Lamine Yamal

Very good player for his age but getting a little bit over the top by some putting him in conversations with Ronaldinho, Messi etc. That’s beyond silly if we’re being honest. Even with Salah for this season tbh.

Ridiculously exciting to watch at times but he hasn’t even been Barcas best player this season. Raphina has been better and Lewandowski continues to be outstanding and Barca wouldn’t be where they are without him but likely would without Yamal this season. Brilliant to watch and could have an incredible career but let’s not go too far this early.

Agree. I think we're all a bit desperate to see an emerging talent like him. Football has been really lacking in these kind of players. I don't really remember anyone since Neymar with this kind of ability.

The fact that he's 17 is making people overrate him a bit, but being consistent at that level isn't easy.
 
Only player in my time watching football who I think was comparable at the same age (in terms of impacting on games) was Rooney...and even then its not quite the same as he was playing for Everton at the time. Think he was was 18 by the time he was tearing it up at the Euros...although he was ridiculously good at Euro 2004. Yamal is a good player in a team of good players which is a bit different.

Kind of goes hand in hand with the perspective argument too, as Rooney was both younger and better than Ronaldo at that point. Yamal is a different type of player though. Its hard to see how he doesn't get better unless the attitude is bad.
 
He's the "football peaked in the 80s" contingent and draft forum's equivalent of stumbling on a porn magazine stash in the woods as a 13 year old

Otherwise, amazing player. Felt like Inzaghi at half time was just flummoxed
 
Very good player for his age but getting a little bit over the top by some putting him in conversations with Ronaldinho, Messi etc. That’s beyond silly if we’re being honest. Even with Salah for this season tbh.

Ridiculously exciting to watch at times but he hasn’t even been Barcas best player this season. Raphina has been better and Lewandowski continues to be outstanding and Barca wouldn’t be where they are without him but likely would without Yamal this season. Brilliant to watch and could have an incredible career but let’s not go too far this early.

I agree but he’s got a bit of magic about him, and football really needs that right now. He’s going to get even better too. This thread will still be active in a decade and beyond.
 
I agree but he’s got a bit of magic about him, and football really needs that right now. He’s going to get even better too. This thread will still be active in a decade and beyond.

Oh he’s a really good player no doubt and I love to see players that play freely without feeling like they’ve been over coached to almost be robotic which I feel we’ve seen with quite a few promising players in today’s game.

The issue is he’s done it over a short period so far and has a long way to go before even being mentioned with the great names that people are naming in the same sentences as him. Looks class but many times players have struggled to eventually take it to the next level or do it consistently. I don’t think it’s just about the talent either, it’s the mentality and personality too which will be key for somebody like him as he ages.
 
Very good player for his age but getting a little bit over the top by some putting him in conversations with Ronaldinho, Messi etc.

At the same age. That's what we're talking about
That’s beyond silly if we’re being honest. Even with Salah for this season tbh.
Watched them both a lot this season, Yamal is better IMO
Ridiculously exciting to watch at times but he hasn’t even been Barcas best player this season.
As others have stated, the team has been ridiculously dependent on him and looks like a different team when he's not playing.
Raphina has been better

No he hasn't
and Lewandowski continues to be outstanding

Yes, but he is not the best player either. He's the best finisher.
and Barca wouldn’t be where they are without him but likely would without Yamal this season.

Spoken like someone who hasn't really watched Barca this season, with all due respect
Brilliant to watch and could have an incredible career but let’s not go too far this early.
No one knows what will happen in the future. But what he's doing is essentially unprecedented in the modern era (at his age).
 
Oh he’s a really good player no doubt and I love to see players that play freely without feeling like they’ve been over coached to almost be robotic which I feel we’ve seen with quite a few promising players in today’s game.

The issue is he’s done it over a short period so far and has a long way to go before even being mentioned with the great names that people are naming in the same sentences as him. Looks class but many times players have struggled to eventually take it to the next level or do it consistently. I don’t think it’s just about the talent either, it’s the mentality and personality too which will be key for somebody like him as he ages.

