Inigo Montoya
Leave Wayne Rooney alone!!
- Joined
- Oct 1, 2008
- Messages
- 38,543
How about Ten Haag?
Does his dial go to eleven?
Does his dial go to eleven?
Fully agree. Cavani was a panick buy. Not sure who Utd were after to compensate getting Cavani. DVB is a strange one. I think he is a top player, but ye looks like Ole doesnt fancy him. Ut's transfer window was nothing short of abysmal.I wouldnt have thought Cavani was an Ole player, VdB was a strange transfer considering you have Bruno and Pogba. Sancho was clearly the target.
We have 6 players for 3 berths. Finding the right combination To start with the right back up appears to be a conundrumI wouldnt have thought Cavani was an Ole player, VdB was a strange transfer considering you have Bruno and Pogba. Sancho was clearly the target.
You were lucky to beat Ajax IMO because you lost in the first leg and and were 2-0 down in the second leg and if it wasn't for Ten Hag's naivety you would've been out because he carried on sacrificing defensive stability for goals.We're talking about an Ajax team that had already dispensed Real Madrid and Juventus in the knockout stages and who didn't lose to Bayern home or away in the group stage. An Ajax team who's players have since left to populate many of the top teams across Europe in various different leagues. You also have changed your stance slightly. I was mostly responding to you saying we were lucky to win the game. In every single possible metric (other than beauty of football played and I assume total number of passes made), we were better in that game and deserved to win.
I think that is a very simplistic reading of the CL final. It was played out between two tired teams, in heat, with an incredibly early award of a penalty, which made the game incredibly dull. Both teams were clearly nervous and nothing was comfortable about that game. Neither team imposed anything on the other, it was a shite game. It is also worth noting that our approach and general play was different in the Dortmund, City, Ajax and Liverpool games.
I think that is a totally reasonable desire, though I think preferring Rodgers slightly goes against that.
For what Davies said, I don't think many people would deny that Mourinho is overall a much better coach than Poch or that his CV isn't significantly more illustrious or that he isn't better in situations where more is at stake. Though I have my doubts about whether Mourinho could have done what Poch did at Spurs over his entire spell.
My issue is that Davies can blow smoke up his current boss' ass without disparaging his former, especially when that former gave him the opportunity to play at such a high level in the first place. And while he's reliable, he's kind of won that LB spot almost by default as Rose continues to self-destruct and be a general ass.
Ok, agree to disagree then, we're clearly not going to see eye to eye here. I don't see how a team that has more possession, shots, shots on target, Xg and actual goals scored can be lucky to win but there we go. The goals are equally as valid whether scored in the 1st minute or last and football fans have a tendency to see last minute goal scored as somehow lucky.You were lucky to beat Ajax IMO because you lost in the first leg and and were 2-0 down in the second leg and if it wasn't for Ten Hag's naivety you would've been out because he carried on sacrificing defensive stability for goals.
The Champions League final was won comfortably by Liverpool. Whether both teams were tired after a long season is irrelevant.
Whether Davies is good enough or shouldn't be making disparaging comments about his former coach is irrelevant to the discussion. The fact is that he's made the comment which I felt needed discussing considering he (Davies) was a player that was coached by Poch.
Fully agree. Cavani was a panick buy. Not sure who Utd were after to compensate getting Cavani. DVB is a strange one. I think he is a top player, but ye looks like Ole doesnt fancy him. Ut's transfer window was nothing short of abysmal.
I'm not denying VdB's ability I would have him starting ahead of Pogba (who I do rate) as his form and fitness seem shot to pieces. Thing is VdB doesnt seem to be given a fair shot to establish himself for whatever reason.We have 6 players for 3 berths. Finding the right combination To start with the right back up appears to be a conundrum
I don't look at games like that because for me stats are interesting to observe but I never form my views on a game over stats and even your current manager agrees with me below. But for me Ajax were 3-0 up and they kept on sacrificing defensive stability which gave Spurs the opportunity to get back into the game.Ok, agree to disagree then, we're clearly not going to see eye to eye here. I don't see how a team that has more possession, shots, shots on target, Xg and actual goals scored can be lucky to win but there we go. The goals are equally as valid whether scored in the 1st minute or last and football fans have a tendency to see last minute goal scored as somehow lucky.
Mourinho is clearly a better coach than Poch, especially if you're talking about one-off situations and past CV. Whether he'll have the same level of success as Poch at Spurs (or more than him) is still to be seen.
