2021 American Civil War

calodo2003

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Could just be standard protocol for insurrection response, but worrying if not…

 

WPMUFC

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Karl: "They were saying 'hang Mike Pence.'"

  • Trump: "Because it's common sense, Jon. It's common sense that you're supposed to protect. How can you — if you know a vote is fraudulent, right? — how can you pass on a fraudulent vote to Congress? How can you do that? And I'm telling you: 50/50, it's right down the middle for the top constitutional scholars when I speak to them. Anybody I spoke to — almost all of them at least pretty much agree, and some very much agree with me — because he's passing on a vote that he knows is fraudulent. How can you pass a vote that you know is fraudulent? Now, when I spoke to him, I really talked about all of the fraudulent things that happened during the election. I didn't talk about the main point, which is the legislatures did not approve — five states. The legislatures did not approve all of those changes that made the difference between a very easy win for me in the states, or a loss that was very close, because the losses were all very close."
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https://www.axios.com/trump-hang-mi...dio-4f147245-becf-4766-ac60-7acece6862be.html

The normalisation of political violence continues.

Babbit is now a political martyr, threatening to hang a politician is justified. State GOP reps calling for the burning of books. They are justifying the march to fascism.
 

WPMUFC

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Adisa said:
You can't listen to this and think there's light at the end of the tunnel. The country is finished.
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I don't think the US can survive the new GOP.


6. Appeal to social frustration


One of the most typical features of the historical fascism was the appeal to a frustrated middle class, a class suffering from an economic crisis or feelings of political humiliation, and frightened by the pressure of lower social groups.


7. The obsession with a plot


The followers must feel besieged. The easiest way to solve the plot is the appeal to xenophobia.


8. The enemy is both strong and weak


By a continuous shifting of rhetorical focus, the enemies are at the same time too strong and too weak.


11. Everybody is educated to become a hero


In Ur-Fascist ideology, heroism is the norm. This cult of heroism is strictly linked with the cult of death.
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https://medium.com/digital-diplomacy/umberto-ecos-14-features-of-fascism-explained-by-the-president-d35676852294


The Trump-GOP is following the model to a tee. i'm just pulling out the ones that are related to the discussion but US fascism will not be "nazism".


Trump does not care that his followers wanted to hang pence.
Trump now openly calls the election "the real insurrection"
Trump created a political martyr (hero) of Babbit through her death.
Trump wanted to create "patriotic education"
Trump/GOP claim the Antifa controls the country yet are also "woke *****" that can't control the "masculine uprising"

The ultimate incarnation of Fascism might not be with Trump at the helm. But all it requires is someone savvy enough to take up the mantle.

I get that a lot of my posting seems "doomer", but i see this as a genuine threat to not only US stability ( and the safety of loved ones that live in that country ) but also for what US Fascism might inspire globally.
 

The Firestarter

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In a way this is morbidly fascinating, but the US managed to destroy their "international brand " for less than 20 years. I'd say from 2003 - until present day. What started as backlash for the invasions only got amplified by the social media.
 

MrMarcello

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WPMUFC said:
Right on cue

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Some good replies to that. This one below has replies that mention Mandel's family have disavowed him due to extreme stances. It also mentions Miller, aka Trump's Bormann, was disavowed by his family which I did not know nor can confirm if accurate.

 

Rob

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WPMUFC said:
Right on cue

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I’m weirdly fascinated by American politics, so if you can recommend other good podcasts on the subject, I’ll be grateful.
 

calodo2003

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MrMarcello said:
Some good replies to that. This one below has replies that mention Mandel's family have disavowed him due to extreme stances. It also mentions Miller, aka Trump's Bormann, was disavowed by his family which I did not know nor can confirm if accurate.

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If I was remotely associated to Miller by blood, I’d have disavowed him decades ago.
 

MarylandMUFan

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If I didn't look at the internet, I would have no clue this nonsense was going on. While these right wing nutters are getting a fair amount of publicity, 99% of Americans are going about their daily lives, of which many will struggle to pay their heating bills this winter, let alone buy food and medicine. The midterm showed that after all is said and done, we still vote with our wallets and it's looking bleak for the Dems.
 

