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Devil may care

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He hasn't had a Fred level of improvement but he's defiitely picked up in the last few games.
 

Utdstar01

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For such a useless player who apparently does nothing, he's done alright to create more chances than any other player in our squad this season :rolleyes:
 

DanClancy

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Anyone who knows anything about the game can see he's nowhere near a United player, you'd have thought after nearly playing 30 times this season we'd ave seen some sort of improvement but we haven't. I'm not convinced a mid table club would even be interested in him.
 

Wednesday at Stoke

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Anyone who knows anything about the game can see he's nowhere near a United player, you'd have thought after nearly playing 30 times this season we'd ave seen some sort of improvement but we haven't. I'm not convinced a mid table club would even be interested in him.
His performances have definitely improved. He might not be the starting #10 for a club with top 4 ambitions but a) he's still 22 and b) He is a viable squad option.
 

Raven

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Anyone who knows anything about the game can see he's nowhere near a United player, you'd have thought after nearly playing 30 times this season we'd ave seen some sort of improvement but we haven't. I'm not convinced a mid table club would even be interested in him.
Except we have seen improvement? How about you try watching games rather than spouting the usual drivel.
 

AltiUn

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Anyone who knows anything about the game can see he's nowhere near a United player, you'd have thought after nearly playing 30 times this season we'd ave seen some sort of improvement but we haven't. I'm not convinced a mid table club would even be interested in him.
I like how you followed up that holier than thou opening statement with something blatantly false, Pereira's clearly improved "anyone who knows anything about the game" could see that.
 

Adam-Utd

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Still has more than anyone else in our squad so I really don't see your point.
I mean he is playing THE creative position in the team. You'd be very surprised if your number 10 wasn't high up on chances created.

Most of these are probably from free kicks / corners and crosses anyway. Off the top of your head can you think of an amazing pass or through ball he did?

The only ones I can think of are the pass for Martial at Burnley and the cross that Rashford scored (own goal) against Villa.
 

Raven

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I mean he is playing THE creative position in the team. You'd be very surprised if your number 10 wasn't high up on chances created.

Most of these are probably from free kicks / corners and crosses anyway. Off the top of your head can you think of an amazing pass or through ball he did?

The only ones I can think of are the pass for Martial at Burnley and the cross that Rashford scored (own goal) against Villa.
What about that perfect ball in our last match that Brandon sent into the stratosphere? He has more chances created than either of our starting wingers who have played almost every game. He has been a squad player, rotating positions and not always starting. It's impressive however you want to look at it.

I'm perfectly aware that he isn't starting quality at the moment but there is absolutely no need to downplay an impressive stat of his.
 

Lynty

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His performances have definitely improved. He might not be the starting #10 for a club with top 4 ambitions but a) he's still 22 and b) He is a viable squad option.
He's 24.

In all honesty, I've watched a lot of EPL this season, and there's not a lot of difference between Pereira and Teilemans performances. Youri is slightly better, but not £40m better, like everyone wanted to pay in July.

Andreas is a useful player to have around the squad, and there has been some improvement in his game. He's much more sure on the ball than he was last season.
 

Adam-Utd

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What about that perfect ball in our last match that Brandon sent into the stratosphere? He has more chances created than either of our starting wingers who have played almost every game. He has been a squad player, rotating positions and not always starting. It's impressive however you want to look at it.

I'm perfectly aware that he isn't starting quality at the moment but there is absolutely no need to downplay an impressive stat of his.
Yes it was a nice cross, that is really his strongest point. For me though as a number 10 we need more ability to create something out of nothing. The ball that mata played for Rashford for example is something we need from him more often.

I did think he played well against Norwich, but they were pretty awful.
 

Cassidy

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What about that perfect ball in our last match that Brandon sent into the stratosphere? He has more chances created than either of our starting wingers who have played almost every game. He has been a squad player, rotating positions and not always starting. It's impressive however you want to look at it.

