Lindelof is a centre back. He will have to battle it out with other centre-backs for a place in the first eleven. There are better options at the club to play the DM role.
Lindelof - new DM?
- Thread starter Mylock
- Start date
I remember hating this idea, but I'm starting to come round to at least wanting to see it tried.
It might be the no-defensive-midfielder desperation talking, but he does have a few qualities that make it interesting: he reads the game very well, he's a good passer - under pressure and through the lines, he's mobile enough and a good ball carrier.
It'd just be nice to have a player who plays the position intelligently instead of running around pressuring everything that moves, chasing every ball, overcommitting and rolling the dice on 'will I win this crazy 30/70 slide tackle or will I completely take myself out of the game' 5 times a match.
We had some really successful position changes under Fergie. Fabinho started out as a RB/CB. Plenty of others too.
It might be the no-defensive-midfielder desperation talking, but he does have a few qualities that make it interesting: he reads the game very well, he's a good passer - under pressure and through the lines, he's mobile enough and a good ball carrier.
It'd just be nice to have a player who plays the position intelligently instead of running around pressuring everything that moves, chasing every ball, overcommitting and rolling the dice on 'will I win this crazy 30/70 slide tackle or will I completely take myself out of the game' 5 times a match.
We had some really successful position changes under Fergie. Fabinho started out as a RB/CB. Plenty of others too.
Please no. He's finally where he should be - on the bench.
After that Pogba-Fred CM pairing, i don't mind if we try this out.
Move him into midfield so he can get bullied off the ball there instead? Nah, we’re alright.
He’s a good third choice central defender. That’s his job now.
He’s a good third choice central defender. That’s his job now.
If you don't try it then you won't know it. Matic and Fred always get bullied off the ball. Lindelof is quicker than both of them and has much better ball control and passing than Fred. He can't run non stop like Fred though.
So we are moaning that Fred and Scott are not CDMs but are CMs yet we want to turn a defender into one.....
Actually think the best pure DM at the club is still Phil Jones. Played there multiple times under Saf including against real madrid.
Sad thing is, you're probably right.
We're getting desperate.
It really is sad as obviously it shows how inept we are in the position
Surely can't be worse than fred atm ? Atleast he'd be defensively better.
I was always against this idea. Then the game vs Wolverhampton happened.
I wouldn't mind giving it a try. He seems clever with his positioning (can't tell if it'll be the same in midfield), decent on the ball and good passing. It surely wouldn't be anything spectacular but we really need some options.
I wouldn't mind giving it a try. He seems clever with his positioning (can't tell if it'll be the same in midfield), decent on the ball and good passing. It surely wouldn't be anything spectacular but we really need some options.
Jones was a bulterier if I remember. A bit like Fred but stronger and faster. I don't consider him as a professional footballer these days.
Hell yeah
I don't think it's as far-fetched as some people are making out, sadly people want shop-bought answers which they see work in other teams or what looks great in a video game.
Most people wouldn't realize:
- Pep during his playing time was a RW, converted into a very good DM by Cryuff (this is why I believe Pep tinkers so much as a manager).
- Gareth Barry went from LB to DM
- Pirlo went from CAM to DM
- Matic went from CAM to DM
Our fanbase is one of the worst at letting our gaffer try things as witnessed by some of the responses you've been getting, people believe you buy big for every position. Some people believe right now that Rice is an upgrade on Scot Mctominay and they are going to be in for a rude awakening if that was to ever happen.
There are on-the-ball arguments for Lindeloff in midfield, however, he makes me nervous when he's pressured physically - but I would love to see Ole try him there for a few games cause his passing is truly up there IMO.