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Fair enough. It can go both ways though, as we, and our current, found out recently as we were coasting into the 80th minute with a 3 goal lead against West Ham!I don't look at games like that because for me stats are interesting to observe but I never form my views on a game over stats and even your current manager agrees with me below. But for me Ajax were 3-0 up and they kept on sacrificing defensive stability which gave Spurs the opportunity to get back into the game.
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I hope you're right mate and I hope if we do appoint him he proves me wrong and wins us titles.
That's fair enough mate..Fair enough. It can go both ways though, as we, and our current, found out recently as we were coasting into the 80th minute with a 3 goal lead against West Ham!
We'll see. Not sure I see Man Utd going for Poch anyway. As I said, as time went on, as much as I loved him, I saw us fall short a frustrating number of times in the biggest games. But if he does make the move, perhaps Poch makes that final leap at Man Utd. If he does go there, I wish him the best of luck (when he's not playing us of course).
I think VdB was bought by Woodward and Ole didn't want him. He wanted Grealish..I'm not denying VdB's ability I would have him starting ahead of Pogba (who I do rate) as his form and fitness seem shot to pieces. Thing is VdB doesnt seem to be given a fair shot to establish himself for whatever reason.
It was reported that Ole wanted both Haaland and Grealish. Haaland didn't happen because it was reported that he wanted a buyout clause in his contract and felt Solskjaer may not last long as United manager so chose BVB who are a enticing development school in European football for young players and play Champions League football regularly. So it makes sense signing someone like Cavani on a short team deal rather than panicking and signing someone for big money because they're the best available option.I wouldnt have thought Cavani was an Ole player, VdB was a strange transfer considering you have Bruno and Pogba. Sancho was clearly the target.
To be fair to him, while I strongly dislike the guy, Mourinho is one of the best tactical minds in all of football history. You only need to listen to his analysis when he was doing his punditry to understand as such. I think where he fails these days is being able to translate his ideas onto the field, but I don't doubt that his understanding of the game is above probably any coach in world football right now.And as far as what Davies said, I do believe that Mourinho is tactically superior to Poch as far as winning games of football go and he's got big trophies on his CV/resume starting from his Porto days.
VdB said himself that the deciding factor of him coming here was Ole persuading him. So I don't think it's a Woody signing.I think VdB was bought by Woodward and Ole didn't want him. He wanted Grealish..
Yet when you look at Pochs record against the big clubs, his tactical game is clearly his biggest weakness. If you feel frustrated with Oles tactics, prepare for a new tier of annoyance with Poch. He's the wrong Manager for us imo.To be fair to him, while I strongly dislike the guy, Mourinho is one of the best tactical minds in all of football history. You only need to listen to his analysis when he was doing his punditry to understand as such. I think where he fails these days is being able to translate his ideas onto the field, but I don't doubt that his understanding of the game is above probably any coach in world football right now.
Being tactically inferior to Mourinho is nothing to be ashamed of, especially when what you see on the field from Poch is better IMO.
Mourinho's analysis on Sky was truely educational and I thorougly enjoyed it. He was on a completely different level to the rest that appear on there. And i'm someone that was a big critic of his during his time here but I have to admit his break down of a football match from a tactical POV was amazing for a tactics geek like myself.To be fair to him, while I strongly dislike the guy, Mourinho is one of the best tactical minds in all of football history. You only need to listen to his analysis when he was doing his punditry to understand as such. I think where he fails these days is being able to translate his ideas onto the field, but I don't doubt that his understanding of the game is above probably any coach in world football right now.
Being tactically inferior to Mourinho is nothing to be ashamed of, especially when what you see on the field from Poch is better IMO.
Yep. I genuinely hope when he calls it a day from management that he goes into the football analysis gig full time. He is on another planet to anyone really that you usually see on there.Mourinho's analysis on Sky was truely educational and I thorougly enjoyed it. He was on a completely different level to the rest that appear on there. And i'm someone that was a big critic of his during his time here but I have to admit his break down of a football match from a tactical POV was amazing for a tactics geek like myself.
Only one who says world class is prob @Amadaeus but there's no denying he did a very solid job at both Totteham and Southampton. My issue is the obvious which is that at Tottenham he layed a very good foundation, built a solid team with class players but with our owners and structure he would probably struggle so thats my worry.Describing Poch as potentially world class seems a stretch to me, but maybe he is, but is his style of football actually what we want going forward?
I’d take Rose first over the others. Not that he’d leave this season thoughOle Hasenhüttl Nagelsman Poch Rose Ten Hag Brendan Rodgers. Give all these managers quality players that fit their system, which of them do you think will win the league?
He bought Son and Moura, and Kane maintains that Poch was the one that brought him on.Describing Poch as potentially world class seems a stretch to me, but maybe he is, but is his style of football actually what we want going forward?
