Piling in on new players: when did this become acceptable?

[Fortitude]

Seeing it more and more the past couple of seasons.

This used to holy ground - the settling in/ grace period. At least a season. Now? A game or two and they're fair game?

What kind of madness has taken hold of the fanbase for this to be acceptable?

 

[mu4c_20le]

Thats the modern fan for you.

 

[Ish]

Players written off before they’ve even kicked a ball for us, yeah! Then using the first 2 matches to prove they’ve been right all along. It’s all a little silly.

 

[meamth]

Martinez wasn't even really at fault for yesterday's shambolic performance. Confusing take from the pundits and fans.

 

[Cassidy]

Players written off before they’ve even kicked a ball for us, yeah! Then using the first 2 matches to prove they’ve been right all along. It’s all a little silly.

People have far more interest in being “right” than being fans

 

[crossy1686]

Seeing it more and more the past couple of seasons.

This used to holy ground - the settling in/ grace period. At least a season. Now? A game or two and they're fair game?

What kind of madness has taken hold of the fanbase for this to be acceptable?

We started signing players based on whichever manager is currently in charge fancies, which almost included Arnautovic. There’s zero trust in the players being brought in will actually improve anything because the manager hasn’t earned trust yet.

 

[Ish]

People have far more interest in being “right” than being fans

That, on an Internet forum no less! You’re 100% spot on.

 

[thegregster]

You can tell pretty quickly if a player is good enough. Only a handful of players have ever recovered from a bad start. Also with an attacking player you can tell very quickly. Its why I knew Sancho wasn't going to cut it after 4-5 games.

 

[JPRouve]

People have far more interest in being “right” than being fans

That's pretty much it. People don't do when it's about a player that they wanted/rated.

 

[ThanksBoss26]

Agree, annoys the hell out of me.

 

[Lecland07]

It is pretty stupid - the team is complete trash and new signings are going to have an incredibly tough time to integrate.

Outside the youth players, Varane, Sancho, Martinez, Eriksen, Malacia are the only players that deserve to get a proper chance. The conditions are too bad to make any conclusions on them.

 

[Sylar]

New players going into a shit team never helps when it's one or two

We really needed half a first team to elevate the good potential we have
Instead the one or two new signings will see their levels drop to the complete shit that's there rather than them elevating the rest

Tbf Bruno helped our team those six months he came in and we really should have beaten Sevilla in the semi finals with all the chances we had.

It's really hard to blame the five or six new players we purchased in the last twelve months

 

[Trequarista10]

It's just frustrations boiling over. ETH is getting it too. Criticism is fine and merited imo, when it's in the form of analysis. Have seen a couple posts calling ETH a bald cnut though, which I think is extremely immature and petulant, especially at this stage of his United career. Haven't seen anyone saying anything personal about Martinez other than fair criticism of the tactical logic of a 5'9" CB, and some light hearted height jokes. I have seen a few people referring to Eriksen as "past it player who nearly died last year" in the context of belittling him/his transfer, which I also find pretty fatuous and in bad taste. It's the natural progression from referring to our players by the club they used to play for (former Hull defender, Southampton left back etc).

 

[Robbie Boy]

New players and the new manager being written off after two games. It really is quite something on here at the minute.

 

[Leftback99]

Questioning the decision to buy a player or throwing them into games they aren't ready for isn't the same as 'piling in on' the player themselves.

 

[IrishRedDevil]

Sky commentators started the narrative during Martinez’s first game.

 

[youmeletsfly]

Martinez wasn't even really at fault for yesterday's shambolic performance. Confusing take from the pundits and fans.

Most of the shit is stirred by idiots like Rio and Gary. Everything generates clicks and social media presence this day and, unfortunately, it's more important to them than accurate and fair journalism.

 

[harms]

Yeah, it's insane. Criticising their performance on a given day is fine but making long-term assessments, especially given the situation, is the definition of knee-jerk reaction.

