I've heard mainly that we should wait for proof as the Antony defense, which is hardly the same as calling her a liar. I've heard a lot more knee jerk reactions essentially condemning him
Antony under investigation by Brazilian authorities for domestic abuse | Inquiries ended | Back in the squad
- Thread starter laughtersassassin
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Yeah, finding Riley's comments on Israel and antisemitism problematic and finding her comments about Greenwood, Antony and the club in particular are correct should be 2 entirely separate things.
I mean you can do both, as people can be right about one thing and wrong about another thing
Is there no clause in the contract where you are caught in criminal proceeding the club has every right to terminate your contract?
I'm pretty sure that clause exist in every employment contract I've signed in my career.
I'm pretty sure that clause exist in every employment contract I've signed in my career.
He’s such a hot tempered player that I can see him getting red carded from the added abuse and jeering he’d get from rival fans. Him getting clattered to a round of applause and then him kicking out.
I’m not sure where I am in regard to suspending him. I think the allegations are vile and if there’s a sprinkle of truth, then he needs to go. But I appreciate there’s a difference between this and the Greenwood case and so it needs to be treated differently - as I was a staunch Greenwood out advocate.
Whether we suspend him or not based on what’s known, he just seems like the type of player who’d get affected by it.
I’m not sure where I am in regard to suspending him. I think the allegations are vile and if there’s a sprinkle of truth, then he needs to go. But I appreciate there’s a difference between this and the Greenwood case and so it needs to be treated differently - as I was a staunch Greenwood out advocate.
Whether we suspend him or not based on what’s known, he just seems like the type of player who’d get affected by it.
So that automatically means Antony must be guilty and should be tried by the media? what if he is innocent, that is okay because there is a more important cause??
I agree that domestic and sexual violence cases do not get prosecuted as often or as vigorously as they should but we need to change the system not allow the media to destroy peoples lives and ignore due process
It's not that easy to submit false evidence. You get grilled pretty hard and all the other Circumstances must also corroborate. Your friends, pictures of you hanging out, proove of relationships, alibi, time of incident needs to checked out.
It's not that simple like doctoring a chat screenshot and submitting it as evidence
MG case is different. Normally players are just being told that investigation is pending and that's it.
MG just happens to have a very damning evidence out in the open.
My position on Antony is he's innocence until further evidence materialized. Which will or will not be available to public.
As for MG. With the recording and picture which he didnt challenge. He's a cnut.
But in this case there aren't, are there? there are pictures that appear to be of injuries, but these were not taken by the police or an independent medical facility, due process exists for a reason, if we ignore due process then you have bigger problems that a footballer and his ex to worry about.
So you have said you would be okay with having your life turned upside down if somebody made allegations against you, basically if you were guilty... what if you were innocent??
My best friend growing up, his parents used to foster kids, when one of them became ill they had to stop, one of the girls they were fostering had to leave, she then made allegations against the whole family, these were found to be untrue and later she admitted she made the whole thing up out of spite and being rejected (I have some sympathy for her feelings but not her actions), my friends dad, and a friend of their family almost lost their jobs, my friend who spent several days being interrogated by police had to have counselling and go on anti-depression medication. The girl who made the allegations got a caution!
Off the top of my head, Matthew Kelly had allegations made against him, publicly interviewed by the police and subsequently there was no evidence, yet his career was ruined, look at the impact on Jimmy Tarbuck, or the way the police raided Cliff Richard's home with the press watching, there are many more examples I am sure but my point is, that this is not victimless either which way, you cannot put the cat back in the box, there has to be a better system which supports victims and doesn't see the accused being punished until they are actually found guilty.
Don't be ridiculous. I said nothing of the sort.
You’re probably not worth £80m to your employers
False allegations are disgusting and do damage lives. The numbers of unreported cases of domestic abuse far outweigh the cases where people manufacture evidence to this degree.
While he is innocent, there is a massive question mark over it just at the moment.
Disagree , untill arrested and charged.
We set the standard with MG that should not be changed.
It does piss me off what Arsenal have been able to get away with, will there ever be consequences for how they've just carried on? I know its a bit what about them etc. but whatever.
We live in ridiculous times.
It used to be innocent until proven guilty , now its guilty until proven innocent.
These type of things should not be made public until a verdict has been reached in court.
The social media witch hunt on these things is out of control.
It used to be innocent until proven guilty , now its guilty until proven innocent.
These type of things should not be made public until a verdict has been reached in court.
The social media witch hunt on these things is out of control.
There is definately a double standard when you compare the reactions to Greenwood and Partey in the media.
It's night and day. There has to be legal reasons, but places like Sky make a choice to still talk and focus on Partey's amazing football abilities, they don't need to go the extra mile. It is very irksome.
Actually in most cases now it's guilty even if proven innocent in public eye.
Issue is most countries/people, rightly or wrongly, have the attitude now that if you are rich you will get away with it. So whenever someone who is considered privileged is accused by someone less privileged, in eyes of most people they are pronounced guilty and it's very hard for them to change their outlook.
