I agree that the conspiracy theory things with Arsenal fans can be pathetic. I’m just look at individual incidents and in this game we were ahead we were playing excellent football and creating chances for fun. The sending off ruined that and ended our run you can of course appreciate how much that pisses us off.
Arsenal 2020/21 - General Discussion
- Thread starter Bubz27
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It's totally irrelevant if it was intentional or not. If there's contact and that interferes, then it's a penalty. It's up to Luiz to avoid contact if he's going to run right behind an attacker in the box. And if it's a penalty, then it's also a red card, if I understand the rules correctly, because Luiz is not attempting to get to the ball.
What I don't get is the overturning of Bednarek's red card for a similar situation. Unless they concluded there that there wasn't contact, and hence should not have been a penalty. Perhaps it's got to do with the fact Bednarek evidently seemed to actually actively attempt to avoid contact, but I've not seen an explanation.
In any case, none of this amounts to cheating.
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Absolutely. That was a magnificent first half, for the most part. I'd be gutted too. Although I think I'd also reflect that it's not the first time David Luiz turns himself into a liability. You seriously need to lose that guy.
They are 13 points better than us. That's pretty simple, until that changes those are the facts.
The "cup final" thing is just stupid though. It's usually a coping mechanism for losing or dropping points.
Mancs have been justifying dropping points like this for decades.
That's why you have to blame the rule. Accidental touch is not mentioned in the triple punishment rule.
Accidental touch is vague, players can start practicing not looking at the ball hoping for an interference, that'll be easy for them to save their feck ups.
David Luiz has every right to chase back, but while doing that, please make a challenge for a yellow.
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And just for that, the decision was right to send him off.
Reckless play.
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No red card today. Progress.
What's the difference between the Luiz and Bednarek reds?
Why was one overturned and the other not?
They need their 'Bruno's
Somebody who isn't afraid to lose the ball by trying things
That would help saka, martinelli, smith-rowe
. They need to bin willian and think hard about what to do with pepe. Aubameyang Is a big issue for them too if he's not scoring (but that might start with their Bruno)
Somebody who isn't afraid to lose the ball by trying things
That would help saka, martinelli, smith-rowe
. They need to bin willian and think hard about what to do with pepe. Aubameyang Is a big issue for them too if he's not scoring (but that might start with their Bruno)
One changed the game? That's the only thing I can think
By giving saints their player back its less fuss. If they over turn luiz they are admitting the ref screwed up and changed the result / game
Only thing I can think
One genuinely took the player out recklessly
Another one genuinely trying to get away from the attacker.
Guess which one deserves triple punishment?
Anyway.
You can't blame the FA for 10 league losses.
You can't blame the FA for 10 league losses.
So are Arsenal crap again, MOTD were saying they are a real quality side the other week?
A midtable team lost to another midtable team. Move on nothing to see here.
I can't believe we have dropped points to Arsenal this season, they are horrific. Such a bad side, this is the worst Arsenal team in my lifetime. There is so much dead wood in that team, it's like a haunted forest.
Of course you can't. It's not been good enough- I don't think that's up for debate.
The difference between the two reds is though, in my opinion. Luiz wasn't any more reckless than Bednarek in my opinion and treating the two differently is always going to leave a sour taste.
So I see that Arsenal fans are still going on about that red card..
They’re making a good go of it.
...Bednarek lifted his hands, Martial dived. - FA admit they were harsh.
Thinning hairline David Luiz run straight like Lego character, "accidentally" tripped Wolves player. Funny though. - FA thinks David Luiz is stupidly careless, triple punishment it is.
Other than referees being incompetent and not giving Arsenal penalty, what do the resident Arsenal fans think is the main problem with this side?
- Are the players just not good enough?
- Is the manager not good enough?
- Is it Willian, who brings just about nothing of note to the team?
- Is the defense not good? Or is it the attackers who are out of form?
- Is it the formation?
- Something else?
They're mid table dross.
The team is set up pretty much to feed lacazette and Aubameyang.
And at the minute, neither could hit a barn door with a banjo.
Worse, Aubameyang looks like hes actively hiding from the ball when on the pitch, and lacazette hasn't given a toss for at least a year.
The manager hasn't got the stones to drop them and have martinelli start, who is the only attacker they have who looks up for it.
We always have that mid and lower table team for 2-3 year periods that we just can't beat. That bogey team is Arsenal for us now.
I like point three, with Willian being so terrible that he warrants mentioning all on his own
He's unbearable. The infuriating is we don't know why he's been signed. Then we don't know why Arteta picks him when he's obviously horrible. But then why aren't the players just "ignoring" him ? His ability to stop the movement of the ball and ruin any momentum we have is criminal.I like point three, with Willian being so terrible that he warrants mentioning all on his own
Him coming on today fecked it all up, having to put Saka at LB, Pepe on the right + Auba alone in the middle. We didn't adapt and stayed on that left wasting balls with him.
Keep Cedric on, bring Martinelli, anything but him.