Is it possible that Martinez won't be able to adapt to Premier League? Sure. But he was always going to have an adaptation period and he couldn't have asked for worse starting conditions. Same goes for Eriksen, who has played for us in 2 roles that he had never (false 9) and barely ever (holding midfielder) played before. And don't get me started on ten Hag

 

[NinjaFletch]

I think after 9 years people are largely fed up and don't feel the need to engage in the honeymoon period where we pretend obvious problems with players don't exist.

Martinez (who this thread is clearly about as I've heard no significant issues highlited with Malacia and Eriksen) clearly has a significant challenge in terms of his height which he will have to overcome in order to succeed in this league. Pretending that doesn't exist doest mean that the challenge goes away. We're just skipping the 3 months where certain posters insist the sky is green until they, under duress, admit that it was in fact blue all along.

Martinez may or may not overcome the issue of his being fecking tiny, but whatever the result it will have nothing to do with whatever worries people air on redcafe, or cause other teams to notice how small he is when they otherwise wouldn't have.

 

[Rams]

People have far more interest in being “right” than being fans

Absolutely, and we’re all guilty of it.

 

[Lay]

The problem isn’t piling in on new players but it’s spotting the obvious. Every team we face will target Martinez, it’s obvious. Whenever we play Fulham, Mitrovic will target Martinez. The question is, what do the club and Martinez do to overcome it.

A lot of the time, posters give credit to players for months/years before realising that the criticism was valid.

 

[r1z3mu]

Agree, that two games is not enough when it's 18-21 year old. When players are 24-25 and not performing generally it's not a good sign. Do you all remember first two games of Mkhitaryan, Lindelof, Sanchez? You can say Lindelof recovered but never became a force in MU. As for others we were counting days when they are gone.

So we will see but as of now signs are not good.

 

[Rams]

Most of the shit is stirred by idiots like Rio and Gary. Everything generates clicks and social media presence this day and, unfortunately, it's more important to them than accurate and fair journalism.

Also true. In the case of Neville it’s terrible because there’s too many topics where he opens his big gob yet clearly hasn’t done any research despite being paid a ridiculous amount of money by Sky. He may know a lot about the club and the ownership, but his knowledge about the players in the EPL and European leagues is almost as embarrassing as yesterday’s performance at Brentford.

 

[Brwned]

People have far more interest in being “right” than being fans

Yep. Plus people are frustrated watching the team at the mo so they come on here to feel better, sometimes by venting, sometimes by showing how right they were.

 

[hobbers]

Nobody with half a brain would be piling into Eriksen or Martinez after yesterday.

Martinez shouldnt be playing in a back 2 against sides like Brentford away from home. Definitely not in his second match and paired with the giant slug that is Maguire.

Eriksen was made to look a mug but the fault of the second goal is 100% on De Gea for giving it to someone fully marked.

 

[Rams]

The problem isn’t piling in on new players but it’s spotting the obvious. Every team we face will target Martinez, it’s obvious. Whenever we play Fulham, Mitrovic will target Martinez. The question is, what do the club and Martinez do to overcome it.

A lot of the time, posters give credit to players for months/years before realising that the criticism was valid.

It will probably confuse Mitrovic whether to target Maguire or Martinez…

Actually, neither Brighton or Brentford specifically targeted Martinez l.

 

[Lay]

It will probably confuse Mitrovic whether to target Maguire or Martinez…

Actually, neither Brighton or Brentford specifically targeted Martinez l.

I think the narrative is being set though, wrongly or rightly. Remember when DDG was signed and apparently he had the worst long range save percentage in Spain? So ‘Arry had his spurs team shooting from the fecking half way line all game

 

[NinjaFletch]

Nobody with half a brain would be piling into Eriksen or Martinez after yesterday.

Martinez shouldnt be playing in a back 2 against sides like Brentford away from home. Definitely not in his second match and paired with the giant slug that is Maguire.

Eriksen was made to look a mug but the fault of the second goal is 100% on De Gea for giving it to someone fully marked.