100 games isn’t a short period though. People were getting giddy about the likes of Messi and Ronaldo before they’d even played 50 games. What I really can’t get my head around is the way he’s already proven he’s not a one season wonder and he’s still only 17 years old. That is surely unprecedented.
 
At the same age. That's what we're talking about

Watched them both a lot this season, Yamal is better IMO

As others have stated, the team has been ridiculously dependent on him and looks like a different team when he's not playing.


No he hasn't


Yes, but he is not the best player either. He's the best finisher.


Spoken like someone who hasn't really watched Barca this season, with all due respect

No one knows what will happen in the future. But what he's doing is essentially unprecedented in the modern era (at his

Disagree.

The numbers also don’t lie. Yamal is a very good player playing at the highest level and performing and could be a great, but you don’t ignore the numbers. Raphina has been as important if not more important this season and outdone him comfortably in numbers. It’s no disrespect to Yamal or saying he’s not quality, he just isn’t better than some of the names people are throwing around. You could stick somebody like Lewandowski in any team of league in the world and he would score you buckets of goals, that’s a true top player. Let’s not overrate and over hype Yamal this early. I get and understand the hype, I just don’t agree that he’s the best in the world or the best player at Barcelona currently or should be mentioned alongside Messi, Ronaldo etc.
 
There’s a lack of exciting attacking/flair players imo, especially compared to years gone by.

If by flair you mean pure dribblers then sure, not many mazy runs since Messi semi-retired, but there's plenty of artistry in all positions today.

:lol: This is a pretty unbelievable statement.

Really? How so?
 
If by flair you mean pure dribblers then sure, not many mazy runs since Messi semi-retired, but there's plenty of artistry in all positions today.



Really? How so?
The artistry: *playmaker plays a pass back to the CB after not wanting to lose the ball with a risky pass*

Or

*winger gets the ball on the wing and plays the ball backwards instead of taking on fullback*
 
If by flair you mean pure dribblers then sure, not many mazy runs since Messi semi-retired, but there's plenty of artistry in all positions today.



Really? How so?

The out of control corruption of the top league in the world (and the fact they can’t govern themselves adequately), leading to seasons and seasons of football played under a cloud.

The embarrassing behaviour of top clubs like Real and Barcelona recently. Real getting on like babies over basic decisions and overshadowing events on the field with their nonsense. Barca not registering or even communicating with their own players properly as they jump from lever to lever and cheapen their legacy.

Organizations like FIFA pushing for more and more games, and exhausted/injured players going months with no form whatsoever because of it. Traditional tournaments (see the Copa America) getting cheapened and overplayed to make some quick money.

Multi club investors turning historically great clubs into mere feeder teams in a system that breeds even more corruption.

Top leagues turning into processions (like Ligue 1) that threaten the very future of the football in their country.

The exploitation of young footballers in places like Africa, basically being trafficked so others can profit.

And that’s before you even get to how much the entertainment value of the game is suffering from system football and an emphasis on athleticism. There have been so, so many poor games in the PL this season, and it will only get worse as more teams try and coach individuality out of the sport.

And that’s just a start…

Football is in the worst shape it’s ever been in, I feel. Money will eventually ruin the game completely.
 
Disagree.

The numbers also don’t lie.

Numbers need context. Denis Law scored more goals for Manchester United than Geroge Best, does that mean he is better? Henry scored more goals for France than Zidane, is he better? I don't understand this reasoning
Yamal is a very good player playing at the highest level and performing and could be a great, but you don’t ignore the numbers.

The person who scores the most goals is not necessarily the best player in the team.
Raphina has been as important if not more important this season and outdone him comfortably in numbers.

This sounds like I'm doing down Raphinha and I'm really not, he's been superb. But how often have you actually watched the team play?
It’s no disrespect to Yamal or saying he’s not quality, he just isn’t better than some of the names people are throwing around.

Which names specifically?
You could stick somebody like Lewandowski in any team of league in the world and he would score you buckets of goals, that’s a true top player.

Not sure of the relevance
Let’s not overrate and over hype Yamal this early.

I don't think people are, they are reacting to what they see
I get and understand the hype, I just don’t agree that he’s the best in the world
OK. Some others do. But to be fair, there's not a lot of amazing players around at the moment. It's a fallow period in that respect.
or the best player at Barcelona currently
He is the best player at Barca currently, along with Pedri
or should be mentioned alongside Messi, Ronaldo etc.
Literally no one said this.
 
