Will you watch the Women's World Cup?

[Ludens the Red]

Norway, Canada and Australia were all supposed to be easy wins but did not work out like that at all

My women’s national team knowledge isn’t great but I didn’t include any of those teams in my bets cos I didn’t have them down as the top teams. Are they seen as top teams?
I was thinking mainly games like England/Haiti, France/Jamaica. Usa/Vietnam etc… those I expect will be the big score lines.

 

[NotThatSoph]

It's as if they stated televising kids school plays. The pretend enthusiasm, the whitewashing of everything obviously shit makes the sport seem less serious than it is. If something isn't awful it's apparently amazing. If something is awful then let's not talk about that, look at how enthusiastic the crowd is.

People who treat it like a parent treats a 4 year old's painting they've stuck to the fridge and gasp and marvel at it, like it's something Van Gough's paintbrush just shat out, are doing more harm to the credibly of the sport than they realise.

The fact the coverage of this 'elite level sporting event' is treating it as an 'everyone's a winner' sports day, is the most revealing thing about it. I'll start taking women's football seriously once it starts treating itself like a proper sport.

Millions watch and enjoy women's tennis. Because it's presented as, and treated like, a proper sport. "Oh she missed that back hand volley but she's so brave look at all these people at centre court" isn't a thing because in serious sport that nonsense would not be tolerated.

Women's golf is indistinguishable from men's golf. They don't go in for that "She's 11 over par but she's very brave and an amazing Kween" utter shite they do with women's football coverage.

It's always a treat to witness the world you live in. A televised kids school play can't compete with that, too realistic.

 

[Rood]

My women’s national team knowledge isn’t great but I didn’t include any of those teams in my bets cos I didn’t have them down as the top teams. Are they seen as top teams?
I was thinking mainly games like England/Haiti, France/Jamaica. Usa/Vietnam etc… those I expect will be the big score lines.

Ok I get you - yes those are the biggest mismatches on paper

Those aren't the top teams but were odds on pre-match and the type of teams people tip as dark horses

 

[Cascarino]

Missed the first two days but my schedule clears up tomorrow so I can start with the Zambia Japan game. Although if I mess up morning schedule it'll be the England game. Thankfully other than coaching I have few locked in commitments in the near future so I'm going to be able to watch a fair amount of the games this year.

 

[Cascarino]

It's always a treat to witness the world you live in. A televised kids school play can't compete with that, too realistic.

I'm kind of bummed out you quoted that post and subjected my eyes to it. I knew the thread was going to be full of cringe but this was the only page I'd opened so far, so I'd avoided the weird shit

 

[NotThatSoph]

I'm kind of bummed out you quoted that post and subjected my eyes to it. I knew the thread was going to be full of cringe but this was the only page I'd opened so far, so I'd avoided the weird shit

I'm not sorry.

The Norwegian media have been eviscerating the team after their opening loss, in-between articles where the players slag themselves off. Everything is questioned: ability, tactics, line-up, manager. Graham Hansen is getting the Ødegaard treatment. Social media is circulating a picture of an angry Ada Hegerberg with her hand raised, the joke being she's about to assault her teammates because they suck so bad. The 8-0 loss is mentioned a lot, because we're not over it and maybe the players aren't, either.

Then I had to read that.

 

[Mshafeek]

It's as if they stated televising kids school plays. The pretend enthusiasm, the whitewashing of everything obviously shit makes the sport seem less serious than it is. If something isn't awful it's apparently amazing. If something is awful then let's not talk about that, look at how enthusiastic the crowd is.

People who treat it like a parent treats a 4 year old's painting they've stuck to the fridge and gasp and marvel at it, like it's something Van Gough's paintbrush just shat out, are doing more harm to the credibly of the sport than they realise.

The fact the coverage of this 'elite level sporting event' is treating it as an 'everyone's a winner' sports day, is the most revealing thing about it. I'll start taking women's football seriously once it starts treating itself like a proper sport.

Millions watch and enjoy women's tennis. Because it's presented as, and treated like, a proper sport. "Oh she missed that back hand volley but she's so brave look at all these people at centre court" isn't a thing because in serious sport that nonsense would not be tolerated.