Yeah it doesnt feel right. Especially given what the alleged victim went through. The online harrassment she received from Arsenal fans was extreme.
I don't even think it's that. Once you are accused of something it seems to stick with you even if you are later proven innocent, particularly in football. Doesn't seem to be any way back from it.
"Please post respectfully"
Our strongest suit
Our strongest suitHe's not charged is he? If he's charged later then the club will suspend him.
What are the examples of football people being proven innocent you are thinking of?
Exactly this. The MG scenario being the latest example of everyone seeing actual evidence, yet nothing happening. This kind of thing is just concreting this view.
Money talks though.
People being falsely accused of something they did not do is a problem that we should take seriously.
People being the victim of domestic abuse and not being belived/helped is a huge problem and something we should take much more seriously.
That domestic abuse actually exist is the biggest problem of the three and should be taken extremely seriously.
People being the victim of domestic abuse and not being belived/helped is a huge problem and something we should take much more seriously.
That domestic abuse actually exist is the biggest problem of the three and should be taken extremely seriously.
Sigurdsson
The club should release a statement today. Suspension should come when/if he gets charged but the club should still acknowledge the ongoing investigation / media narrative.
Yep.
"The CSEW estimated 2.4 million adults aged 16 years and over experienced domestic abuse in the year ending March 2022 (1.7 million women and 699,000 men). This equates to a prevalence rate of approximately 5.0% of adults (6.9% women and 3.0% men)."
https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopula...walesoverview/november2022#measuring-the-data
No in most cases it's guilty and not even charged.
False accusations are disgusting. But the stats show it's a very small % that goes to the stage of falsely submitting evidence. Especially relative to the estimated domestic abuse figures.
Its insane numbers.
Actually insane.
This is the most annoying part.
When we talk about double standards, this is the thing that stands out. It seems the press have just decided to pile on United because we're an easy target at the moment.
But revitalised FC after 3 non-CL finishes in a row were off the table for some reason last year.
Let the due process take course and if he's charged and arrested, then there's a precedent that's been set and the club would then look suspicious if we don't follow it.
What?
Is it so? In most cases?
How can anyone be aware of those stats and come up with the l "it's such a dangerous time to be a man" nonsense. Parents apparently scared for their poor sons. Lunatics.
Were they?
?
I thought he was cleared, wasnt he?
Charges were dropped after two years.
"The 33-year-old man who was arrested in connection with an investigation opened in June 2021 will face no further action. The investigation team and Crown Prosecution Service have been working together and reached the decision that the evidence available at this time does not reach the threshold set out in the Code for Crown Prosecutors. Greater Manchester Police is committed to investigating allegations to secure the best possible outcomes for all involved and will continue to work with partner agencies to ensure individuals are supported throughout investigations and beyond.”
That's not being proven innocent.
Doing the right thing shouldn't be relative to what Arsenal do. It's ridiculous that Party is out on bail playing football.
Regarding the media, United are always a bigger story, that's part of the club.
I think all of these things are pendulums that swing one way, then too far in the other, than hopefully come towards a more sensible end point. I think we can all agree it's likely that some of our favourite players in the 80s/90s did worse than what Antony is accused of, and nothing was said, reported or done. And the victims had to suffer because of that silence.
Now we seem to have swung to the point where the twitter mob are the judge, jury and executioner, rather than the legal systems setup with certian processes to protect both sides. I personally find the Antony case so problematic because one party is going to the media and one party is going through the proper channels. This assymetry is a 'clever' tactic to win the battle of public opinion, regardless of the actual judicial process that should follow.
We may never know what happened between Antony and the alleged victim, but by taking this public she has foregone his right to the proper channels of justice, and given today's environment, unilaterally condemned him.
As a society we have to wary of cures that are potentially as damaging as the disease. At a macro level sure, throw a few rich folk under the bus as examples if it means we reduce the staggering number of abuse victims. But doesn't mean that we should feel good about it.
Antony may end up being a creep who deservedly gets justice. But I'd much rather see that come from the courts and police, rather than twitter and the media.
Now we seem to have swung to the point where the twitter mob are the judge, jury and executioner, rather than the legal systems setup with certian processes to protect both sides. I personally find the Antony case so problematic because one party is going to the media and one party is going through the proper channels. This assymetry is a 'clever' tactic to win the battle of public opinion, regardless of the actual judicial process that should follow.
We may never know what happened between Antony and the alleged victim, but by taking this public she has foregone his right to the proper channels of justice, and given today's environment, unilaterally condemned him.
As a society we have to wary of cures that are potentially as damaging as the disease. At a macro level sure, throw a few rich folk under the bus as examples if it means we reduce the staggering number of abuse victims. But doesn't mean that we should feel good about it.
Antony may end up being a creep who deservedly gets justice. But I'd much rather see that come from the courts and police, rather than twitter and the media.
To be fair, when you live in a tatetopian echo-chamber i guess you never will be aware of those stats.
You will be very aware of every time a man is unfairly treated thought.