Antisemitism & Islamophobia

[gfactor86]

One of the unfortunate consequences of what's taking place in the Middle East is a rise in antisemitism.

Reported cases have spiked over 1000% since the start of the war in the UK. Same happening in USA and I imagine other countries too.

Incidents risen in Islamaphobia increased too. A sad state of affairs.

https://amp.theguardian.com/news/20...don-rise-1350-since-israel-hamas-war-met-says

https://www.cbsnews.com/amp/news/an...g-hamas-attack-israel-anti-defamation-league/

 

[Andy_Cole]

Maybe edit the title to ‘rise of antisemitism and Islamophobia’

 

[Oldyella]

Maybe edit the title to ‘rise of antisemitism and Islamophobia’

Yup.

 

[RedDevilQuebecois]

Did this need a thread? Stop spamming pro Israel shite on the forum.

The problem became far more prevalent since Charlottesville and its aftermath with (former) President Fat Feck saying there are good people "on both sides", even though one side was full of white supremacists.

 

[gfactor86]

Did this need a thread? Stop spamming pro Israel shite on the forum.

How is this being pro-Israel?

Apparently we can only consider one point a view on this forum.

 

[Ragnar123]

One of the unfortunate consequences of what's taking place in the Middle East is a rise in antisemitism.

Sadly it was always there and was also imported in recent years by european countries. Israeli retaliation for the worst terrorist attack against their people since the Third Reich acted as a trigger to voice their opinions loudly. The governments were blind to it, school education has completely failed in some cases, if you watch what's happening in american universities.

This twitter account gathers and shows most of it: https://twitter.com/visegrad24

 

[Abizzz]

I don't think it's a rise. People are saying in public what they have said in private for a long time now. They are just revealing their true faces.

 

[do.ob]

I don't think it's a rise. People are saying in public what they have said in private for a long time now. They are just revealing their true faces.

Well in Berlin a Jewish community center was firebombed and stars of David were painted on houses. In Duisburg authorities arrested an Islamist, who reportedly was plotting a truck attack.

 

[Abizzz]

Well in Berlin a Jewish community center was firebombed and stars of David were painted on houses. In Duisburg authorities arrested an Islamist, who reportedly was plotting a truck attack.

All very troubling. The point I was intending on making is that these people didn't just turn into antisemites in the past month. Although I agree dormant antimesites are marginally preferable to active ones.

 

[do.ob]

All very troubling. The point I was intending on making is that these people didn't just turn into antisemites in the past month. Although I agree dormant antimesites are marginally preferable to active ones.

It shows that thoughts are turning into action. And these actions may have grave consequences.
So while it may not be a huge rise quantitatively (and even that may be debatable, considering all the people that are going to dive into social media cesspits over the current escalation), it's probably a significant rise qualitatively.

 

[gfactor86]

This is pretty sick. In Turkey apparently

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

 

[SilentWitness]

Very sad that this situation has enabled anti-semites and islamaphobes to crawl out of their cage but also important as to why countries and groups need to be careful in labelling things anti-semitic and islamaphobic when they aren't.

 

[NotThatSoph]

This is pretty sick. In Turkey apparently

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

This tweet got 100 views. The tweeter is pro Canadian anti-vaxxers, pro Bukele in El Salvador, pro Donald Trump, retweets racists, pro Alternative für Deutschland. Says that "multiculturalism has failed. Likes Tucker Carlson, Jordan Peterson and Elon Musk.

Friend of yours?

 

[gfactor86]

This tweet got 100 views. The tweeter is pro Canadian anti-vaxxers, pro Bukele in El Salvador, pro Donald Trump, retweets racists, pro Alternative für Deutschland. Says that "multiculturalism has failed. Likes Tucker Carlson, Jordan Peterson and Elon Musk.

Friend of yours?

The tweet has been shared all over Twitter but lots of people.
What's your point?

 

[NotThatSoph]

The tweet has been shared all over Twitter but lots of people.
What's your point?

No, a tweet with 100 views from a tiny account hasn't been shared all over Twitter with lots of people.

Are you friends with this far right extremist?

 

[The Corinthian]

A 6 year old Palestinian was stabbed to death in the US.

 

[Badunk]

The tweet has been shared all over Twitter but lots of people.
What's your point?

Share someone else tweeting it then.

 

[Badunk]

No, a tweet with 100 views from a tiny account hasn't been shared all over Twitter with lots of people.

Are you friends with this far right extremist?

"You can prove anything with facts"

 

[Ragnar123]

Very sad that this situation has enabled anti-semites and islamaphobes to crawl out of their cage but also important as to why countries and groups need to be careful in labelling things anti-semitic and islamaphobic when they aren't.

