Could they void the PL due to the Coronavirus? | No | Resuming June 17th
- Thread starter Tarrou
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Damien said all liverpool fans would be blocked when they win the league.
He's at that point now
I think that was a joke.
Or some temporary prank ban. Well, it should be that at most at least.
Or some temporary prank ban. Well, it should be that at most at least.
There is a little bit of sway as Bury folded leaving one spare place. But it doesn't sit right. Although it does swerve how you deal with Macclesfield and Stevenage both being crap and separated by one game in hand and a mere 3 point difference.
Plus how to sort the conference playoff zone into a winner.
Even if there's no second wave social distance will be kept for months so I don't expect fans in PL stadiums before mid / late November anyway.
Oh I agree with that. I don’t EXPECT fans to be allowed back in stadiums almost until the last case of Corona has been treated in the whole world, but that’s more because of the target that football seems to be I think.
I’m just thinking out loud or how it could be feasible.
The Bundeliga games were so bad I’d rather they just didn’t bring football back at all until they can do it properly. I already don’t want to watch the rest of the PL season like this.
It's a difficult situation for the mods regards their stance on Liverpool fans.
I mean, can you call winning the
'We tried, la. We really did. We ran a lot, we scored a lot, we VAR'ed a lot, we PED'ed a lot, we avoided injury a lot, we dived a lot, but ultimately shot our lot before the season ended' trophy
a league title?
I don't think so.
I don't see it that way. I see fans being allowed in stadiums but with limited capacities. They'll probably retain the whole social distancing and safe distance rules which could allow stadiums to fill a fourth or even a third of their full capacities. All of this before the vaccine and while the virus is still at large.
Well Boris has already declared that January at the earliest for fans in stadiums here. As I said, I’m with you, I believe reduced capacity stadiums can work, say 20-25% of every stadium. I just think that, because the argument for it is largely because ‘football will be better to watch’, government will be seen to take the stance that such doesn’t matter. Something about teachers, doctors and nurses being the real heroes etc.
It’s not about the distancing in the stands, it’s about how you get them in & out of the ground safely. And even more, what happens if they need to evacuate in an emergency?
100% agree with you.
agree 100%...end the season , give liverpool their * and bring it back when crowds are allowed .... that was pathetic , boring and even the purists struggled
The Bundesliga games I saw were fine. Not sure what people were expecting. It's not the most competitive league in the world.
There's no reason at all why they can't finish the PL season and it's getting rather boring and distasteful listening to spoilt babies like Deeney and co whine from their mansions about how unfair it is on them. They'll be back playing football weeks after most other people are back at work, and in an environment that even now is about 700% less of a risk than most people put themselves at to do their fecking shopping every week.
THis whole thing has put me off football a bit in general because it's shone a light on what a bunch of spoilt, out of touch, and frankly fragile brats a lot of footballers are. Moaning about being unfairly treated while being in better circumstances than most people and being looked after better than almost anyone, and yet despite that a significant number of them haven't even bothered to stick to the isolation rules.
Other sports will just come back when they can without a fuss. Premier League football you'd think the government and Premier League are trying to them all to war and not giving them any guns. If you don't want to go in and train, don't, and see what happens. Even if the club sacked a player they'd still be in a FAR better position than anyone on furlough, or anyone who's still been working the whole time...which is basically everyone.
There's no reason at all why they can't finish the PL season and it's getting rather boring and distasteful listening to spoilt babies like Deeney and co whine from their mansions about how unfair it is on them. They'll be back playing football weeks after most other people are back at work, and in an environment that even now is about 700% less of a risk than most people put themselves at to do their fecking shopping every week.
THis whole thing has put me off football a bit in general because it's shone a light on what a bunch of spoilt, out of touch, and frankly fragile brats a lot of footballers are. Moaning about being unfairly treated while being in better circumstances than most people and being looked after better than almost anyone, and yet despite that a significant number of them haven't even bothered to stick to the isolation rules.
