Beat City 2-0 in 2020, he was outstanding. Scored a good free-kick against Liverpool to knock them out of the FA Cup as well in his first year.
Will Bruno achieve legend status at utd?
- Thread starter simplyared
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Maguire is our most consistent player this season by a mile.
Casemiro and Martinez and probably Rashford were last season, at least until February when it all went to shit.
Legend status is bestowed upon someone on one good season now, is it? Or half a season in Maguire's case. feck me!
Since he arrived at United, he's been out best and most consistent player.
Unless we have a huge upturn in winning/competing for multiple trophies I don’t see him reaching legendary status. It takes a very special player like Robbo to be able to do so in a poor team.
I do think he has the ability if the team was better overall. He would also be more likely to have defining moments if he had a stronger group around him. At the moment, it’s too much to ask and he’ll likely run out of time.
I do think he has the ability if the team was better overall. He would also be more likely to have defining moments if he had a stronger group around him. At the moment, it’s too much to ask and he’ll likely run out of time.
Not even top 50. He's a very good player but with many flaws and the team under his leadership didn't really set the world on fire. Unless he leads the team to PL or CL, he won't even be considered one of our best players in modern times.
He hasn't been our best player this season, last season, or the season before that.Legend status is bestowed upon someone on one good season now, is it? Or half a season in Maguire's case. feck me!
Since he arrived at United, he's been out best and most consistent player.
There are far more reasons why Robson is a legend. Playing in a poor side does not make you Bryan Robson. Being fantastic week in week out and dragging the team to victory. Numerous huge games against rivals like Liverpool, City, Arsenal. Cup final goals. Being the first captain to lift the FA Cup three times, at the time a huge trophy. The cup winners cup final. The league title was really a cherry on what was an unbelievable cake.
Feck people can’t even name one big game where Bruno has even turned up. 4 seasons. You know….’anyone, anyone….BUELLER’….As if that’s some small issue. We’ve had players over the past ten years have good games against big teams…Blind, Herrera, Smalling, Shaw, Pogba, Lingard, Mata, DeGea off the top of my head.
Here’s one for you and particularly those who base their opinions on stats….
David Beckham…two assists in the CL final in 99. But I don’t remember him for that. He’s a legend to me because we struggled in that game against a top class Bayern side and despite playing in a midfield four in CM against a midfield on par with our first choice midfield, with Giggs on right, Butt next to him and Blomqvist on the left…Beckham was utterly outstanding.
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I’d have Van Nistelrooy ahead of Cole. Scored more goals for us in far fewer games (if Wiki is to believed)(I consider ALL of the below to be United legends, but I've split them into two groups. The second group consists of players who I have experienced people disagreeing with me on multiple times. So don't shoot the messenger!)
More or less undisputed United legends
Edwards, Charlton, Law, Best, Robson, Schmeichel, Giggs, Scholes, G.Neville, Irwin, Keane, Cantona, Cole, Stam, Rio, Vidic, Rooney
Seems to be up for debate
Beckham, Solskjær*, Evra, Park, Carrick, De Gea, Ronaldo**
* his reputation (unfairly) took a blow after his managerial stint
** (rightfully) fell down after his second stint
The only thing these all have in common are Premier League/English First Division trophies. Some are there primarily because of their hard work, others for their x factor. Some were at the club for a long time, others for just 3 years.
There are multiple players on this list that Bruno is more talented than. There are multiple players on this list that Bruno will have stuck around for longer than this summer. And in terms of hard work and effort, Bruno does in no way look out of place. The only way to exclude Bruno (provided that you agree on the second group as well) is if you consider winning the PL a necessity in order to be considered a legend. Personally I disagree with this distinction so regardless of happens in the upcoming years Bruno has already done enough to warrant a spot in that second group.
Some of these might be a bit overlapping but here goes:
- Chance-creation
- Vision
- Movement
- Passing (spare me the pass completion stats, it's more nuanced than that)
- Intercepting
- Tackling (for being an attacking midfielder)
Pressing, hard work and fitness are also skills that I normally would include, but those belong in the other category I called "effort".
Only if he wins the league. Its a high bar at the club and its too recent to outrageous success for anything less to cut it.
Where did you read that?Legend status is bestowed upon someone on one good season now, is it? Or half a season in Maguire's case. feck me!
