Ole says this season will be used to find next season’s squad

[Eriku]

These fans are watching a game without any hope of their team winning? They are there just to watch the game, have some beer and just enjoy their team getting thrashed?

No, I'm saying that winning and challenging for trophies shouldn't be a prerequisite to be able to enjoy watching football.

Winning TROPHIES. Something most teams generally don’t do. Most teams make up the numbers. The poster you responded to reiterated this point earlier in this thread too.

And in case you haven’t noticed, we do win matches, so to say we have no hope of that is silly.

 

[NK86]

Winning TROPHIES. Something most teams generally don’t do. Most teams make up the numbers. The poster you responded to reiterated this point earlier in this thread too.

And in case you haven’t noticed, we do win matches, so to say we have no hope of that is silly.

Winning matches lead to winning trophies, unless you are happy with winning a match here and there while flailing around the rest of the time.

Makes no sense. Hey we want our team to win but that does not mean we are looking for our team to compete for or win trophies. Do you see the silliness in that? If you win matches, you compete for trophies. But if we play like we have been, we will be languishing exactly where we are currently.

 

[Eriku]

Winning matches lead to winning trophies, unless you are happy with winning a match here and there while flailing around the rest of the time.

Makes no sense. Hey we want our team to win but that does not mean we are looking for our team to compete for or win trophies. Do you see the silliness in that? If you win matches, you compete for trophies. But if we play like we have been, we will be languishing exactly where we are currently.

Again, most teams will not be in contention for any trophies most seasons. Does this make their supporting a team a cavalcade of misery? Challenging for trophies was a significant part of the thing you quoted and disagreed with.

If you still don’t get what I’m trying to ask you after this then I give up.

 

[Castia]

Already wrote the season off in December after the worse start in our PL history.

Fair play to Ole he talks a good game, he must have the easiest job in football.

 

[iluvoursolskjær]

Who gives a shit that there's fans out there that watch football without the expectations of winning trophies? Like there's some deeper meaning than wanting your team to be the best in the world when you have the history, finances and thus full capability to do so?

*vomits*

 

[Paul_Scholes18]

Who gives a shit that there's fans out there that watch football with the expectations of winning trophies? Like there's some deeper meaning than wanting your team to be the best in the world when you have the history, finances and thus full capability to do so?

*vomits*

Yeah playing like Liverpool right now should not be our goal. We should look at teams like Burnley, Palace and Newcastle as our standard.
It feels like that is what Ole is doing mentally. Low expectations can be good sometimes since when it goes well there will be higher momentum gained from the added confience. Ole enjoyed that too after Mourinho, but then we imploded once we started getting a few bad results. Now we try to lower expectations even further for some reason.

 

[Class of 63]

Chinese whisper: Ole says next season will be used to find this season's squad.

 

[Judge Red]

This would be an acceptable plan if we had the right manager in place to manage next season’s squad.

 

[Focusmate]

I just don't buy into the idea of rebuilding and being happy with mediocrity for an unspecified period of time while we do.
The team came 2nd less than 2 years ago and that was seen as z failure.
With our resources we should be aiming to win the league every year.
Would Real Madrid or Barcelona accept coming 5th or 6th ? Its crazy.

 

[Class of 63]

I just don't buy into the idea of rebuilding and being happy with mediocrity for an unspecified period of time while we do.
The team came 2nd less than 2 years ago and that was seen as z failure.
With our resources we should be aiming to win the league every year.
Would Real Madrid or Barcelona accept coming 5th or 6th ? Its crazy.

Real Madrid and Barcelona don't play in a League where a team like Southampton, who looked doomed only a few weeks ago, can go to Chelsea who have spent more money than 98% of all teams in Europe over the last few decades, and have arguably the best Academy in Europe as well, competing for a top-four spot, win 0-2 and deserve to win. It just doesn't happen anywhere else, or very rarely.

 

[Litch]

If we buy a couple of players in this window, I might believe him but if we don't and leave it till another summer window especially with the euros where it's notoriously difficult signing players, he'll sound even more like a Glazer puppet

 

[Andersonson]

Some of you guys are crazy. You write as if a new manager comes in some of ours players would suddenly become top players.

How good do you think Poch, Klopp and Pep would make Fred, Lingard, Shaw, Matic, Andreas, Lindelof, Bailly, Rojo, Jones, Mata and Young?

Our team aint good enough to challenge for the title, no matter who the manager is.

The argument aint about mediocrity its about rebuilding. If Ole aint doing better next season then he has problems.