Women's golf is indistinguishable from men's golf. They don't go in for that "She's 11 over par but she's very brave and an amazing Kween" utter shite they do with women's football coverage.

ha ha.. spot on. Was thinking along these lines actually. If it has legs, it'll stand on its own - this is not some life/death or livelihood situation to force an imagined 'justice' onto. Women don't need any patronizing in sports they really do excel - tennis, gymnastics, athletics etc. In others, in which they can't match quality-wise with the level of the men's game - it'll be perceived and will remain at the actual level of quality it has achieved - nothing more, nothing less. And for a developing sport, fifa is not doing them any favors. Staging the biggest tournament yet at times most of the world struggle to watch, and not providing easy access to streams etc - these are just plain idiotic stances. Personally, I think they ought to develop women's football differently - there will always be a handful of women who match the men's game in quality - but you need thousands of them for it to develop into a properly accepted sport and i feel that can't be done if they don't adjust the rules specifically for women.

 

[Cascarino]

I'm not sorry.

The Norwegian media have been eviscerating the team after their opening loss, in-between articles where the players slag themselves off. Everything is questioned: ability, tactics, line-up, manager. Graham Hansen is getting the Ødegaard treatment. Social media is circulating a picture of an angry Ada Hegerberg with her hand raised, the joke being she's about to assault her teammates because they suck so bad. The 8-0 loss is mentioned a lot, because we're not over it and maybe the players aren't, either.

Then I had to read that.

At least you had 6 minutes until the thread delivered again

ha ha.. spot on. Was thinking along these lines actually. If it has legs, it'll stand on its own - this is not some life/death or livelihood situation to force an imagined 'justice' onto. Women don't need any patronizing in sports they really do excel - tennis, gymnastics, athletics etc. In others, in which they can't match quality-wise with the level of the men's game - it'll be perceived and will remain at the actual level of quality it has achieved - nothing more, nothing less. And for a developing sport, fifa is not doing them any favors. Staging the biggest tournament yet at times most of the world struggle to watch, and not providing easy access to streams etc - these are just plain idiotic stances. Personally, I think they ought to develop women's football differently - there will always be a handful of women who match the men's game in quality - but you need thousands of them for it to develop into a properly accepted sport and i feel that can't be done if they don't adjust the rules specifically for women.

I didn't get anything out @stw2022 post other than he seems weirdly angry that people are passionate about something he isn't (and this is a really big problem for some reason),

but what does " Was thinking along these lines actually. If it has legs, it'll stand on its own- this is not some life/death or livelihood situation to force an imagined 'justice' onto" mean from your post? I think you should google the FA's 1921 women's football ban for the first part of legs thing (and taking note of the environments in which women's football has had to grow). But that part aside, what is the 'imagined justice being forced onto' mean? What is the justice you're talking about?

 

[Mshafeek]

At least you had 6 minutes until the thread delivered again



I didn't get anything out @stw2022 post other than he seems weirdly angry that people are passionate about something he isn't (and this is a really big problem for some reason),

but what does " Was thinking along these lines actually. If it has legs, it'll stand on its own- this is not some life/death or livelihood situation to force an imagined 'justice' onto" mean from your post? I think you should google the FA's 1921 women's football ban for the first part of legs thing (and taking note of the environments in which women's football has had to grow). But that part aside, what is the 'imagined justice being forced onto' mean? What is the justice you're talking about?

If you don't see it, so be it. People perceive things differently - probably coming from what they actually would like to believe. But the media narrative - and also of many of the posters here as well - is that women's football already matches the men's in enjoyability and 'importance', importance as in how much people ought to care about it and how everything about it should match the men's - down to the prize money. And deriding women's football as no match to the men's game is misogynistic no less. People seem to not able to come to terms with a scenario where maybe women are not generally suited to play a highly physical game as good as people with more muscle strength and physique - many people find it offending to suggest a change in rules for the women. It's naïve to try to connect this difference to a 1921 ban.
Also, some people being passionate about something holds no truth value - people can be passionate about things that totally don't warrant the said passion. And people's interest can be generated by a media campaign very easily. Objectively in sport, quality is the only arbitrator, and by that metric alone any women's football tournament will come way below most men's tourneys - simply due to the dearth in the number of world class players and teams. But that doesn't stop people from claiming that those who don't watch are somehow missing out.