Other sports will just come back when they can without a fuss. Premier League football you'd think the government and Premier League are trying to them all to war and not giving them any guns. If you don't want to go in and train, don't, and see what happens. Even if the club sacked a player they'd still be in a FAR better position than anyone on furlough, or anyone who's still been working the whole time...which is basically everyone.
Eventually people will move away from the make believe idea that the virus is ever going to go away and they can just wait until it's gone to do things. It's only sheer and ignorant stupidity that's keeping that mindset alive. I can see them holding off until towards the end of the year with allowing spectators but at that point unless there's an early second wave it's just going to start looking really stupid. Clubs and jobs will start disappearing and no one will be able to give a logical explanation for why it's being allowed to happen.
I think they'll hold off in the hope a vaccine appears in the autumn and they can hide behind that as the reason to open stadiums again, even though it'd make next to feck all difference. unless you can magically give it to the entire population of the world within a few weeks. Or we might see intermediate measures like allowing grounds at half capacity or something.
Also though the fact it is going to be months before there's crowds again just dead ends the idea of abandoning this season...the start of next season will have exactly the same problem and if you end this season sooner you end up bringing the start date of next season forwards.
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Yea, you’re right, eventually people will just get on with it. This season will certainly end behind closed doors but hopefully next season can start with some fans if it is late enough.
I think ultimately, the government will not permit it until the ‘more important’ sectors are close to normalised. Football can’t be seen to be given any importance over just about anything.
Yeah. Stadium crowds will be last on the list anyway. I can't see there being fans at the start of next season as there's only so long they can delay it, so they may as well just get this season over with.
There's really no reason why players can't train and play at this point, never mind in 3-4 weeks time. It's way lower down on the risk scale than some non essential things that were never banned in the first place, like uber eats and amazon deliveries, construction work, etc.
The fuss over it and constant headlines of players breaking lockdown, moaning about being victims or being forced into unsafe working environments etc. has cemented my view that premiership footballers are the most pathetic "professional" athletes in the world.
Tbh I think this entire pandemic, from a football perspective, has been all about optics and PR anyway.
As far as health and safety is concerned, I doubt the footballers are really the ones causing the issue. It’s all of these medical experts who are crawling out of the woodwork every day from Eva Carneiro to others, with the press of course, in their desperation to run something, spinning it into some huge ‘lives being placed at risk’ over-exaggeration.
I don’t blame the players much at all tbh. I think this period has highlighted the contempt that the public hold them in due to envy of their riches. When this thing really exploded here footballers were the first group after the actual fecking politicians that people pointed fingers at and started asking what are you going to do to fix this.
I’m less sure that there won’t be a change of heart regarding allowing at least reduced capacity at stadiums to start next season. I think people have been watching Germany and there’s a growing consensus that this is not really a sustainable solution. It’s one thing to play out an incomplete season like this, but they will be reluctant to start a brand new one in this vein. And for the sake of ‘integrity’ and all that, randomly giving massive home advantage to teams halfway through a season doesn’t really work to me. It questions the integrity of all of the games gone before, and the anomaly and subsequent asterisk attached to this season now rolls on to becoming the second asterisked season in a row because it’s all a bit of a joke.
I can actually tell you how I felt with all the matches of the Bundesliga this weekend.
Saturday - watching the Bundesliga goal show (that is somehow like the Goal show that they show in England for the CL matches) I had my problems - but I think it was because I missed action, too. The goal show lives of goals falling and scores changing on different pitches. It somehow felt for me more like sometimes when I do the same with the EPL when I am not really emotionally bound by the players or the different playing styles do not really give me something.
The late match I as usually only watch doing something differently. I then only switch to it when something happens. The missing noise did not really bother me.
Sunday I started to watch the first minutes of the 2nd League goal show on my TV - but then made me a pot of coffee and went to my computer. I remembered that I wanted to watch the 2nd League 10 to 15 minutes prior to the end of the matches and switched into them. There was a lot action on the pitch in the last minutes and that it was different because of no fans I reminded myself after the finish.