(I have copied this part of my response from another thread)
Everyone would probably disagree with me here, but, before Varane the only other CB I watched get pressed and deal with it is Bailly. Now admittedly he gives me a heart attack doing so, with the chest controls, stepovers, and ball rolls. But he does deal with the press well albeit it's high risk (Ndombele for Spurs is one of the most press resistant players I've seen live and I see similarities with how he and Bailly deal with the press). Defensively Bailly is tenacious enough (he engages opposition very similar to Ndidi, Bailly would never have suffered Fred's fate with Trincao and Adama) but the issue would be can he learn the discipline in that role. He would be a water carrier at best admittedly, and really be only there to recover and distribute (5 - 15 yard passes), I can imagine after a few games - if successfully identified by opposition coaches as press resistant he could be the one opposition allow time on the ball - as they mark his passing options and lanes, as they will see his limited passing range as a non-threat, that's when marauding runs by Maguire and passing range of Varane could be utilized; I suppose Bailly would have to improve on his range as well. This is all conjecture and guesswork (like any brand new signing) and I'm not saying it would work but we certainly have a squad to experiment.
I believe our current CB pairing would be forgiving enough to an experiment of Lindeloff or Bailly, I mean it forgave that unfortunate performance by Fred.
Does our fanbase have the patience to allow experimentation? Does our manager have the courage? (I'm fiercely Ole in btw, always have been).
The top managers try things, the problem is our fanbase, doesn't give our manager the time to try things in-game, it's really disappointing. A lot of the other managers can try what they want, if it's not a success it's not an indictment of the manager and their fanbase doesn't go into public meltdown online.
- I've seen Pep, play Fernandinho CB and Gundogan false nine.
- Klopp has played Milner full-back and midfield
- I'm still not entirely sure what role Chilwell was doing in that Madrid second leg last season but it was genius by Tuchel.
- I've seen Oshea and the Da Silva twins in our midfield back in the day by SAF.
- https://ibb.co/b71nNTf
No squad is ever perfect, but our squad is pretty close to it (especially with Ronaldo).
This season is where I hope Ole proves me right, that he is the man for the job. He should just ignore the fanbase and just try things. We have the squad for that.
You don't think he doesn't? If Lindelof shows any promise in training as a DM he will get a shot there. If not, he simply doesn"t have what it takes to play in midfield.
Don't understand this obsession with shoehorning in Lindelof, he hasn't really lit up the sky while being with us. He's rightly on the bench, where he should be imo.
No, feck, this is a stupid idea.
I've only seen one defender recently who could do a job at DM and that was Marquinhos, it's not a simple switch, especially with the rest of the personnel in midfield at United.
I don't think this idea being bad is about open mindedness to the idea, he just isn't good enough on the ball. It shouldn't be underestimated how difficult it is to play in midfield against the press.
We tried this with Rio and it was horrific and he was a lovely player on the ball. Different players, different times - but it does show how hard it is to do as a CB. Lindelof is competent, good for a CB, but within central midfielder terms he would be considered pretty weak technically in my opinion.
We tried this with Rio and it was horrific and he was a lovely player on the ball. Different players, different times - but it does show how hard it is to do as a CB. Lindelof is competent, good for a CB, but within central midfielder terms he would be considered pretty weak technically in my opinion.
When you say he isn't good enough on the ball which standard are you using? I just hope you aren't thinking of Carrick, Keane or Fernandinho and concluding he isn't good enough when our current starting CM fails to execute 5 yard passes. The metric we should use is would he be a better option than Matic or Fred. When you say Rio failed, yes it was horrendous but Ole doesn't have the luxury of a Keane or Carrick to fall back on, he has Fred, Matic and McT.
Rice is a CB moved DM, before that Eric Dier was moved from CB to DM for a few seasons and for a while even considered the best DM in the league.
At this point we might have to give it a try either him or Bailly 
Lindelof is in his rightful place, on the bench, should be nowhere near the DM position. Just like Fred shouldn't be near the LB position and Shaw LW position like the previous position change threads suggested.
Can't believe there are people considering it for real. CM is a whole different level of ability on the ball. The awareness needed, the touch, the simple passing, the positioning to receive the ball..... Sigh.
You've seen him play as a DM?