So far he has done good, there is a clear view on who can be here and a clear view on who dont.

Stop being so god damn RAWKish.

No chance in hell Greenwood would be playing so much if it was Pep, Klopp or Poch who'd manage us. We got a good manager for rebuilding the club. And it takes more than one windows with this fecked up squad

 

[Sky1981]

Some of you guys are crazy. You write as if a new manager comes in some of ours players would suddenly become top players.

How good do you think Poch, Klopp and Pep would make Fred, Lingard, Shaw, Matic, Andreas, Lindelof, Bailly, Rojo, Jones, Mata and Young?

Our team aint good enough to challenge for the title, no matter who the manager is.

The argument aint about mediocrity its about rebuilding. If Ole aint doing better next season then he has problems.

So far he has done good, there is a clear view on who can be here and a clear view on who dont.

Stop being so god damn RAWKish.

No chance in hell Greenwood would be playing so much if it was Pep, Klopp or Poch who'd manage us. We got a good manager for rebuilding the club. And it takes more than one windows with this fecked up squad

Mate he's already been doing worse than last season, even with 120m new defenders.

 

[Andersonson]

Mate he's already been doing worse than last season, even with 120m new defenders.

He's lost our best striker and the 2nd best CM. Our best CM has been injured for almost the whole season.

He started rebuilding from the back, which is a good sign.

And worse than last season? He was appointed in March...

 

[Sky1981]

He's lost our best striker and the 2nd best CM. Our best CM has been injured for almost the whole season.

He started rebuilding from the back, which is a good sign.

And worse than last season? He was appointed in March...

He's rebuilding from the back. How many clean sheets we have? None. And that's record breaking btw. Record fee for defender and record no clean sheet.

 

[Andersonson]

He's rebuilding from the back. How many clean sheets we have? None. And that's record breaking btw. Record fee for defender and record no clean sheet.

You think one CB and a RB would suddenly make us compact at the back? You think a clean sheet is all about the 4 we have in defence? We've lost a record amount of posession in our own half with Scott and Fred. And frankly, we dont have many others to play in CM. He could of course change tactics to suit your needs for clean sheets and park the bus. But it would be wrong no matter what.

We have conceded 5th least and scored 5th most. Its around the level expected with that young squad.

 

[RedSky]

He's rebuilding from the back. How many clean sheets we have? None. And that's record breaking btw. Record fee for defender and record no clean sheet.

If we bring in a new DM and we still leak in goals, then feel free to throw shit at him. But you'd just find something else to moan about right?

 

[Drifter]

So this as been one long pre - season. If that is the case, we are in trouble.

 

[Sky1981]

If we bring in a new DM and we still leak in goals, then feel free to throw shit at him. But you'd just find something else to moan about right?

Eh? The ole in boys made a grand thread about how mct is better than herrera and herrera wont have a place in our lineup. Just next door red, it's still fresh.

One thread about martial is the most intelligent and hardworking players. Then when shit hits the fans we have a top 6 squad at best.

The goalpost is constantly being moved around as fit

 

[Sky1981]

You think one CB and a RB would suddenly make us compact at the back? You think a clean sheet is all about the 4 we have in defence? We've lost a record amount of posession in our own half with Scott and Fred. And frankly, we dont have many others to play in CM. He could of course change tactics to suit your needs for clean sheets and park the bus. But it would be wrong no matter what.

We have conceded 5th least and scored 5th most. Its around the level expected with that young squad.

So... chequebook ole needs another 500m to be properly judged?

 

[steffyr2]

No. That’s not what I meant.

The two previous managers chose to do quick fix which is why they failed with us and why our squad are behind Liverpool & city. While Ole chose to do rebuilding the squad by improving and developing players which something that the previous managers with big CV couldn’t do. However, under Ole, players have shown sign of improvement & progress. If players are improving and developing, it will benefit the team as well especially the next 2-4 years. Not sure how did you get into conclusion that we are doing worse right now, you don’t compare a result of managers with 2 full season to the result of manager who is still in mid season.

The 2 previous managers improved the team quickly and efficiently (BAD!) whereas Ole is improving the team slowly (GOOD!). Not sure I get that, unless you're the Utd board who'll be happy if the fans are happy while they spend less money.

 

[TwoSheds]

Eh? The ole in boys made a grand thread about how mct is better than herrera and herrera wont have a place in our lineup. Just next door red, it's still fresh.

One thread about martial is the most intelligent and hardworking players. Then when shit hits the fans we have a top 6 squad at best.

