All-Time European xi vs. All-Time South American xi

[Fortitude]

Had a gander at the the greatest Euro player of all time thread, thought it would be interesting to see what people would come up with for xi's of these two great footballing continents. Who they'd omit to make a balanced xi, or, where they would put the talent to make a cohesive and functional team.

Please don't include Di Stefano in a Euro side - he's an Argentine, and thus, S.A. xi.

Also, feel free to have a go at an xi outside of Europe and S.A - a rest of the world xi, if you will.

 

[Šjor Bepo]

south americans have better individuals but i reckon europe would win it "comfortably"......

------------Yashin----------------
Lahm---Baresi--Maldini---Facchetti
----------Busquets---------------
---------Xavi-----Iniesta---------
Rummennige-Cruyff-----Stoichkov

Without thinking to much i think i would go with this team, not the best individuals but i reckon they would be the best for this system. You can maybe upgrade Lahm and Stoichkov....

 

[BBRBB]

south americans have better individuals but i reckon europe would win it "comfortably"......

------------Yashin----------------
Lahm---Baresi--Maldini---Facchetti
----------Busquets---------------
---------Xavi-----Iniesta---------
Rummennige-Cruyff-----Stoichkov

Without thinking to much i think i would go with this team, not the best individuals but i reckon they would be the best for this system. You can maybe upgrade Lahm and Stoichkov....

Chilavert
Cafu - Passarella - Figueroa - Nilton Santos
Redondo - Di Stefano
Maradona
Messi - Pelé - Ronaldinho​

That much quality upfront is unfair, nothing tiki-taka could do.

 

[Enigma_87]

Chilavert
Cafu - Passarella - Figueroa - Nilton Santos
Redondo - Di Stefano
Maradona
Messi - Pelé - Ronaldinho​

That much quality upfront is unfair, nothing tiki-taka could do.

maybe Falcao instead of Di Stafano for better balance and Fillol on goal and that's my team as well.

Europe:

------------Yashin----------------
Vogts---Baresi--Maldini---Facchetti
----------Beckenbauer---------------
---------Xavi-----Zidane---------
Puskas-----Van Basten-----Cruyff

 

[Šjor Bepo]

Chilavert
Cafu - Passarella - Figueroa - Nilton Santos
Redondo - Di Stefano
Maradona
Messi - Pelé - Ronaldinho​

That much quality upfront is unfair, nothing tiki-taka could do.

debatable.....in Europe side you have almost a team built around every individual as they are in their perfect role(debatable with Cruyff) and in SA side there are questionmarks all over the pitch, Messi and Pele are great and you can have third GOAT around them and i would be okay with it but Di Stefano, Maradona and Dinho in same team? No chance in hell that would work(against another side full of GOATs).

 

[fontaine]

The team with Messi and Ronaldo wins.

 

[MJJ]

------------Yashin----------------
Thuram---Baresi--Maldini---Facchetti
----------Rijkaard---------------
-----Cruyff-----Matthaus---------
Ronaldo--Van Basten---Best

Would be my european xi.

 

[Gio]

European XI

Yashin
Thuram - Baresi - Kohler - Facchetti
Matthaus - Rijkaard - Beckenbauer
Eusebio - Cruyff - Best
​

Thoughts:
- avoid pitfall #1 of fantasy teams by not putting 2 liberi together in the heart of defence. Sorry Bobby.
- pretty narrow - hence Facchetti over Maldini
- strangely no place for Xavi. But in a theoretical match up against the South American boys, I'd want Lothar in there.

As for the South American XI, it's really difficult to do anything balanced. Dropping one of Di Stefano, Messi, Maradona or Pele seems crazy, but it might be the only way for it to work.

 

[fontaine]

I'd do it like this.

------------------Chilavert--------------------

Cafu-----Passarella-----Figueroa---Roberto Carlos

--------Redondo-----Falcao------------

-----Messi----Maradona-------Pelé

------------Ronaldo--------

 

[Snow]

European XI

Yashin
Thuram - Baresi - Kohler - Facchetti
Matthaus - Rijkaard - Beckenbauer
Eusebio - Cruyff - Best
​

Thoughts:
- avoid pitfall #1 of fantasy teams by not putting 2 liberi together in the heart of defence. Sorry Bobby.
- pretty narrow - hence Facchetti over Maldini
- strangely no place for Xavi. But in a theoretical match up against the South American boys, I'd want Lothar in there.

