Not really
Manchester United sign Raphael Varane! (not in time for Leeds)
- Thread starter RonaldoVII
- Start date
-
In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik (@Rood) was joined by comedian Ali Woods to look back at the best and worst moments of a rollercoaster season with the annual United Hour Awards.
Has Ten Hag been sacked yet? We're not sure and we hope not, but it's looking more likely as the days pass.
Who should replace him and why is it taking so long to make a decision?
- Status
Eh? Isn't honesty meant to be the truth?
Lindelof was better than Maguire first half of the season. Maguire had the better season come may but not by much. They were both very prone to mistakes. Multiple clips of both of them being clowns last season.
He was not. That said Lindelof is someone we should be looking to keep 100%, he and Maguire now both have a great partner if the other is out for whatever reason. Varane’s pace and aerial ability would suit Lindelof and Maguire like a glove. Signing Varane is just generally very good squad management.
You're exaggerating. Maguire had a torrid start to the season but turned it around relatively quickly (definitely not "first half"), and then went on to have a very high standard consistent season. Lindelof wasn't as bad as some are making out but he had a few high profile errors and wasn't as consistent as Harry. The latter had a great season overall, was a serious contender for being in the PL team of the season, and we definitely missed him in the EL final.
According to Talksport and certain Jamie O'Hara, whoever that is, Varane is slow and he got destroyed by Chelsea in CL.
I agree with you here. Lindelof was not as bad as a lot of people like to make out and Maguire was not as good as a lot of people make out. Both were solid but both made a good few errors. I’m not sure Varane has a transformative effect on our defence but what he does give us is recovery speed in behind and he is used to playing with an over aggressive partner so reads the game well and covers for their misses.
So on paper it should be solid but we’ll have to see. Hopefully Jones is let go now and Tuanzebe gets a loan. Although if Bailly goes I would think we need to keep Tuanzebe then. MCT looked semi decent playing in a back 3 for Scotland so maybe in an emergency he could do a job at CB.
I genuinely haven’t seen much of Varane but I did see a lot of Vidic and he had some stinkers against Liverpool in particular. Jamie O’hara is playing up to everyone that isn’t a United fan by bringing up his worst bits. I’m not worried.
Of course
He was and always is, a weak liability at CB.
This is the balance here. Maguire is very overrated here and it will only continue after his exceptional Euros performance. They just despise Lindelof because he is poor in the air, very weak and not aggressive enough for a top level defender. Yes it sounds very bad but he has had many exceptional performances last season also. Im not delusional enough to think Lindelof is better than Maguire but he is not the weakness Cafe makes him out to be. He offers great support when we need to build out the back. Something he did alone earlier in the season when Maguire would only make predictable passes towards Shaw. Maguire was only confident with his passing second half of the season.
What Varane offers over Lindelof is aerial ability and strength which is a lot considering all the silly setpieces we get bullied over.
Lindelof is decent but he isn't at a high enough level generally and his weaknesses really get exposed as Maguires partner, but also mainly in the premier league. You just can't be a top CB if you're weak physically and in the air like he is. Excellent as a 3rd choice option though.
Disagree with Maguire being overrated, he's a top defender IMO but he'll be even better with a quicker CB like Varane, one who can also handle himself in the air and in physical duels. You won't see us get bullied at the back anymore, and Varane's recovery pace is a huge asset to cover for Maguire.
This is just objectively not true - and was further highlighted when Maguire was out injured too.
Lindelof plays better next to Maguire because Maguire carries so much defensive burden on his shoulders that means Lindelof has a much easier go at it (yet he still makes multiple mistakes) without a more dominant defender next to him, Lindelof becomes much more exposed.
Yes I agree he's a good option off the bench, but we have to stop saying things like 'he can play the ball' as a reason to have a defender in the side - he's a defender first and foremost and his defensive ability is what we're criticising here.
Lindelof isn't exactly Nesta with the ball at his feet either, he shits himself when put under the slightest bit of pressure and can't dribble his way out of trouble.
Pro tip for everyone out there.
Start the playback speed at normal, then ramp it up to 1.25, 1.5 and finally 1.75, for an absolute Champions League Varane festival!
Personally I think it’s something to do with many being stuck in the past where being an aggressive lump at the back was all you needed and many still view that as being the main criteria for a defender.
Nothing irks me more when you see people in the performance thread or match thread saying Lindelof is scared and all he does is back off. Sorry to tell them but they are going to see the same thing from Varane. This is just modern defending. Lindelof can and will be aggressive when it’s the best choice of action as will Varane but backing off is sometimes the best course of action to delay a striker till others can get in to position or you can make a move.
I’m certainly not going to say Lindelof was perfect, he certainly had moments where for me he should have been a lot stronger and and not bullied off the ball but generally I find his positioning much better than Maguires who I don’t know why but gets himself in some right muddles just with his over eagerness to win the ball. Just physically he is a lot stronger.
Not at all & its incredibly reductive to assume this too.
Lindelof doesn't need to be an 'aggressive lump', nor am I expecting him to thrash into people - my favourite defender of all time is Rio, so I understand and appreciate a defender who isn't tackle first, but rather reads the game, and is clever with his positioning and selective with his interceptions.