The only good objective argument that can be made is from a feminist perspective- that irrespective of the actual quality, women's football needs to be supported because that's a good thing to do.

 

[Cascarino]

If you don't see it, so be it. People perceive things differently - probably coming from what they actually would like to believe.

I think my perspective is different to the likes of yours and Stw because I’ve been heavily involved in football all my life, in various capacities, with now the coaching aspect giving me a much better understanding and appreciation for what goes into the game outside the top 12 or so global sides? I enjoy a wide range of football, and I think someone is missing out if they consider the International level of the women's game "shit" as a few commenters in this thread have mentioned. I saw a post complaining about league 1 and how it’s shit also, and I think it’s a shame when people come at sport from that mindset, no one says they have to enjoy it but it’s always important to have an appreciation.

About the part of your post I quoted, if you say that you come to your perspective because of what you’d like to believe, I’d recommend working on that.

 

[Rood]

But the media narrative - and also of many of the posters here as well - is that women's football already matches the men's in enjoyability and 'importance', importance as in how much people ought to care about it and how everything about it should match the men's - down to the prize money. And deriding women's football as no match to the men's game is misogynistic no less.

You made this up - I haven't seen even 1 post in here suggest anything like this.

Quite obviously Women's football is nowhere near Men's in terms of importance, but how could it be?
This is only the 9th WWC Vs 22 Mens WC.
In UK the Women Super League only went professional 5 years ago in 2018 Vs 1888 for Men so there is over a century of catch up required.

Still the women's game has come a long way in a relatively short space of time and growing constantly on every level.

 

[Bucephalus74]

Living in the U.S., I was convinced to go watch the last women's World Cup final (Americans might be disinterested in both football and women's sport in general, but never turn down the opportunity for performative patriotism!). And hey, it was brunch at the local brewpub, why not? The quality of the footballing was appalling. Crosses from wide open positions raining down on the roof of the net. Just bad.

Watched the most recent Euros. The advance in the quality of the football in just a few years was, quite frankly, stunning.

I'll skip the group stages, for the same reason I skip women's matches the first week at Wimbledon--there's less talent depth in the women's game, and so there are a lot of simply uncompetitive matchups. But I will tune in for the knockouts.

 

[davisjw]

You made this up - I haven't seen even 1 post in here suggest anything like this.

Quite obviously Women's football is nowhere near Men's in terms of importance, but how could it be?
This is only the 9th WWC Vs 22 Mens WC.
In UK the Women Super League only went professional 5 years ago in 2018 Vs 1888 for Men so there is over a century of catch up required.

Still the women's game has come a long way in a relatively short space of time and growing constantly on every level.

This.

Why do (mostly) men get their panties in a twist because the women's game is being hyped up? If you're a fan of football, you're rooting for the women's game to continue to grow regardless of how you feel about the competition. No one is forcing you to watch the matches, so move on from the coverage if you don't like it.

The women's game is different. It's less physical and more tactical, sort of like the Premier League vs. Serie A. It doesn't make one better than the other, they're just different.

The joy of the game should not be based solely on the perceived quality. It'd be like saying there's no point in eating unless it's Michelin starred. I enjoy watching my kids on the pitch mishitting passes as much as I enjoy an FA Cup final; I don't compare them.

Quite a few posters are coming across like the grumpy old neighbor you had growing up, who you and your mates made fun of for finding zero joy in anything, and who you swore you wouldn't become when you got older...

 

[Cascarino]

You made this up - I haven't seen even 1 post in here suggest anything like this.

Quite obviously Women's football is nowhere near Men's in terms of importance, but how could it be?
This is only the 9th WWC Vs 22 Mens WC.
In UK the Women Super League only went professional 5 years ago in 2018 Vs 1888 for Men so there is over a century of catch up required.

Still the women's game has come a long way in a relatively short space of time and growing constantly on every level.

