Ruben Amorim - Manchester United Head Coach

[criticalanalysis]

It’s interesting because I completely understand the outrage with results (it’s embarassing ), but at the same time I’m not sure what people expect to see that’s vastly different? Do people think 4231 counterball would have us vastly higher in the table? Does a change in formation suddenly mean we aren’t relying on Garnacho/Hojlund/Zirkzee for attacking production and sharp final third play? Will us playing a different system mean Ugarte and Casemiro will suddenly become anything close to a Newcastle level of athleticism, or technicians like Liverpools midfield?

I don’t think Amorim has done much of anything notable and I’m not sure if he is or isn’t the man to bring us back into contention. He says a lot of the right things and seems to have a pretty clear view of the situation (as opposed to the pure delusion of our last manager). But at a certain point there can't just be a shrugging of the shoulders when it's an endless stream of shit results. At the same time, I genuinely think the majority of our fanbase seems to not understand just how poor the squad is, specifically in midfield/attack. We are a bottom tier team in terms of athleticism, bottom tier in terms of technicality, and absolute rock bottom in terms of attacking sharpness/thrust. You can give any manager in the world those circumstances and the results/performances won't be much better than "meh" and thats best case scenario.

This is where I disagree and what I'm worried about with Amorim. ETH also said a lot of the right things about culture, about ball losses, attitude, possession, player ability etc in his first and even last year but he never really changed the system, personnel or did anything on the training pitch to get the players playing above to their level or better than the sum of its part. I empathise with Amorim for the squad he's inherited but he's 'allowed' as much for the rot to continuing rotting as much as ETH did even if I acknowledge it's over a much shorter time span and with little squad change. It's obvious both managers wanted to play out from the back but why do our centre backs and midfielders go missing every time for the bounce pass/triangles? Why do we have such high ball losses in our own half? I would expect him/them to address that. If Amorim wants playing out from the back then there should be automatic 3-4 options for Onana/the CBs every single time even if we keep losing it but this hasn't changed a single bit in 6 months.

I don't doubt we will play better with surprise better/new players but the lack of actual patterns is a major major red flag. If he's stubborn about his playing style, system etc then actually be stubborn about it. Make your players play that way.

It may be an isolated game as I don't watch much outside of Utd but I had the Liverpool vs West Ham game in the background. West Ham were playing it out from the back against Liverpool's press with remarkable bravery and guile. Ward-Prowse and Paqueta (who was admittedly very good) was doing a lot work in the middle with a similar back 3/wing backs like us. Again I'm not sure if it's representative of their time under Potter but he's only been there since January.

It's not about the results but the performances, which have been downright disgraceful at times. I can forgive it if we were stubbornly doing things in an organised manner and losing but it's a lot of the same individual freestyling we saw under ETH whether that's fair or not. We should be way above meh, something like 'sometimes good, sometimes poor but promising' at the very least. I'll remain patient but it's mostly out of sheer desperation and hope than anything else. If he manages to 'turn it around' (whatever that means) by the end of next season then I'll happily applaud the optimistic lot here.

 

[tomaldinho1]

Amorim is known for being inflexible. During his time at Sporting CP, this trait has drawn considerable criticism.

His early months at the club mirrored his start at Manchester United. He introduced a 3-4-2-1 system — and that was it. There were no alternatives. He was fully convinced this was the best way for his team to play. By the end of that season, criticism began to grow, and many supporters were unsure whether he should remain in charge for the following year.

Then came the next season, with a renewed squad. The signings were surprisingly good, although fans initially didn’t quite understand the strategy behind them. The team still lacked a proper striker, and reports indicated that Amorim specifically requested Paulinho.

That season went remarkably well, and Sporting CP won the Portuguese league title. However, during the winter transfer window, it became clear: Amorim wanted Paulinho — and no one else. As a result, Sporting spent a record fee to bring him in. Most people didn’t quite understand the move, as Paulinho was… well… neither outstanding nor terrible. He had the potential to be good, but more often than not, he underperformed and drew heavy criticism.

The following season, Paulinho crumbled under the pressure. He insisted on playing Ricardo Esgaio, who was widely criticised by fans. Throughout the season, supporters voiced their frustration with the lack of tactical alternatives and the persistence in using underperforming players. Amorim did not care. He insisted that Esgaio and Paulinho were doing very well and knew everything of the game.