Lindelof just isn't good enough - he gets bullied off the ball, doesn't have the pace to recover, doesn't have the aerial skills to challenge, his tackling is good to average depending on his starting position, there's nothing good enough about his game that is good enough to offset the bad things. People mention his ball skills and you'd assume he was pinging balls all over the park, and laying it on a plate for our attackers every match - he's nowhere close to that. He'll play one or two cute passes here and there when he's in acres of space, and I remember some good over the top balls in the latter half of the season too, that's about it.
Lindelof is a passive defender in every sense of the word imo, he needs to be next to someone who is more dominant, (I don't mean that to be 'aggressive' either) authoritative and has leadership skills because Lindelof doesn't have those characteristics - which is why him being 3rd choice suits him.
This is still mental. Can't believe we have actively gone out and got two top class players, for two positions that we needed to strengthen, before the season starts.
So many transfer windows of panic buying, buying big name players for the sake of it and square pegs in round holes etc, to this.
Beyond happy.
So many transfer windows of panic buying, buying big name players for the sake of it and square pegs in round holes etc, to this.
Beyond happy.
Hopefully playing next to Varane improves Maguire’s game.
Lindelof's problem isnt that he backs of sometimes to wait for a good position to defend, his problem is he often get outmuscled or barged of like he's made of paper.
My goodness. What you been watching mate?
Couldn't agree more with this post. Perhaps people don't watch United enough or they look at Lindelof through rose-tinted glasses. He has been part of or at complete fault for so many goals this season. He plays in defence, therefore, he needs to be good at defending primarily. Which he isn't.
As you mentioned, people talk about his ball/passing skills. Firstly, isn't that meant to be a midfielders job? Secondly, does Lindelof actually play any incredible balls that split the opponents team? No.
Has Lindelof had any 'dominating' performances? None that I can remember off of the top of my head. It's crazy how a lot of people bash Fred & McTominay, when to me it's clear as day that Lindelof is the weakest link in our team. Even Fred has some games where he's the MOTM.
I'm personally ecstatic that we've managed to upgrade Lindelof with Varane, it'll make the world of difference to our team. Anyone that disagree's is crazy in my eyes
I think Axel will be knocking on that door if he is not loaned out. He has the potential to be better than both Lindelof and Bailly.
Lindelof makes 10x more mistakes than Maguire, many that leading to conceding goals.
Maguire has needed a higher level partner. Varane sitting in the hole while Harry attacks the ball/or steps higher up the pitch is exactly what we've needed.
We can now play higher up the pitch and not fear being countered as much as with the Maguire/Lindelof partnership.
It's also the mentality Varane brings.
I don't entirely disagree with your post, but i wanna pick you up on this bit. Do you remember having Smalling at CB? It's really important that CBs can pass, otherwise we basically can't build attacks, as our cbs panic under pressure and blast the ball off for a throw in every time. And secondly, Lindelof definitely got a couple of assists last season playing perfect long balls. Here's one against Granada -
So it's just untrue to say Lindelof doesn't play incredible balls that split the defence.
He's actually had few games were he was outstanding AC Milan last season at the San Siro he was blocking everything.
the touches and takedowns by rashford and junior were more impressive than the passes
Isn’t he flying in today to quarantine and have his medical early next week?
Still hasn’t quite sunk in…. On paper we now have one of, if not the the best back 4 in Europe.
Last edited:
Oh come on, if you think that then there's no such thing as a good long pass. Lindelof passes through the whole team and lands the ball on Rashford's foot. What more are you looking for from a good long pass?
Let's say he made 3 assists all season, but he was the reason for conceding 10 goals. Does his passing 'suffice' at that point? In my opinion, no.
Smalling was an exception, he couldn't pass a ball, yet he was quite good at one on one defending. Even then, he wasn't good enough for Man Utd & he's off and out on his merry way.
I'm not disagreeing that Lindelof needs to be benched cos he's hesitant, slow and weak in the air. I was just taking issue with whoever it was who said Lindelof never plays defence-splitting passes. Give him his due, his long passing is really good, even if most other aspects of his game aren't.
not discounting the long pass at all as they dropped them on a dime but impressive how both players took the ball down on the full sprint while under big pressure
those long balls by both guys were impressive more so than long balls where guys are just hitting the big diagonal switch to a wide open player
I don't think anybody said he never plays defence splitting passes, I believe the conversation was that it's not as though he's playing them often enough to justify his weaknesses.
He's been here 3(?) seasons, and it's not as though we turn to him to help us build out play from the back because his ball playing skills are that superior, far from it actually.
Is he here yet? Anyone checking the flights?
The quote I originally posted did
Oh yeah, absolutely. I'm always amazed when someone manages a straight long ball past the CBs, but 9/10 times the striker fecks the touch and the chance is gone
Ole will need to rotate the squad more this season, he can't continue to just run the starting eleven into the ground every week and then expect a fresh team come semi-finals time.
So i'm wondering what a Varane/Lindelof partnership looks like.
So i'm wondering what a Varane/Lindelof partnership looks like.
that's very frustrating for a CB when that happens as you start to second guess whether to play that ball again or not
Some have said Ole might go with a back 5 and not bench Lidof if that happens I will be fuming! Surely its not going to happen ?
And so they did, my bad.
It will all mean nothing if we don't fix the midfield problem. We are still destined to play 4-2-3-1 with McFred and we will fail again. We need 4-3-3 but with Rashford and Martial out and possibly Pogba, I'm just a little worried. We need another quality midfield playmaker.
Maybe I've got it all wrong.
Maybe I've got it all wrong.
- Status