Mason Greenwood (Please post respectfully)

[TsuWave]

Part of me thinks he shouldn't play for us again, then part of me thinks he wasn't convicted and that whole second chance and rehabilitation spiel starts playing in my head.

Ultimately, I know I'm only really conflicted because he was my favourite player - it's selfish, horrible even, and makes me feel bad, but it's the way I feel.

I just hope the girl's OK/doing better and that he works to be a better person, especially now that he's going to be a father.

 

[mu4c_20le]

Many voting no because of what he did, sure have a looser moral compass when it comes to the potential Qatari Royal ownership. Especially when we know which is worse.

Either have a strong ethical view on both or neither.

It's interesting. The caf is a really good social experiement.

 

[Withnail]

Again, I’m not being sarcy or prickly, but I genuinely think the evidence around the Ronaldo case is far more damning.

The audio, which is all there is, could have a number of issues with it - it could’ve been edited easily in this day and age, her phone could’ve been hacked / stolen (her Dad suggested this straight away).

I think it’s very likely that the ‘new evidence’ is to do with the phone recordings and if it’s enough for the police and crown prosecution to literally drop all charges - which they can pursue without Hariet - then I feel it’s important to at least step back and hear that out.

I know it’s a very emotive issue, and it’s a very serious topic, but we mustn’t project that onto a man who has been extensively investigated and found NOT WORTH EVEN TRYING.

The couple are supposedly having a baby together and I just think that with the above considered, we shouldn’t be deciding what’s gone on here. We know very little of it.

As far as I recall she released the audio/photos and was initially co-operating with police so you should probably drop this hacking red herring. Also if the victim won't give evidence and is living with and apparently planning a future with the alleged abuser a conviction is not really possible.

It's not all that hard to figure out. I don't really understand why you're trying to make out the whole thing is as confusing as you are.

 

[The Firestarter]

Many voting no because of what he did, sure have a looser moral compass when it comes to the potential Qatari Royal ownership. Especially when we know which is worse.

Either have a strong ethical view on both or neither.

What a wet fart of a post.

 

[Mmm-Qatarian]

Many voting no because of what he did, sure have a looser moral compass when it comes to the potential Qatari Royal ownership. Especially when we know which is worse.

Either have a strong ethical view on both or neither.

No problem, I do. I don't want Greenwood back at United and I don't want Qatari state ownership of us either.

 

[pauldyson1uk]

Many voting no because of what he did, sure have a looser moral compass when it comes to the potential Qatari Royal ownership. Especially when we know which is worse.

Either have a strong ethical view on both or neither.

Dont want Greenwood, but thats a simple he stays or goes.
Dont want Qatari's or Ratcliffe but that's not so simple

 

[arthurka]

I just ask that anybody who wants him back, to listen to the audio again and imagine it's your daughter or sister whose on the receiving end.


He's vile and should never play for us again.

If they have worked it out so should you.

 

[glazed]

It's weird because the "No" camp are full of memorable posters who have a presence on the forum and the "Yes" lot are seemingly nameless wasters who you might only briefly remember for posting something incomprehensibly stupid in a player thread or the club sale one. Can some of the "Yes" posters confirm that is the case please.

I'm saying yes because I don't think the court of public opinion should get to decide people's fate. We have a legal process for that. He's clearly an odious individual but so are lots of footballers. But that's not enough.

 

[Gambit]

Your reaction is in my opinion why HE should be sent on loan if they have the mind to keep him

My issue is if we're keeping him. I want to know why. I don't want a loan or PR campaign of rehabilitation.

 

[Berbaclass]

It's weird because the "No" camp are full of memorable posters who have a presence on the forum and the "Yes" lot are seemingly nameless wasters who you might only briefly remember for posting something incomprehensibly stupid in a player thread or the club sale one. Can some of the "Yes" posters confirm that is the case please.

I'm taking that as a compliment

 

[dove]

We don't personally know neither Greenwood nor his partner to assume anything. It's just as likely to be an abusive relationship as his partner being just as cnut as Greenwood is.

4 warning points for that Someone must be related to Greenwood here.