Ironically, this very stubbornness became one of the key reasons for Amorim’s success. After a long spell of fan frustration, Esgaio - originally brought in to replace Pedro Porro - suffered an injury. This forced Amorim to turn to Geny Catamo, a reserve player who had previously been loaned to Marítimo and was not seen as a serious option.

Amorim began using Geny as a right-back or right-midfielder. That change became one of the defining moments of his success at Sporting CP.

The back three remained, but the setup evolved: Nuno Santos, originally a winger, was now often deployed as a left-back or a left-midfielder. Matheus Reis, a left-back, played as a centre-back. Geny, a left-footed winger, took on the right-back role. Despite still appearing to field five defenders, the team effectively played with only three at the back. Occasionally, Amorim adjusted further — for instance, using Matheus Reis as a left-back to push Geny further forward as a winger.

At the same time, Paulinho started partnering with Gyökeres up front. The once heavily criticised striker finally began to thrive. With less pressure, he operated between the lines, sometimes coming off the bench and creating chances. He evolved from a system with one striker and started some matches with two strikers.

That said, Amorim remains a rigid manager. He famously dropped fan-favourite Slimani, benched another fan-favourite, Jérémy Mathieu, and did the same with Marcos Acuña. His commitment to players like Esgaio or Paulinho, despite poor form, was unwavering.

He is capable of adapting, but only when triggered by an event he deems significant. For example, he eventually gave minutes to Quaresma — a player he had dismissed since his first season and had publicly stated he would not count on again.

Nice to hear from non United fans. Sounds familiar, we hope we are headed in the same eventual direction it seems.
I remember one Sporting fan saying Amorim loved inverted WBs, and I think we were all quite worried when he signed Dorgu and then played him RWB and Dalot LWB which seemed mad and then was thankfully abandoned. Is his preference to do this again do you think at some point?

 

[Frank White]

It’s a bit over £3m per place in the table, 7th earns £31m more than 17th.
I think when you look at it weekly, it’s about 600k per week. It wouldn’t surprise me if that is the entirety of the money ‘saved’ from loaning out Rashford, Antony, and Sancho, Malacia.
Now obviously it’s not like a good manager would certainly have got Utd to finish 7th (and you are unlikely to finish 17th), but at the extremes, the numbers are significant.

Didn't realise it was that much £3m per position in team struggling with potential PSR problems is pretty significant.

 

[Garnacho Libre]

Amorim is known for being inflexible. During his time at Sporting CP, this trait has drawn considerable criticism.

His early months at the club mirrored his start at Manchester United. He introduced a 3-4-2-1 system — and that was it. There were no alternatives. He was fully convinced this was the best way for his team to play. By the end of that season, criticism began to grow, and many supporters were unsure whether he should remain in charge for the following year.

Then came the next season, with a renewed squad. The signings were surprisingly good, although fans initially didn’t quite understand the strategy behind them. The team still lacked a proper striker, and reports indicated that Amorim specifically requested Paulinho.

That season went remarkably well, and Sporting CP won the Portuguese league title. However, during the winter transfer window, it became clear: Amorim wanted Paulinho — and no one else. As a result, Sporting spent a record fee to bring him in. Most people didn’t quite understand the move, as Paulinho was… well… neither outstanding nor terrible. He had the potential to be good, but more often than not, he underperformed and drew heavy criticism.

The following season, Paulinho crumbled under the pressure. He insisted on playing Ricardo Esgaio, who was widely criticised by fans. Throughout the season, supporters voiced their frustration with the lack of tactical alternatives and the persistence in using underperforming players. Amorim did not care. He insisted that Esgaio and Paulinho were doing very well and knew everything of the game.

Ironically, this very stubbornness became one of the key reasons for Amorim’s success. After a long spell of fan frustration, Esgaio - originally brought in to replace Pedro Porro - suffered an injury. This forced Amorim to turn to Geny Catamo, a reserve player who had previously been loaned to Marítimo and was not seen as a serious option.

Amorim began using Geny as a right-back or right-midfielder. That change became one of the defining moments of his success at Sporting CP.

