I’m sure we’ve all seen absolutely idiotic behaviour from people in professions where they’re expected to be a lot better educated than cops. The capacity for (mainly) men to be childish feckwits should never be underestimated.
The murder of Sarah Everard | Couzens sentenced to a whole-life order
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It's not just soldiers and police that's true. Wasn't there a health care professional that have gotten herself the sack last year by spouting bollocks about covid. You don't have to be a genius to know that one's views mightn't align with that of the government etc.
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Bizarre point. I've been completely brainless many times, and I'm sure you have too. And everyone else in this thread. Why would police be different?
Storm in a teacup, the whole things just a sad situation, and nothing to do with police.
Well I've posted my fair share of shit-posts but I've never mixed my work with my personal life and it isn't hard to do -- it really isn't too much to ask.
Complete side point but you can actually get 10 years in prison for attacking a statue? Jesus.
Police humour can be very dark too. But it should stay in the locker room or the pub, not be put where it can be seen like this.
It was in a private whatsapp group but I think coppers are governed by different rules so it wasn't allowed. Makes you wonder if @TheReligion could get slotted for some of the shite he posts here
That depends if the statue is deemed to be wearing something that may have encouraged any unwanted attention.
That's the wrong attitude, Trump would be proud.
In this day and age, nothing is private, hence there is some bloke whom is out of the job now.Police humour can be very dark too. But it should stay in the locker room or the pub, not be put where it can be seen like this.
It was in a private whatsapp group but I think coppers are governed by different rules so it wasn't allowed. Makes you wonder if @TheReligion could get slotted for some of the shite he posts here
Not really. They are human beings and will deal with stuff like other people do. It's unreal to expect them to be robots but we can expect them to be discreet.
Some of you people just don't live in reality it seems.
The copper loses their job. That's change right there. I don't see anyone arguing against that happening.
We should be encouraging men to move away from such "locker room chat" or keeping it in the pub to begin with.
Thats the change.
I believe that says 'rape sentences', not 'the maximum sentence for rape'. I know Starmer is not viewed in the best light, but in no way would a former director of public prosecutions misrepresent sentencing in this way. They appear to have misunderstood his tweet.
Locker room talk.
Christ on a bike.
Christ on a bike.
What a dull world that will be.
SB's right; Starmer's tweet is comparing the maximum allowable sentence for 'attacking a statue' to the average sentence for rape.
Although frankly, even if it is a slightly disingenuous comparison, it's still utterly absurd that it is at least theoretically possible to go to prison for longer for defacing a statue than for raping someone.
What a fecking country.
Have you ever engaged in such talk yourself?
Personally I'd run a mile from locker room talk. I have no appetite for that sort of stuff myself even thought I have a very dark sense of humor at times.
And to me locker room talk brings up visions of "Phoar - looks at the jugs in that one. A blond goes into a bar ....." so maybe we are talking at cross purposes.
And to me locker room talk brings up visions of "Phoar - looks at the jugs in that one. A blond goes into a bar ....." so maybe we are talking at cross purposes.
Yes. His point is that potentially you can get twice as long for defacing a statue. Which is both absurd and sends a message that we don't take rape seriously enough.
For me it's just a term to describe what blokes talk about when they are together in a variety of settings Now you and I are middle-aged so don't really do much of that anymore, but I'm sure you did in your younger days, just like I did. Now we just moan about our ailments and the cost of things.
Haven’t engaged in locker room talk in about 10 years. I’m not sure what to make of that. Certainly nothing that would be deemed unprofessional though. Probably distasteful but certainly not a sackable offence.
Actually, it would be sackable nowadays, but at the time it was so acceptable that you’d have to sack an entire branch.
Actually, it would be sackable nowadays, but at the time it was so acceptable that you’d have to sack an entire branch.
Yea sure Donald, it’d be awful if we couldn’t all quietly share vile jokes about women.
This issue comes down to the Met handling the protest terribly when the protest was sparked by one of their own being charged with rape and murder.
In terms of trusting cops I can see both sides. I know many cops and they are to a person good people. My observation would be that they are predominantly right to very far right wing which to me is a bit problematic as it often brings with it a view of various minorities that can't be helpful when dealing with those minorities amongst other things. So I'd generally trust cops under most circumstances but I'd give them close to zero trust if I was arrested for anything serious as there have been so many miscarriages of justice that I'd have little confidence of being treated fairly. I also wouldn't be too trusting if part of a protest as their treatment of protesters is highly variable.