Since he arrived at United, he's been out best and most consistent player.
Since around the time Ronaldo came back Bruno has been neither our best nor most consistent player. Unless you mean consistently abysmal in big games.
It's not nonsense just because you don't understand it.
I'd agree with this tbh. I'm surprised by the amount of people saying Stam. If he's included the list must be long.
Some of our fans don’t rate De Gea as a legend so Bruno has no chance….
I actually think 2) is what's not true. Usually when he plays well, we win. However, he's not very consistent. Within a game let alone game to game. He also rarely stands out positively in big games. This is why for me, he's not a legend. However, this may change if we get better as a team he leads the team to success.Ok I will bitenumber 1 is not true IMO, at least it is only occasionally true, I can easily see a better Utd without Bruno in the 1st 11, I can even envisage Mount being better than him in that false 10 role, Bruno as many have said is chaotic, there is some advantage in order.
That said the OP question was is he a Utd legend, which I TBH is not ruled in or out by any or all of your statements, I guess it comes down to your definition of Legend, I think that definition should be extremely personal, for me it purely comes down to how you feel or felt about a player, football is yes full of stats, but you know from watching the game so much more than the stats can tell you, for instance Wayne Rooney, obviously a Legend based on stats, trophies and performances, on that basis you could argue that he is one of our most Legendary players, but for me he would be down the pecking order, below players like Robbo, Rio, Schmeichel, Cantona, Beckham, it is just personal, emotional instinct.
Question for you:
Marcus Rashford 126 goals in 384 games,
OGS 126 goals in 366 games....
Who has the more legendary status at Utd?
I know which player gets into my mental highlight reel more than the other (BTW not meant as a dig at Rashford, I still love him).
You can add Andy Cole 121 in 275, still above Rashy! but then I was younger and not such a miserable cynic, maybe that is another factor
You're right about viewing footballers more cynically these days, I do too. I don't view Rashford in a positive light unlike the other two, however I believe he has a real chance to surpass them because he has time on side.
Problem for Bruno is, that moment has not just eluded him, he's stood out negatively in big games.
It’s not hard to see why some fan bases regard Man Utd fans as a joke.
Firstly, it always amuses me how he is always referred to as “Bruno”. It seems that only some players garner this distinction. It’s so weird.
The guy is nowhere near a legend and never will be. He is totally unreliable. His attitude is pathetic. He is physically crap and his technical ability is nowhere near good enough to make up for that. His dribbling is horrendous. For every good shot or pass that he picks out, he pings twenty more out of play akin to something out of a Harry McGuire YouTube compilation. The sooner this muppet, McGuire, Rashford, Martial, McTomminay, Shaw, Onana, and all the other substandard dross are out, the better. What a dismal era. Zero light at the end of the tunnel as it stands. Man Utd has never been so far off the mark. It is in its most weak state, after spending a king’s ransom. You can only laugh. It’s a shame the sheikh withdrew.
Firstly, it always amuses me how he is always referred to as “Bruno”. It seems that only some players garner this distinction. It’s so weird.
The guy is nowhere near a legend and never will be. He is totally unreliable. His attitude is pathetic. He is physically crap and his technical ability is nowhere near good enough to make up for that. His dribbling is horrendous. For every good shot or pass that he picks out, he pings twenty more out of play akin to something out of a Harry McGuire YouTube compilation. The sooner this muppet, McGuire, Rashford, Martial, McTomminay, Shaw, Onana, and all the other substandard dross are out, the better. What a dismal era. Zero light at the end of the tunnel as it stands. Man Utd has never been so far off the mark. It is in its most weak state, after spending a king’s ransom. You can only laugh. It’s a shame the sheikh withdrew.
Yeah they were so furious at the guy for captaining United to a 7-0 mauling at Anfield.
And playing in the 5-0 and 4-0 maulings the season before.
He absolutely terrorises them.
They can when they're top players who contribute to elevating the players around them and lifting the mood generally.
Yes yes.. he terrifies them, yes thats exactly what i said.Yeah they were so furious at the guy for captaining United to a 7-0 mauling at Anfield.
And playing in the 5-0 and 4-0 maulings the season before.
He absolutely terrorises them.