David Luiz, Alaba, Pepe when doing hacking job under Mou, Kimmich, Lahm. And that's just recent players.
It's not to a particular standard as we have no direct means of determining whether he would be good in comparison to the aforementioned players, it is based on educated guesswork and the attributes we see at centre back. That is always going to be the basis for which a manager might think about changing a players position, and obviously through assessment in training. We don't know with certainty until it's experimented with but here we're just giving opinions.
It's not so much that a DM has to be Carrick or Scholes, it's that Lindelof for me is not even in the stratosphere of being suited to it.
He is fairly slow at finding his man from centre back where the whole game is in front of you and the majority of passes are lateral and less pressured than receiving the ball in midfield. He dilly dallies a lot. I also think playing in midfield calls into question a player's touch a lot more as you take it facing your own goal and directly confronted, you usually have a few yards at least to make decisions at CB.
I think his phsyical abilities would be under question as he lacks dynamism in the defensive areas, he would have to cover a lot of ground and track creative players more directly even if we play him as the archetypal DM. Currently he struggles with this when he is exposed to it, yet he is covered. In this situation he IS the initial cover. That concerns me.
I just don't really see it to be honest, it's the sort of thing that would probably cross my mind in training as a manager, you would always be looking for ways to best use the players, especially relative to weak positions, but it seems an incredible long shot.
I was thinking Phil Jones.
For that you need a manager like Sir Alex and Klopp, not a PE teacher.
Yes, all those switches were a while back though, I mentioned Marquinhos because he did it just a year and a half ago as a stop-gap solution to a problem position similar to United right now (still a problem position to this day too) and doing the job despite being clearly a better CB. Of course it's definitely happened before, I just didn't think those above are still considered recent but that's subjective, I guess.
In regards to Lindelof, he's not as good as any of the names mentioned, but then again Fred was so terrible last game that I can understand someone even thinking of this, even if I agree with the general sentiment that wouldn't work out.
I think you are expecting too much, no one is saying that if Lindelof plays DM he will be Carrick reincarnated but the question here at United is after our refusal to sign a DM can Lindelof be a better option for the role than Matic, Scott and Fred? That's the only thing we need to consider because all three do what you have mentioned above and worse, none amongst them is a particularly good passer, Fred likes quick passes but messes them up a lot, Scot hides from his partner and his passing is meh. At least Lindelof can defend across the ground, he can pass through the lines and has a good touch. The rest we won't know until it has been tried and we do need to try it afyer what we have seen against Southampton and Wolves.
You lot all slag Fred but his mobility has been a great asset for us in many games. Lindelof would be a big lump in holding midfield.
He'd be twice as good as matic.. but yes, I really rate Fred. He may make some mistakes, but his work rate and tackling is really, really good.
I’ll be alone but I think Shaw would make a good DM
Would take a lot away from what he offers on the flank and we should never do it. I just think he would be good there
Would take a lot away from what he offers on the flank and we should never do it. I just think he would be good there
I want this idea to die a quick death, but I understand that those who don't listen, must feel.
He can't be worse than Fred or Matic so I don't see why not. Worth a shot.
Positionally he's good, unlike Fred. He stays on his feet, unlike Fred. He's fairly mobile, unlike Matic. He's not terrified of the ball, unlike Fred. And his long passing to Rashford and Bruno especially has been excellent for years.
Positionally he's good, unlike Fred. He stays on his feet, unlike Fred. He's fairly mobile, unlike Matic. He's not terrified of the ball, unlike Fred. And his long passing to Rashford and Bruno especially has been excellent for years.
This sounds crazy. He's nothing like Carrick and lacks positional awareness already
Rice, Kimmich, Lahm, Mascherano to name a few. It's the intelligence of the player that counts being able to read the game. Fred struggles because he doesn't read the midfield area well enough to shield the defence. Rice suits Ole's management and this team very well tactically.
Not this again. Complete Football Manager logic.
FFS no get out of here with this shit. However, going three at the back to make the midfield less important could be an option.