In terms of trusting cops I can see both sides. I know many cops and they are to a person good people. My observation would be that they are predominantly right to very far right wing which to me is a bit problematic as it often brings with it a view of various minorities that can't be helpful when dealing with those minorities amongst other things. So I'd generally trust cops under most circumstances but I'd give them close to zero trust if I was arrested for anything serious as there have been so many miscarriages of justice that I'd have little confidence of being treated fairly. I also wouldn't be too trusting if part of a protest as their treatment of protesters is highly variable.
Are you talking about British cops? To be honest, I’ve been on both sides of the law and I can’t recall them ever being cnuts. Maybe I was lucky enough though.
It sounds like the copper would have been grassed up by somebody in the Whatsapp group, presumably another copper, so that's progress too.
Yes, yes I have. And now I recognize that things ive said and joked about in the past were wrong, hypocritical, so now I listen and learn and aim to do better.
Yourself?
That’s what almost certainly happened.
Regarding progress, I only notice it in hindsight. Now that I think about it, a lot of shit that was said only a decade ago, would now be completely unacceptable.
I can only imagine what it’s like for folk that are in their late 40’s early 50’s and in a work place. Must be a totally different place in terms of what’s appropriate.
British, US and Australian. Not truly terrible but not great (occasionally) in recent years.
In the 80's I had far less trust partly due to their often terrible behavior when policing football matches and also because my wife is from NI and used to live next door to a terrorism suspect. We got used to being harassed when coming in or out of the country (UK) and her brothers occasionally got arrested for no apparent reason and then released (as they hated terrorists on both sides and would have nothing to do with them), again when studying in the UK.
Think I've said this a few times on here over the past year but stuff like this is just making me feel as detached from the left as I do from the right. THe left seems to have descended into daft angry hypocrasy.
Firstly, at the risk of sounding controversial, I've seen a LOT of posts on social media along the lines of "men you need to sort yourself out", "why isn't there a curfew on men being allowed out", "Just because you don't do it doesn't mean you aren't to blame"....Blaming "men" for the fact a man murdered a woman or even for the fact sexual assault is obviously a big problem, is the same logic as blaming "Muslims" for the fact terrorism exists or saying "black people need to sort themselves out" if there's a stabbing involving a black person. It's ignorant and stupid and extremely counter productive, and also obviously incorrect. The idea of protesting or arguing a cause is to unite people behind it to bring about change. You don't unite people to your cause by immediately tarring all of them as the enemy. That's what a villain in a comic book does. When did supposedly intelligent people start defaulting to this line of reasoning so easily? It seems to happen every time there is something to be outraged about.
I'm not saying women suffering from sexual assault or idiotic behaviour from men isn't a big problem, because it is. I've witnessed it enough times and I'm not even a woman...but that's why its important to come up with productive ways of uniting people to want to do something about it. I don't feel inspired to do something about anything if I baselessly get accused of being one of the people causing the problem. Its just going to make me defensive and think the person accusing me must be an idiot, and even if I did want to help it would be very difficult for me to when I've already been branded as the problem rather than a potential part of the solution.
Secondly, all these protests. I'm all for protesting and protecting our right to protest, but there is a worldwide pandemic going on. Pandemics aren't political, they just kill people. So, I'm not saying no one should protest, but you'd think there'd have to be a pretty compelling reason to justify a protest. Something like children being at risk of starving to death, or innocent people being at risk of dying because the government wont properly fund the health service or listen to their own scientists, would be examples of current, actually important issues. Over the past year we've had protests about statues, protests about people protesting about statues, protests about being allowed to protest, people burying themselves in a tunnel under a train line because they don't like trains, protests about men being nasty, protests about police being nasty. There was even an anti-France protest outside my work. I mean I can't see my own family but I could go march about with thousands of people if I decided I don't like the shape of a toblerone bar or something. Give over and get some perspective surely? What positives have any of these protests brought about? The main thing they've done is allowed the government to pass legislation and propose more legislation that will make it easier for the police to whack you over the head with sticks the next time you go to a protest. We'll end up with riots over something trivial unless one side of the fence starts acting with a bit of sense.