He is terrible. Even at his peak he was a nothing player, and nowadays he's downright awful. I shudder when I think about how many United fans wanted him here. Glad you guys bit that bullet for us
Ultimately the players aren't good enough save a handful. Recruitment for many years has been horrendous.
Willian does deserve a special mention as he's probably the worst of the lot.
An inexperienced manager is always going to struggle with the situation Arteta inherited.
Tierney, Gabriel, Partey, Saka, Smith-Rowe and Aubameyang are clearly good enough even if there have been a few issues with form and fitness.
Everybody else in that squad ranges from 'debatable at best' to 'get rid yesterday'.
So yeah, we have 6 players.
No everyone in here is wrong, they are as good as Utd, just bad luck and poor refereeing is the difference between the two sides. Arsenal will win the title next year...
So Willian is poor and the manager isn’t the best and a lot of the players are bang average - then why are Arsenal fans only interested in calling out the refs as though the refs are solely responsible for everything bad with the club’s position on the table? Even some players tweet out memes about bad refereeing decisions on social media and of course fans lap it up.
Is it just shifting the blame or trying to create the whole us vs the world narrative?
Is it just shifting the blame or trying to create the whole us vs the world narrative?
We're not shifting the blame, you're basing this on Twitter idiots. The state of the squad/club means we should be between 5th - 7th place.
I think the refereeing issue isn't new, it's just blowing up because we now get VAR and we went from opinions on a 10s incident to tens of thousands watching in slow-mo for 3 minutes. And the ref still gets it wrong. Wether you support Arsenal or West Ham don't matter, the difference is it's getting harder to accept these events when the proof is there to see.
It's a shame there isn't some sort of solidarity between fans, clubs and managers on this issue. It would be better for everyone. Referees or not we're capable of providing unlimited amount of memeing content.
I think that if a defender does what Martinez did against Lacazette and the ref blows for a pen, nobody bats an eyelid and call the defender stupid.
There is another possibility....you could be talking bollocks.
True - I’m looking at Reddit and specifically the gunners sub. So many posts about VAR and the general ref quality.
You do make an interesting point about solidarity. I guess most teams and fans will just chalk that down to bad luck and get on with it.
Oh hey Grinner, you could be right too.
BTW- what’s the story with your tag line?
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I don't think we are that bad. Our position in the table is the result of a couple of months of really poor form before Xmas, where creativity was a massive issue.
Since the introduction of a creative mid that's not off form (Smith-Rowe mainly), the team has generally looked a lot more fluid & threatening in attack.
We have bad moments still, like the Luiz sending off, or the Villa goal where individually we just switch off a bit, so that's something that needs stamped out again, but we are in a lot better place just now than we were back in the beginning of December (although the league table doesn't really reflect that).
What we do lack is quality in depth when some of our better players are out. Given the clearance of the last couple of windows, that's something we need to address in the summer.
We are not very good but better than out league position.
There are many things wrong with the squad and club. But there are also some very basic (and hopefully correctable) issues that have held us back this season.
We played the first 40% of the season without anybody who could play the 10 role and our results during that stretch are largely why Arsenal's league position is so bad. We have 20 points in 10 matches since Christmas and that is second best in the league after City during that period. Arteta made a major mistake in squad building but we're not going to be playing without anybody in this role again going forward, as we now have Smith-Rowe and Odegaard rotating there.
We also have had five players sent off this season (correct decisions, other than the Luiz decision against Wolves), which is just an absurd number. Almost every other club that fancies itself a top four contender has had 0-1. Red cards are absolute killers in terms of expected points in matches, especially when you get them against teams you should be beating. Keep everything about the squad and season exactly the same except remove the cards against Wolves, Burnley, and Southhampton (all games we looked on top before the cards, from which we got a combined 1 point in the end) and we probably have 40-41 points and are right in the thick of the battle for top four. In the end, its the players' fault that they were sent off and that is part of performance. But it should be a very improvable part of performance.
We haven't been putting away our chances. Lowest goals scored in the top 10. Our GA stat isn't terrible compared to the other teams but PEA and Lacazette have been misfiring all season.
Also...Willian. Arteta, please stop. It's not working.
Also...Willian. Arteta, please stop. It's not working.
Think a lot of the first part of your post was due to the fact we didn't have a reliable / in form number 10 as well connecting the midfield & attack.
Since ESR started against Chelsea (& Saka played wide right), I think we are 2nd in the form table. Think we scored 12 goals in 14 games pre Chelsea game, & have scored 19 goals in 10 games since the change.
Now, I'm not saying we still don't have issues, or that we're a proper team again by any means, but the stats & performances don't lie. There's obviously plenty room for improvement, but at least it seems to be going in the right way again.
As for your last line, fully agree. What's even worse is he's now getting game time at the expense of minutes we could be giving Martinelli to get him back up to speed.
Willian actually has a negative impact on the team whenever he plays. Plus I'm sure the other subs are thinking WTF too.
Probably the worst thing about boxing day is it led to Arteta clicking on about Willian.
Yeah, as Grinner says above, just not totally, he's still getting minutes ahead of Martinelli from the beach the last couple of games which is still a bit mind boggling, but at least his starts are rare now.