As for the South American XI, it's really difficult to do anything balanced. Dropping one of Di Stefano, Messi, Maradona or Pele seems crazy, but it might be the only way for it to work.

Why Facchetti over Maldini if you want to play narrow? Maldini was more defensive.

 

[MJJ]

-----------Pele---------
-Messi--Maradona-Garrincha
-------Falcao-Redondo
-Santos-Figueroa-Passarella-Cafu

For the South American XI for me, maybe drop maradono for di stefano.

 

[Gio]

Why Facchetti over Maldini if you want to play narrow? Maldini was more defensive.

Nah, because it's narrow I'd go for Facchetti to open up the flank more.

 

[MJJ]

I'd do it like this.

------------------Chilavert--------------------

Cafu-----Passarella-----Figueroa---Roberto Carlos

--------Redondo-----Falcao------------

-----Messi----Maradona-------Pelé

------------Ronaldo--------

Almost..

-----------Pele---------
-Messi--Maradona-Garrincha
-------Falcao-Redondo
-Santos-Figueroa-Passarella-Cafu

For the South American XI for me, maybe drop maradono for di stefano.

 

[Gio]

I'd do it like this.

------------------Chilavert--------------------

Cafu-----Passarella-----Figueroa---Roberto Carlos

--------Redondo-----Falcao------------

-----Messi----Maradona-------Pelé

------------Ronaldo--------

I'd probably agree with this. Pele is the odd fit, but has the all-round game to make a decent fist of it at inside-left. Otherwise if you want someone a bit more naturally left-sided, then there's Ronaldinho and Rivaldo.

 

[Devil may care]

I just went with players I actually saw play full games numerous times.

 

[harms]

Mazurka
Cafu - Figueroa - Passarella - N. Santos
Falcao - Redondo - Didi
----- Maradona
Messi ------- Pele

Subs: Chilavert, Ronaldo, Di Stefano, Garrincha, Zico, D. Santos, Chumpitaz

It's very hard to compile a balanced SA XI. And I'm not a fan of shoehorning Di Stefani in midfield. Redondo is a little light on this level but can't think of a better defensive midfielder - and you need one for this team to work. Maybe Varela? Not too keen on a central defensive pairing, but they are a clear standouts.

Yashin
Thuram - Baresi - Scirea - Maldini
Rijkaard - Beckenbauer
-------- Matthaus
Best --- Puskas --- Cruyff

Subs: Zoff, Van Basten, Platini, Desailly, Charlton, Facchetti, Moore

You can put Van Basten instead of Puskas if you prefer more classic interpretation of n. 9. Again, 2 libero at the back, but I was too greedy and didn't want to leave one of them on the bench


I feel that European XI is more balanced and is capable of closing up the shop when needed - absolutely brutal midfield (without losing anything creatively, and that's with Desailly on the bench!) and versatile attackers. Not surprisingly, it's an Italy/Germany combined XI with a little hint of Dutch and 2 notes of Russia and NI.

Edit: Sorry for the formations, posted from my phone

Edit: just realized that Cristiano didn't even made the bench, and Muller too

 

[ADJUDICATOR]

 

[RedRevongge]

I have picked a European team using only Balon D'or (and equivalent) winners using this site:
http://www.totalsportek.com/list/fifa-ballon-dor-winners-of-all-time/
I tried to use multiple time winners as a priority (So Keegan is unlucky not to get in) and a lack of Full Backs hurts the team greatly.

------------------------------------------Lev Yashin-------------------------------------------

------------Franz Beckenbaur --------- Lothar Matthaus----------Fabio Cannavaro-------


------------------------Ruud Gullit-------------------------Michel Platini-----------------------


Cristiano Ronaldo--------------------George Best--------------------------------------Johan Cruyff

-------------------------------Van Basten-----------------Rummenigge---------------------

 

[Physiocrat]

Euro XI

------------------------Yashin----------
---Maldini----Baresi--Nesta---Facchetti
------------------------Rikjaard-------------------------
--------------Matthaus-----Beckenbauer---------
--------Best----------Cruyff-------Puskas---------

Edit- Put Thuram in for Vogts for being better on the ball. Then subbed Thuram off and Neeskens for Maldini and Matthaus. I don't think the proper libero role in a total football setup works, so der Kaiser to midfield.