He's the "football peaked in the 80s" contingent and draft forum's equivalent of stumbling on a porn magazine stash in the woods as a 13 year old

Otherwise, amazing player. Felt like Inzaghi at half time was just flummoxed
He was . At full time too
 
If by flair you mean pure dribblers then sure, not many mazy runs since Messi semi-retired, but there's plenty of artistry in all positions today.



Really? How so?
Um, where?
 
In conversations like this, some people believe numbers are useless.
False. The issue is people referring to 'numbers' and basically meaning 'goals (and sometimes assists)', and then saying that this is enough to determine that one player is better than another. Which makes no sense.

If you're going to argue that watching football matches and making decisions on who is good and who is not based on that is flawed because of the subjectivity, then fair anough. But a stats based argument has to take into account all the stats, not just goals.

For example Yamal has the most completed dribbles in La Liga this season, some 30 more than the next highest person and almost 70 more than Raphinha. Why is that not part of the 'numbers' consideration?
 
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Ridiculously exciting to watch at times but he hasn’t even been Barcas best player this season.
You could just say you never watched Barcelona play this season
 
The artistry: *playmaker plays a pass back to the CB after not wanting to lose the ball with a risky pass*

Or

*winger gets the ball on the wing and plays the ball backwards instead of taking on fullback*

More goals are being scored across football. Are these all from backward pass assists?

Um, where?

Wirtz? De Bruyne? Salah? Vinicius? Odegaard? Mbappe? The list goes on? TAA? Rodri? Gvardiol?

What exactly are ye looking for? The technical floor has been lifted, we have CBs dribbling out of defense now
 
More goals are being scored across football. Are these all from backward pass assists?



Wirtz? De Bruyne? Salah? Vinicius? Odegaard? Mbappe? The list goes on?
Because the game is more focused on pressing and forcing mistakes... the speed of the players and athleticism is causing this. Not magic from playmakers/wingers/flair players in general.
 
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Ironically, we've moved away from players being respected for playing a team game - Yamal is already on Ronaldinho's level, but what he does isn't going to be enough until he becomes [a lot] more selfish and focused more on winning games himself than setting others up (endlessly) to do so.

He plays with a lot of joy and fun at the moment; if he's anything like Messi and C.Ron, that joy might evaporate and be replaced by sheer, ruthless efficiency and focus on the objective. By that estimation, we'd have about 6-8 years left (on account of him being so stupidly young)
I think you can throw the accusation of selfishness or lack of joy in the game at Cristiano but not at Messi. Unfair that they are lumped together like this.
Yep. 100 games by 17 years old for an elite club like Barcelona is crazy stuff. We occasionally rest kids his age in school because they're playing multiple sports. He'll need to be looked after.
People compare him to a 17 year old Messi who played 9 matches, all cameos from the bench, throughout season 2004/5 at 17. There was a good reason, and it wasn’t that he was not good enough. It was that he was being taken care off. With Yamal, he is being overplayed right now; Barcelona really haven’t had much of an option. Reminds me of Rooney in that way.
False. The issue is people referring to 'numbers' and basically meaning 'goals (and sometimes assists)', and then saying that this is enough to determine that one player is better than another. Which makes no sense.

If you're going to argue that watching football matches and making decisions on who is good and who is not based on that is flawed because of the subjectivity, then fair anough. But a stats based argument has to take into account all the stats, not just goals.

For example Yamal has the most completed dribbles in La Liga this season, some 30 more than the next highest person and almost 70 more than Raphinha. Why is that not part of the 'numbers' consideration?
Aren’t you the one who argued about Messi's lack off goal/assist in a final for Argentina? Moving goalposts eh?

Anyway, i agree with you regarding Yamal in the sense that there are players who are beyond goals/assists stats, Yamal is one of them. To truly understand him, one must watch him play. It was the some in the Messi vs Cristiano debate as well.
False. The issue is people referring to 'numbers' and basically meaning 'goals (and sometimes assists)', and then saying that this is enough to determine that one player is better than another. Which makes no sense.

