Experts in Poland saying now that we can semi-open in two weeks but it'd be only for select services and shops with additional restrictions. Bars and restaurants with limited capacity maybe in the Summer. Travel/movement restrictions, ban of mass gatherings including sports events and concerts and obligatory wearing of masks likely to remain for 2+ years until vaccine is found and proven to be efficient.
SARS CoV-2 coronavirus / Covid-19 (No tin foil hat silliness please)
- Thread starter Don't Kill Bill
- Start date
Agree with your points in general but from the perspective of pensions younger people will be hit harder on average potentially. Older people are more likely to have final salaries/defined benefit schemes, and also are more likely
To be invested in lifestyle funds which wouldn’t have felt the impact of the crash as much (this does of course depend on what you define as ‘older’)
To be fair to @Feed Me, he is a millenial and a massive whinger. Maybe he is using himself as an example which would be to some extent a sign of self awareness.
I haven’t slagged anyone off. That’s seemingly your domain. Go and look up the original post that sparked this all off. The poster has even since admitted that it smacked of a woe is me attitude. You’re really over analysing the whole thing too much when all I’ve said is that it’s imprudent to get into a dick measuring contest about which cross-section of society is most impacted when a) we don’t know how things will pan out and b) every person will have hardships to endure. I’m going for a walk, it’s not healthy to sit here ranting on. Apologies if I offended you in any way.
I’ve got no football to moan about nowTo be fair to @Feed Me, he is a millenial and a massive whinger. Maybe he is using himself as an example which would be to some extent a sign of self awareness.
For the record, this is the post I originally reacted to. Not meaning to pick on the poster specifically, but it is a bit ‘woe is me’.
One third of over 50s have no personal pension or savings whatsoever. Many of those that do will have relatively small amounts.
https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money...13/One-third-of-over-50s-have-no-pension.html
Sounds about right. It's what I expect from most of Europe, the UK of course being behind the curve a bit due to the dilly-dallying bullshit.
How does 'obligatory wearing of masks' work in restaurants and bars, though? And the workplace, where conversations are necessary (lectures as well). Just a thought.
Agree with this. I work in professional services and I can’t see how people will justify travelling to London for a meeting via train when you can do it so easily remotely!
I agree with that in many ways, but it will need a big attitude shift from employers and society more broadly towards accepting apprenticeships and the like as equivalents.
I'm sat here now sifting through applications for a project on highlighting up and coming younger talent in financial services and of the 30 selected, only two have not had a university education. These individuals are still seen as massive outliers, despite going on to pick up stacks of vocational qualifications along the way.
And how would their position have been affected more so than younger pension savers?
They are also much more likely to lose everything (they die) so I guess that balances it out a bit. Some of the richer older folk will be fine but like everything in life they are the minority and many older people have little to no savings and a meagre pension.
2+ years. Where did that come from. Hell, why not 30?
Most predictions seem to be that it will be 12-18 months until a vaccine is approved and some are claiming as early as September, with potential mass distribution near the end of the year. 2+ I never heard before.
Also, is a partial lockdown that long economically viable?
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They're not really equivalent though. There's a problem with even the better apprenticeship programs (talking about it as an engineer myself) - you basically learn to work in a way that specific business wants you to work. From a young age, you're taught to do things one way only. That's fine, if you're going to stay there for the rest of your life but you're not as useful once you leave that environment.
my pension has taken an absolute battering but I’m 34 so theory is I’m not able/planning to cash it on for 25 - 30 years so it has time to rebuild.
If someone at say 59 has taken a similar percentage hit on their fund it will have lost way more in absolute terms and they have little/no time to rebuild, so quality of retirement or indeed ability to retire is adversely affected.
Not sure that's how it comes across, but each to their own.
I think we all have to acknowledge that everyone struggles differently and some people are very worried about the future and will use this thread to vent. I'm just not sure dog pilling those posters and telling them that it's entitled to dare to think about themselves or their peers is really helping anyone. It just comes across as dismissive.
But agreed that it's not healthy to continue this on, enjoy your walk!
I'd say masks only for public transport.
Bars can work around it by limiting the number of people inside - same for restaurants.
It will be probably the quickest vaccine in history if we manage to get one ready for mass use in 18 months. Most vaccines take 6-9 years to develop. We could be looking at 2-3 years realistically though hoping for much less than that of course but 18 months is likely best case scenario.
What we really need right now are some breakthroughs in effective treatments - the vaccine will come eventually but it's on down the line.
This is partially true, but like I said, many funds for people approaching retirement are invested on a ‘lifestyle’ basis, which means the risk profile is decreased gradually as you approach retirement (which is why proportionately, younger peoples funds have been more adversely affected, which was part of the initial point I made). I work in pension income brokering and can only go off what I’ve seen of late. A few of our clients have lost a lot of money, but many haven’t felt the hit nearly as much as you might think.
How your fund rebuilds is another story and I hope you’re right and it builds back up nicely. On a side note, the older generation as a minimum have more certainty regarding their state pensions, which is something the younger generation do not, and this won’t have been helped by what is happening now.
Why stop there? Factory farming in America has just as many egregious practices, which likely led to the H1N1 epidemic in 2009. They didn't learn their lessons and neither will the CCP.
What needs to happen is a fundamental rethink on the current political and socio-economic system. When we let the market dictate and decide on the allocation of resources we see shit like this occurring. It's no coincidence that the last 30-40 years have been amongst the most financially turbulent outside of wartime.
