Arsenal's title credentials...

[alastair]

One thing I am a little worried about at Arsenal is the contract situation of a few key figures.

Firstly, Sagna. Best right back in the league this year and needs signing up. Rosicky needs a new deal too.

More importantly though, Arsene. If he's going to renew, then he needs to do it at some point. I'm wondering when he thinks the right time is going to be. There's going to come a point when potential new players start to wonder whether he's going to be there.

 

[Archie Leach]

Suarez wasn't worth Ronaldo money in the summer.

 

[Grinner]

Well played sir. I was called an idiot when I valued Suarez at Ronaldo money in the summer. Everyone laughed too I believe.

Wenger has an allergy to silver. That's fair enough. He has all the talent but has lost the balls to take risks. My opinion. You may follow it up with a laughing smilie.

You've been called an idiot every year you've been here.

 

[cesc's_mullet]

Well played sir. I was called an idiot when I valued Suarez at Ronaldo money in the summer. Everyone laughed too I believe.

Wenger has an allergy to silver. That's fair enough. He has all the talent but has lost the balls to take risks. My opinion. You may follow it up with a laughing smilie.

You'll stop being called an idiot when you prove the Caf wrong.

 

[Barney]

I've heard that Costa is a horrible cheating, diving little scrote. Is this true?

Yeah, he's a cnut. He's a boss one though.

Interesting to see Arse fans views on signing him, when some were so against Luis signing in the summer.

 

[Archie Leach]

Well there's being an annoying shithead on the field and there's being a racist, biting cnut.

 

[Barney]

Well there's being an annoying shithead on the field and there's being a racist, biting cnut.

The racism incident is on another level, but that aside, Costa is much worse than Suarez on the pitch. I hope we sign him.

 

[Archie Leach]

A few news sources are saying we've launched a bid for Jackson Martinez.

None particularly reputable.

 

[Barney]

He'd be good, but I imagine he'd cost an arm and a leg. Haven't seen much of him, but from what I've read he seems like the type of striker you lot need.

 

[Archie Leach]

He's quite a late developer and hasn't done it at the top level so there's a risk but he'd be an interesting purchase. Porto are good at getting big fees though so that could be an issue.

 

[elmo]

Jazz G, you're suggesting both clubs owners are friends/colleagues yet you went in with an insulting bid but not a proper one. Strange. Suarez was Bale - £20m value while banned. Now he's Bale + £10m. A decent director / manager would have known that in the summer. The excuses so far are very unconvincing.

Wenger's problem with strikers is incredibly similar to Ferguson's with midfielders minus the silverware to back it up.

Grinner, when we were linked with Costa there were videos of him gobbing on players.

You think Arsenal would slap on an extra 10m if they really thought that they could get him at any price above 40m just because both owners know each other? They didn't become millionaires by throwing away money carelessly.

 

[cesc's_mullet]

The racism incident is on another level, but that aside, Costa is much worse than Suarez on the pitch. I hope we sign him.

Throwing spit at someone, even that khunt Ramos who deserves a good kicking, is just pathetic. That was one of the lowest acts I've seen on the pitch.

 

[coolredwine]

Throwing spit at someone, even that khunt Ramos who deserves a good kicking, is just pathetic. That was one of the lowest acts I've seen on the pitch.

He has fought with Pepe and Ramos. I dunno whether that's good or bad.

 

[JaffyJoe]

Even Arsenal don't win the title (and I don't think you will) you have made a lot of progress. You are a quality striker away from being a very good team. Let's see what Wenger does in the summer, Ozil may not have set the league on fire but his signing had a great affect on the others.

 

[cesc's_mullet]

Ozil has been great so far. Unfortunately a striker like Giroud will not get the best out of him, and the only player that will (in our squad) has gone down for the season.

 

[JaffyJoe]

He's been meh for me. He can split teams open with his passing at anytime but he hasn't shown up in a big game yet. He also has this tendency to let games pass him by. For 40 million plus......

 

[Donaldo]

He's been meh for me. He can split teams open with his passing at anytime but he hasn't shown up in a big game yet. He also has this tendency to let games pass him by. For 40 million plus......

You discount just how much of an impact he has on the team. This is without getting into his playing ability in his nascent months in English football. To see his impact you need to watch us a bit more. He'll come good against the big boys soon enough.

 

[JaffyJoe]

You discount just how much of an impact he has on the team. This is without getting into his playing ability in his nascent months in English football. To see his impact you need to watch us a bit more. He'll come good against the big boys soon enough.

In my initial post I did say his signing lifted the others, the team had more self belief and confidence. Now your grinding out the wins like title winning teams do, I just feel you need him to be stamping his ability on games more. He is a quality player, if any manager can get it out of him it's Wenger.