The back three remained, but the setup evolved: Nuno Santos, originally a winger, was now often deployed as a left-back or a left-midfielder. Matheus Reis, a left-back, played as a centre-back. Geny, a left-footed winger, took on the right-back role. Despite still appearing to field five defenders, the team effectively played with only three at the back. Occasionally, Amorim adjusted further — for instance, using Matheus Reis as a left-back to push Geny further forward as a winger.

At the same time, Paulinho started partnering with Gyökeres up front. The once heavily criticised striker finally began to thrive. With less pressure, he operated between the lines, sometimes coming off the bench and creating chances. He evolved from a system with one striker and started some matches with two strikers.

That said, Amorim remains a rigid manager. He famously dropped fan-favourite Slimani, benched another fan-favourite, Jérémy Mathieu, and did the same with Marcos Acuña. His commitment to players like Esgaio or Paulinho, despite poor form, was unwavering.

He is capable of adapting, but only when triggered by an event he deems significant. For example, he eventually gave minutes to Quaresma — a player he had dismissed since his first season and had publicly stated he would not count on again.

This is an excellent and interesting post.

From what I gather, you are saying he lays down the law with players. The Quaresma comment at the end of your post - it will be interesting in Rashford stays and if something similar will happen.

The only thing is and I'm not being disrespectful - and If I am being ignorant you can correct me - I think the time factor for United and Sporting might be so different. The pressure is likely much higher. I really like Ruben, I think he has all the tools to be successful here. The fans are behind him. He knows how to control the media. He seems to have a good relationship with the board. It's our bloody players and their attitudes is what gets all our managers sacked.

United must back him this summer.

 

[Frank White]

This is an excellent and interesting post.

From what I gather, you are saying he lays down the law with players. The Quaresma comment at the end of your post - it will be interesting in Rashford stays and if something similar will happen.

The only thing is and I'm not being disrespectful - and If I am being ignorant you can correct me - I think the time factor for United and Sporting might be so different. The pressure is likely much higher. I really like Ruben, I think he has all the tools to be successful here. The fans are behind him. He knows how to control the media. He seems to have a good relationship with the board. It's our bloody players and their attitudes is what gets all our managers sacked.

United must back him this summer.

Rashford's gone either way I think. Outside of the inconsistency on the pitch his wage is a huge problem and the fee he brings is going to be needed to back Amorim. Be interesting to see what we do with Antony though.

 

[tomaldinho1]

Didn't realise it was that much £3m per position in team struggling with potential PSR problems is pretty significant.

I wonder if it also impact tv money the year after as well. United are a big name but finishing near the relegation places + not exactly being that exciting/high scoring isn't really going to endear us to the tv overlords when the pick games to show.

 

[Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber]

Having seen enough games now under Amorim, how many players do you think will be performing better under this system by next season ?

A good number. Mazraoui and Dalot have significantly improved their understanding of operating as wingbacks as compared to when Amorim first arrived. (Remember thd move vs Arsenal that led to a world class save by Raya)
Yoro, Mazraoui, and De Ligt have all displayed shown improved understanding of operating in a 3 man center back trio. In spite of them errors vs Newcastle from two of them. Martinez too before being struck with injury.

Bruno has adjusted the fastest being able to operate in deeper midfield in a duo. He will be even superior going forward. As will Amad.

I thought Mainoo showed promise as a 10 before injury stalled him.

Zirkzee has showed real progress as a 10 in the system. Plus is starting to understand what Amorim demands from him as a 9 in terms of movement and pressing.

I thought Amass on his debut. Plus Collyier whenever he has played has looked used to the system.

In spite of initial growing pains. He has found a role in which he can groom Garnacho in this system. His recent performances as an inside right 10 have shown glimses of promise.

I'm quietly confident those that stay beyond the summer will be assets in this system.

 

[Frank White]

I wonder if it also impact tv money the year after as well. United are a big name but finishing near the relegation places + not exactly being that exciting/high scoring isn't really going to endear us to the tv overlords when the pick games to show.

Who knows. Think Uniteds pull is still top tier be that actual fans who want to watch or oppo fans who want to laugh at how shite we are.

 

[Stig]

But you've also seen Moyes go into clubs and struggle right?

So how does that work with your theory? Was Moyes a bad manager then but a good manager now?

Or are other factors at play?

It's all a bit crazy and unpredictable.