Firstly, at the risk of sounding controversial, I've seen a LOT of posts on social media along the lines of "men you need to sort yourself out", "why isn't there a curfew on men being allowed out", "Just because you don't do it doesn't mean you aren't to blame"....Blaming "men" for the fact a man murdered a woman or even for the fact sexual assault is obviously a big problem, is the same logic as blaming "Muslims" for the fact terrorism exists or saying "black people need to sort themselves out" if there's a stabbing involving a black person. It's ignorant and stupid and extremely counter productive, and also obviously incorrect. The idea of protesting or arguing a cause is to unite people behind it to bring about change. You don't unite people to your cause by immediately tarring all of them as the enemy. That's what a villain in a comic book does. When did supposedly intelligent people start defaulting to this line of reasoning so easily? It seems to happen every time there is something to be outraged about.
I'm not saying women suffering from sexual assault or idiotic behaviour from men isn't a big problem, because it is. I've witnessed it enough times and I'm not even a woman...but that's why its important to come up with productive ways of uniting people to want to do something about it. I don't feel inspired to do something about anything if I baselessly get accused of being one of the people causing the problem. Its just going to make me defensive and think the person accusing me must be an idiot, and even if I did want to help it would be very difficult for me to when I've already been branded as the problem rather than a potential part of the solution.
Secondly, all these protests. I'm all for protesting and protecting our right to protest, but there is a worldwide pandemic going on. Pandemics aren't political, they just kill people. So, I'm not saying no one should protest, but you'd think there'd have to be a pretty compelling reason to justify a protest. Something like children being at risk of starving to death, or innocent people being at risk of dying because the government wont properly fund the health service or listen to their own scientists, would be examples of current, actually important issues. Over the past year we've had protests about statues, protests about people protesting about statues, protests about being allowed to protest, people burying themselves in a tunnel under a train line because they don't like trains, protests about men being nasty, protests about police being nasty. There was even an anti-France protest outside my work. I mean I can't see my own family but I could go march about with thousands of people if I decided I don't like the shape of a toblerone bar or something. Give over and get some perspective surely? What positives have any of these protests brought about? The main thing they've done is allowed the government to pass legislation and propose more legislation that will make it easier for the police to whack you over the head with sticks the next time you go to a protest. We'll end up with riots over something trivial unless one side of the fence starts acting with a bit of sense.
Such a reaction belies a sense of guilt. We don't need to let such statements bother us. Acknowledge that the problem is systemic and support changing the way things are.
edit: it doesn't mean one is guilty of anything but subconsciously our brains can wrestle with the accusation. Nothing riles people up like a false accusation, repeated, even an innocuous one.
they're female.
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Right? But but but, they needed to be together to cry a bit and mourn someone they didnt even know, because, you know, she was middle class, and they're middle class too, so they're entitled.
Meanwhile my wife buried her father a month ago today with 10 people at the funeral, no husbands there to support her sisters, none of his grandkids there to say goodbye to their grandfather. No nephews, nieces or friends.
That’s pretty terrible experience to be fair. I know a fair few cops as well so it might make me more bias towards them.
Surely this opens up a whole new can of worms, like should people like Frankie Boyle and Jimmy Carr be allowed to earn a living in the manner they do? Should shows like Always Sunny In Philadelphia and American Dad be allowed on telly?
Still amazes me how many police bootlickers there are on here.
Probably a big overlap between those and the people that don’t think this vigil was necessary etc.
Probably a big overlap between those and the people that don’t think this vigil was necessary etc.
I wonder what Ismail Mohamed Abdulwahab’s family think about this, a year after his burial where none of his family could attend. Or indeed anyone whom experienced similar.
Never mind the family, we need to consider the feelings of those, who, OK, they might not have known him, but felt they were entitled to mourn him, regardless of if they'd been asked not to.
The risks of Covid infection are much smaller outdoors. If everyone wears a mask they should be able to protest safely with the cooperation of the police.
I personally think these protests are important and should to be allowed. It's not just about grieving for Sarah, it's about showing solidarity for all women and striving towards a society where sexual assault is not something all women live in fear of. They are having similar protests in Australia right now after a cabinet member was accused of rape.
It's a murky subject though and I don't know if I'm right or wrong. Who gets to decide what protest is valid or not? To me the vaccine protests are ridiculous but for those people it's an important topic.
I personally think these protests are important and should to be allowed. It's not just about grieving for Sarah, it's about showing solidarity for all women and striving towards a society where sexual assault is not something all women live in fear of. They are having similar protests in Australia right now after a cabinet member was accused of rape.
It's a murky subject though and I don't know if I'm right or wrong. Who gets to decide what protest is valid or not? To me the vaccine protests are ridiculous but for those people it's an important topic.