 

[cesc's_mullet]

He's been meh for me. He can split teams open with his passing at anytime but he hasn't shown up in a big game yet. He also has this tendency to let games pass him by. For 40 million plus......

Fair enough. And I hope you take no offense when I disagree with your opinion - being a Gooner I have watched our games and I have noticed how the team changed with him in it. He certainly has more to give, but there is no changing the fact he has been great so far. He would be in our top 3 players this season, for the team currently sitting atop the PL and got through the hardest group in the CL.

 

[Donaldo]

Apologies, neglected to see the line in the earlier post.

You're right, I think he'll kick on as the season winds down, and that will be crucial for us. We just need someone clinical to put away the chances he will inevitably create.

 

[Donaldo]

Fair enough. And I hope you take no offense when I disagree with your opinion - being a Gooner I have watched our games and I have noticed how the team changed with him in it. He certainly has more to give, but there is no changing the fact he has been great so far. He would be in our top 3 players this season, for the team currently sitting atop the PL and got through the hardest group in the CL.

Rambo
Mert
Kos
Sagna
Mesut
Tom

In that order

 

[cesc's_mullet]

I wouldn't argue with that either, and Gibbs has been quality too it has to be said.

 

[Donaldo]

And Chesney.

That Feb end, March period is giving me nightmares btw...if we can get through that and still be 3-4 points off the top, I'd start getting excited.

 

[Dumbstar]

You'll stop being called an idiot when you prove the Caf wrong.

I had put thought and effort into my posts, and was not abusive or underhanded. My opinions on Wenger and your board have been clearly laid out which may have jolted your own comfort position.

But once again a debate ends due to a misguided superiority complex.

 

[JazzG]

He's been meh for me. He can split teams open with his passing at anytime but he hasn't shown up in a big game yet. He also has this tendency to let games pass him by. For 40 million plus......

Ozil's final ball is only a small part of what his game is about, keeping play ticking and even recently without him it is quite clear what he brings. Keeping the ball moving high up the pitch, always on the move to receive a pass and our play has looked a hell of a lot better with him than without. Fans I feel only look at end product but going by that the likes of Scholes didn't set the world on fire. He's given us a lift off the pitch but his performances also bring the best out of other players. I think that is his biggest strength, he makes players around him look better. He isn't going to be the one with his name up in lights but makes the team function far better. Also take into account he is still settling into the league & I think Wenger will improve him further as a player. Part of his problem is he thinks too much for the team, he needs to be more selfish and confident in his own ability to finish a move off.

Jazz G, you're suggesting both clubs owners are friends/colleagues yet you went in with an insulting bid but not a proper one. Strange. Suarez was Bale - £20m value while banned. Now he's Bale + £10m. A decent director / manager would have known that in the summer. The excuses so far are very unconvincing.

Wenger's problem with strikers is incredibly similar to Ferguson's with midfielders minus the silverware to back it up.

Insulting bid? It was what we were advised (incorrectly) his buy out clause was. Something that even after Liverpool refused to sell his agent was adamant existed hence why they went to their lawyers and the PFA. Either your lot have pulled a sly one and left it open ended or his agent and representatives were being very naive in thinking they had a gentleman's agreement if an offer came in. Bale went for £85mill but you can't use one player as an indication of another's value. Going by that then we could sit here and say going by Carroll's £35mill tag Bale should of gone for £150mill. While as a player I prefer Suarez but Bale is a lot more marketable, no drama or controversy surrounds him hence why I believe R.Madrid paid over the odds for him. Falcao & Cavani went for less than him! I think we should of gone up to £50mill but who knows maybe we did but were told categorically no by Liverpool. Suarez has huge talent but he had only come off one great season in the league & been involved in racism case & biting case in his two years at Liverpool for which he had a combined 18 match ban, in hindsight it is easy to sit here now and say we should of gone higher. In hindsight we should of bought him from Ajax.....

Wenger's problem with strikers? Up until recently we've had players like Henry, Bergkamp, Anelka & RvP playing for us, one hell of a problem to have....

 

[Dumbstar]

Fair points Jazz. I meant 'insulting' in the sense it offended Kroenke's friend/collegue John Henry (what are they smoking comments, etc). Kroenke was willing to offend Henry with that bid but not curry his favour with a higher one straight off instead. Suarez was also on course for player of the season and Bale won it possibly because of Suarez's bans. A world of difference from the Carroll comparison.

For your final point, Bergkamp was never signed by Wenger. Henry and Anelka were 15+ years ago. RvP is the only one relevant and he left Wenger because of a lack of risk taking to win silverware.