South American XI

----------------------------Chilavert-----------------
----------C. Alberto--Passerella--Figueroa-------
Cafu----------Falcao--------Redondo------R.Carlos
--------------------------Maradona----------------------
---------------Batistuta------------Pele-------------------

I really want Di Stefano but he'd clash with Maradona. I also want Messi but Pele was always best with a proper striker hence Batistuta. That said Messi may work with Pele but I'd have to think about it more.

 

[harms]

European XI

Yashin
Thuram - Baresi - Kohler - Facchetti
Matthaus - Rijkaard - Beckenbauer
Eusebio - Cruyff - Best
​

Thoughts:
- avoid pitfall #1 of fantasy teams by not putting 2 liberi together in the heart of defence. Sorry Bobby.
- pretty narrow - hence Facchetti over Maldini
- strangely no place for Xavi. But in a theoretical match up against the South American boys, I'd want Lothar in there.

As for the South American XI, it's really difficult to do anything balanced. Dropping one of Di Stefano, Messi, Maradona or Pele seems crazy, but it might be the only way for it to work.

Yeah, Kohler over Scirea/Moore is the more rational choice. Also I picked Maldini over Facchetti only because of 2 liberos. Same midfield, which is going to win the game

 

[Brwned]

Up until now I'd never really appreciated that South America have a long-standing issue with goalkeepers. Apart from Julio Cesar's brief peak, you'd struggle to think of a time when South America had the best goalkeeper in the world post-50s. Fillol's the only option for me.

In terms of star names it'd be something like:

Fillol
Cafú Figueroa Passarella N.Santos
Varela
Maradona Di Stéfano
Messi
Pelé Ronaldo
​

Realistically you could fit di Stéfano, Messi and Maradona and Pelé in a theoretical '82-styled 4222 but I couldn't see it working. Going in completely the opposite direction, I think this'd be the most balanced and coherent team.

Fillol
D.Santos Santamaría Figueroa N. Santos
Falcao Varela
Garrincha Pelé Zagallo
Ronaldo​

Zico, Ronaldinho, Rivelino and co. were far better players than Zagallo but he was perfect in that supporting role and that's what Garrincha, Pelé and Ronaldo need. It's hard to look past the tried and tested wing partnerships of the Santos brothers, Garrincha and Zagallo too - the most successful international partnerships of all-time I suppose. Back-to-back World Cup wins and the synergy on both sides was terrific.

It's a tough call at centre back. Nasazzi and Santamaríá for an all-conquering all-Uruguayan partnership is tempting, but it's a bit too retro and leaving out both Figueroa and Passarella is a bit absurd. Neither were all-out liberos like Scirea or Beckenbauer so you could probably fit them both in there as the best partnership, but defence is all about discipline, compatibility and synergy and you'd be preventing them both from playing their natural game. Figueroa's the better player for me, and Santamaría's arguably the most successful stopper of all time.

You could go a dozen ways in midfield so I just went for balance. Varela's leadership qualities and defensive play provide security and balance and Falcao's the ideal player to knit things together in an energetic midfield duo.

Garrincha and Pelé are the most formidable attacking duo of all-time and Zagallo slots in there alongside for balance. Ronaldo's a better fit for the role than shoehorning Messi, Maradona or di Stéfano into the team and as a one-man attack he stands up to anyone.

 

[harms]

Another variation of South American XI - if we use the old W-M formation we can pick more attacking players and to crowd the midfield (which is the weakest area in SA all-star team). Figueroa will have Nilton and Djalma on the left and on the right who are better fit than Cafu/CAT/R. Carlos. The outside left position is up for grabs though, neither Ronaldinho nor Rivelino won't feel too comfortable there

 

[TheNewEra]

I don't think you can compete with the south american attack.

 

[harms]

I have picked a European team using only Balon D'or (and equivalent) winners using this site:
http://www.totalsportek.com/list/fifa-ballon-dor-winners-of-all-time/
I tried to use multiple time winners as a priority (So Keegan is unlucky not to get in) and a lack of Full Backs hurts the team greatly.

------------------------------------------Lev Yashin-------------------------------------------

------------Franz Beckenbaur --------- Lothar Matthaus----------Fabio Cannavaro-------


------------------------Ruud Gullit-------------------------Michel Platini-----------------------


Cristiano Ronaldo--------------------George Best--------------------------------------Johan Cruyff

-------------------------------Van Basten-----------------Rummenigge---------------------

That looks awful, really . You can also put Sammer in the backline, unlike Matthaus he won his Ballon D'Or playing as a defender - and push Lothar further up the pitch. Also I don't understand how your front 5 is supposed to play, Best as n.10, Ronaldo on the right and Rummenigge up front?