As you know I am a Bayern supporter. So the Sunday late match was the one I ached for now for weeks.
I missed the fan support less than I would have thought. It is not that all matches with fans are great either. It felt like that matches at the begin of the season when all are rusty or the matches in which you play against an underdog that does the job pretty well keeping you away from their own box. Often this matches get better in the second half when the other team either is behind and tries to come back and opens up - or when you do not have a lead and put more energy in the offense. As Bayern had a penalty in the first half and a set-piece goal before they would have went all in in the second that did not happen. But it is somehow good to see the guys playing again - and there for sure will be better matches in the next weeks when the rust is gone (and with different opponents)
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I do not think that it makes sense to always complain about the lack of supporters. It is like it is. It is a scenario that we got to live with in the next months. Maybe it is like it is with other things, too - I lived through the first computer game generation - we played with terrible graphics but the gameplay was the most important and we enjoyed it as much as the players do today.
Saturday - watching the Bundesliga goal show (that is somehow like the Goal show that they show in England for the CL matches) I had my problems - but I think it was because I missed action, too. The goal show lives of goals falling and scores changing on different pitches. It somehow felt for me more like sometimes when I do the same with the EPL when I am not really emotionally bound by the players or the different playing styles do not really give me something.
The late match I as usually only watch doing something differently. I then only switch to it when something happens. The missing noise did not really bother me.
Sunday I started to watch the first minutes of the 2nd League goal show on my TV - but then made me a pot of coffee and went to my computer. I remembered that I wanted to watch the 2nd League 10 to 15 minutes prior to the end of the matches and switched into them. There was a lot action on the pitch in the last minutes and that it was different because of no fans I reminded myself after the finish.
As you know I am a Bayern supporter. So the Sunday late match was the one I ached for now for weeks.
I missed the fan support less than I would have thought. It is not that all matches with fans are great either. It felt like that matches at the begin of the season when all are rusty or the matches in which you play against an underdog that does the job pretty well keeping you away from their own box. Often this matches get better in the second half when the other team either is behind and tries to come back and opens up - or when you do not have a lead and put more energy in the offense. As Bayern had a penalty in the first half and a set-piece goal before they would have went all in in the second that did not happen. But it is somehow good to see the guys playing again - and there for sure will be better matches in the next weeks when the rust is gone (and with different opponents)
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I do not think that it makes sense to always complain about the lack of supporters. It is like it is. It is a scenario that we got to live with in the next months. Maybe it is like it is with other things, too - I lived through the first computer game generation - we played with terrible graphics but the gameplay was the most important and we enjoyed it as much as the players do today.
I saw a lot of "it was serviceable", "wasn't that bad", "better than nothing" reactions to the Germany games which is fine. But I wonder how many will be prepared to fork out for expensive TV packages for " it was alright".
Agreed. The likes of Abraham etc complaining they have family members in high risk categories. Well, don't we all? If I was to tell my boss that I can't come to work because I have an at-risk family member, I would be laid off. If the rest of the world can get back to work despite being in more difficult situations, why do these footballers think they are so special? It's their job to go out and play. And unlike so many of us, people like Abraham can actually set up separate accommodation facilities for his family if he feels they are at risk by being in contact with him.
The Bundesliga has already started, players in Spain and Italy are about to be back in training or are already doing so. But here, we have people like Deeney, Sterling, Aguero moaning about one thing or another, despite being more fortunate than 99% of the world's population in this crisis.
'Premium mannequins' ......yeah, right 
Coronavirus football: FC Seoul apologises for 'sex dolls' in stands
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-52702075
Coronavirus football: FC Seoul apologises for 'sex dolls' in stands
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-52702075
Really happy everything went so well in the Bundesliga. The standard of the games was also pretty good I thought. Not that having no fans in the stadium is a good thing but it made it easier to focus on tactical aspects of the game. And there seemed to be less diving.