VorZakone

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The Firestarter said:
In a way this is morbidly fascinating, but the US managed to destroy their "international brand " for less than 20 years. I'd say from 2003 - until present day. What started as backlash for the invasions only got amplified by the social media.
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It's an interesting point you're making and it may bolster the Chinese regime in becoming more aggressive.
 

njred

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It is getting out of control around here in my opinion. I live in the metro nyc area. Anytime I leave the area the Trump flags suddenly appear as you drive further away. Not only Trump flags but other variations of patriotic symbols on flags. Don’t Tread on Me, black and white stars and stripes, and other bizzare types of flags are on peoples lawns and on peoples trucks. It used to be the Stars and Stripes on July 4th only. Now it’s a whole thing with statements. A lady 3 doors away has been flying a pure black American flag for the past three days. I asked her why and she said it was in support for Steve Bannon. This is in a so called liberal northeast stronghold. Very weird times
 

calodo2003

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njred said:
It is getting out of control around here in my opinion. I live in the metro nyc area. Anytime I leave the area the Trump flags suddenly appear as you drive further away. Not only Trump flags but other variations of patriotic symbols on flags. Don’t Tread on Me, black and white stars and stripes, and other bizzare types of flags are on peoples lawns and on peoples trucks. It used to be the Stars and Stripes on July 4th only. Now it’s a whole thing with statements. A lady 3 doors away has been flying a pure black American flag for the past three days. I asked her why and she said it was in support for Steve Bannon. This is in a so called liberal northeast stronghold. Very weird times
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Jesus. Support for Steve Bannon via flag. We have really sunk to a new low & are dropping still.

Some neighbors of mine can’t believe Steve Bannon has been indicted & Biden is still in office. Their ignorance about basic governmental processes is staggering.
 

njred

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calodo2003 said:
Jesus. Support for Steve Bannon via flag. We have really sunk to a new low & are dropping still.

Some neighbors of mine can’t believe Steve Bannon has been indicted & Biden is still in office. Their ignorance about basic governmental processes is staggering.
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Not to be judgmental but Florida is one confused state especially with who’s in charge. Mum in West Palm doesn’t see too much craziness where she lives in Fla but she does tell me of news stories there about some insane news regarding right wing politics. Where I am is supposed to be a bastion of liberal ideals but the more and more I look around it’s changing. As you get older you kind of read people better and it’s discouraging when you think neighbors are normal decent people end up being something else. I have recently lost a few acquaintances due to our differences in views on politics and especially race. It’s like the past four years has awakened this angry mob of right wing racist brainwashed side of people here.
 

adexkola

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njred said:
It is getting out of control around here in my opinion. I live in the metro nyc area. Anytime I leave the area the Trump flags suddenly appear as you drive further away. Not only Trump flags but other variations of patriotic symbols on flags. Don’t Tread on Me, black and white stars and stripes, and other bizzare types of flags are on peoples lawns and on peoples trucks. It used to be the Stars and Stripes on July 4th only. Now it’s a whole thing with statements. A lady 3 doors away has been flying a pure black American flag for the past three days. I asked her why and she said it was in support for Steve Bannon. This is in a so called liberal northeast stronghold. Very weird times
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The suburbs have always had those people.

They didn't display it, but an hr trip from Grand Central in any direction you'll find plenty of them.
 

calodo2003

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njred said:
Not to be judgmental but Florida is one confused state especially with who’s in charge. Mum in West Palm doesn’t see too much craziness where she lives in Fla but she does tell me of news stories there about some insane news regarding right wing politics. Where I am is supposed to be a bastion of liberal ideals but the more and more I look around it’s changing. As you get older you kind of read people better and it’s discouraging when you think neighbors are normal decent people end up being something else. I have recently lost a few acquaintances due to our differences in views on politics and especially race. It’s like the past four years has awakened this angry mob of right wing racist brainwashed side of people here.
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No, my old home state of Florida is quite polarized. You leave the coasts or travel outside small islands of blue like Gainesville & Tallahassle, you take many, many steps back vis à vis intellect & political progressivism. Their dwarf governor is flaming these fires of discontent. These people have always lived in the hinterlands & have had such backwards, neck mindsets, but the egregiousness & illumination of their beliefs has been muted in the past. No more now.

I currently find myself in Savannah, GA, a liberal bastion, but you go inland 20 miles & the same horseshit pops up all the way to Atlanta with a small break around Macon.
 
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