Its funny how HE bought all the players that worked and Levy bought ALL the players that were shite.He bought Son and Moura, and Kane maintains that Poch was the one that brought him on.
Defensively Spurs looked good with Toby.
Whatever you feel about him, his teams have been excellent to watch
I’ve no idea about Levy, all I saw is what the players offered under him. If Levy bought them then brilliant but Poch had to work with them.Its funny how HE bought all the players that worked and Levy bought ALL the players that were shite.
Maybe none of the coaches mentioned would win the league. But with the exception of Poch the rest would at the very least implement a attacking brand of football with the evidence at hand.Ole Hasenhüttl Nagelsman Poch Rose Ten Hag Brendan Rodgers. Give all these managers quality players that fit their system, which of them do you think will win the league?
What else was he going to say?VdB said himself that the deciding factor of him coming here was Ole persuading him. So I don't think it's a Woody signing.
How come?I’d take Rose first over the others. Not that he’d leave this season though
This is always such a shit takeWhat else was he going to say?
I’m joining Utd for Only the money As I don’t rate Ole
I don't think it's that damning. They probably talked up the CL final as a once in a lifetime opportunity for Spurs and most of the players, everyone knew it was their peak, several players wanted out afterwards, other players got on in age. I think it's pretty normal to the squad to have some motivational issues after that. I mean what were they playing for at that point? "Come on guys, we just lost the CL final, now let's win that 4th place trophy"? They had clearly come to the end of their circle and probably would have needed a much bigger squad overhaul than they got. Poch made it into his 6th year, that's twice as long as Mourinho's usual life span, or Guardiola's jobs thus far. It's not like you can blame him for burning out quickly.Ignoring all his other negatives, what kind of mentality is it that the manager and his players checks out just because they lost a CL final? So he does well as long as he exceeds expectations but when there’s a major disappointment like the CL final he is lost? I didn’t see Sir Alex, Simeone or Klopp having disastrous league campaigns after losing CL finals. Neither did anyone at United give up after losing the title to City in the last seconds on goal difference.
I would assume due to Rose's belief/ability to implement a attacking brand of football but he's also shown that he can get results playing against big clubs like Bayern, Real Madrid and Inter even if he is handicapped by the lack of quality at his disposal compared to those teams.How come?
Agree with this, I don't want Pochettino because even though he will probably do better than Ole he doesn't have a set attacking philosophy that I think we need to take the team to the next level.Maybe none of the coaches mentioned would win the league. But with the exception of Poch the rest would at the very least implement a attacking brand of football with the evidence at hand.
We need someone with a attacking philosophy that will start on the training ground and manifest itself on match days. When was the last time we played a big club and played front foot football against them? The last time I remember us playing front foot football against a big club was under LVG even if it was a short lived experience.
LVG is hardly a good example, he was sacked that season and Bayern was his last successful job. It is widely expected now that he was well past it when he came to United.I don't think it's that damning. They probably talked up the CL final as a once in a lifetime opportunity for Spurs and most of the players, everyone knew it was their peak, several players wanted out afterwards, other players got on in age. I think it's pretty normal to the squad to have some motivational issues after that. I mean what were they playing for at that point? "Come on guys, we just lost the CL final, now let's win that 4th place trophy"? They had clearly come to the end of their circle and probably would have needed a much bigger squad overhaul than they got. Poch made it into his 6th year, that's twice as long as Mourinho's usual life span, or Guardiola's jobs thus far. It's not like you can blame him for burning out quickly.
Oh and after Bayern lost their CL final under van Gaal they were 7th 10 games into their following season, 10 points behind the top spot. Inter completely fell apart after winning that final, too.
Only my observation mind, but I’ve been watching him for a few years now. I was impressed with the team ethic at Salzburg as well as the tactical approach.How come?
I meant more that a lot of signings made under Poch were fecking terrible.I’ve no idea about Levy, all I saw is what the players offered under him. If Levy bought them then brilliant but Poch had to work with them.
Van Gaal was still good enough to win the double and make the CL final in the previous season. Did he suddenly become well past it between his two seasons at Bayern?LVG is hardly a good example, he was sacked that season and Bayern was his last successful job. It is widely expected now that he was well past it when he came to United.
Also a CL final is always hyped up and if Poch comes to United then of course for the club it won’t be for the first time they would reach a CL final, but for our current players it would and with Poch not having won anything so far the situations would be comparable. There will be many disappointments at United still before we might reach the top again and if our manager can’t deal with those disappointments, we’ll then our current players definitely won’t.