[The Substitute]

and whenever he's played he's looked bang average in the first team. Sure, give him a go if it'll quieten down the folks clamouring - season's pretty much gone anyway - but he isn't the answer, I'm afraid.

That's the most subjective message ever. He played really well on his cameo earlier this season. You can't just say :"bang average" cause it fits your narrative when he clearly wasn't!

Comparing him to Antony but less physical is not just a lazy comparison, it also mean you haven't watched him at all. Amad is a receive&play winger, all about unlocking & chance creation.

We don't have any wingers like this in the current squad, we have 3x flair wingers who omly has eye for the goal, not teammates.

 

[Pickle85]

You've watched a grand total of 377 minutes of Amad for United spread out over 11 appearances during his age 18-21 seasons. Majority of those being when he was 18-19 years old.

You've seen feck all. And if he ends up not being good enough for United, it won't be because you somehow knew all along. It will be due to an easy guess because most young players aren't good enough for United, and guessing is all you're doing.

Fair enough if you've judged him off him playing for our youth teams or on loan, but seeing as his technical ability allowed him to do really well in those competitions, you obviously haven't formed your opinion on seeing him fail. So you wouldn't be forming your opinion to the same standard of youth watchers did when judging say, Tyler Blackett all those years ago.

I think we'll agree to disagree here. But if I'm right it'll be because it's possible to judge the player on what we've already seen. Thanks.

 

[Pickle85]

That's the most subjective message ever. He played really well on his cameo earlier this season. You can't just say :"bang average" cause it fits your narrative when he clearly wasn't!

Comparing him to Antony but less physical is not just a lazy comparison, it also mean you haven't watched him at all. Amad is a receive&play winger, all about unlocking & chance creation.

We don't have any wingers like this in the current squad, we have 3x flair wingers who omly has eye for the goal, not teammates.

I wasn't the one comparing him to Antony! Someone else did initially and I said Antony is more ready for the prem than Amad because he's physically more capable which, again, he is. I didn't say anything about their styles of play.

 

[Litch]

This would sound more realistic if Forson hadn’t started in his position and Antony was on the bench still when he was subbed in. Given that, either you consider Antony a fringe player and Forson a lynchpin in the team, or you … wait … there is no alternative.

Id answer that if I knew what you are on about...

 

[Gordon Godot]

I wasn't the one comparing him to Antony! Someone else did initially and I said Antony is more ready for the prem than Amad because he's physically more capable which, again, he is. I didn't say nothing about their styles of play.

Antony gave the ball away constantly when he came on vs Wolves. Maybe we should try playing a few technical players who can help us keep the ball and create attacks. Not as if Forson did anything at all yesterday.

 

[Adamsk7]

Personally I always think he looks good when he plays. He can do all the basic things a footballer should be able to do well 100% of the time. We have SO many players that can’t even do that! He’ll always need a run of games before showcasing his true talent, just like Mainoo and Hojlund.
personally I think he’s a better player than Garnacho who IMO is riding high off occasional moments like that overhead.

 

[EI Beatle]

Amad is not United quality but if i was him i would be knocking on erik's door Monday asking why a youth player is getting a start ahead of him, didn't he turn down loan offers in January ?

 

[Pogue Mahone]

I wasn't the one comparing him to Antony! Someone else did initially and I said Antony is more ready for the prem than Amad because he's physically more capable which, again, he is. I didn't say nothing about their styles of play.

I think picking Antony ahead of Diallo would have been at least a decision we could defend. Picking Forson ahead of him makes no sense on any level and is one of those calls that makes it harder and harder to have faith in this manager.

 

[Idxomer]

He played well for 30 minutes against Nottingham when losing in December and didn't see any game time again till a couple of months later.

Is it any surprise he looked rusty?

 

[Lash]

Hopefully will see him in the cup, really getting sick of watching Rashford.

 

[Pickle85]

Antony gave the ball away constantly when he came on vs Wolves. Maybe we should try playing a few technical players who can help us keep the ball and create attacks. Not as if Forson did anything at all yesterday.

I think picking Antony ahead of Diallo would have been at least a decision we could defend. Picking Forson ahead of him makes no sense on any level and is one of those calls that makes it harder and harder to have faith in this manager.

I'm not disagreeing with the idea that he has a solid argument to be given more of a chance given the options we have, but I just don't think he's a PL player. Maybe I'm labouring the point or being too hard on him.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

I'm not disagreeing with the idea that he has a solid argument to be given more of a chance given the options we have, but I just don't think he's a PL player. Maybe I'm labouring the point or being too hard on him.