 

[RedRocket9908]

Having seen enough games now under Amorim, how many players do you think will be performing better under this system by next season ?

Very few of the current players will be performing better under this system by next season, if they cant perform better in it after 5 months of competitive games I doubt they are suddenly going to improve in it after a few pre-season friendlies in Malaysia

 

[DSG]

Fair enough but our current struggles under Amorim aren't solely down to switching formation. And our struggles under Tan Hag for 18 months weren't due to playing 4231 either it was primarily due to Ten Hag employing a brand of football that made little or no sense and stubbornly sticking with it. We did fine in 22/23 with 4231 using more sensible tactics.

I'd agree that this squad is more suited to 4231/433 but I think most of our struggles this season can be traced back to a lack of quality training under Ten Hag, virtually no midfield/defensive structure being implemented for a long period (something Amorim has improved), key personnel missing and a factor that gets overlooked I feel. This squad virtually to a man has or was rock bottom in terms of confidence. Half of them look much worse players than they are right now.

The single most damaging aspect of the Ten Hag era was a lack of quality in recruitment. I don’t think the formation really matters. An extreme example, but if we had Alphonse Davies and Hakimi at wingback, Rice and Neves at CM, Wirtz at 10 and Harry Kane, we’d be challenging for the league. Obviously not all of those were even available, but talent matters.

I think if you look at top 15 clubs in the world, virtually every one of our first choice 11 would be squad rotation players. Maybe only Bruno would be in with a shout.

 

[Raoul]

Very few of the current players will be performing better under this system by next season, if they cant perform better in it after 5 months of competitive games I doubt they are suddenly going to improve in it after a few pre-season friendlies in Malaysia

The players are performing the way they are because Amorim doesn’t have the pieces in place to implement his formation and tactics. Some of the current players will settle into that next year along with a few new arrivals. Those who aren’t ideal for Amorim’s style of play will leave.

 

[NicolaSacco]

The single most damaging aspect of the Ten Hag era was a lack of quality in recruitment.

Do you think this was apparent at the time? I think we can see in hindsight that he made some pretty awful buys, particularly on long, expensive contracts.

Looking back at it, I don’t think his first year was too bad at first glance. Although that second season does look abysmal. I just can’t remember if it was considered bad at the time, or whether it’s hindsight.

 

[Big Ben Foster]

Do you think this was apparent at the time? I think we can see in hindsight that he made some pretty awful buys, particularly on long, expensive contracts.

Looking back at it, I don’t think his first year was too bad at first glance. Although that second season does look abysmal. I just can’t remember if it was considered bad at the time, or whether it’s hindsight.

Yes, in the first summer many of us were ringing the alarm bells when it became clear the club was going to continue letting the manager drive recruitment and handpick targets.

 

[NicolaSacco]

Yes, in the first summer many of us were ringing the alarm bells when it became clear the club was going to continue letting the manager drive recruitment and handpick targets.

Yeah fair enough. I think his first summer was actually better than his second, but you’ve reminded me about the worries on here, especially focusing on players he’d managed before.

 

[Godfather]

Very few of the current players will be performing better under this system by next season, if they cant perform better in it after 5 months of competitive games I doubt they are suddenly going to improve in it after a few pre-season friendlies in Malaysia

I agree. Huge squad overhaul is needed. Early in the window too.

 

[tomaldinho1]

Do you think this was apparent at the time? I think we can see in hindsight that he made some pretty awful buys, particularly on long, expensive contracts.

Looking back at it, I don’t think his first year was too bad at first glance. Although that second season does look abysmal. I just can’t remember if it was considered bad at the time, or whether it’s hindsight.

I feel this happens with every manager though. Ole’s window of Varane, Sancho and Ronaldo was praised on here about best ever by some. Look at it now. Jose saddled us with almost no one that stayed long term apart from bloody Lindelof. He also got Dalot although as a cheap punt but he’s been ok broadly speaking I guess.

Ineos will struggle to be worse than the post SAF years.

 

[Abhinav]

The situation looks a bit grim but we must allow him to get a couple of attackers before we judge him. Goals win matches and lack of goals loose matches. Despite playing well and appearing comfortable in a lot of the games, we lose or draw matches because our attackers are not able to put the ball in the back of the net.
Look at Mendes’ goal for PSG vs Villa just now - the ball was bouncing but he finished it with ease. That’s the kind of ruthlessness we need.