Not talking about Mshafeek here with this because I haven’t seen enough of their posts to have an opinion on him, but often times you just end up arguing preconceived notions in threads like these rather than what people have actually said.

I find certain posts are annoyingly common too where when women’s football comes up they want to talk at length about how they don’t respect women’s football, they don’t watch it and why should they, it’s a joke compared to Men’s football and it has no entertainment value, but despite this the very same people seem to think their opinions on how the women’s game should be ran and what changes should be implemented should be listened to?

Spoiler

 

[santeria13]

This.

Why do (mostly) men get their panties in a twist because the women's game is being hyped up? If you're a fan of football, you're rooting for the women's game to continue to grow regardless of how you feel about the competition. No one is forcing you to watch the matches, so move on from the coverage if you don't like it.

The women's game is different. It's less physical and more tactical, sort of like the Premier League vs. Serie A. It doesn't make one better than the other, they're just different.

The joy of the game should not be based solely on the perceived quality. It'd be like saying there's no point in eating unless it's Michelin starred. I enjoy watching my kids on the pitch mishitting passes as much as I enjoy an FA Cup final; I don't compare them.

Quite a few posters are coming across like the grumpy old neighbor you had growing up, who you and your mates made fun of for finding zero joy in anything, and who you swore you wouldn't become when you got older...

What a load of nonsense. Men's football is clearly of higher quality than women's football. It has nothing to do with 'perceived quality'. I agree with you on that you can enjoy both though.

 

[Stack]

If you don't see it, so be it. People perceive things differently - probably coming from what they actually would like to believe. But the media narrative - and also of many of the posters here as well - is that women's football already matches the men's in enjoyability and 'importance', importance as in how much people ought to care about it and how everything about it should match the men's - down to the prize money. And deriding women's football as no match to the men's game is misogynistic no less. People seem to not able to come to terms with a scenario where maybe women are not generally suited to play a highly physical game as good as people with more muscle strength and physique - many people find it offending to suggest a change in rules for the women. It's naïve to try to connect this difference to a 1921 ban.
Also, some people being passionate about something holds no truth value - people can be passionate about things that totally don't warrant the said passion. And people's interest can be generated by a media campaign very easily. Objectively in sport, quality is the only arbitrator, and by that metric alone any women's football tournament will come way below most men's tourneys - simply due to the dearth in the number of world class players and teams. But that doesn't stop people from claiming that those who don't watch are somehow missing out.

The only good objective argument that can be made is from a feminist perspective- that irrespective of the actual quality, women's football needs to be supported because that's a good thing to do.

What a fecking massive steaming pile of bollocks.

 

[krazyrobus]

Nope

 

[Halftrack]

Not talking about Mshafeek here with this because I haven’t seen enough of their posts to have an opinion on him, but often times you just end up arguing preconceived notions in threads like these rather than what people have actually said.

I find certain posts are annoyingly common too where when women’s football comes up they want to talk at length about how they don’t respect women’s football, they don’t watch it and why should they, it’s a joke compared to Men’s football and it has no entertainment value, but despite this the very same people seem to think their opinions on how the women’s game should be ran and what changes should be implemented should be listened to?

Spoiler

Some, consciously or subconciously, end up believing they're the main characters of reality, and can't fathom something existing that doesn't appeal to them.

 

[Redplane]

One thing that makes women's footie fun is similar to watching my kid play: often a lot more back and forth action. I.e. Norway and Nigeria yesterday. That may sound like a dig but it's not intended to be. Men's footie can be quite dull in the methodological approach it often takes.

 

[Cascarino]

What a load of nonsense. Men's football is clearly of higher quality than women's football. It has nothing to do with 'perceived quality'. I agree with you on that you can enjoy both though.

The line you bolded doesn't mention quality, or 'perceived quality' so I don't think they're talking in a head vs head sense it'd be a close game. Just that they're different. If you took a world class flyweight and put him up against a a decent pro heavyweight he's going to lose. Same sport but different formats.

One thing that makes women's footie fun is similar to watching my kid play: often a lot more back and forth action. I.e. Norway and Nigeria yesterday. That may sound like a dig but it's not intended to be. Men's footie can be quite dull in the methodological approach it often takes.

