch is good as a manager maybe even great but the problem is he took advantage of a weaker top 4 and he plays dull uninteresting football. If he was a guy who played great football then hell yeah but he isn't so it's not worth getting him. Think of it this way why get Poch (who is proven to play dull football) when it could affect our ability to get a Rose, Naagelsman or Ten Haag who all play better football.

Ole is finally putting the right system and payers in place and while he isn't the right guy he is as good as having Poch while building for a proper progressive manager. Hopefully (but not likely) our braindead board use this period to put a great DOF in place too.

 

[Leftback99]

Those obsessed with Poch are very blinkered in believing he'd turn us into the peak 16/17 version of Spurs (or better) while ignoring the rest of his reign wasn't particularly special compared to Redknapp etc before him.

 

[Zen86]

Okay here goes.. Prior to Poch's arrival spurs finished 5th and 6th the seasons before.

His finishes then was 5th, 3rd, 2nd 3rd but hey that is not any achievement.

He got into a Champions League final, but hey that again is no achievement.

Squad before his arrival - Kane, Defoe, Adebayor, Soldado, Townsend, Lamela, Chadli, Sigurdson, Bentaleb, Eriksen, Paulinho, Waker, Naughton, Sandro, Vertonghen, Llrois, Kaboul, Dawson

Signings
Son, Alderweireld, Trippier, Sissiko, Wanyama, Jansenn, Moura, Sanchez, Aurier.

No one said Spurs were a shit club but they were never challengers, they were always fighting for top 4. They are now challenging, world class players.

Yes ofcourse they were a good team, no one is saying he worked a miracle bringing a championship side to compete.

Manchester United have always had a good side, so are we not challenging? We can't even get into the champions league, let alone even challenge.

We have a WC keeper, £180m defence, £150m midfield, and £50m attack.. Now you go look to see how much he spent to get that team to challenge.

Let’s be fair, ‘challenge’ is a stretch despite their league positions. They rose slightly up the table at a time when many of the established top clubs we’re struggling.

 

[Handré1990]

FFS it's very simple. Poch came in at a time when Arsenal, Chelsea and particularly United went through bad times. Of course he got top 4 more when the best team in England and the only constant in the CL spots for 20 bloody years decides to become shite. United faltering opened an extra space to these competitions that what unheard of for years. Newsflash Leicester also don't win the League if Ferguson is still at United too. Of all forums to have to explain this it's surprising this is one. You do remember that United were a powerhouse unprecedented in most Leagues for 20 plus years so when we fell it left a vacuum for others to fill.

Poch is good as a manager maybe even great but the problem is he took advantage of a weaker top 4 and he plays dull uninteresting football. If he was a guy who played great football then hell yeah but he isn't so it's not worth getting him. Think of it this way why get Poch (who is proven to play dull football) when it could affect our ability to get a Rose, Naagelsman or Ten Haag who all play better football.

Ole is finally putting the right system and payers in place and while he isn't the right guy he is as good as having Poch while building for a proper progressive manager. Hopefully (but not likely) our braindead board use this period to put a great DOF in place too.

Good post. The thing about dull football is actually something I’ve thought for years, at least since they got this reputation of playing good football.

 

[ROFLUTION]

Sure, Ole is s*** and we will be doomed, happy now? I am tired of having to explain again and again, Ole's games are changing, and the scores prove that. Don't confuse the defensive nervousness with the inability to score against low defenses. Why can't people just do their tactical analysis of the games themselves? If you're too lazy, just read what the others have done. It's out there, there's no secret.

No mentioning whatsoever of what you think he's doing right against midtable clubs in this You're just attacking instead of defending your views.

How are his games changing? Last five games against midtable sides:
Aston Villa (H) 2-2 - Not good enough
Sheffield United (A) 3-3 Not good enough
Brighton (H) 3-1 Good result
Bournemouth (A) 1-0 Bad result
Norwich (A) 1-3 Good result, worst team in the league

Sure we've scored more as injured players have come back, but this is still just 8 points from 5 games against midtablers. Not sure what has really changed against midtable clubs compared to last season.

Funnily enough these type of games were the exact games Poch used to be really good at carving out a result from in the majority of his tenure at Spurs.

 

[Gasolin]

No mentioning whatsoever of what you think he's doing right against midtable clubs in this You're just attacking instead of defending your views.

How are his games changing? Last five games against midtable sides:
Aston Villa (H) 2-2 - Not good enough
Sheffield United (A) 3-3 Not good enough
Brighton (H) 3-1 Good result
Bournemouth (A) 1-0 Bad result
Norwich (A) 1-3 Good result, worst team in the league

Sure we've scored more as injured players have come back, but this is still just 8 points from 5 games against midtablers. Not sure what has really changed against midtable clubs compared to last season.

Funnily enough these type of games were the exact games Poch used to be really good at carving out a result from in the majority of his tenure at Spurs.

I said you should just watch the game and do the analysis yourself but since it seems to difficult, let’s break it down again one more time in the forum...

1/ difficulty to score? Yes we’ve been scoring more so we must have some answers. But then we only took 2 pts against Sheffield or Villa? Alright do we need to fix the defense and the lapse of focus?

2/ fantastic! In the last games, we have had to defend and we kept the focus! So we are making progress!

or no, he’s still s*** and doesn’t understand anything about football anyway. Am I doing this right? Yeah, why do I bother, really... do you even look at the game and think about the tactical implication happening on the field or do you only look at the score or don’t you ever care about understanding what’s happening on the field when you watch games?!?

 

[VJ1762]

Okay here goes.. Prior to Poch's arrival spurs finished 5th and 6th the seasons before.

His finishes then was 5th, 3rd, 2nd 3rd but hey that is not any achievement.

He got into a Champions League final, but hey that again is no achievement.

Squad before his arrival - Kane, Defoe, Adebayor, Soldado, Townsend, Lamela, Chadli, Sigurdson, Bentaleb, Eriksen, Paulinho, Waker, Naughton, Sandro, Vertonghen, Llrois, Kaboul, Dawson

Signings
Son, Alderweireld, Trippier, Sissiko, Wanyama, Jansenn, Moura, Sanchez, Aurier.

No one said Spurs were a shit club but they were never challengers, they were always fighting for top 4. They are now challenging, world class players.

Yes ofcourse they were a good team, no one is saying he worked a miracle bringing a championship side to compete.

Manchester United have always had a good side, so are we not challenging? We can't even get into the champions league, let alone even challenge.

We have a WC keeper, £180m defence, £150m midfield, and £50m attack.. Now you go look to see how much he spent to get that team to challenge.

Bro, give it a rest. The cafe will revert back to ole out if we fail to beat everton. Deep down, everybody knows that Ole is not the right man for the job.

 

[Halftrack]

Deep down, everybody knows that Ole is not the right man for the job.

Sure thing, man.