The goalpost is constantly being moved around as fit

Why are there so many people who need to believe everyone falls in a particular "camp", "brigade", "club" or whatever you want to call it? As if a football fan having a different opinion to you about one thing makes them some sort of knob who automatically believes a whole series of things you've decided are laughably stupid? Maybe the people in your Venn diagram don't actually always overlap, they're just a whole series of different people with different views and that's ok. And what's more, they're all fecking United fans you daft fecker, that's the only club that matters.

 

[GiddyUp]

Pretty sure this is just a warning to players he feels lack the correct mindset and who are not giving it all.

Our main problems are not lack of quality or tactics, its mentality. Its a reason why we always look up for it in the big games and then look like a bunch of amateurs vs presumed lesser teams. You could say its partly on Ole to instill that winning mindset, but some people simply can not be changed.

He knows very well what players has the talent to play here and not. Hes not blind. The question is if they are commited enough

I think you are right. I have serious reservations about everything in the club at the moment, including a proper rebuild after 7 years of incompetence. It's always been about the team though. Individually you can see the quality but as a unit we've been shockingly poor. There's no trust or partnerships being formed. Very few leaders which shows with our inability to cover individual mistakes. The 2nd half against Watford should have been a fecking hurricane from us to make DDG & AWB mistakes meaningless. But nothing came. After the Newcastle goal I feared the same but we were excellent to the point of dominating the opposition, which we rarely see.
Consistancy comes when a team plays for each other and actually gives a shit. By all accounts the players where blaming each other for the 25% cut in their salary at the end of last season instead of looking at themselves.
I freak out the same as everyone else when we are comfortably playing like the worst team in the league but I've also seen some great performances that tell me if we stick it out we might actually get somewhere. I still don't think the club will be in a healthy position with Woodward and Lingard. Two individuals I think the club could really do without, today.

 

[Keefy18]

That was Klopp's first season in charge. He only joined in October of 2015, so he didn't have a summer window to prepare.

Whereas Ole joined December last year. He's already had half a season last year, plus a whole summer window to "find next seasons squad".

It's like he's hiding behind young players, the future, next season. No, we want to challenge for top 4 now. Klopp got top 4 with 76 points in his 2nd season.

Ole is way behind Klopp, plus he plays nothing like him. Even though Woodward is the root of the problem, I'm really beginning to get frustrated.

There's a whopping 2 months in the difference of their starting points.

Klopp took over in Oct 2015, Ole in Dec 2018.

Either way their starts / take overs are eerily similar.

This is his first full season in charge and we are still in the running for top 4, in the LC and the EL.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

There's a whopping 2 months in the difference of their starting points.

Klopp took over in Oct 2015, Ole in Dec 2018.

Either way their starts / take overs are eerily similar.

"eerily similar" my arse @Keefy18, by 28th December in his first full season Klopp was 2nd (and already had a trophy in the bag). OGS is 7th.

Stop comparing the best manager in the World with fecking Ole, it does him absolutely no favours and makes you sound like a deluded dipper from the 90's or 00's trying to compare Evans or Rafa to Fergie. Ole has had a wank start to his first full season, but let's hope he goes on a massive winning run now and proves all of us doubters wrong.

 

[Schmeichel's Cartwheel]

His signings have been good and I think he has a good long term vision and wants to bring in proper "Man United players" as opposed to some of the shite Moyes, LVG and Mourinho brought in, but I've gotta say his tactics are poor and his game management is piss poor also.

He'd be better suited as a DOF, because I do like his long term vision as I said, but we need a better manager/coach if we're gonna get back to the top.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

His signings have been good and I think he has a good long term vision and wants to bring in proper "Man United players" as opposed to some of the shite Moyes, LVG and Mourinho brought in.

I think that's more of a club thing that, the club clearly decided not to give Mourinho what he wanted (for example sell Martial, buy William), Mourinho obviously lost his shit about this but it's a good long term vision from the club. Taking all the power away from the manager and having a transfer committee was also a very smart move.
Ole is a manager that agrees with that club vision - another smart move.

You'd hope that if Ole is moved on at some point, that the club will only appoint a manager who shares that club vision so that we don't have to spunk hundreds of millions and ship out half a squad every time we change manager.

 

[Keefy18]

"eerily similar" my arse @Keefy18, by 28th December in his first full season Klopp was 2nd (and already had a trophy in the bag). OGS is 7th.