 

[NicolaSacco]

I feel this happens with every manager though. Ole’s window of Varane, Sancho and Ronaldo was praised on here about best ever by some. Look at it now. Jose saddled us with almost no one that stayed long term apart from bloody Lindelof. He also got Dalot although as a cheap punt but he’s been ok broadly speaking I guess.

Ineos will struggle to be worse than the post SAF years.

I guess the thing is, when you look at those 3 big signings, it’s two genuinely world class players, ‘legends’ of the game, and one of the most highly rated forwards in Europe. You can see why people were so pleased.
Looking back, Mourinho’s signings really were the gift that keeps on giving though. I don’t think I’d registered quite how little they took Utd forward as a team.

 

[Gavinb33]

Very few of the current players will be performing better under this system by next season, if they cant perform better in it after 5 months of competitive games I doubt they are suddenly going to improve in it after a few pre-season friendlies in Malaysia

People think pre season is some kind of pancea where 4 weeks will make our center backs miraculously be able to play better in the build up

 

[Escobar]

We have an old Eriksen, washed up Casemiro, naive and young Garnacho, crap and weak Lindelof, young and first season Yoro, no focus Dalot, only shit goalkeepers, debut Amass and a long list of injuries. On top, a club in huge trouble for all the wrong reasons.

Do you really think we can play successfull, great football?

 

[frostbite]

We have an old Eriksen, washed up Casemiro, naive and young Garnacho, crap and weak Lindelof, young and first season Yoro, no focus Dalot, only shit goalkeepers, debut Amass and a long list of injuries. On top, a club in huge trouble for all the wrong reasons.

Do you really think we can play successfull, great football?

Between playing "successful, great football" and losing 4-1, there are many other possibilities.

Right now, the question is not if Amorim is a world class manager, the question is if Amorim is any better than ETH.

 

[jem]

Between playing "successful, great football" and losing 4-1, there are many other possibilities.

Right now, the question is not if Amorim is a world class manager, the question is if Amorim is any better than ETH.

I fail to see how Amorim holds much of the blame for that when you have yet another keeper gifting a goal (and another keeper that he inherited), a normally reliable player slipping, and a young academy player (who many have been urging him to play) get caught out of position. I do think he kind of fecked up playing Zirkzee, but other than that, I think it was just one of those days. Of course, there will be no excuses for the team not turning up on Thursday.

 

[frostbite]

I fail to see how Amorim holds much of the blame for that when you have yet another keeper gifting a goal (and another keeper that he inherited), a normally reliable player slipping, and a young academy player (who many have been urging him to play) get caught out of position. I do think he kind of fecked up playing Zirkzee, but other than that, I think it was just one of those days. Of course, there will be no excuses for the team not turning up on Thursday.

Again, the question is: Is Amorim any better than ETH?

Perhaps it is too early to answer this question with any confidence. However, so far the results say no. We'll see...

 

[JPRouve]

Again, the question is: Is Amorim any better than ETH?

Perhaps it is too early to answer this question with any confidence. However, so far the results say no. We'll see...

The answer is currently, maybe. There is no way to tell one way or the other.

 

[Escobar]

Between playing "successful, great football" and losing 4-1, there are many other possibilities.

Right now, the question is not if Amorim is a world class manager, the question is if Amorim is any better than ETH.

Newcastle are currently so much better in terms of players. Compare their midfield to ours, no wonder we lost

 

[pcaming]

I fail to see how Amorim holds much of the blame for that when you have yet another keeper gifting a goal (and another keeper that he inherited), a normally reliable player slipping, and a young academy player (who many have been urging him to play) get caught out of position. I do think he kind of fecked up playing Zirkzee, but other than that, I think it was just one of those days. Of course, there will be no excuses for the team not turning up on Thursday.

He gets blame because the side he puts out every week can't keep a clean sheet, can't control and can't create/score.

Confidence is in the floor, performances have never risen.

Every game his head is in his hands because his team is pathetic. People are hanging on to his sporting tenure, because every aspect of his united tenure is awful. He is our Villas-Boas.

 

[Redstain]

Between playing "successful, great football" and losing 4-1, there are many other possibilities.