The trouble with Germany games was I am not sure if the lack of quality was a rustiness, league quality or player apathy. Can’t say I’d pay big money to watch it with having no skin in the game
I watched a bit of Dortmund-Schalke and Berlin-Bayern, hard to get into the games but thought that was more because of lack of affection for a team rather than the lack of a crowd. I do think crowd noise being played at the grounds might help a bit, if only to make the games feel less "hollow".
Thought the quality was alright and will probably improve over time as well. If it's Dortmund-Bayern in a few weeks time, I'm definitely watching and I think such games will have more of an edge too, regardless of fans attending. It's the new reality for the foreseeable future, better get used to it or learn to live with it rather than complain about it. I get that it's not everyone's cup of tea, but you're not forced to watch football either.
All in all it was as good as we could have hoped for I guess. Considering there had been no friendlies in preparation for this, it was honestly quite good. Comments along the lines that games looked liked training matches are more down to the fact we are not used to empty stands I think. I didn't see any holding back or lack of intensity. Anyway, this is how it's going to be for the remaning games of this season. There were some encouraging news about letting fans back into the stadium in August/September over the weekend.
Have to agree with this. I'm a massive football watcher usually, but just found the Dortmund game and games BCD before the lockdown so boring.
More annoying, Liverpool fans keep trying to make out like it's completely fine and exciting to watch, to try and justify them playing on and winning the title.
Well it is fine if you have a situation where you can control things. Thats what is really up for debate with the EPL and BL. We will see what happens in the BL I guess, it will be an indicator of what could happen in the UK. If we see teams losing two or three players due to CV infection and therefore affecting "integrity", we might see it suspended. However in the UK they are are so focused on getting it back that I expect they would simply ignore infections of players and say carry on. Its what most Liverpool fans and the media have said for some time, to the point people keep comparing the loss of two or three players to coronavirus as the same as an injury.
The Bundesliga games were pretty terrible. As soon as a team no longer has anything to play for they will switch off. Not even a crowd to fire them up and a lot of players probably ok with being left on the bench.
I disagree with the comparison, but if I had only one thing I could repeatedly and annoyingly point out to my future grandchildren, this would be it. Best games ever!
I'm guessing you're missing the fact that there are still 8 matches left with all title, European and relegation spots still open. They is still plenty to play for.
Yeah disagree with the comparison too, but I'm an old 8 bit kid an can say gameplay wasn't all that either back then. Go back and play Treasure Island Dizzy or one of the "classics" you will soon see how much you miss modern day "quality of life" changes to games. I talk as someone who plays a fair bit of 8 bit and 16 but games still!
Agreed I was excited to see bvb schalke but it just felt dead and I couldn't be bothered giving it my undivided attention. I'm not that motivated to watch another 10 or so games of pre season training ground intensity and feel like our LASK Game.
If we look at the fundamentals: player fitness, injuries, respect of anti infection guidelines [aside from Hertha - again], then I would say the relaunch was a success - assuming we don't get wave of positive Corona tests now of course.
The football is not as straight forward to judge. I think Dortmund and Gladbach were very crisp and looked very close to their usual form, Bayern too played with their usual dominance and confidence, but their game was more grind than spectacle, though the same could be said about their last match before the break. Cologne vs Mainz was also a match that was fairly entertaining and seemed fairly unaffected by the break.
I suspect we could see a teams who rely on athleticism and pressing suffer, because some of their success relied on creating a hectic atmosphere and using it to force out mistakes to capitalize on. As well of course as crowds helping them maintain their energy. On the other hand superior sides and technical players may find it easier, since everything is quiet and there are no fans to sigh when they pass backwards/sideways or when they try a more ambitious piece of footwork that doesn't pan out. I haven't verified this via statistics, but I also assume that fitness isn't yet at a level where the weaker teams can press relentlessly for most of the game.
The derby was a fairly good example of this. Schalke usually manage to close the gap in quality with aggression in these, as Dortmund struggle for composure and concentration. However this time around Schalke were their usual miserable self and Dortmund took them apart with clinical precision.
I think the form table is also worth a look to see the effect of Corona on the football [keep in mind: Leverkusen and Bremen have not played post break yet]:
With the exception of Hertha all teams which won/lost their games were also in good/bad shape results-wise before the break. Leipzig, too saw their form dip before the break.