 

[Phil Jones Face]

He made a mistake, everyone makes mistakes, some are worse than others. He wasn't punished legally, his girlfriend is having his baby and is soon to be his wife.

Let's not let a mistake made by a boy ruin a man's career.

Get a grip of yourself. This isn't a "oops-a-daisy. I accidently raped and beat up a girl and had the audio and pictures leaked all over the internet.". This is more than a "mistake".

Again, a reminder:

 

[Withnail]

I don't want him back and think he probably did it but there are two sides to every story

I'm interested in why the other poster is calling her a cnut. I'm aware there can be two sides but it seemed a bit extreme, given what we know, so I wanted to know what the hell they were on about.

 

[Redlambs]

Many voting no because of what he did, sure have a looser moral compass when it comes to the potential Qatari Royal ownership. Especially when we know which is worse.

Either have a strong ethical view on both or neither.

Murderers and war criminals are given second chances, not sure why MG is being held to a higher standard. He’s not been found guilty and has borne the weight of public judgment. Time to get him in the field where he belongs.

It begins.

We did well getting this far!

 

[L1nk]

I have to say though, respectfully, the fact there are so many yes votes in the poll is extremely disheartening. You can only fathom being the reason is he was a talented footballer and we need a goalscorer, is that really the level people look at when absolving and washing their hands of everything they’ve seen and heard? I’d say I genuinely cannot believe it but here we are.

Are social media dunks and goals in football really worth it?

I really cannot fathom how anyone can hear that audio and want to cheer him for this club anymore after that, really I can’t

 

[Enigma_87]

I’m going to play devils advocate. There’s plenty of players to choose from that have done some bad shit and still they play. I was fully against him staying but after these last few months. We could really use his talents. Now in saying that. The whole thing is just plain weird. The domestic trouble and now they have a kid? It’s all fecking strange. Hopefully that’s the last time we ever hear anything abusive from MG. People can always change and be better, he’s still very young. Though I believe not many do change, in my experience. Either way, It’s the squads decision and I support whatever they choose.

Are we really that desperate?

 

[LawCharltonBest]

My issue is if we're keeping him. I want to know why. I don't want a loan or PR campaign of rehabilitation.

I clicked reply on your post by accident so I have to type something now

 

[The Urban Goose]

Whether he should return for us or not should be moot, for his own sake he should restart his career abroad. Crowds here will be brutal.

 

[kouroux]

I doubt he's been sat on the couch playing fifa, he'll have been training for sure.

Training with who ? You see players coming back from long lay offs in a specific training regimen within their teams, struggle a lot to go back to their best level.
Training on your own might keep you in shape but it won't be nearly the required level

 

[Cloud7]

No it's fair enough, like I said, you're entitled to your own views and it is definitely easier to split the club from the owners than it is an actual player. But that's pretty much my question isn't it? One is directly there in your face, the other is bankrolling what is happening in front of you. I don't want either, but think it's pretty much in the same world, but also can see that you'd have more Greenwood no's than Qatar no's for the reason you said. I do think you're more in the minority of pro Qatar (not sure if you prefer Qatar of Ratcliffe or just fine with either).

For me, there's pretty much nothing that would stop me from being a United fan - but it would be super dark and morally shit of the club if both of these scenarios were to happen. Just prefer to not have to deal with my club being attached to all that.

I think it is as you said, one is directly in front your face and the other is providing the funding, so one is easier to ignore than the other.

I would prefer Qatar, but I’m sure that JR would do a better job than the Glazers anyway purely on the basis of him seeming to be a more sensible businessman than the six of them combined, so whichever one of the two we get I will ultimately be happy with (Admittedly some of the Glazers sticking around in a diminished capacity under JR does leave a sour taste in my mouth but emotions aside I can see the potential reason for it) but whichever we do get I do wish they would hurry up with it

I agree with you that after thinking long and hard there’s nothing that could stop me from being a United fan either. As much as I would prefer Greenwood (weird to be typing that name again after saying Voldemort for so long) to not come back, I’m not going to hope he doesn’t do well if the club decides to bring him back into the fold, it would just be easier for my morals if he didn’t.

I don’t think you and I are far apart in where our opinions are, we just have different lines in the sand on different topics.