If you're going to argue that watching football matches and making decisions on who is good and who is not based on that is flawed because of the subjectivity, then fair anough. But a stats based argument has to take into account all the stats, not just goals.

For example Yamal has the most completed dribbles in La Liga this season, some 30 more than the next highest person and almost 70 more than Raphinha. Why is that not part of the 'numbers' consideration?
Most completed in Europe yet below all of Messi's (including at 17 and 18 years) and Neymar's seasons in Europe. He is an elite dribbler but that really isn’t his biggest strength. It is his intelligence and final pass (especially crossing) that really stand out and not just for a 17 year old.
 
Disagree.

The numbers also don’t lie. Yamal is a very good player playing at the highest level and performing and could be a great, but you don’t ignore the numbers.
which numbers, only goals?

That'd make Lukaku 5 times the player Modric or Kroos ever were as Modric had 10 g&a in his "best g&a numbers season" in La Liga, and better than peak Ronaldinho.

You could stick somebody like Lewandowski in any team of league in the world and he would score you buckets of goals, that’s a true top player. Let’s not overrate and over hype Yamal this early.
Are you comparing a striker with Yamal based on goal numbers to decide who's better? Then, there should be tons of players in the world better than Yamal, right now, and Ronaldinho at his peak. The fact that Yamal is now seen as a top-3 player this season shows there are other numbers and there are things beyond goal numbers in football.

Excessive focus on goal numbers can even show Higuain better than Maradona, which is a meme on social media these days to show the uselessness of goal numbers without context.
 
More goals are being scored across football. Are these all from backward pass assists?



Wirtz? De Bruyne? Salah? Vinicius? Odegaard? Mbappe? The list goes on? TAA? Rodri? Gvardiol?

What exactly are ye looking for? The technical floor has been lifted, we have CBs dribbling out of defense now
When people talk about 'artistry,' they mean 'flair', and none of those are flair players, with the exception of Vini. I think you are talking about technical players, and some of those guys are. However, the overall point is that there are not a lot of really exciting players around at the moment compared to 10 or 15 years ago. I'm not sure how that can be argued.
 
Because the game is more focused on pressing and forcing mistakes... the speed of the players and athleticism is causing this. Not magic from playmakers/wingers/flair players in general.

This is related to the common lament of the decline of the classic 10

The creativity of the classic 10 has simply been distributed through the rest of the team either through the number 8s in midfield or the wide forwards up front

Pressing has increased but the quality of build up play has also improved such that teams are better prepared to play through the press (and get rewarded with open space as a result)

It's not all gloom and doom this era
 
Numbers need context. Denis Law scored more goals for Manchester United than Geroge Best, does that mean he is better? Henry scored more goals for France than Zidane, is he better? I don't understand this reasoning


The person who scores the most goals is not necessarily the best player in the team.


This sounds like I'm doing down Raphinha and I'm really not, he's been superb. But how often have you actually watched the team play?


Which names specifically?


Not sure of the relevance


I don't think people are, they are reacting to what they see

OK. Some others do. But to be fair, there's not a lot of amazing players around at the moment. It's a fallow period in that respect.

He is the best player at Barca currently, along with Pedri

Literally no one said this.

You could just say you never watched Barcelona play this season

Watched them most of the season, disagreeing with your opinion means I haven’t watched them? Raphina has been sensational and Lewandowski the same, both have put up better numbers, in fact Raphina has comfortably eclipsed Yamal with numbers while playing a very similar attacking role. They’ve both provided as many important moments as Yamal this season if not more and done it at a higher consistency imo too. It’s not a knock on Yamal, we are talking about two other brilliant players. He’s in the conversation, let’s not get silly acting like I don’t watch Barcelona because I’ve claimed Yamal isn’t their best player. You take Lewandowski out of that team and I don’t believe they get to the levels they have this season. You take Yamal out and replace him with another winger I believe they would provide a very similar output to Yamal, even if they weren’t as exciting or talented. Just my opinion.

Yamal may go on to have an unreal career and be the best player in the world, for me currently he’s not better than Lewandowski, Raphina, Salah and that’s just naming a few of the attacking options, not going into different positions.
 