 

[JaffyJoe]

Cesc I respect your opinion, I would expect him to make a difference when he plays. He is worth 40 million plus. I'm talking abut when I have sat down to watch, it is telling that I can come away with this opinion. Against us, City and Liverpool he was a passenger for the majority of the matches. He still has that ability to play a defence splitting pass out of nowhere, he has great movement but he isn't a good finisher. I rate Ozil these are just thongs I have noticed abut him. He looks like he can't be asked at times. For me Ramsey has been better, so has your back two. You don't pay 42 million for a player to see you through against West Ham, that is a given. He has only been here 6 months and I expect he will be a great signing, these are just things I have picked up on.

Jazz Scholes played a few roles in his career to a hgh level, early on he was a goal scoring midfielder. He was scoring in double figures every year and later on when he dropped deeper he became the player who ran the game for us. Scholes set the tempo for the whole attack, a deep lying playmaker in every sense. His whole career it has been very clear what Scholes has been been about. I agree he has made others better, the same way Van Persie did for us, quality players have that affect. He moves around well and gets into good positions, I agree he need to learn how to capitalise on them. If he improves his finishing and stamina he will go up a level.

 

[Il Prete Rosso]

And Chesney.

That Feb end, March period is giving me nightmares btw...if we can get through that and still be 3-4 points off the top, I'd start getting excited.

Now is the time to put some distance (if you can) between yourselves and the chasing pack. The games aren't that difficult till then so I hope you come away with a much points as possible. A striker is definitely needed, there's no two ways about that but I can't see Wenger (after signing Ozil) paying for mediocre players anymore. He wants top quality in and it's just not quite available in the transfer window.

 

[kouroux]

Really hoping Arsenal wins it instead of City or Chelsea. It obviously won't be a cause of celebration but I know that one of my best friends will be extremely happy.

 

[Cal?]

Really hoping Arsenal wins it instead of City or Chelsea. It obviously won't be a cause of celebration but I know that one of my best friends will be extremely happy.

The thought of storey and Piers Morgan makes me want Chelsea to win.

 

[alastair]

Now is the time to put some distance (if you can) between yourselves and the chasing pack. The games aren't that difficult till then so I hope you come away with a much points as possible. A striker is definitely needed, there's no two ways about that but I can't see Wenger (after signing Ozil) paying for mediocre players anymore. He wants top quality in and it's just not quite available in the transfer window.

Absolutely crucial. It's difficult to see us winning it if we're only one point clear at the end of February.

 

[Ish]

Absolutely crucial. It's difficult to see us winning it if we're only one point clear at the end of February.

When's that horrible month for your lot? March?

The scary part is that City's (and to an extent Chelsea) picking up some real momentum

 

[alastair]

When's that horrible month for your lot? March?

The scary part is that City's (and to an extent Chelsea) picking up some real momentum

It's sort of end of February to mid March.

It's brutal and there's no way any team in the world would come through it unscathed.

 

[Ish]

It's sort of end of February to mid March.

It's brutal and there's no way any team in the world would come through it unscathed.

Well, on the bright side, and it's a shitty side, if you do come through it there or thereabouts, you're in with a real chance.

It's a crap fixture list, but you guys might just surprise a few.

 

[JazzG]

Fair points Jazz. I meant 'insulting' in the sense it offended Kroenke's friend/collegue John Henry (what are they smoking comments, etc). Kroenke was willing to offend Henry with that bid but not curry his favour with a higher one straight off instead. Suarez was also on course for player of the season and Bale won it possibly because of Suarez's bans. A world of difference from the Carroll comparison.

For your final point, Bergkamp was never signed by Wenger. Henry and Anelka were 15+ years ago. RvP is the only one relevant and he left Wenger because of a lack of risk taking to win silverware.

He wasn't willing to offend anyone we were just trying to activate the clause, your MD has said as well afterwards that there were no hard feelings and just business really. Suarez comes with a lot of baggage, possibly explains why apart from Arsenal no other club bid for him in the summer.

As for not investing in a striker, unlike Liverpool we have been well managed since Wenger took over. Your lot overspent so couldn't afford to build a new stadium or expand, sold out to those Americans who promised a new stadium who then messed you up even further before the current lot came in. Last I heard the current American lot are only expanding Anfield because cost of new stadium is too high. Now compare this to us during the period you are referring to, we've built a new stadium, redeveloped the old stadium and met most of our planning obligations that the council put on us. Had to take a hit on the property side due to the recession but still got through it. During this time you never heard Wenger complain, he didn't overstretch the club and stayed well within his means and kept us in the CL. You can talk about Wenger not taking risks but unlike most managers he looked at the overall picture & future rather than right here and now. A lot of our fans are idiots who don't appreciate he has had a lot of constraints but still got on with the job, always thinking about trophies and short term success. The extra stadium revenue & new commercial deals will mean we can go out and bid mega money for players. Like we did for Suarez and like we showed with signing Ozil. In terms of money generated by the club not many in a better position than us, much of that is thanks to Wenger and not going out and chasing success when we had to strengthen our foundations.