This is pretty interesting, there was a Swedish sports company who have spent time breaking down the differences between the Men and the Women's game when it came to international football, especially when it came to the sport from a spectator's perspective. They found that the Women's games tended to be less risk averse when it came to progressing the ball, being more willing to pass the ball further and initiate riskier passes. On top of that they were more willing to take shots so the games tend to consist of more free flowing football where possession changed hands frequently and the action was more end to end in nature. Another little perk was there's less fouling, so they concluded that this adds to the flowing nature of the game compared to a more stop start game. This of course is just one group's perspective from taking things like passing statistics etc but I do think it's interesting.

I find that there's a decent amount of people who prefer watching championship, L1&L2 football for similar reasons.

 

[jeff gurr]

England vs Haiti starts at 3.30 am MST but I have set the alarm and will be watching

 

[jojojo]

And deriding women's football as no match to the men's game is misogynistic no less.

Here's a thought. If you want to be taken seriously as someone who isn't a misogynist - maybe not using phrases like "deriding women's football" would be a good place to start.

Do you also deride U17s football or the Championship? What about the Eridivisie - do you go into threads about football in the Netherlands to "express contempt for or ridicule" it? If you did, would you expect some push back from people who do watch it?

No one has to watch women's football, just like no one has to watch any other kind of football. For those who do watch it - sometimes it's good, sometimes it's bad, sometimes it's mediocre. Sometimes I care about a match in terms of who wins and that can add spice to the game. It's all pretty normal stuff really.

 

[Hester_manc]

I would watch it, if I thought they were about as good as the men.

For me, there is simply too big a difference in level between the best men and the best women as it seems right now. If the conditions for women's football develop, and maybe the level of the women does too, then I want to see it in the future. But not as it is now.

 

[Wibble]

I watched most of the Australia vs Ireland game. So already more than the last Men's World Cup.

I will probably watch some or all of Australia's and England's games.

 

[Wilt]

England v Haiti ….can’t imagine a more one sided game in any football World Cup.

Turkey shoot.

 

[V.O.]

England v Haiti ….can’t imagine a more one sided game in any football World Cup.

Well, you don't have to go too far. The game before that is USA vs Vietnam, and USA are currently 1.002 to win (500/1 on)

 

[maniak]

England v Haiti ….can’t imagine a more one sided game in any football World Cup.

Turkey shoot.

Double digits are a possibility.

 

[Wilt]

Well, you don't have to go too far. The game before that is USA vs Vietnam, and USA are currently 1.002 to win (500/1 on)

England or USA…. who will shoot the most turkeys?

 

[V.O.]

England or USA…. who will shoot the most turkeys?

In either game, anything less than double figures and every goal being celebrated like a winner in the final and I'd be disappointed.

 

[Wilt]

In either game, anything less than double figures and every goal being celebrated like a winner in the final and I'd be disappointed.

Yep, queue hysterical screaming and group hugs.

 

[Stack]

Its likely that England will win easily against Haiti but its important to note that the lesser teams have been steadily closing the gap over the last 20 years and Haiti are currently ranked 53 but Zambia who are ranked 77 recently beat Germany in a warm up friendly. Haiti have virtually no chance of beating England but there is a chance it wont be a so called Turkey shoot.

 

[Mshafeek]

You made this up - I haven't seen even 1 post in here suggest anything like this.

Quite obviously Women's football is nowhere near Men's in terms of importance, but how could it be?
This is only the 9th WWC Vs 22 Mens WC.
In UK the Women Super League only went professional 5 years ago in 2018 Vs 1888 for Men so there is over a century of catch up required.

Still the women's game has come a long way in a relatively short space of time and growing constantly on every level.