 

[We need an rvn]

What's with the Baresi / Maldini centre pairing for Europe constantly? Maldini played his best years at left back and we've the likes of Moore / Beckenbauer / Nesta / cannavaro / Rio who are better at centre half than Maldini, who's my left back for sure though.

Once the kids go to bed I'll get cracking on my Xi, love this stuff

 

[harms]

What's with the Baresi / Maldini centre pairing for Europe constantly? Maldini played his best years at left back and we've the likes of Moore / Beckenbauer / Nesta / cannavaro / Rio who are better at centre half than Maldini, who's my left back for sure though.

Once the kids go to bed I'll get cracking on my Xi, love this stuff

Can't agree more. It's the usual shoehorning that takes place in All-time Italian and World XI, when people can't decide between Facchetti and Maldini they just put the latter in the center. Don't think that Cannavaro or Rio were better CBs than Maldini though, around the same level for me, but there are Baresi, Scirea, Beckenbauer (can be fielded in midfield though), Moore, Kohler and Nesta who deserve that place more, imo.

 

[Physiocrat]

@Šjor Bepo

What would your South American XI be? Mine are above

 

[Fortitude]

I don't think you can compete with the south american attack.

Question is: what is the S.A attack?

I took players out, put them back in, and then took them back out again because I just don't see how Di Stefano, Maradona, Pele and Messi all play together without making quite severe concessions for one another. The 5 10's of 1970 Brazil is different because they had complementary skills and 'kind of' needed each others' skill set to function - none of these guys need the others, so the inclination to pass when they could run, or run when they could pass would come down to their willingness to use each other.

I guess we have the example of all the wonderful teams we've seen them function in and the way they reined in their talents when needed, but in this kind of side ego, and, taking orders from each other (Di Stefano & Maradona! Messi being told what to do and where to go; Pele truly having players who rival his talent around him) is what it comes down to.

I think the Euro sides have a more comfortable time of it in terms of complementary attacks.

 

[Fortitude]

European XI

Yashin
Thuram - Baresi - Kohler - Facchetti
Matthaus - Rijkaard - Beckenbauer
Eusebio - Cruyff - Best
​

Thoughts:
- avoid pitfall #1 of fantasy teams by not putting 2 liberi together in the heart of defence. Sorry Bobby.
- pretty narrow - hence Facchetti over Maldini
- strangely no place for Xavi. But in a theoretical match up against the South American boys, I'd want Lothar in there.

As for the South American XI, it's really difficult to do anything balanced. Dropping one of Di Stefano, Messi, Maradona or Pele seems crazy, but it might be the only way for it to work.

I'm more surprised with no Platini in your side, tbh.

And Eusebio out on the right?

 

[Invictus]

Only way I could find to fit the biggest name South Americans in positions close to their favorite roles:

Not ideal, but they're secure in terms of defensive structure, while maintaining great quality in attack.

 

[Joga Bonito]

European XI

​

Goalie - Lev Yashin pretty much is the #1. Dino Zoff, Buffon, Maier, Kahn, Schmikes, Banks etc are pretty much inseparable in the next tier
RB - Went for Lilian Thuram, with Bergomi and Vogts coming ever so close
Libero - The one and only Franz Beckenbauer - Absolutely no debate here
Stopper - Jürgen Kohler - arguably the greatest stopper in the history of the game.
LB - Between Giacinto Facchetti and Maldini but went with the former, as Facchetti and Charlton would be absolutely cracking and the Italian makes more sense with Thuram on the other flank

CM - Frank Rijkaard - Once again a shoe-in for this role
CM - Lothar Matthäus - Likewise

SS - Should have been Cruyff here but I slightly prefer Ferenc Puskás here in this particular set-up. Platini just about misses the cut too.
RW - The greatest winger/wing-forward of all time alongside Garrincha. Rummenigge and Ronaldo as wing-forwards would be nice too but prefer George Best myself, who has the perfect blend of goalscoring and trickery in that trio imo.
LAM - Sir Bobby Charlton. Selfless, creative, industrious and an absolutely brilliant player. Hard to think of a similar player of his make, in the top 10 GOAT category.