Jazz Scholes played a few roles in his career to a hgh level, early on he was a goal scoring midfielder. He was scoring in double figures every year and later on when he dropped deeper he became the player who ran the game for us. Scholes set the tempo for the whole attack, a deep lying playmaker in every sense. His whole career it has been very clear what Scholes has been been about. I agree he has made others better, the same way Van Persie did for us, quality players have that affect. He moves around well and gets into good positions, I agree he need to learn how to capitalise on them. If he improves his finishing and stamina he will go up a level.

My point is a lot of (mainly) opposition fans look at Scholes in his latter years and didn't have a clue what he was doing, always comparing him to Lampard/Gerrard when they are completely different players. People can't always see what Ozil is doing, I'm no expert but I do get the impression compared to most continental fans we are probably the most uneducated bunch of fans. Look at our unappreciated the players like Scholes or Rio are here whereas abroad a lot of top players see them as idols.

 

[Donaldo]

He wasn't willing to offend anyone we were just trying to activate the clause, your MD has said as well afterwards that there were no hard feelings and just business really. Suarez comes with a lot of baggage, possibly explains why apart from Arsenal no other club bid for him in the summer.

As for not investing in a striker, unlike Liverpool we have been well managed since Wenger took over. Your lot overspent so couldn't afford to build a new stadium or expand, sold out to those Americans who promised a new stadium who then messed you up even further before the current lot came in. Last I heard the current American lot are only expanding Anfield because cost of new stadium is too high. Now compare this to us during the period you are referring to, we've built a new stadium, redeveloped the old stadium and met most of our planning obligations that the council put on us. Had to take a hit on the property side due to the recession but still got through it. During this time you never heard Wenger complain, he didn't overstretch the club and stayed well within his means and kept us in the CL. You can talk about Wenger not taking risks but unlike most managers he looked at the overall picture & future rather than right here and now. A lot of our fans are idiots who don't appreciate he has had a lot of constraints but still got on with the job, always thinking about trophies and short term success. The extra stadium revenue & new commercial deals will mean we can go out and bid mega money for players. Like we did for Suarez and like we showed with signing Ozil. In terms of money generated by the club not many in a better position than us, much of that is thanks to Wenger and not going out and chasing success when we had to strengthen our foundations.

Whenever I see your earnest, sensible longer posts, I read it with the Rocky theme playing in my head in a crescendo.

Tararara-raaaa, tararara-raaaa

Well said, though. Worth reminding our snidey friend Dumpstar.

 

[JazzG]

Whenever I see your earnest, sensible longer posts, I read it with the Rocky theme playing in my head in a crescendo.

Tararara-raaaa, tararara-raaaa

Well said, though. Worth reminding our snidey friend Dumpstar.

Not quite sure how to respond to this....

The thought of storey and Piers Morgan makes me want Chelsea to win.

Lets be honest Cal, Chelsea having your favourite manager Mourinho is the reason you want them to win.

 

[Dumbstar]

I am well jealous of your new stadium JazzG. And now that you've nearly paid it all off, will be even more jealous as you will have pots and pots of money to spend within club budget. Wenger's done a sterling job of keeping Arsenal near the top, but not right up at the top (probably an impossible task for anyone bar Ferguson).

My 'concern' with Wenger is has he become too entrenched in that behaviour over the last ten years? Habits are a bitch to shake off sometimes. The signing of Ozil was a bit out of the blue admittedly but was it a one off (or 'panic buy' as I probably incorrectly called it earlier)?

 

[Dumbstar]

Not quite sure how to respond to this....

I thought that much was obvious by now. You call me an idiot and feel good about yourself.

FWIW, I appreciate someone replying without snidiness or a feeling of internet-superiority.

 

[crappycraperson]

Good point about Scholes and how under-appreciated he has always been in England. His treatment in the English NT was pathetic.
Someone like Wenger though always saw the talent since the beginning. I remember seeing an interview with Vieira back in 2002 and he said Arsenal players rate Scholes the most in United team. Another one with Cesc later on, where he said Wenger gave him the example of Scholes regarding midfielders he can learn from. Imagine if Scholes had ended up in any other academy run by a dinosaur of English coach.