As I said earlier , football is not too serious an issue to be too concerned about the accuracy of arguments. But the narrative thing isn't something I made up - The guardian is the media outlet I read mostly, and the effort the likes of them are putting to hype this up is palpable - it's much higher than what a tournament that involves many low quality football teams to be considered world class objectively deserves. Maybe the angle I'm suggesting isn't obvious or discernable because of political/gender dynamics involved - it's that the quality of women's football/tournaments hasn't reached a level relative to other men's tournaments to be hyped up to a level it currently is being hyped up, if it's purely the sporting quality that is the objective indicator of hype or attention something deserves. The men's youth tournaments carry more weight behind them in terms of the efforts, players , quality etc that's involved - but those don't get anywhere near the hype here - and the reason is that it's not purely the sporting aspect that's at play here but rather a political/gender dynamic - driven interest. Nothing wrong in that if it's presented for what it is - just as there's nothing wrong in pointing this out.

 

[steffyr2]

I'm watching the US vs Vietnam now, so apparently i'm watching....

 

[Carolina Red]

As I said earlier , football is not too serious an issue to be too concerned about the accuracy of arguments. But the narrative thing isn't something I made up - The guardian is the media outlet I read mostly, and the effort the likes of them are putting to hype this up is palpable - it's much higher than what a tournament that involves many low quality football teams to be considered world class objectively deserves. Maybe the angle I'm suggesting isn't obvious or discernable because of political/gender dynamics involved - it's that the quality of women's football/tournaments hasn't reached a level relative to other men's tournaments to be hyped up to a level it currently is being hyped up, if it's purely the sporting quality that is the objective indicator of hype or attention something deserves. The men's youth tournaments carry more weight behind them in terms of the efforts, players , quality etc that's involved - but those don't get anywhere near the hype here - and the reason is that it's not purely the sporting aspect that's at play here but rather a political/gender dynamic - driven interest. Nothing wrong in that if it's presented for what it is - just as there's nothing wrong in pointing this out.

Yeah man it’s so crazy that they’re hyping up the World Cup for the other half of the human population. I mean… who would that even appeal to, right?

 

[Stack]

As I said earlier , football is not too serious an issue to be too concerned about the accuracy of arguments. But the narrative thing isn't something I made up - The guardian is the media outlet I read mostly, and the effort the likes of them are putting to hype this up is palpable - it's much higher than what a tournament that involves many low quality football teams to be considered world class objectively deserves. Maybe the angle I'm suggesting isn't obvious or discernable because of political/gender dynamics involved - it's that the quality of women's football/tournaments hasn't reached a level relative to other men's tournaments to be hyped up to a level it currently is being hyped up, if it's purely the sporting quality that is the objective indicator of hype or attention something deserves. The men's youth tournaments carry more weight behind them in terms of the efforts, players , quality etc that's involved - but those don't get anywhere near the hype here - and the reason is that it's not purely the sporting aspect that's at play here but rather a political/gender dynamic - driven interest. Nothing wrong in that if it's presented for what it is - just as there's nothing wrong in pointing this out.

Another massive steaming pile of absolute bollocks from you. Your arguments are just infantile.

Firstly you are moaning about the hype this tournament is getting. Its the Womens World Cup, its the absolute pinnacle of womens football, of course there is a massive hype surrounding it. Its the only major football being played anywhere in the world right now.
The hype exists because of the absolutely massive growth of girls and womens football around the world over the last 25 years. Im now 60, when I was a teenager playing there were a dozen girls teams in the city I live in. There are now over 1000 girls teams. thats just the girls, not counting the womens teams. thats in a country that is a long way from the major Pro leagues and where football is well down the pecking order of importance. The opening game here was attended by the largest ever crowd to watch a football game we have ever seen here, men or women. I went to the game, everywhere you looked were girls and women. They werent there because of some massive hype, they were there because the vast majority of them now play and we are co hosts for a world cup. The hype is driven by the massive numbers now playing and also watching girls and womens football around the world, not by any sort of agenda by media or your percieved political/gender dynamics.

Have you taken any note of how fast crowds have grown in Englands Womens top division? Have you taken any notice of how big the crowds have been at the elite Spanish womens level?

You mention the tournament involves too many low quality teams to be considered world class. What utter bollocks. the problem you have is that you fail to understand that world class is relative to the participants. With respect to this Womens world cup there are just as many World class womens teams as the number of World class mens teams at Mens world cups. NZ made a world cup a few years ago, we are a massive distance from being world class on the mens scene and every mens WC there are plenty of teams which are not "World Class" mens teams

You lack perspective, balance and understanding in your arguments.