 

[DJ_21]

I would be very curious to know (obviously there is no way to actually know) what the opinions of the other players are on him. I think it was documented somewhere (no idea if true) that he was a bit of a loner and used to eat alone at mealtimes and such, and apparently Ronaldo didn’t like him either.

However for someone like say Rashford who would have been around him for years, I wonder what he actually makes of this and what he would think should the club decide to bring him back.

He’s always seemed like a loner tbh… I’ve always thought he’s a bit greedy and I’m sure the other players think that. Especially Ronaldo who moans a lot anyway. I think the team as grown a lot without him and having 1 bad person in the group could affect things. He won’t be guaranteed a starting spot anymore anyway like he use to be because we have Antony now who’ll just keep getting better. We’re buying a ST this summer. Plus we have garnacho as our new shiny player. A lot has changed since he was last here.

 

[MarkoDolohov]

Really hope we see him return tbh but then I had hoped we get taken over by Qatar - both of which are looking unlikely sadly. Shame tbh

 

[kouroux]

Murderers and war criminals are given second chances, not sure why MG is being held to a higher standard. He’s not been found guilty and has borne the weight of public judgment. Time to get him in the field where he belongs.

The stupidity of this post is unreal

 

[Raoul]

I'd wager higher.

Probably so. People who have the perceived less popular view are obviously less likely to express it if they know everyone can see their vote.

 

[RedRonaldo]

You're right we have no idea, but even if it was a "one-off", there needs to be lines that can't be crossed, this is definitely one of them. It's Manchester United we're talking about.

From the sounds of the audio, I doubt it was a one-off either. It sounded like the sort of thing that happened frequently for her to know to record it.

Yes so I totally understand those who would say no, as he has totally crossed that line from that incidence.

But hypothetically speaking, lets just say if he did deeply regrets what he has done and has made his best effort to repent and make up to his girl, and became a good boy now, do you think we should give him a second chance?

I am actually neutral on this, as I don't have the full picture.

 

[hobbers]

Many voting no because of what he did, sure have a looser moral compass when it comes to the potential Qatari Royal ownership. Especially when we know which is worse.

Either have a strong ethical view on both or neither.

Or maybe the ethics and practicalities of Greenwood just happen to align better. He's a thundercnut and doesn't deserve to play for us again, tick. But ignoring ethics and focusing on practicality, he will be vilified and jeered at every stadium in the country, the press will vilify him and us for playing him, it will be a constant PR shitstorm and potential nightmare for him as much as anyone else. If he has any advisors they will all be telling him to get on the first plane to Serie A if he wants to stay in football.

Also seems like a lot of his potential team mates deeply dislike him so there's also dressing room harmony to worry about.

 

[Enigma_87]

Many voting no because of what he did, sure have a looser moral compass when it comes to the potential Qatari Royal ownership. Especially when we know which is worse.

Either have a strong ethical view on both or neither.

Will the Qatar owners share the same dressing room with Greenwood?

 

[Cassidy]

Better not to speculate. Partly because I don't think it would be acceptable to the forum moderators but also because we will never know.

Indeed just expressing why answering the question is difficult.

 

[Unam333]

I hope lessons are learned, and i believe in second chances. I really hope he's sorted his shit out and the whole experience has been sobering for him. Any more silliness and he's gone before it even hit's the news.

We've seen enough silliness by him.
If he wasn't talented then he was already sold by the club and nobody would bat an eyelid. He comes across as a real prick. The prostitutes thing, him ignoring seniors' advice, in one of his gf's earlier vids he tells in the camera he wants to feck her, then the audio tapes, later on him reaching out and contacting the victim even though he was adviced not to. He has serious attitude and behavioural issues.

 

[adexkola]

I'm still confused as to why some thought delaying discussion on this topic made any sense at all. Nothing has changed.

Anyways, I'm ambivalent on whether he goes or stays. I'd vote for "I'm fine either way".

Given his talent, age and potential, we should not be letting him go for peanuts in the name of supposed moral superiority. We don't get FFP credit for letting a homegrown player go for peanuts. And we disadvantage ourselves compared to other clubs who have players who have (allegedly or confirmed) committed reprehensible acts, on their books, for what?