We’ll never know if he’s a PL player until he gets more minutes in the PL. All we know for sure is that he excelled in the Championship and looked good in the only brief opportunity he’s had to play in the PL since. A cameo that had the manager singling him out for praise. In terms of being ready for the match yesterday he certainly seems a long way ahead of Forson.

 

[Lash]

We’ll never know if he’s a PL player until he gets more minutes in the PL. All we know for sure is that he excelled in the Championship and looked good in the only brief opportunity he’s had to play in the PL since. A cameo that had the manager singling him out for praise. In terms of being ready for the match yesterday he certainly seems a long way ahead of Forson.

Forson had looked bright in his cameos too, I don't think Forson didn't deserve his chance or Amad deserves it more than Forson. Forson has probably been training with the first team longer than Amad due to Amad being out most of the season.

Forson wasn't ever in my thinking as an option, but he's obviously impressed a lot of people to warrant the chances he's getting or we're trying to convince him to stay.

I think if Amad is good enough he'll break through this season, Ten Hag needs to win games. He's not going to play inferior players for fun.

 

[Pughnichi]

He’ll probably get thrown under the bus against citeh…manage 90 mins in a 6-0 drubbing and never be seen again

 

[Grande]

Id answer that if I knew what you are on about...

You write in the Amad thread after Amad came in to play 20 mins that the problem is that the coach doesn’t play fringe players enough, is that correct? It is strange to write that about Amad, when a (even more?) fringe player started the same game in his exact position.

 

[Raven]

For millionth time ETH proved he's a total fecking moron. I was okay with Forson starting until I saw he was starting on the right, Amad is so clearly a more suitable option currently it's not even funny.

 

[Litch]

You write in the Amad thread after Amad came in to play 20 mins that the problem is that the coach doesn’t play fringe players enough, is that correct? It is strange to write that about Amad, when a (even more?) fringe player started the same game in his exact position.

Maybe its my definition but not sure the young lad coming on for a couple of games could be called a fringe player? Fringe players for me, are players on the bench even when we have a full squad... he wont be.

 

[Grande]

Now it’s me being confused. Who do you reckon is a fringe player then? Antony, who was first choice last season but now appears to be 4th choice for RW, Diallo, who since he was injury free and not loaned seems to have moved from 4th choice behind Forson to getting mins at RW ahead of Antony, or Forson, who has gotten the most minutes behind Garnacho since new year, or none of the above? Do we even have a fringe player at RW then? Legitimate confusion maybe, as per recently Garnacho seems first choice for RW, but he still is preferred to play LW when Rashford isn’t played there.

To me, I reckon Garnacho, Antony, Forson, Diallo and at a stretch Fernandes as partnof the squad and liable to play RW as it looks now. Pellistri is loaned out, I’ll be surprised to see Rashford started there again, and let’s not talk about Greenwood for now. Garnacho has a strong shout for being main man there now, Antony had it but looks like he has a big fight on his hands to get regular starts again (maybe he’ll get a shot as false nine first, given that he did that role functionally when we beat City last season?), so him and Mainoo and Forson I see as squad players on the fringe of the first team.

Talking about Saturday’s despickable team performance, I’m not sure which player should have gotten more minutes previously, ahead of whom. Seems to me Ten Hag has wanted to play last years first choice into form, and upon that failing, has tried out options with Pellistri, Rashford, Fernandes, Garnacho, Forson and Diallo there, and has found the Garnacho solution most effective, Pellistri and Rashford not satisfying, and Forson ahead of Diallo for competition to Antony as subs for Garnacho. How that is an example of ‘not playing fringe players enough’ or what should be the alternative, I struggle a bit with seeing personally.

 

[DWelbz19]

I think if Amad is good enough he'll break through this season, Ten Hag needs to win games. He's not going to play inferior players for fun.

This logic is very much predicated on the idea that Ten Hag's view of Amad being good enough is correct. Judging by our performances, goals scored, and general position in the league -- it would be a fair assumption that he maybe isn't entirely infallible.

 

[ColvaleGoa]

Amad surely deserves to start over Forson.

 

[Lash]

This logic is very much predicated on the idea that Ten Hag's view of Amad being good enough is correct. Judging by our performances, goals scored, and general position in the league -- it would be a fair assumption that he maybe isn't entirely infallible.