Ive played since I was 5 years old, only stopped playing 2 years ago. Ive played club, school, indoor, 7 aside and old manys division footy. I have coached for over 20 years, coached boys, girls, men and women at every level available to me here in NZ. Ive even been lucky enough to have been involved at international in a very limited capacity. I make mention of all of this because in my lifetime the single best thing thats happened to football has been the rise of the female side of the game.
Why is that?
Well when i was playing in our top amatuer division here there were very few women watching the game and very few women in the clubrooms after the games. Clubs were the bastion of men and were quite frankly just boring booze halls. Now the clubs are filled with grisl and women, playing supporting and helping run grass roots football. The life blood of world football. I now watch girls and boys, men and women able to talk about football on an equal level with respect to tactics, game understanding and social interactions.
Big games now have larger numbers of girls and women attending. Football stadiums are now far more safer and enjoyable spaces to attend when i got to got to games in the UK when I was a kid in the 70s and then later in the late 80s.
The growth of the womens game has brought about a massive amount of inclusivity to grassroots clubs around the world, to school football around the world and to semi pro and pro teams around the world. Its been a massive and hugely rewwarding change for everyone involved.

If you want to concentrate on this bullshit perceived hype angle then i really feel sorry for you. They hype is because of how far the womens game has come in 25 years, becaus a huge number of people are now playing girls and womens football and also supporting their heroines. If you think its just a product of media hype then I would bet you have never been anywhere close to grassroots football, are one of those who only ever watches elite footy on tv and has no idea of whats actually going on in the real world.

I will probably get a warning or be banned but you sir are a clueless muppet.

 

[Mshafeek]

Yeah man it’s so crazy that they’re hyping up the World Cup for the other half of the human population. I mean… who would that even appeal to, right?

It's all good.. just pointing out that there is an amount of pretending present from some - that it's 'as good'. For ref - see the french ad or some of the media stories. Or the claims here to the effect that those who don't watch are losing out on a spectacle.

 

[Cascarino]

I'm watching the US vs Vietnam now, so apparently i'm watching....

Same, I wasn’t going to stay up and watch it but my sleep pattern is all over the place atm (04.20 here).I was originally going to watch Brazil tomorrow instead of USA Vietnam, but now ireckon I’ll try and sleep and get up for the England game.

As I said earlier , football is not too serious an issue to be too concerned about the accuracy of arguments

Just because you don’t think football is a particularly serious issue, doesn’t necessarily mean the accuracy of your arguments aren’t important. It makes working out what someone is trying to say, and the validity of it, that much harder.

Also, some people being passionate about something holds no truth value - people can be passionate about things that totally don't warrant the said passion. And people's interest can be generated by a media campaign very easily. Objectively in sport, quality is the only arbitrator, and by that metric alone any women's football tournament will come way below most men's tourneys - simply due to the dearth in the number of world class players and teams.

I’m not sure where to start with this, this is totally at odds with how I feel about football, or sport or media or anything really! I’ll start off with the first sentence

“some people being passionate about something holds no truth value - people can be passionate about things that totally don't warrant the said passion.”

You’re misusing both truth value and the word passion here.

a very powerful feeling, for example of sexual attraction, love, hate, anger, or other emotion:
Football arouses a good deal of passion among its fans

coincidentally the Cambridge dictionary I copy and pasted that from had football fans as it’s example .I nor no one else claimed that passion is solely a reflection of quality, just that Stw being angry that people were passionate about something was very silly. Passion in the context we’re talking here is also a lot more than that, and people will have different levels of passions and different reasons for being passionate.
When you say that “people can be passionate about things that totally don’t warrant said passion” how could you or Stw possibly make that assertion about someone’s passion for their sport, or the side they support? Surely that makes no sense? I’m very passionate about my local Welsh Cymru side, I don’t understand how someone else would be able to make a judgement call on if that passion was warranted/justified? That’s just now how sport works is it?

I’ll leave this post there because as I took forever the posters above me have made the points I was going to better anyway

 

[Cascarino]

It's all good.. just pointing out that there is an amount of pretending present from some - that it's 'as good'. For ref - see the french ad or some of the media stories. Or the claims here to the effect that those who don't watch are losing out on a spectacle.

