Are we too pragmatic in the big games?

[TMDaines]

Newly updated!

Since that famous McTominay goal against City, the last in front of a full stadium, United have played nine games against Big 6 sides behind closed doors. United have failed to score a single non-penalty goal, scoring only three penalties in all those nine games!

It’s what is stopping us putting up a really strong challenge and setting the title pace. Can’t continue to not score in our two home games against Liverpool and then in our trips to the Emirates, the Etihad, Stamford Bridge and White Hart Lane. Gonna have to find goals in big games to win something.

 

[Fracture90]

Yes.

 

[arnie_ni]

Toothless.

 

[acnumber9]

Our central midfield is set up to stop the opposition but they aren’t that good at it. We need two midfielders.

 

[Di Maria's angel]

Far too negative in these games. We're set up not to lose.

 

[100]

I don't treat Liverpool away like the other games. A draw is a great result. We don't have the midfielders to play expansive football in a game like that

 

[lsd]

Newly updated!



It’s what is stopping us putting up a really strong challenge and setting the title pace. Can’t continue to not score in our two home games against Liverpool and then in our trips to the Emirates, the Etihad, Stamford Bridge and White Hart Lane. Gonna have to find goals in big games to win something.

We need to actually try and win if we are going to score. We are just so scared of losing every time we play in a big game

 

[NoneBmStore]

We tired Liverpool and dominated the last part of the game. Great strategy and execution, bar the horrid finishing.

 

[Zoo]

We created the best two chances in the second half to win. No complaints. Just needed more quality from Bruno and Rashford in particular.

 

[Adisa]

It's shit tbh. Have we scored against a big team this season? Ole being an attacking coach is a myth. I would love to hear his thinking behind his tactical choices in these games.

 

[Oldtraffordboy]

Look up the meaning of pragmatic.

 

[cyril C]

Our tactics in Istanbul was far more aggressive, with 9 players in the box. What do you want? Try to score 5 goals by half time?

 

[RedStarUnited]

I don't treat Liverpool away like the other games. A draw is a great result. We don't have the midfielders to play expansive football in a game like that

If our team was as depleted and had to play Matic and Scott in Defence. Best believe Liverpool would have be on our necks.

 

[stubie]

We can over analyse results like this but the encouraging thing is we’ve got better defensively since the Spurs defeat. You will gradually find in these type of games we will start to take more risks.

 

[Sylar]

If either Fred or mctominay could pass like Matic it would work

Today was a missed opportunity
First half the ball over the top was not right or Rashford was going too quick
Second half we got it right but their keeper saved them a couple of times

 

[PoTMS]

Yes. Liverpool were there for the taking in the second half. A title winning side would win against that centreback partnership which is why I think City will win it.

 

[cyberman]

We should have won 2 nil, away at Anfield.
Today isnt really the say to bump this thread.
Teams come to OT and get a 0-0 its our fault. We go to Anfield and get a 0-0...still our fault?

 

[Lee565]

At some point ole's negative mentality is going to hold us back from truly getting back on our perch.

 

[Di Maria's angel]

I don't treat Liverpool away like the other games. A draw is a great result. We don't have the midfielders to play expansive football in a game like that

Is a no crowd Anfield even the same thing?

This is the worst they've played against us in how long? Game was there for us but we weren't really interested for large parts. That said, a point is still a decent result.

 

[Kag]

In a way. McTominay and Fred aren’t good enough and it shows.

 

[Ash_G]

Not sure it was pragmatism today but definitely a miss I think to not get the win. Whilst we didn't start well I didn't think McT/Fred were the problem, the issue was the attack. Martial still lacking that drive and then Bruno/Rashford and Pogba were far, far too sloppy on the ball. Clearly there was a tactical piece in how we set up, trying to force it which I don't think was the right approach but the players let themselves down I think.

 

[mu4c_20le]

Ole got it right today, we had our chances but just couldn't take them. Trying to attack Liverpool would be suicidal as we've seen time and time again.

 

[Superunknown]

If we're being truthful, a large amount of the "big games" usually turn out to be disappointing affairs for most sides. I think on the whole, many managers are either too pragmatic or defensive in those sorts of games, which kills the spectacle. So much attacking talent in the league, yet we often never see it when they're on the pitch at the same time.

 

[100]

If our team was as depleted and had to play Matic and Scott in Defence. Best believe Liverpool would have be on our necks.

Well they're at home. And us with Matic and McTominay at CB is a completely different scenario. Fabinho is a very good CB.

We played well in the second half. You also need to account for our attack being wasteful.