It's more predicated on the fact that Amad's talent is what it is. Everyone gives Ten Hag no praise for playing Mainoo because supposedly anyone could see Mainoo's talent. If Amad can't convince a man who's crying out for creativity and goals in his team and is currently auditioning to the new footballer hierarchy, his talent is isn't what we think it is.

 

[RedRocket9908]

The fact that Erik chose Omari Forson over Amad is a clear indication that Amad simply isnt working hard enough on the training ground and showing he is ready for the first team.

 

[Matt851]

He played well for 30 minutes against Nottingham when losing in December and didn't see any game time again till a couple of months later.

Is it any surprise he looked rusty?

It's the ten hag approach to managing some of our players, ignore them until he gets desperate

 

[lex talionis]

The fact that Erik chose Omari Forson over Amad is a clear indication that Amad simply isnt working hard enough on the training ground and showing he is ready for the first team.

Must the answer be laziness in training? On the few occasions we've seen Amad in competition he looks a substantially better footballer than Antony. And we know Amad was outstanding in the Championship last season, when there wasn't a single report of Amad being shit in training.

It may well have been worth the punt to see if Forson was ready for the PL to see if he's now up for it -- which he clearly was not last weekend -- but based on what we saw from the Forson and Amad, in retrospect ETH got that one wrong.

 

[OmarUnited4ever]

The fact that Erik chose Omari Forson over Amad is a clear indication that Amad simply isnt working hard enough on the training ground and showing he is ready for the first team.

Unfair to assume Amad is not training well, but I guess we can say that EtH does not think much of Amad's ability/talent and went ahead with Furson to start ahead of Amad.

 

[Oldyella]

He’ll probably get thrown under the bus against citeh…manage 90 mins in a 6-0 drubbing and never be seen again

Could easily see this happening.

 

[Lash]

Must the answer be laziness in training? On the few occasions we've seen Amad in competition he looks a substantially better footballer than Antony. And we know Amad was outstanding in the Championship last season, when there wasn't a single report of Amad being shit in training.

It may well have been worth the punt to see if Forson was ready for the PL to see if he's now up for it -- which he clearly was not last weekend -- but based on what we saw from the Forson and Amad, in retrospect ETH got that one wrong.

Where we disagree on other factors here, it is stupid to suggest it has to be laziness. I agree, I think Forson was the wrong call. Even though he was bright in his cameos, he doesn't look better than Amad.

 

[Lash]

With Bruno a doubt, maybe we see him in the 10?

 

[criticalanalysis]

With Bruno a doubt, maybe we see him in the 10?

*laughs in subs bench*

 

[Lash]

*laughs in subs bench*

...

 

[CasaStreets]

I read a few posts since the game and then found myself wondering how you all have so much to say? He barely played.

Players ahead of him are underperforming. Deserves chances, ideally off the bench at first, hopefully more than 15 minutes. That’s all.

 

[jem]

I'm a big fan of Diallo's pass-and-move style but that was not a great cameo and it don't think it will do his cause many favours.

 

[Red Rash]

I'm a big fan of Diallo's pass-and-move style but that was not a great cameo and it don't think it will do his cause many favours.

Couldn't really get involved. Would still like to see him get a few starts to see what he can do. Definitely a very good player there.

 

[Dec9003]

He’s going to need some consistent minutes to show what he can do, not just the odd 10/20 mins. His linkup is very good and I think he’d be better in the centre for us than the right.

 

[dubplate warrior]

I'm a big fan of Diallo's pass-and-move style but that was not a great cameo and it don't think it will do his cause many favours.

A cameo here and there is no good for anyone.

 

[VP89]

A cameo here and there is no good for anyone.

Had 20 minutes to make an impact. Didn't do that.
Antony was better, and justified in starting.

 

[jem]

A cameo here and there is no good for anyone.

Agreed.

 

[DWelbz19]

He’s going to need some consistent minutes to show what he can do, not just the odd 10/20 mins. His linkup is very good and I think he’d be better in the centre for us than the right.

Yeah, I’m pretty resigned to the fact he’s not really going to get that under this manager. It’ll be limited cameos in matches like these which are dissipating by the second as we have Liverpool next in this competition.

 

[Van Piorsing]

21 already, surely he can sustain at least 45 minutes.

 

[MDFC Manager]

He's got no future here. Move him on.