Something has to change, unfortunately there are too many vested interests which preclude such a change from occurring.
This. If we could find some drugs that could treat those who are actually infected, that could tide us over until the vaccine.
Just read in the independent that Ireland expects restrictions until the vaccine is found. That is going to impact the economic system hugely.
This.
Is there a cruise ship itinerary review like we can find for airplanes? Marella Explorer is currently heading for France, after passing close to Azores with already 3 deaths on board and hundreds of infected.
When has this cruiseship originally left port? I presume they left from Europe, were denied anchoring in the US, and had to turn back. But when the feck did they originally started the trip? How long have they been at sea? Or have they been "abandoned" in the sea for over a month?
Someone help me understand this. I found a site called "cruise mapper" which shows its position and planned future trips, but I would like to know it's recent itinerary.
When has this cruiseship originally left port? I presume they left from Europe, were denied anchoring in the US, and had to turn back. But when the feck did they originally started the trip? How long have they been at sea? Or have they been "abandoned" in the sea for over a month?
Someone help me understand this. I found a site called "cruise mapper" which shows its position and planned future trips, but I would like to know it's recent itinerary.
Probably going to make tables far apart and you will have to wear them when you are not eating, or something. You can speak with a mask on though it obviously sounds a bit silly.
It will be likely most other countries will be doing the same thing unless something dramatic changes. This is going to go on in one way or another for over a year at least which is a very depressing thought.
2 years sounds right. Vaccine will probably get approved within 12-18 months indeed but distribution among population will take months, and they will have to slowly see if that works and there are no mutations at that point that could overcome it to be 100% confident. Simply no country can allow the curve to get very high.
I don't know if it's economically viable but there's no other choice. Having millions of people die is not a solution either. There are thousands of jobs that will not exist for those 2 years though so it's certainly very difficult but it's not like we are presented with a choice here. There's absolutely no way in hell that you can allow people back into stadiums and concerts and not have a massive outbreak again.
So how long do we think the UK lockdown will get extended by? Anything less than 4 weeks is surely too soon?
Yeah 4 weeks I reckon, then we can see what happens to those countries lifting their lockdowns in those 4 weeks and make an informed decision then.
I'm not expecting any changes until June at the earliest and even then likely to be minor loosening of things (kids going back to school most likely). There will likely not be a total return to normal life for probably 2-3 years unless we get a vaccine sorted before then. I'm pessimistic on this because I don't see a way out of this right now.
6k more deaths than usual in the week ending 3rd April, only 3,475 linked to covid-19: ONS dataset
Looks like quite a few covid-19 deaths are going unreported and that dealing with covid is lessening the quality and availability of care provision elsewhere. Also seems like this latter factor could more than counterbalance the number of deaths from covid who would have died anyway.
Looks like quite a few covid-19 deaths are going unreported and that dealing with covid is lessening the quality and availability of care provision elsewhere. Also seems like this latter factor could more than counterbalance the number of deaths from covid who would have died anyway.
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Mega lolz. I swear you’ve literally repeated the exact same posts about 200 times now.
France extended until 11 May yesterday, Belgium will extend until 3 May tomorrow, probably with possibility to extend further until mid-May.
You shouldn't be hopeful for anything before mid-May, realistically.
They'll extend by "at least another 3 weeks".
I replied to you because you seemed to believe older people were all wealthy and living off good pensions, which is far from the truth.
You've now introduced a new question and my answer is that a great many people of all ages will be affected by a lengthy depression. If you must insist on bringing age into it then the difference is the over 50s will have less time to do anything about it. It's common for those in their 30s and 40s to struggle to raise a family and have nothing left over, but look upon their final decade of work as the time to save and prepare for their own retirement, and it's looking as though for many that won't happen.
Health minister literally said this today so it's not just my view now. You think it's unrealistic to have no mass gatherings for 2 years?
We are actually opening up pretty early but our curve has not got that high. We locked down when we were at like 10 cases per day I think so we did not allow it to spread too much. Our total death count is a third of daily deaths in UK in recent days.
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The 'people do not develop antibodies' is a bit misleading. One of Chinese studies showed 6% of people did not develop them. Antibodies are not needed in everyone to prevent disease from spreading, even if 80% of patients develop antibodies and are immune it's good enough to slow it down very significantly. Also I don't think it's going to matter for vaccine, and vaccine will be there long before we can achieve 'herd immunity' from getting everybody sick. Even if you allowed 50,000 people to get sick every day in UK it'd take you almost 3 years to get 'herd immunity' and you obviously can't allow 50k to get sick every day.
I thought this was a discussion about coronavirus, not about economic to and fro about generation x,y or z... please keep to the topic!
They are related.
Are you a mod?
The “lockdown” phase is surely just stalling for time whilst we measure how deadly the disease it, how easily it’s transmitted, how long it takes to recover etc...as well as doing the necessary to help bolster defences.
The question is, what do we do next? Because it seems to be commonly accepted that there will be no widely available vaccine for at least one year, if not two. I also think we all accept that we can’t operate under lockdown conditions for a prolonged period of time.
The question is, what do we do next? Because it seems to be commonly accepted that there will be no widely available vaccine for at least one year, if not two. I also think we all accept that we can’t operate under lockdown conditions for a prolonged period of time.