 

[Random Task]

No, Ole knows what his team is about and what they're good at.

His game plan worked great today; sit in deep, soak up the pressure and hit them on the break as often as possible, then gradually venture forward more and more as the game progresses. It's worth noting that Liverpool did not create a single chance at any point in the game, while we created three.

It's not his fault his players failed to convert those chances.

 

[Majima]

Hell yes we are. I don't think Pogba and Bruno played more than 5 passes to each-other between them. I think we had something like 50~% passing accuracy in the first half from 30~% possession. 0 shots on target too.

How can we ever expect to do anything in the biggest matches playing our two most creative players so far apart from each other?

That was the single most frustrating part about us from today.

 

[Bastian]

This was a valid question when playing at home against Arsenal (against Chelsea Ole was under quite a lot of pressure, so understandable that he went mega conservative). Today though, you don't play into their hands...

 

[SER19]

Go guns blazing next week versus Liverpool see what happens I think.

 

[hasanejaz88]

Do people forget how defensive we used to be at Anfield even during our title winning seasons? If Pogba or Bruno would've scored if their chances it would've been na classic Fergie big game away performance.

If this match were at home then it would be a definite discussion point (though we have similarly been passive at home matches).

Today is not a performance to criticism. It was a good away draw that kept us in first place.

 

[Lewnited]

In the games against Chelsea, Arsenal etc definitely - however this game is a level up entirely. Playing pragmatically and gaining a point away against a Liverpool team that hasn't lost at home in four years is never bad thing. In fact aside from our time under LVG, we've always been pragmatic against title contenders away from home, I'm not sure why anyone expects otherwise

Liverpool dropping points lately has been due to them struggling against low blocks, they would have liked nothing more than for us to open up and give their wide players space to operate in.

 

[passing-wind]

This approach of adjusting everything based on the opposition will lead to inconsistencies in performance but the result today is a feasible return. I don't see us winning major silverware under Ole because of his failure to influence the team having a consistent pattern of play but the nature of the league this season is certainly ordained around the opposite. Liverpool for all their possession didn't penetrate the goal enough and us despite being so poor on the ball throughout the park had the three best chances.

This is what we are signed up for under Solskjaer, this isn't really a criticism but more of a reality check for anyone surprised by our form against the bigger clubs this season.

 

[Infra-red]

34% possession today. Sitting deep and hoping to hit teams on the break, will only get you so far.

 

[100]

Is a no crowd Anfield even the same thing?

This is the worst they've played against us in how long? Game was there for us but we weren't really interested for large parts. That said, a point is still a decent result.

Thats on the attack/midfield, not Ole. We had countless opportunities and space.

Some credit has to go to us for them being shit.

 

[James35]

We have a whopping 3 points from 15 and have scored one penalty. Plus we have played City in cup and lost, scoring none. Also we play Liverpool in cup next week so another chance to actually win a game.

The reverse 5 fixtures need to be a hell of a lot better if we have any aspirations of challenging.

 

[RUCK4444]

In a way. McTominay and Fred aren’t good enough and it shows.

This. They are partnered together to do the job of one top level DM.

Until we fix midfield with a top DM we will NOT control the game against the top sides.

We play negatively as we cannot commit to a full press (like Liverpool do) because it’s all too easy to get at our back four.

A 26 year old Matic would be perfect, not the version we have.

 

[united_99]

It's shit tbh. Have we scored against a big team this season? Ole being an attacking coach is a myth. I would love to hear his thinking behind his tactical choices in these games.

I mean he is not stupid, he must know that we lack quality in a couple of key positions but rightly he will never admit it openly.

 

[united_99]

If we continue to win most games against mid table and bottom half teams and don’t lose games against the top teams, we should be fine (in the league).

 

[mu4c_20le]

We have a whopping 3 points from 15 and have scored one penalty.

We were really good in the big games under LvG. We finished 6th.

 

[JustAGuest]

I guess it depends on your expectations today. I thought it worked pretty well and we did not concede a single clear opportunity. We also had a few chances where we could have scored. The draw was probably fair in the end. Would we have done better if we had played differently? I'm not sure.

Although from a viewing perspective I prefer a less pragmatic style.

 

[Infra-red]

If we continue to win most games against mid table and bottom half teams and don’t lose games against the top teams, we should be fine (in the league).

Yep, that approach will see you through to a top 4 finish most years.

If you want to win this league, you probably need to offer a little more than that, though. We've been better without the ball than with it for a number of years now. I'd like to see us do more in possession.