He's just so ridiculously entertaining to watch. There were times last night when I found myself laughing at the stuff he was doing, just these sublime pieces of skill over and over again. Looks like of those players that will get standing ovations from opposition crowds if he keeps his feet on the ground. Magic.
 
Much more easy on the eye than Messi for me and variety when it’s come to dribbling. Sorry for Dembele, Raphinha and Salah but he is the best player in the world. I don’t rate this Barcelona team, they are very ordinary and this kid is the main reason we are talking about a potential treble, it’s crazy…

Please don’t ruin this genius by overplaying him or asking him to become a stat padder.

Sorry but what? That implies that you think Messi wasn't very easy on the eye when saying 'much more easy'. Messi was as easy on the eye as you are going to get.
 
Watched them most of the season, disagreeing with your opinion means I haven’t watched them? Raphina has been sensational and Lewandowski the same, both have put up better numbers, in fact Raphina has comfortably eclipsed Yamal with numbers while playing a very similar attacking role. They’ve both provided as many important moments as Yamal this season if not more and done it at a higher consistency imo too. It’s not a knock on Yamal, we are talking about two other brilliant players. He’s in the conversation, let’s not get silly acting like I don’t watch Barcelona because I’ve claimed Yamal isn’t their best player. You take Lewandowski out of that team and I don’t believe they get to the levels they have this season. You take Yamal out and replace him with another winger I believe they would provide a very similar output to Yamal, even if they weren’t as exciting or talented. Just my opinion.

Yamal may go on to have an unreal career and be the best player in the world, for me currently he’s not better than Lewandowski, Raphina, Salah and that’s just naming a few of the attacking options, not going into different positions.
Barca fans disagree..

Pedri is the consensus no.1 choice when it comes to their player of the season and it's not even close. Shows once again how useless goal numbers can be without context when choosing the best player in a team.

Lamine is a common name when discussing their player of their season also, see how many times you can spot Lewa below.

www.reddit.com/r/Barca/comments/1jysd0y/who_has_been_ur_player_of_the_season_so_far/?rdt=61915
 
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Sorry but what? That implies that you think Messi wasn't very easy on the eye when saying 'much more easy'. Messi was as easy on the eye as you are going to get.
Well this is your take. Aesthetically I find many players more beautiful to watch, more elegant with the ball (Zidane, Iniesta, R10, etc) but this is subjective. He lacks something, maybe the way he moves, runs, his dribbling is very effective but lack elegance.
 
Barca fans disagree..

Pedri is the consensus no.1 choice when it comes to their player of the season and it's not even close. Shows once again how useless goal numbers can be without context when choosing the best player in a team.

Lamine is a common name when discussing their player of their season also, see how many times you can spot Lewa below.

www.reddit.com/r/Barca/comments/1jysd0y/who_has_been_ur_player_of_the_season_so_far/?rdt=61915

But I’m talking about attackers and not comparing an attacker to other areas of the pitch?

Going off of what you’ve posted more are saying Raphina over Yamal?
 
Watched them most of the season, disagreeing with your opinion means I haven’t watched them? Raphina has been sensational and Lewandowski the same, both have put up better numbers, in fact Raphina has comfortably eclipsed Yamal with numbers while playing a very similar attacking role.
So you haven't seen them then. There absolutely no way anyone who watched them would say this. Barcelona run their entire attack through Lamine. Raphinha, is a finisher
 
There's a distinct lack of flair players nowadays. Football has become very robotic.

If you're defining flair very narrowly to mean rabonas and elasticos and nutmegs then sure, flair has gone down (I don't have enough evidence to the contrary so I won't argue this point)

I just think that overall, imagination and artistry in the game remains significant (it needs to be as team defenses have gotten better). And on robotic-ness, when was football not robotic?
 
If you're defining flair very narrowly to mean rabonas and elasticos and nutmegs then sure, flair has gone down (I don't have enough evidence to the contrary so I won't argue this point)

I just think that overall, imagination and artistry in the game remains significant (it needs to be as team defenses have gotten better). And on robotic-ness, when was football not robotic?
I think he makes a fair point, one that has been made multiple times by others over the last decade. There has been an inverse correlation between the rise of positional football as the dominant football philosophy and individuality, which has resulted in significantly less flair in the game. I don’t see this as being particularly debatable. It’s one of the most obvious trends in football. The trade off is that teams are better organised, keep possession, and are fitter than at any point in the games history.
 