Right now, the question is not if Amorim is a world class manager, the question is if Amorim is any better than ETH.

Classic case of two managers who don't have the capacity to get United back on top.

I think Amorim would be very very lucky in his entire three year tenure to match the season that Erik did in his first year at United.

There was a massive drop off after the EFL cup final but subjectively for me the team played well for three consecutive months in that season, at the moment Amorim can't even play well for three consecutive games.

Ruben is arguably the worst manager at United given his infancy but that changes if the team performs drastically well next season or at the very least he wins the Europa league. The fact that no matter top 10, mid table or relegation fodder every game feels like the team is the underdog is not just indicative of the teams quality but the instructions they are recieving in the system the manager is deploying.

 

[Redstain]

He gets blame because the side he puts out every week can't keep a clean sheet.

This is a worry as well, out of every position on the field the defence for quality is one of the most well covered areas yet the team always concedes significant chances.

Having Onana doesn't help but on the balance of play, United are so vulnerable in the areas either side of the wider defensive centre backs and wingbacks. Additionally, when you consider that there's an average 6-7 defensive orientated players in most fixtures it further exposes Amorim's inability to adequately coach this formation out of possession.

Remember posting beforehand with my expectations for the team (before Rubens appointment) to struggle scoring goals but to be robust defensively. Therefore the club have a manager with a pragmatic ideology yet still the teams performances aren't benefitting from these approaches.

 

[acnumber9]

Newcastle are currently so much better in terms of players. Compare their midfield to ours, no wonder we lost

One of their midfielders is a guy who was a laughing stock as a striker who their manager has developed into a good midfielder. That’s what good coaching can do. Make players better. Make a team more than the sum of its parts. Amorim is failing to do that and that is a managers main responsibility.

 

[DJ_21]

Newcastle are currently so much better in terms of players. Compare their midfield to ours, no wonder we lost

Compare there owners to ours aswell. They’ll start challenging for trophies now because just like city when they get bought by billionaires they become relevant

 

[Superunknown]

He gets blame because the side he puts out every week can't keep a clean sheet, can't control and can't create/score.

Confidence is in the floor, performances have never risen.

Every game his head is in his hands because his team is pathetic. People are hanging on to his sporting tenure, because every aspect of his united tenure is awful. He is our Villas-Boas.

I've been critical of Amorim over the last few pages, mainly based on that second half performance against Newcastle. However, I will say that the chaotic nature of the ETH era (specifically last season) where we were facing 20+ shots in a game and getting overrun in midfield and defensively is very different to now. There is a lot more control to our play and we do look tougher to beat, barring the individual errors which keep happening (which I do maintain that Amorim has a significant part to play with eliminating within the squad - it's a focus thing). The way we're losing games is different to the way we were losing last season. The chance creation and finishing is a bigger issue.

 

[DJ_21]

Classic case of two managers who don't have the capacity to get United back on top.

I think Amorim would be very very lucky in his entire three year tenure to match the season that Erik did in his first year at United.

There was a massive drop off after the EFL cup final but subjectively for me the team played well for three consecutive months in that season, at the moment Amorim can't even play well for three consecutive games.

Ruben is arguably the worst manager at United given his infancy but that changes if the team performs drastically well next season or at the very least he wins the Europa league. The fact that no matter top 10, mid table or relegation fodder every game feels like the team is the underdog is not just indicative of the teams quality but the instructions they are recieving in the system the manager is deploying.

this is a joke. How many times do we see this same sentence mentioned. ETH came under this category aswell. We’ve seen progress the last few weeks and people was praising Amorim and then we come up against Newcastle who are a very good team at home and they beat us down to individual mistakes. I actually thought we could have won it the way we played first half and so did a lot of other people but mistakes cost us.

 

[Leftback99]

One of their midfielders is a guy who was a laughing stock as a striker who their manager has developed into a good midfielder. That’s what good coaching can do. Make players better. Make a team more than the sum of its parts. Amorim is failing to do that and that is a managers main responsibility.

Why were only 3 of the team that started on Sunday there before he joined then? Why didn't he coach the rest to be good?