ST - Gerd Müller. van Basten runs him close but I'd plump for Der Bomber as the greatest #9 in the history of the game

South American XI

​

Goalie - Ubaldo Fillol
RB - Djalma Santos - Greatest RB of all time but Carlos Alberto does run him close. Cafu in the next tier for me
CB - Daniel Passarella
CB - Elías Figueroa
LB - Nilton Santos



CM - Didi - As much as I like Redondo and Falcão, Didi is arguably the greatest playmaking CM of all time alongside Xavi
CM - Luis Monti - Could have shoehorned Falcão or Redondo in here but Monti provides more balance and is one of the greatest DMs of all time to boot. Varela just misses out.

#10 - Diego Maradona just has to be there
RW - Should have been Garrincha but Jairzinho makes more sense with Maradona

Left sided SS - Pelé
CF - El Fenomeno

Is a bit lop-sided but simply couldn't leave Pelé out of the side and N.Santos has it in him to man the flank single-handedly, with Pelé in his younger inside-leftish second striker incarnation.

 

[BBRBB]

Yes my SA XI is over the top but might still work, would be fun to watch anyway.

My take on Europe:

Van Basten
Cruyff Platini Best
Rijkaard Matthaus
Facchetti Baresi Desailly Thuram
Yashin​

 

[adexkola]

Good post.

To get more penetratjon from the right wing, I would drop Drogba, move Eto'o center, and place Finidi George on the right.

Only weakness in that team is Babayaro at left back, but I can't think of a better replacement.

 

[Brwned]

What's with the Baresi / Maldini centre pairing for Europe constantly? Maldini played his best years at left back and we've the likes of Moore / Beckenbauer / Nesta / cannavaro / Rio who are better at centre half than Maldini, who's my left back for sure though.

Once the kids go to bed I'll get cracking on my Xi, love this stuff

It's primarily to fit in Facchetti who has claims for being the best defender in history. If we exclude liberos, he's one of just two defenders of the last century to feature in the top 2 in the Ballon d'Or rankings - the other being Billy Wright in '57*. Alongside that he was arguably the best player in perhaps the most successful defensive system of all time, undoubtedly an essential component of that revolutionary defensive structure and is rightly credited for playing a formative role in the development of the libero role itself.

*Who you could argue, like Matthews in '56, was awarded it for his long-term contribution as opposed to his current standing. He retired two years later as the first player to win 100 caps and remains the player with the record of the most competitive international appearances in the history of the game, in large part due to the fact he never got booked in his entire international career.

 

[Šjor Bepo]

@Šjor Bepo

What would your South American XI be? Mine are above

i dont know enough to make a good team, can only put best individuals in there....

 

[Ecstatic]

EUROPE



Subs: Fachetti / Scirea / Charles / Desailly / Bozcik / Thuram / Gullit / Best / Matthews / Roberto Bagio

 

[Gio]

I'm more surprised with no Platini in your side, tbh.

And Eusebio out on the right?

I know it's a bit of a dog's dinner, Eusebio would be inside-right in that one But here's a couple of more considered efforts:

Harsh on Cruyff, Xavi and Cristiano, but they each need more specific arrangements to truly shine.

 

[harms]

Why Beara? Not the obvious choice

I would've probably had Kaltz instead of Brehme in the first formation. Not the best right-back ever and an inferior player but I do not like players to feature in an All-time XI not in their best position and it's hard to imagine a right wing-back who will contribute to attacking play more than Kaltz.

 

[Gio]

Why Beara? Not the obvious choice

The real answer is because I'm a hipster twat.

But from ye olde footage of keepers from the pre-colour TV era, he has a unique blend of the physicality you'd typically associate with the brave keepers of the time, along with the gymnastic agility more akin to a keeper today. Hard to say given the relative lack of footage and changes in the game over the years, but he was an impressive specimen who Yashin regarded as the best in the world.

 

[Theon]

What's with the Baresi / Maldini centre pairing for Europe constantly? Maldini played his best years at left back and we've the likes of Moore / Beckenbauer / Nesta / cannavaro / Rio who are better at centre half than Maldini, who's my left back for sure though.

Once the kids go to bed I'll get cracking on my Xi, love this stuff

Aye, agree with that. I always thought that Nesta was noticeably the best centre back for Italy and Milan.