Semitic people is a term for a racial and cultural group of people. Islam is a religion. To my understanding, one thing is being against a certain group of people, the other is being against the beliefs of a certain group of people. For me, it's not the same thing.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

No, a tweet with 100 views from a tiny account hasn't been shared all over Twitter with lots of people.

Are you friends with this far right extremist?

Is that the way Twitter works these days? People only share tweets from people they’re friends with. Have to say I’m on board with this new model.

 

[Siorac]

No, a tweet with 100 views from a tiny account hasn't been shared all over Twitter with lots of people.

Are you friends with this far right extremist?

Here's the same picture from a less distasteful source:

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

 

[SilentWitness]

Semitic people is a term for a racial and cultural group of people. Islam is a religion. To my understanding, one thing is being against a certain group of people, the other is being against the beliefes of a certain group of people. For me, it's not the same thing.

Not necessarily. Islamophobia is not restrictive to just being prejudice to Islam but to Muslims in general.

 

[NotThatSoph]

Here's the same picture from a less distasteful source:

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

I'm asking about the Twitter account, not the picture. The account you're referencing isn't reliable, but it wouldn't exactly be a shock if the picture is real.

This user has been very adamant in labeling the pro Palestininan protests as extremist, genocidal antisemites because he claims to have identified some extremists, yet here he is among the first 100 people to follow what this extremist tweets. Using his logic, he would say that a large part of pro Israel people are far right extremists. He won't, though.

 

[gfactor86]

A 6 year old Palestinian was stabbed to death in the US.

This was shocking. Absolutely abhorrent

 

[HTG]

A 6 year old Palestinian was stabbed to death in the US.

Could you please link a source to news like this?

 

[Badunk]

Could you please link a source to news like this?

It was all over the news last week.

https://abcnews.go.com/US/mother-muslim-boy-fatally-death-statement/story?id=104259737

 

[HTG]

It was all over the news last week.

https://abcnews.go.com/US/mother-muslim-boy-fatally-death-statement/story?id=104259737

This is why I was asking. I remembered there was something like this. But due to the wording of the post, I thought it might be yet another stabbing.

 

[jackal&hyde]

Maybe edit the title to ‘rise of antisemitism and Islamophobia’

Rubbish modification. The fight against islamophobia is if not successful, then at least talked about.

Antisemitism has been kept under the rug for decades and surprise surprise, it has grown and metastasized.

 

[jackal&hyde]

"from the river to that sea" is a call from some. Not to go all geography here but the river is the river Jordan and the sea is the Mediterranean sea. From the river to the sea, is a call for the destruction of Israel. I would love if the "pro" this or that, would talk about what they really want.

 

[Raoul]

One of the unfortunate consequences of what's taking place in the Middle East is a rise in antisemitism.

Reported cases have spiked over 1000% since the start of the war in the UK. Same happening in USA and I imagine other countries too.

Incidents risen in Islamaphobia increased too. A sad state of affairs.

https://amp.theguardian.com/news/20...don-rise-1350-since-israel-hamas-war-met-says

https://www.cbsnews.com/amp/news/an...g-hamas-attack-israel-anti-defamation-league/

The recent situation notwithstanding, both of the above have been ongoing for some time.

 

[Kaos]

Rubbish modification. The fight against islamophobia is if not successful, then at least talked about.

Antisemitism has been kept under the rug for decades and surprise surprise, it has grown and metastasized.

Based on what exactly? How would you deem it successful if year on year, hate crimes aimed at Muslims has increased, and you have incidents within both major political parties being treated as trivial and swept under the rug?

I'm not trying to deflect from the concerning rise of anti-semitism, nor am I comparing. But to simply dismiss it as being 'successful' is premature at best.

 

[SilentWitness]

Rubbish modification. The fight against islamophobia is if not successful, then at least talked about.

Antisemitism has been kept under the rug for decades and surprise surprise, it has grown and metastasized.

2022 Study -

Support for prohibiting all Muslim migration to the UK is 4-6% higher for Muslims than it is for other ethnic and religious groups: 18.1% of people support banning all Muslim migration to the UK (9.5% ‘strongly support’). Overall support for prohibiting Christian Migration is 13.1%, Sikh migration is 11.8% and Jewish migration is 12%.

Muslims are the UK’s second ‘least liked’ group, after Gypsy and Irish Travellers: 25.9% of the British public feel negative towards Muslims (with 9.9% feeling ‘very negative’). This compares with 8.5% for Jewish people, 6.4% for black people, and 8.4% for white people. Only Gypsy and Irish Travellers are viewed more negatively by the British public, with 44.6% of people viewing this group negatively.