If Chelsea come in and offer £70M, send him away. If Galatasaray come in offering €3M, feck off. Play him for a season, "rehabilitate" him, get his form up, and then sell if need must be. Better yet, if he scores 50 goals a season keep him. Or sell him for £100M.

Who cares. They aren't role models. They aren't privileged persons. They kick balls around, well. The sooner you stop seeing footballers as examples for young kids (who's parents for some reason abdicate responsibility), and start seeing them as assets on a club's balance sheet, assets because of their football ability alone, the sooner you can remove emotion from this, or at least not let it lead you into making a ridiculous decision.

This isn't commentary on his character. I never listened to the tape. I read the transcript and that was horrendous enough. If the law got him, cancel his contract, he's bad goods. That didn't happen, so here we are.

 

[Howl]

Honestly I don't know how anyone can hear that audio and be comfortable endorsing him. I'm shocked how close the split is.

Because none of us actually know anything about the case. Neither me nor you. All we know is a 50 second snippet from a 15 minute recording, as well as a few photos (which doesn't mean anything, just look at the depp v heard case from last summer). In the eyes of the law he's innocent, as he hasn't been found guilty of anything. If the club want to sell him I'm sure there will be a few suitors, but I don't think they will as he's too valuable of an asset, there's a reason why they didn't rip up his contract. I do wonder however, how many of the people who are staunch critics, will decline to cheer if he scores a goal for us.

 

[Gabriel Djemba-Bebe]

I really hope none of the people voting yes have daughters.

I feel sick just thinking about my daughter unknowingly celebrating a goal from this guy.

I know right. Only people who have spawned female offspring can possibly comprehend a subject matter such as this.

 

[pogbasformerbarber]

I think every poster that says yes should be forced to say why or get banned.

I voted yes and wrote a comprehensive post on why. I don't think everyone should have to, but I agree giving context to the vote is a helpful way of explaining an admittedly controversial position. it was somewhat for personal reasons, but those personal reasons apply to the situation...

 

[DevTheRed]

I don’t want him back but the fact they’re back together and now she’s pregnant just doesn’t sit right with me.

 

[Yorke to Cole]

I totally get the disgust towards him but if he commits to getting psychological help then I don't see why he can't get a second chance? It's clearly a more complicated situation between him and his girlfriend/fiance than some think.

That is my opinion. If the club and more importantly Greenwood, himself can determine a path to rehabilitation, then it is possible. From a legal perspective, the man is still very young, but he has a right to continue with his life. It is very easy these days to disregard these issues and immediately condemn someone with "cancel culture" when the alternative is to get to the root of these problems and eradicate them completely.

 

[Reditus]

Probably so. People who have the perceived less popular view are obviously less likely to express it if they know everyone can see their vote.

Shy Tories

 

[Bebestation]

The people who can’t second chance Greenwood are still calling Maradona G.O.A.T

 

[Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber]

I don't buy this schtick of acting more aggrieve than the alleged victim and acting superior to law enforcement. The law saw it fit to wall away and the alleged victim is starting a family with him. I seeknow reason why we should all punish hkm beyond what he has legally been hit with already both personalky and career wise. I want him back on the pitch resuming his career. The lull in it due to his own sheer stupidity should have taught him the lesson he needed to learn.

 

[ExoduS]

Best get rid. He might repeat it and then we are going through this sh1t again. Best send him out and let him figure out what he wants to do with his life.

He is definitely flawed individual and what he did you don't simply outgrow it. He is a vile person and I don't want to cheer for him on the field.

 

[Sir Erik ten Hag]

I have to say though, respectfully, the fact there are so many yes votes in the poll is extremely disheartening. You can only fathom being the reason is he was a talented footballer and we need a goalscorer, is that really the level people look at when absolving and washing their hands of everything they’ve seen and heard? I’d say I genuinely cannot believe it but here we are.

Are social media dunks and goals in football really worth it?

I really cannot fathom how anyone can hear that audio and want to cheer him for this club anymore after that, really I can’t

A lot of us don't really care about social media glamor. But goals are kinda the foundation of football as a whole. People watch football for goals, and it's always been that way.