The out of control corruption of the top league in the world (and the fact they can’t govern themselves adequately), leading to seasons and seasons of football played under a cloud.

The embarrassing behaviour of top clubs like Real and Barcelona recently. Real getting on like babies over basic decisions and overshadowing events on the field with their nonsense. Barca not registering or even communicating with their own players properly as they jump from lever to lever and cheapen their legacy.

Organizations like FIFA pushing for more and more games, and exhausted/injured players going months with no form whatsoever because of it. Traditional tournaments (see the Copa America) getting cheapened and overplayed to make some quick money.

Multi club investors turning historically great clubs into mere feeder teams in a system that breeds even more corruption.

Top leagues turning into processions (like Ligue 1) that threaten the very future of the football in their country.

The exploitation of young footballers in places like Africa, basically being trafficked so others can profit.

And that’s before you even get to how much the entertainment value of the game is suffering from system football and an emphasis on athleticism. There have been so, so many poor games in the PL this season, and it will only get worse as more teams try and coach individuality out of the sport.

And that’s just a start…

Football is in the worst shape it’s ever been in, I feel. Money will eventually ruin the game completely.

A lot of these things have been so in football for most of its history. It's like when people complain that there’s too much doping in the Tour de France these days when from the very beginning it was rife with drugs.

The embarrassing behaviour of Real and Barca is not at all new. Countless examples but just one to mention the 1968 Copa del Rey final:

"Real Madrid fans, angry about the refereeing, started throwing bottles at the referee and Barcelona players in the last minutes of the match. Antonio Rigo, the referee of the final, was accused of favouring Barcelona. Regarding the two not awarded penalties, he said "I didn't see a penalty on Amancio, and Serena tripped. He wanted to deceive me by diving when he entered the penalty area." He also accused the Real Madrid manager of trying to bribe him with a pre-match gift. General Franco presented the trophy to Barcelona with a pitch full of bottles."

The Copa America was played every year bar 2 in the 1920s, it used to be every two years so there are actually some longer gaps between them now.

Exploitation of young footballers from places in Africa has been going on a long time.

Everything you read now about the game being better 20 years ago was written about 20 years ago too, always looking back to a golden era. Eamon Dunphy wrote a chapter in Only a Game in 1976 about how there were no entertainers in football anymore like the 1950s and how football was too focused on tactics and athleticism, this was when Cruyff would have been in his pomp.

I generally agree about there being too many fixtures and the Premier League ownership almost being like a list of the worst people in the world. But I've seen how people get nostalgic about the mid 2000s for example when football was really conservative and defensive in style and managers thought they had to play like Jose Mourinho to compete. There were so many bad games back then too, Chelsea winning every game 1-0 or 2-0 was hardly much of a spectacle, or Greece winning the Euros on set-pieces. Then there was the catenaccio era and earlier eras where talented players would just get hacked and hacked out of every game, borderline violence on pitches that were crap that didn't allow for progressive football, with stadiums that were falling apart. I think every era had pros and cons on the pitch and in organisation, you can't say this era is the worst.
 
So you haven't seen them then. There absolutely no way anyone who watched them would say this. Barcelona run their entire attack through Lamine. Raphinha, is a finisher

wtf are you on about at this point mate? No they aren’t the same players but they both play in a similar ATTACKING style position and both have freedom, maybe I just worded it wrong for you to understand what I meant. Basically, you can compare the two. And when you do, Raphina has the better numbers, it’s not hard to comprehend. Let’s stop with the childish “oh my did you disagree so you clearly don’t watch them”. Why would I need to come on to a forum and lie about watching a football team? :lol:
 
Sorry but what? That implies that you think Messi wasn't very easy on the eye when saying 'much more easy'. Messi was as easy on the eye as you are going to get.

Think he means players like Ronaldhino, Neymar type look better when they skip past players. However all is subjective to each persons taste.