I'm perfectly aware that he isn't starting quality at the moment but there is absolutely no need to downplay an impressive stat of his.
Its not that impressive given hes playing as a 10
 

AltiUn

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Yes it was a nice cross, that is really his strongest point. For me though as a number 10 we need more ability to create something out of nothing. The ball that mata played for Rashford for example is something we need from him more often.

I did think he played well against Norwich, but they were pretty awful.
To be fair, Pereira put in a nearly identical cross against Villa for Rashford's goal, but you're correct that he needs to do things like that more consistently.
 

Raven

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Yes it was a nice cross, that is really his strongest point. For me though as a number 10 we need more ability to create something out of nothing. The ball that mata played for Rashford for example is something we need from him more often.

I did think he played well against Norwich, but they were pretty awful.
I'm of the opinion that he's a grand squad player who's quite versatile and has room for further improvement. His decision making has been a little off this season but it's getting better and he already has the technical ability. He's exactly the type of squad player we will need going forward.
 

Raven

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Its not that impressive given hes playing as a 10
Except he doesn't always play as a 10? He spent most of the start of the season as a right midfielder before being dropped and then brought back briefly as a 10 in a squad player capacity. Stop trying to rewrite history to make out that he's been our starting 10 this season.
 

Adam-Utd

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I'm of the opinion that he's a grand squad player who's quite versatile and has room for further improvement. His decision making has been a little off this season but it's getting better and he already has the technical ability. He's exactly the type of squad player we will need going forward.
Oh yeah i'm happy for him as a squad player. He obviously cares and wants to be here which is important, and he can play multiple positions.

Quite rightly though we're looking to upgrade him with a bit more individual threat.
 

Raven

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Oh yeah i'm happy for him as a squad player. He obviously cares and wants to be here which is important, and he can play multiple positions.

Quite rightly though we're looking to upgrade him with a bit more individual threat.
Yeah, absolutely, I feel he should probably be second choice 10 or a utility player who fills in where and when needed.
 

Cassidy

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Except he doesn't always play as a 10? He spent most of the start of the season as a right midfielder before being dropped and then brought back briefly as a 10 in a squad player capacity. Stop trying to rewrite history to make out that he's been our starting 10 this season.
Where have I said STARTING 10 :rolleyes:
https://www.whoscored.com/Players/243254/Show/Andreas-Pereira

He has played most of his games this season as a 10, only person rewriting history here is you
 

Utdstar01

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I mean he is playing THE creative position in the team. You'd be very surprised if your number 10 wasn't high up on chances created.

Most of these are probably from free kicks / corners and crosses anyway. Off the top of your head can you think of an amazing pass or through ball he did?

The only ones I can think of are the pass for Martial at Burnley and the cross that Rashford scored (own goal) against Villa.
He's created plenty of chances this season tbf. Another key one in the city game just before they scored their second but of course nobody to meet the cross which hasn't been an uncommon problem this season.
 

Bebestation

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It's not pereiras fault that Pogba isn't available to play there.

The fact is he is the best CAM we have at the moment & that's coming from someone who never really rated him but at the moment I'd rather see him in the side than Lingard or a slowed down Mata ( who I prefer on the right due to his left footed ability over James ).

When we get a better CAM pereira takes a back seat & gets back in to our subs bench & hopefully someone can leave the club.

He has some energy to his game that helps our attack that doesn't come from deeper in midfield. Can be useful for a another year or two & see how he develops.

I like to see how these players adapt when they bulk up and lose a bit of pace because they can become a bit more well rounded and balanced almost in a way they didn't even plan to - and I can see that possibly happening with pereira.
 

Raven

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Where have I said STARTING 10 :rolleyes:
https://www.whoscored.com/Players/243254/Show/Andreas-Pereira

He has played most of his games this season as a 10, only person rewriting history here is you
No he hasn't. I don't particularly rate whoscored, but we'll go with it. According to the stats you have provided, he has started 16 games this season (not very many) 8 of them as CAM and 8 elsewhere. He has 6 sub appearances, from memory, he has come on to the right more often than not. So even using your source, I can tell that you're talking shite.
 

tomaldinho1

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Anyone who knows anything about the game can see he's nowhere near a United player, you'd have thought after nearly playing 30 times this season we'd ave seen some sort of improvement but we haven't. I'm not convinced a mid table club would even be interested in him.
He is a solid second choice 10. It's no surprise when he's been played there, he's been fine but when he's been a CM (with Lingard usually as 10) he's been poor. United fans love complaining about players but don't take into account that usually they're playing out of position; James is much better on the LW but accommodates Rashford, Mata used to get slated when he was shoehorned into the RW slot, Pereira was terrible as a 6 when Jose tried to convert him, Young did his best as a full back but we shouldn't have had to resort to that.