Stop comparing the best manager in the World with fecking Ole, it does him absolutely no favours and makes you sound like a deluded dipper from the 90's or 00's trying to compare Evans or Rafa to Fergie. Ole has had a wank start to his first full season, but let's hope he goes on a massive winning run now and proves all of us doubters wrong.

Yes he was 2nd on that date and then finished that season where? 4th.

He didn't have a trophy in that half season so not sure what trophy your on about? He made finals alright but lost them.

I'm not comparing their abilities, I'm comparing the situations they walked into.

Klopp took over 8th placed Liverpool in Oct, Ole took over 6th place United.
They both took over clubs that were previously mismanaged by boards with managers being sacked in quick succession.
They both had expensive under performing Belgian Forwards (Lukaku / Benteke) that needed to be sold.
They both had to rebuild their teams in a new image.

Ole clearly favors a mobile, versatile and pacey front 3 much like Klopp does. He clearly wants his Fullbacks to push forward and act as wingers, sadly our 2 currently don't provide the same level of offensive threat.

I've seen plenty of stats flying around that Ole's form in the same number of games is better than Klopps was at the same point but sure I suppose to folks like you that isn't allowed.

 

[rotherham_red]

Mate he's already been doing worse than last season, even with 120m new defenders.

Ignoring that we also had a squad gutted in midfield and attack. A squad which finished 6th.

 

[rotherham_red]

He's rebuilding from the back. How many clean sheets we have? None. And that's record breaking btw. Record fee for defender and record no clean sheet.

Erm, the 4-0 against Chelsea?

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

Yes he was 2nd on that date and then finished that season where? 4th.

He didn't have a trophy in that half season so not sure what trophy your on about? He made finals alright but lost them.

My error that, he'd already made the EL final.

It doesn't matter where he finished the season, because right now Ole could just as well finish 8th as 4th. By 28th December Klopp had his side playing some great stuff and they were second, and they ended the season on a points tally that Ole and United can only dream about at this stage. 76 points - we're on track for about 55.
Liverpool ended the season losing 6, we'd lost 5 by the middle of December.

Klopp took over a shitter side and didn't get the same bounce Ole did, but after their first half season and then summer with their new squads, everything about what Klopp did absolutely shits upon Ole right now.

But as I said earlier, don't compare them or anything they have done so far because it doesn't look good for Ole, instead cross your fingers that we don't feck up again today and that we go on a massive winning run, proving doubters wrong the right way, rather than comparing him with the incomparable.

 

[Sky1981]

Erm, the 4-0 against Chelsea?

First game of the season? and?

 

[Sky1981]

Why are there so many people who need to believe everyone falls in a particular "camp", "brigade", "club" or whatever you want to call it? As if a football fan having a different opinion to you about one thing makes them some sort of knob who automatically believes a whole series of things you've decided are laughably stupid? Maybe the people in your Venn diagram don't actually always overlap, they're just a whole series of different people with different views and that's ok. And what's more, they're all fecking United fans you daft fecker, that's the only club that matters.

If you argue about How ole should be given more time because apart from not being very good, "MAYBE" things would be better once X,Y,Z then yes, we're all manchester United.

But when they start to argue that Ole = Klopp, Ole > Pochetinno, then no, they're Ole supporters.

 

[Andersonson]

So... chequebook ole needs another 500m to be properly judged?

Not be judged, but if the club want som challenge we have to pay up.

We have the youngest first 11 in the prem and are close to top 4.

What were your expectations before the season??

 

[Sky1981]

Not be judged, but if the club want som challenge we have to pay up.

We have the youngest first 11 in the prem and are close to top 4.

What were your expectations before the season??

Same. 4th or sacked.

i'd even stated that i'd give ole a -2 spot handicapped, 6th or sacked.

EDIT: So what on having the youngest squad? Any teams can field a young squad if they're not expected to challenge anything

 

[Keefy18]

My error that, he'd already made the EL final.

It doesn't matter where he finished the season, because right now Ole could just as well finish 8th as 4th. By 28th December Klopp had his side playing some great stuff and they were second, and they ended the season on a points tally that Ole and United can only dream about at this stage. 76 points - we're on track for about 55.
Liverpool ended the season losing 6, we'd lost 5 by the middle of December.

Well, I had a look at the table when Klopp had Liverpool 2nd going into New year 2017. Liverpool were indeed 2nd on 40 points, we were 6th only 7 points behind.

With margins that small, it was entirely possible Liverpool could of finished 7th or 8th himself. I mean Liverpool supporters were calling for his head right up to the CL win last season saying he couldn't win big trophies.