 

[Teja]

I've been critical of Amorim over the last few pages, mainly based on that second half performance against Newcastle. However, I will say that the chaotic nature of the ETH era (specifically last season) where we were facing 20+ shots in a game and getting overrun in midfield and defensively is very different to now. There is a lot more control to our play and we do look tougher to beat, barring the individual errors which keep happening (which I do maintain that Amorim has a significant part to play with eliminating within the squad - it's a focus thing). The way we're losing games is different to the way we were losing last season. The chance creation and finishing is a bigger issue.

All nuance has gone from this thread

It looks like it's going the same way as all our manager threads over the past decade - a couple of bad results and the haters come in and have a go and a few good results and all the supporters will come in and praise him as the next coming of Fergie.

As you say, it's much more productive to look beyond the results and evaluate how we press, how many chances we create, how effectively we build up and so on. Stats can help quite a bit here.

 

[Superunknown]

All nuance has gone from this thread

It looks like it's going the same way as all our manager threads over the past decade - a couple of bad results and the haters come in and have a go and a few good results and all the supporters will come in and praise him as the next coming of Fergie.

As you say, it's much more productive to look beyond the results and evaluate how we press, how many chances we create, how effectively we build up and so on. Stats can help quite a bit here.

The best way I can summarise what I'm feeling is that Amorim has presented us with a different set of problems compared to the ones we had under ETH, or at least at a different end of the scale. There are a few issues which have plagued both, which is work rate, determination to win back the ball, mentality, poor individual errors, etc. We had the "doughnut in midfield" during ETH's time and there was no control whatsoever, so this is an improvement on that. We've taken it the other way where it's almost become too defensive or feels that way at times. I welcome more control of the ball and that's what top teams should be doing.

But, the first question I ask myself with this current team is "where are the goals going to come from?" There's a range of factors to look at there with our recruitment, form of the players, the players who have been shipped out on loan, etc. That isn't strictly down to Amorim and I can't lay all of the blame at his door, but it is a problem that he has to have an answer to if we're going to win games.

 

[Cathy Ferguson]

The best way I can summarise what I'm feeling is that Amorim has presented us with a different set of problems compared to the ones we had under ETH, or at least at a different end of the scale. There are a few issues which have plagued both, which is work rate, determination to win back the ball, mentality, poor individual errors, etc. We had the "doughnut in midfield" during ETH's time and there was no control whatsoever, so this is an improvement on that. We've taken it the other way where it's almost become too defensive or feels that way at times. I welcome more control of the ball and that's what top teams should be doing.

But, the first question I ask myself with this current team is "where are the goals going to come from?" There's a range of factors to look at there with our recruitment, form of the players, the players who have been shipped out on loan, etc. That isn't strictly down to Amorim and I can't lay all of the blame at his door, but it is a problem that he has to have an answer to if we're going to win games.

Most likely we will play 3 CBs and Dalot, Dorgu and Ugarte also next season. We need to have one hell of a transfer window if we are to radically improve our goalscoring and chance creating.

 

[Superunknown]

Most likely we will play 3 CBs and Dalot, Dorgu and Ugarte also next season. We need to have one hell of a transfer window if we are to radically improve our goalscoring and chance creating.

Amad being back is also going to be a huge plus. It's really unfortunate that he's been out as he has already become a significant goal threat for us. Question marks about where he plays, however.

 

[LordSpud]

No, we are saying that United needs a long term reset and fix, not someone to "fix it a little" and "play to players strengths".

You are looking at short term meaningless results and getting angry that you can't get dopamine hits from sharing "yey we won" on social media.

Nothing is new. Amorim wants a style and we see glimpses of it.
Half of our squad is not good enough. Half of the other half are inconsistent.

We need a proper window and good preseason.

It's astonishing how some posters are desperate for a "yes man" in charge who will "fix it a little".

To build a new house, you burn the old one down.
And when the pillars of the old house are the likes of Onana, it's super simple to burn.

We've only got enough money to build a house out of sticks though. The wolves in the Premier League will be blowing that shit down every week

 

[tomaldinho1]

I guess the thing is, when you look at those 3 big signings, it’s two genuinely world class players, ‘legends’ of the game, and one of the most highly rated forwards in Europe. You can see why people were so pleased.
Looking back, Mourinho’s signings really were the gift that keeps on giving though. I don’t think I’d registered quite how little they took Utd forward as a team.

Yh Mou’s I think were the worst of em everyone. LVG’s maybe the best but it’s a low bar.