Now, obviously anti-semitism will have spiked hugely due to this situation but let's not pretend everything is fine and dandy on the islamophobia front.

 

[Traub]

I've been subject to anti-semitism myself over the years, and I definitely feel more uneasy recently. Going to synagogue lately has become harder and harder, since times have to be moved around based on planned 'peaceful' marches in Jewish areas and because of the need for heightened security.

 

[jackal&hyde]

Based on what exactly? How would you deem it successful if year on year, hate crimes aimed at Muslims has increased, and you have incidents within both major political parties being treated as trivial and swept under the rug?

I'm not trying to deflect from the concerning rise of anti-semitism, nor am I comparing. But to simply dismiss it as being 'successful' is premature at best.

I literally said that if not successful then at least talked about. It is clearly not successful, but is at least brought in to the public. How much has antisemitism seen in the last 20 years as talking points? Especially from a continent, Europe, that did what it did.

There is no question under the sun that can argue that antisemitism has been ignored for decades and there is also now rational and decent argument that can say that the west has not at least made some steps to fight islamophobia.

EDIT: that west has done vastly more talk, if not effort, to fight islamophobia, then it did antisemitism.

 

[Drizzle]

"from the river to that sea" is a call from some. Not to go all geography here but the river is the river Jordan and the sea is the Mediterranean sea. From the river to the sea, is a call for the destruction of Israel. I would love if the "pro" this or that, would talk about what they really want.

Maybe some protestors are envisaging a secular democratic state where Jews, Muslims and all rub shoulders in a peaceful prosperous paradise.

I think others are basically advocating retaking Israel in its entirety, resettling it with Palestinians through right of return, and whatever happens to the 8m or so Jews there, happens.

Either way, a Palestine from the river to the sea is basically impossible without wholesale slaughter. Not sure why adopting this slogan is helpful to any moral cause frankly.

Edit, as this is more to do with the Israel/Palestine thread. I'm just trying to explain why this slogan can be seen as a call to eliminate Israel (which it is) and therefore its Jews either directly or indirectly. It may not be meant that way by many (but it is by some) but it's how it looks to jews, hence the touchiness about it.

 

[jackal&hyde]

2022 Study -


Now, obviously anti-semitism will have spiked hugely due to this situation but let's not pretend everything is fine and dandy on the islamophobia front.

Did I say that it is?

 

[Kaos]

I literally said that if not successful then at least talked about. It is clearly not successful, but is at least brought in to the public. How much has antisemitism seen in the last 20 years as talking points? Especially from a continent, Europe, that did what it did.

There is no question under the sun that can argue that antisemitism has been ignored for decades and there is also now rational and decent argument that can say that the west has not at least made some steps to fight islamophobia.

And I'm challenging that perception. It being talked about and being taken seriously aren't the same thing. Like i've mentioned you have both major parties in the UK not taking incidents within their own ranks seriously as well as the media downplaying it. Anyone accused of anti-semitism within their party is rightfully and quickly suspended, the same hasn't been true for Islamophobic incidents.

There has been a rise in anti-semitism in Europe which is alarming, and the UK government has rightly promised an additional £3million to protect the Jewish community. But nothing of the sort has been offered to the Muslim community, so to say that the latter's concerns are being taken seriously are a fallacy.

Instead of downplaying one and pretending it doesn't bear the same concern because its being tenuously acknowledged, how about we focus on both and insist on protecting both groups, both of which have have to endure alarming increases in hate crimes towards their respective communities.

 

[SilentWitness]

Did I say that it is?

It was a weird turn of phrase to say 'if not successful' which appeared to imply that they've done a pretty good job.

At least talked about...in UK politics anti-semitism has been a fairly hot topic for about 3-5 years now. I wouldn't say it's been talked about in the right way though, but then again, neither has Islamophobia. Both situations need to be vastly improved in the west in how they are dealt with and how both groups are protected.

Good post by @Kaos above that I agree with.

 

[Tarrou]

I literally said that if not successful then at least talked about. It is clearly not successful, but is at least brought in to the public. How much has antisemitism seen in the last 20 years as talking points? Especially from a continent, Europe, that did what it did.

There is no question under the sun that can argue that antisemitism has been ignored for decades and there is also now rational and decent argument that can say that the west has not at least made some steps to fight islamophobia.

EDIT: that west has done vastly more talk, if not effort, to fight islamophobia, then it did antisemitism.

this makes sense really as there are 16 million Jews in the world and 1.8 billion muslims.. so they are obviously not going to get the same amount of attention

 

[Kaos]

EDIT: that west has done vastly more talk, if not effort, to fight islamophobia, then it did antisemitism.

Can you back this up? What steps have the West taken in protecting Muslims from Islamophobia?