Will he ever be a world class player, of course not but he's young, has a great attitude and is a good bench player. Our focus shouldn't be on selling x,y or z player it should be on finding a top DM, CAM and RW to complement the squad we have which is actually a good one despite how shit they've been playing.
 

Cassidy

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No he hasn't. I don't particularly rate whoscored, but we'll go with it. According to the stats you have provided, he has started 16 games this season (not very many) 8 of them as CAM and 8 elsewhere. He has 6 sub appearances, from memory, he has come on to the right more often than not. So even using your source, I can tell that you're talking shite.
:rolleyes:
He has actually been subbed on at CAM as much as RW but whatever, your memory is obviously more reliable than recorded stats
 

Adam-Utd

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He's created plenty of chances this season tbf. Another key one in the city game just before they scored their second but of course nobody to meet the cross which hasn't been an uncommon problem this season.
Yeah our forwards don't make gambling runs often enough. If rashford did a similar run to what he did for his Norwich goal, he'd score 30 a season!
 

Raven

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:rolleyes:
He has actually been subbed on at CAM as much as RW but whatever, your memory is obviously more reliable than recorded stats
If I am wrong and he has been subbed on as a 10 as many as on the right that would still mean he has not played most of his games as a 10.
 

Mark Pawelek

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Why would we offer Pereira in any loan deal in the Bruno transfer? If anything we should offer Lingard. Pereira has been useful for us this season. Not good, but definitely useful.
Because Bruno would replace Pereira in the team. We wouldn't need Pereira for cup matches either because Mata is more useful. No point offering Lingard; they don't want him.
 

Chesterlestreet

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He might not be the starting #10 for a club with top 4 ambitions but a) he's still 22 and b) He is a viable squad option.
Yeah - more or less.

Based on what he's shown so far, though, he should be easy to upgrade on - even as a squad player.

But good and reliable squad players do tend to have a connection to the club - which he has. He wouldn't be on my "100% deadwood - get rid ASAP" list, to put it like that.
 

Cassidy

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If I am wrong and he has been subbed on as a 10 as many as on the right that would still mean he has not played most of his games as a 10.
It actually would. You dont add up every other position and come up with a number. Which position has he player most of his games. CAM 11, RW 9, LW 1, MC 1, DMC 1 its not rocket science.

Anyway thats my last post on that in this thread
 

Ekeke

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I mean he is playing THE creative position in the team. You'd be very surprised if your number 10 wasn't high up on chances created.

Most of these are probably from free kicks / corners and crosses anyway. Off the top of your head can you think of an amazing pass or through ball he did?

The only ones I can think of are the pass for Martial at Burnley and the cross that Rashford scored (own goal) against Villa.
Through balls is a bit much to expect. I bet most players have played less of them than you'd imagine

Here's the players who have played the most throughballs per 90 mins this season in any position



But heres the most throughballs per 90 mins specifically from the 10 position.



What I will say is that City's far forward AM positions are not included here. They count as CM. Same as Maddison.

Very few players in the premier league have played that 10/hole role more than a handful of games this season. The ones that have played as many games as Andreas have played the same amount of throughballs. The ones who have played less have played more throughballs. Chances are the more they play the position the lower the number becomes because its not easily to consistently, successfully play throughballs from the position game after game. Its probably easier from CM or the wing, which is why in general its those players who play the most of those passes (top picture).