I'm very surprised and worried by the 'defence' that a £60m centre half can't be expected to play in the league away from home against certain sides.

If that's really the most optimistic slant we can create in favour of Martinez then oh boy are we in trouble.

 

[Andersonson]

When you use 50 or more millions on a player, is it wrong to expect that he comes in and strengthen the team?

Or should we be ok with that every player we buy needs two seasons before we can judge him?

 

[JoaquinJoaquin]

Martinez wasn't even really at fault for yesterday's shambolic performance. Confusing take from the pundits and fans.

Exactly. Maguire was alot worse. But the narrative for Martinez has been set now, so he will be forever in for a tough ride.

 

[Chairman Steve]

It’s unfair to pile on the likes of Martinez now. There’s been plenty of instances where new players start off rank for us, especially defenders.

I remember Jaap Stam looking completely ineffective in 1998 against Arsenal twice. Patrice Evra had his infamous 45 minute debut against a mid-table City. Nemanja Vidic looked average in his first few games. Rio Ferdinand wasn’t too great in his first few games.

 

[BlahRules]

Martinez wasn't even really at fault for yesterday's shambolic performance. Confusing take from the pundits and fans.

These fans just repeat what the pundits say and they will never point the mistakes the English players are doing.

Maguire has never been called out of the mistakes which led to goals. Rahsford never making an effort and walking around. McTominay does not have good touch, passing and awareness. Shaw does not have positional sense and is passive when defending and attacking. Sancho going missing.

 

[captaincantona]

Martinez wasn't even really at fault for yesterday's shambolic performance. Confusing take from the pundits and fans.

Exactly. None of their chances came from him being targeted. Pundits on a bandwagon.

 

[Volumiza]

This is why I’m bemused why people are jumping on Martinez. The guy didn’t even have a full pre season with us. Fecking bizarre. CB in the prem is so different to what he’s used to. ETH wanted him for his fighting spirit and I still think we’ll get exactly that.

 

[bond19821982]

Our fans are arrogant and think we have a divine right to win everything. If we aren't willing to give a new manager and new signings more than couple of matches, then we deserve all the shit we are getting now.

 

[Volumiza]

paired with the giant slug that is Maguire.

I’m not a Maguire hater and I didn’t usually like name calling but …

 

[DRJosh]

Martinez has more right to feel aggrieved. Arriving at a club that seems more and more reminiscent of a Sunday league team. A far cry from the progressive football he enjoyed at Ajax

 

[Bubz27]

The only thing Martinez did yesterday was the same thing probably every centre back in the premiership has had happen to them at some point, which is get beaten at the back post. But narratives are set, memes are ready and any and every tiny mistake he makes will be shared and posted and liked and it'll take near perfect form for him to turn that around.

It's unfortunate but it's a symptom of where the club is at. Every single thing is scrutinised now, moreso than ever before.

 

[Fooza]

The issue is EtH signing a defender he knew for over 50m+ (we got fleeced)

Playing him, and then subbing him at half time when it's 4-0 but keeping Maguire. Damage was done already by half time, he should have kept him on and ride with it, but instead it does look even worse on the outside - it looked like EtH didn't believe in his ability (but I don't think this was the case). Was the icing on the cake of our worse performance.

If this was any other team, the media, and everyone, including us would be laughing their tits off

I still believe in our new signings but they have to be managed well

 

[little.triangles]

The only thing Martinez did yesterday was the same thing probably every centre back in the premiership has had happen to them at some point, which is get beaten at the back post. But narratives are set, memes are ready and any and every tiny mistake he makes will be shared and posted and liked and it'll take near perfect form for him to turn that around.

It's unfortunate but it's a symptom of where the club is at. Every single thing is scrutinised now, moreso than ever before.

Exactly! It happened to Trent Arnold recently when he got outjumped by Mitrovic on opening weekend, but nobody was calling him out. United fans will do well to remember how Evra and Vidic were written off in their first few months in the PL.

Martinez is quality and it will eventually show. He and Varane should be played together so that the team can play a high line.