Personally, I don't credit Klopp alone in how great Liverpool have become. I think a huge, huge part of their success is also largely due to Edwards and his transfer dealings. Yes Klopp is a fantastic manager but their transfers since 2016 have done a complete 180 and aided their squad rebuild massively.

Don't think we can say the same here at United can we? In the same time frame we've continued to do poor scouting and transfer business. That in turn hurts the managers (Jose and Ole) ability to perform better.

Klopp took over a shitter side and didn't get the same bounce Ole did, but after their first half season and then summer with their new squads, everything about what Klopp did absolutely shits upon Ole right now.

I think the squad was under performing myself.

It shouldn't of been 8th anyway, it was capable of a top 4 finish at the time what with Clyne, Benteke, Firmino, Lallana, Coutinho & Emre Can.

Again, rebuilding a squad needs a functional club for it to be a success. I think weather folks support Ole or not, everyone agrees we've been ran poorly for long time.

I'm not for a second saying Ole will follow a similar path, but right now its a complete unknown and when you look at the vote on weather he should stay or go it shows as well with it being split exactly 50/50.

Funny thing is, I think out of all the post Fergie managers he has the best long term plan and is playing it out better than any of the others.

We badly need rid of deadwood (he's done as much as is possible in a single transfer window), phased out ageing / under performing senior players (Valencia, Fellaini, Young) and been replaced by AWB, McTominay and Williams.

With his comments about finding a team, he isn't exactly wrong.

He isn't saying this season is a write off, I mean we can still get top 4, we are still in 2 cups. He's simply saying that next year there should be a better idea of a United team long term.

 

[TwoSheds]

If you argue about How ole should be given more time because apart from not being very good, "MAYBE" things would be better once X,Y,Z then yes, we're all manchester United.

But when they start to argue that Ole = Klopp, Ole > Pochetinno, then no, they're Ole supporters.

You sound like a Trump supporter. All the evidence points towards what you've already decided is true and anything that doesn't suit that view is ignored.

They just have a stupid opinion FFS, to which they're fully entitled. And there's even the smallest possibility they might be right, stranger things have happened. Go and have a wank and delete your Twitter.

 

[Keefy18]

He's rebuilding from the back. How many clean sheets we have? None. And that's record breaking btw. Record fee for defender and record no clean sheet.

Clean sheets would be easier to come by if De Gea wasn't so error prone.

Facts are, De Gea is being worked less this season than in either of the previous two seasons (less saves), yet he's making more errors (Tops the goalkeeper errors table).

 

[Schmeichel's Cartwheel]

There's a whopping 2 months in the difference of their starting points.

Klopp took over in Oct 2015, Ole in Dec 2018.

Either way their starts / take overs are eerily similar.

This is his first full season in charge and we are still in the running for top 4, in the LC and the EL.

This is a very kind comparison for Ole here dude.

Klopp got 4th in his first full season with only 6 defeats and had already led Liverpool to 2 cup finals in his half season prior. He also had the previous pedigree of leading Dortmund to successive titles and a Champions League final.

They were clearly in a much more promising position than we are.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

Well, I had a look at the table when Klopp had Liverpool 2nd going into New year 2017. Liverpool were indeed 2nd on 40 points, we were 6th only 7 points behind.

With margins that small, it was entirely possible Liverpool could of finished 7th or 8th himself. I mean Liverpool supporters were calling for his head right up to the CL win last season saying he couldn't win big trophies.

What are you going on about... we're currently sat on a fecking miserable 28 points man.

Klopp was on 40 points so no it wasn't really feasible at all that Liverpool were suddenly going to nosedive and finish 7th or 8th, what the feck are you smoking? Just admit that Klopp started his first full season like a house on fire and did miles better than what Ole is currently doing, it doesn't make Ole a shit manager not comparing well to the best manager in the game.

I was gonna break down the rest of your post but it's fantasy land stuff just like the above. Klopp is the single biggest reason by a mile why Liverpool are where they are, unless he's just been lucky enough to pick up jobs where everywhere he goes suddenly 90% of signings are amazing and his current players get tonnes better (Mikhi, Kagawa, Şahin etc etc.) and yet once they leave him, they turn to shit or at best "meh" again.

And then you think the Liverpool squad Klopp took over was 8th but underperforming and capable of a top 4, however.... let me have a wild guess here, you think Ole took over a squad that was performing either above or to it's level and wasn't capable of top 4?