Why might that be? Probably because a CM or winger will probably have more targets to pick out than someone playing in the hole and will also not be as tightly marked as someone playing that advanced playmaker role. Most of the time their only target for a throughball is the one striker ahead, which is predictable. Occasionally it'll line up to play it for a winger getting forward but clearly not that often.
 

Raven

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It actually would. You dont add up every other position and come up with a number. Which position has he player most of his games. CAM 11, RW 9, LW 1, MC 1, DMC 1 its not rocket science.

Anyway thats my last post on that in this thread
11 games as CAM, 12 games not as CAM = Most games played as CAM.

Right you are.
 

MadDogg

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If you read my post, I said much bigger 'games' not much bigger teams.
E. G. The games against Everton, Watford, Villa etc. were huge because other sides, most importantly Chelsea, had just dropped points.

That momentum is lost now, so anyone getting their hopes up after beating Norwich is seriously kidding themselves.
Of the three games you mentioned, Pereira didn't play against Everton or Watford, and Villa was one of those two games he had in central midfield when nobody else was fit and he was absolutely terrible. Obviously we should have a better starting #10, but equally obviously he's been our best this season. Not amazing, but he's been decent (which instantly puts him significantly ahead of Lingard and Mata).

You got me interested so I actually just looked up the stats and they make interesting reading:

Pereira has started 7 premier league matches this season at #10. We've won 5 of them. The two matches we didn't win included the 1-1 against Liverpool where we were the only team this season to take any points off them. So that means only 1 match out of 7 where we wrongly dropped points (the 1-0 loss against Bournemouth). 16 points out of a potential 21, or 2.28 ppg (points per game).

In the 5 premier league matches where he started on the right wing, we've had 2 wins, 2 draws and a loss. 8 points out of a potential 15, or 1.6 ppg.

In the other 10 matches (which include him playing at CM, him coming on as a late sub, or him not playing at all) we've had 2 wins, 4 draws, 4 losses. 10 points out of a potential 30, or 1 ppg.

As I said, it makes interesting reading. In comparison, Mata's numbers at #10 are 1 win, 2 draws and 2 losses (1 ppg), and Lingard's are 3 wins, 3 draws and 3 losses (1.33 ppg).
 

Cassidy

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11 games as CAM, 12 games not as CAM = Most games played as CAM.

Right you are.
Logic so his most games are played as a mixture of positions :lol: just admit when you're wrong and move on
 

SS

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Because Bruno would replace Pereira in the team. We wouldn't need Pereira for cup matches either because Mata is more useful. No point offering Lingard; they don't want him.
Mata's had one good game all season and he wasn't even playing at #10 in it.
 
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Raven

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Logic so his most games are played as a mixture of positions :lol: just admit when you're wrong and move on
Or he's mostly played out of position? Remember that this debate is to do with him creating the most chances this season.

Edit: This is your initial comment on the subject.

"Its not that impressive given hes playing as a 10"
 

Cassidy

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Or he's mostly played out of position? Remember that this debate is to do with him creating the most chances this season.

Edit: This is your initial comment on the subject.

"Its not that impressive given hes playing as a 10"
Ok let me put it like this, its not that impressive as hes mostly played as an attacking mid.... whether its CAM or AMR and what is out of position for him. He doesn't have a position really, even when on loan at Valencia
 

Raven

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Ok let me put it like this, its not that impressive as hes mostly played as an attacking mid.... whether its CAM or AMR
Given that it is the most in our squad and he's not a guaranteed starter and often moves about the pitch to accommodate others, it is impressive, I'm not entirely sure what the problem is. We have Rashford (30 games) and James (27 games) as our starting wingers and neither have created as much as one of our utility players, you have to admit, that particular stat is impressive.
 

Cassidy

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Given that it is the most in our squad and he's not a guaranteed starter and often moves about the pitch to accommodate others, it is impressive, I'm not entirely sure what the problem is. We have Rashford (30 games) and James (27 games) as our starting wingers and neither have created as much as one of our utility players, you have to admit, that particular stat is impressive.
Rashford isn't a winger, he is playing as a wide forward hence being the clubs top scorer, and James isn't very good, a young player who just came from the championship. It's not that impressive.