I think a lot of people have unrealistic expectations, like comparing a highlight reel with an actual match. It's fairly normal for teams to accept defeat at some point and conserve some energy or protect their goal difference. E.g. Union Berlin being down 0-2 minute 80 against an in-control Bayern side, or Schalke when they haven't created an ounce of pressure all game and find themselves down three goals in Dortmund.
I can understand when people say that football isn't the same for them without the crowd noises, that they can't get immersed into the matches (maybe some international broadcasters will try the feed with mixed in fans - it got a positive reception in Germany as far as I can tell), but when I read stuff like "the football is so shit, LOL" I really wonder if people are actually capable of making the comparison between Cologne vs Mainz and your average Burnley vs Brighton match, which would be their PL counterparts.
The football is not as straight forward to judge. I think Dortmund and Gladbach were very crisp and looked very close to their usual form, Bayern too played with their usual dominance and confidence, but their game was more grind than spectacle, though the same could be said about their last match before the break. Cologne vs Mainz was also a match that was fairly entertaining and seemed fairly unaffected by the break.
I suspect we could see a teams who rely on athleticism and pressing suffer, because some of their success relied on creating a hectic atmosphere and using it to force out mistakes to capitalize on. As well of course as crowds helping them maintain their energy. On the other hand superior sides and technical players may find it easier, since everything is quiet and there are no fans to sigh when they pass backwards/sideways or when they try a more ambitious piece of footwork that doesn't pan out. I haven't verified this via statistics, but I also assume that fitness isn't yet at a level where the weaker teams can press relentlessly for most of the game.
The derby was a fairly good example of this. Schalke usually manage to close the gap in quality with aggression in these, as Dortmund struggle for composure and concentration. However this time around Schalke were their usual miserable self and Dortmund took them apart with clinical precision.
I think the form table is also worth a look to see the effect of Corona on the football [keep in mind: Leverkusen and Bremen have not played post break yet]:
With the exception of Hertha all teams which won/lost their games were also in good/bad shape results-wise before the break. Leipzig, too saw their form dip before the break.
You're making a pretty broad point, but what games are you actually talking about? Frankfurt scored a goal when they were down 0-3 and kept trying, Schalke conceded an easy counter attack, because they kept pushing forward players when 0-2 down, Mainz actually turned a 0-2 into a draw.
I think a lot of people have unrealistic expectations, like comparing a highlight reel with an actual match. It's fairly normal for teams to accept defeat at some point and conserve some energy or protect their goal difference. E.g. Union Berlin being down 0-2 minute 80 against an in-control Bayern side, or Schalke when they haven't created an ounce of pressure all game and find themselves down three goals in Dortmund.
I can understand when people say that football isn't the same for them without the crowd noises, that they can't get immersed into the matches (maybe some international broadcasters will try the feed with mixed in fans - it got a positive reception in Germany as far as I can tell), but when I read stuff like "the football is so shit, LOL" I really wonder if people are actually capable of making the comparison between Cologne vs Mainz and your average Burnley vs Brighton match, which would be their PL counterparts.
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I'm referring to the PL. What happens when City and Leicester are safely in the top 4 with no hope of catching Liverpool? Or the likes of Burnley, Everton and Palace are safe from relegation and can't get into Europe either. Are they really going to be trying? Teams rely on the crowd to get fired up for games and some of them still switch off when the season is coming to the end at the best of times.
You get similar situations every season, some teams or players will take it easy, others will say once they are on the pitch they might as well try, or for a new contract or to impress their current/future coach or club.
I doubt it's just the crowd that keeps everyone going, especially away from home.
Yep, that's it. Dortmund Schalke is meant to be one of the bigger derbies around, so if that's the benchmark, I can't imagine what others are like. I've given the games a chance, but it's just so flat.
Will just catch the goals of every game, possibly even ours if we go back to playing.
Great!
Scotland have finished their season early