They can when they're top players who contribute to elevating the players around them and lifting the mood generally. If they dont offer that then of course they need trophies to compensate
And in that area Lingard has done more to be considered a United legend with his FA cup final goal than Bruno.
Correct. The ones with the long surnames. See also Rio.
Next weeks lesson. Why people often type “CM” instead of “central midfielder”…
It’s not true just because you wrote it.
If someone were to say he’s been the most available player, the one who has played most often, that would be true.
Saying he’s been our best player the entire time he’s been here bar a few months from Rashford is utter bollocks.
Justify it.
You’re arguing with someone who genuinely believes Bruno’s been “abysmal all season”. That’s the level of ignorance you’re dealing with. Do yourself a favour and put them on ignore. I did it ages ago. One of my best decisions ever made on the caf.
These threads are so pointless. Quantify legend first.
Who's better, Ronaldo or an M4 Sherman mk II?
Who's better, Ronaldo or an M4 Sherman mk II?
DDG was our last club legend and I do t see anyone in the current set up get close to joining the at club anytime soon. Way to early to start citing future legends amongst the youngsters.
Bruno has been a top player for us but his form is way too patchy and his captaincy will be tarnished by an under performing team and the most dislikeable trait of his moaning and gesticulating, rather than getting on with the job of leading.
Not even close to a club legend for me.
Bruno has been a top player for us but his form is way too patchy and his captaincy will be tarnished by an under performing team and the most dislikeable trait of his moaning and gesticulating, rather than getting on with the job of leading.
Not even close to a club legend for me.
Not arguing your general point re: Beckham, but he had zero assists in the CL final. Giggs and Sheringham were the last players to play the ball prior to the two goals.
Also, people have already mentioned some big games were Bruno played well and influenced a positive result for us, so not sure why that point keeps being brought up.
Fictional assists aside, Beckham didn’t have a good game in the CL final. Bayern kicked our arses for almost the entirety of that match. One of the most one sided games we played in that whole campaign, primarily because our rejigged central midfield was nowhere near good enough on the night. Is that being brought up as the sort of performance Bruno should be aspiring to produce?
Herrera like player for me. I’ve got a lot of time for him whilst he’s here, but I’ll probably almost entirely forget about him as soon as he’s gone.
Rasmus as well. I ain't learning his last name.
True that. Although for some weird reason I don't remember many of us calling our Polish keeper Tomasz. We really should have.
Similarly, I guess Kvaratskhelia's first name didn't catch on because it's also a ball ache to spell.
I certainly hope so because it would mean he’d have captained us to a league title or CL.
Bruno (and Rasmus) are both fun to say as well. Way more so than Fernandes and Hoijlandsson or whatever the feck it is.
Yup. See also Ruuuuuuud.
I find it funny how Bruno supporters seem puzzled as to why Bruno has so many critics and don’t view him as world class or close to world class like they do. It’s almost as if they can’t fathom the thought that he just isn’t as good as you think he is.
Why would fans of a team deliberately underrate a player of ours? If Bruno was this amazing player you think he is, the criticism of him would be minimal or nonexistent.
Last season when Rashford was playing at an unreal level, his praise was unanimous, it was similar with DDG from 2014-2018. Even Bruno had this in his first calendar year here.
Why would fans of the club target Bruno as one to intentionally criticise, why would there be an agenda against him? That hasn’t happened with any player before him and doesn’t happen with players of other teams. There are just too many critics of Bruno both fans and ex players.
Bruno in a sense reminds me of Berbatov in 2010/11. He had good stats, was top scorer even and was consistent but when it came down to it in the business end of the season SAF trusted more reliable players and despite being our top scorer wasn’t on the bench for the CL final. Berbatov that season was pretty much loading his goals against the smaller teams but even he managed to get his iconic moment with the hat trick vs Liverpool.
Bruno supporters look for every excuse in the book for why he doesn’t have any memorable performances. How can you be a Manchester United legend or rated highly when you go missing in big moments consistently? There’s several examples of him carrying us against fodder but not even once can he do it in a big game. He’s pretty much the Lukaku of midfielders and that was another player who played for us and a large section of the fan base didn’t rate even after his first season where he score 27 goals. It’s funny because I recall @Pogue Mahone defending Lukaku then too when he was being criticised for being a small game player.