Can you link these posts? I don’t doubt their existence but I want to read what they said.

 

[Mshafeek]

Another massive steaming pile of absolute bollocks from you. Your arguments are just infantile.

Firstly you are moaning about the hype this tournament is getting. Its the Womens World Cup, its the absolute pinnacle of womens football, of course there is a massive hype surrounding it. Its the only major football being played anywhere in the world right now.
The hype exists because of the absolutely massive growth of girls and womens football around the world over the last 25 years. Im now 60, when I was a teenager playing there were a dozen girls teams in the city I live in. There are now over 1000 girls teams. thats just the girls, not counting the womens teams. thats in a country that is a long way from the major Pro leagues and where football is well down the pecking order of importance. The opening game here was attended by the largest ever crowd to watch a football game we have ever seen here, men or women. I went to the game, everywhere you looked were girls and women. They werent there because of some massive hype, they were there because the vast majority of them now play and we are co hosts for a world cup. The hype is driven by the massive numbers now playing and also watching girls and womens football around the world, not by any sort of agenda by media or your percieved political/gender dynamics.

Have you taken any note of how fast crowds have grown in Englands Womens top division? Have you taken any notice of how big the crowds have been at the elite Spanish womens level?

You mention the tournament involves too many low quality teams to be considered world class. What utter bollocks. the problem you have is that you fail to understand that world class is relative to the participants. With respect to this Womens world cup there are just as many World class womens teams as the number of World class mens teams at Mens world cups. NZ made a world cup a few years ago, we are a massive distance from being world class on the mens scene and every mens WC there are plenty of teams which are not "World Class" mens teams

You lack perspective, balance and understanding in your arguments.

Ive played since I was 5 years old, only stopped playing 2 years ago. Ive played club, school, indoor, 7 aside and old manys division footy. I have coached for over 20 years, coached boys, girls, men and women at every level available to me here in NZ. Ive even been lucky enough to have been involved at international in a very limited capacity. I make mention of all of this because in my lifetime the single best thing thats happened to football has been the rise of the female side of the game.
Why is that?
Well when i was playing in our top amatuer division here there were very few women watching the game and very few women in the clubrooms after the games. Clubs were the bastion of men and were quite frankly just boring booze halls. Now the clubs are filled with grisl and women, playing supporting and helping run grass roots football. The life blood of world football. I now watch girls and boys, men and women able to talk about football on an equal level with respect to tactics, game understanding and social interactions.
Big games now have larger numbers of girls and women attending. Football stadiums are now far more safer and enjoyable spaces to attend when i got to got to games in the UK when I was a kid in the 70s and then later in the late 80s.
The growth of the womens game has brought about a massive amount of inclusivity to grassroots clubs around the world, to school football around the world and to semi pro and pro teams around the world. Its been a massive and hugely rewwarding change for everyone involved.

If you want to concentrate on this bullshit perceived hype angle then i really feel sorry for you. They hype is because of how far the womens game has come in 25 years, becaus a huge number of people are now playing girls and womens football and also supporting their heroines. If you think its just a product of media hype then I would bet you have never been anywhere close to grassroots football, are one of those who only ever watches elite footy on tv and has no idea of whats actually going on in the real world.

I will probably get a warning or be banned but you sir are a clueless muppet.

You are very invested in this and I understand your emotion. Good for you.
But THERE IS a load of irrationality surrounding this hyping up - a disproportionate and pretentious one - and people will continue pointing this out. Other than that , I'm not claiming the support and hype are itself wrong. It's the same people who are claiming to be 'just supporting' women's football who are sometimes bringing out the comparisons with the men's game. One recent example is the claim that the prize money needs to be equal to the men's game. What?? The men's WC is a world wide event - not remotely comparable to anything else. What rational basis is there for equating the reward for both, other than it being a political gimmick? Just like any other field - for example music - you deserve reward and hype proportionate to the objective level of excellence achieved - the entertainment and quality generated, not exclusively 'relative' to what other people in your field are achieving.

 

[moodyred]

There is a woman's world cup?