Why would fans of a team deliberately underrate a player of ours? If Bruno was this amazing player you think he is, the criticism of him would be minimal or nonexistent.
Last season when Rashford was playing at an unreal level, his praise was unanimous, it was similar with DDG from 2014-2018. Even Bruno had this in his first calendar year here.
Why would fans of the club target Bruno as one to intentionally criticise, why would there be an agenda against him? That hasn’t happened with any player before him and doesn’t happen with players of other teams. There are just too many critics of Bruno both fans and ex players.
Bruno in a sense reminds me of Berbatov in 2010/11. He had good stats, was top scorer even and was consistent but when it came down to it in the business end of the season SAF trusted more reliable players and despite being our top scorer wasn’t on the bench for the CL final. Berbatov that season was pretty much loading his goals against the smaller teams but even he managed to get his iconic moment with the hat trick vs Liverpool.
Bruno supporters look for every excuse in the book for why he doesn’t have any memorable performances. How can you be a Manchester United legend or rated highly when you go missing in big moments consistently? There’s several examples of him carrying us against fodder but not even once can he do it in a big game. He’s pretty much the Lukaku of midfielders and that was another player who played for us and a large section of the fan base didn’t rate even after his first season where he score 27 goals. It’s funny because I recall @Pogue Mahone defending Lukaku then too when he was being criticised for being a small game player.
To be fair, that mostly shows the insanity of going 'this player has X assists so must be class'.
Beckham played two good corners in which really created the chances - with Bruno those two corners are more likely to go into the first man or create a chance for another team. (well certainly the winner)
Even in the games where we get smashed or upset by little teams, it's 'Bruno created 5 chances' and then when you watch they are spammed through balls when we're under the cosh and actually having the ability to control the game would be better. I honestly think that in a lot of games he gives more chances to the other team than he creates for us.
Under Bruno's captaincy, we've had one of the worst records ever against good teams - look at the statistics about our away form to top 8 sides in the last season and a bit.
I’m not sure if any of the current crop are on track for legend status.
Probably because they never hear or see anything close to the level of RedCafe criticism out in the real world. This forum is toxic as hell when it comes to rating its own players and managers so Bruno is far from alone in this. It's just more shocking when it comes to him because he's actually a good footballer.
We laugh at Facebook and Twitter comments, but at least their toxicity is immediately apparent from the emojis and slurs, so you don't get fooled to engage to begin with.
Two things:
1. You don't need to be world class to be a club legend. There are plenty of examples that prove this.
2. "World class" is yet another subjective term that people never can agree on. Going by Fergie's definition, Bruno is nowhere near world class. Going by the most common definition (best or second best in a given position), Bruno is at the very least in the conversation. And if you're in the conversation you have to be a very good player. There's no way around it.
It still amazes me how people act surprised that the fan base is negative when the club has pretty much been in a state of negativity since SAF left. If we were winning or at least could consistently play and conduct ourselves like a top club the atmosphere within the fan base would be a lot less toxic. Liverpool, Madrid, Bayern, Barcelona fans etc would be exactly like us in the same situation.
Limiting this to a redcafe issue also doesn’t make sense and is far from true. It’s far more toxic on twitter and even other fan channels. I see stuff here that I see anywhere else. Roy Keane, Paul Scholes and Gary Neville have been on TV every week having a go at the club too but I guess the truth is toxic to you.
Keane and Neville also have no time for Bruno and probably dislike him a lot more than most posters here do. They know what it is to be a Manutd player and captain and can’t stand the sight of him. Maybe they’ve been reading too much on Redcafe?
The second part of your post is another example of you engaging in strawman arguments and ignoring the main point of the post. Nowhere did I say you had to be world class too be a legend.
I think Bruno will be a cult hero, akin to Gordon Hill of the 1970s or Norman Whiteside of the 1980s. Won’t hit the legendary heights of Robbo or Eric
Depends what he's supposed to be remembered for an impactful player who was present in a period of the clubs recent history being inconsistent competitively. It's hard to triangulate where he has merit in such a discussion.
I’ve seen one game against City described as outstanding….he played well but certainly was t outstanding and one game against Liverpool in the cup where he scored a free kick. That’s literally it?
It keeps getting brought up because it’s a factor for any big player at the club, nevermind legend.