I never cease to be amazed that 'social justice warrior' is now somehow an insult. Like fighting for social justice is a bad thing.
'Are we the baddies?'
As Rugby refuses to take the knee, is it time the Premier League stopped too?
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik @Rood and Imran @Annihilate Now! start with the good news by celebrating Manchester United Women's emphatic FA Cup win over Spurs at Wembley and the future of manager Marc Skinner.
Then it's the bad news and the ever worsening form of our Men with losses to Arsenal and Palace.
Finally the main debate - ETH Out now or keep him until the end of the season - if not longer. Are you Team Nik or Team Imran?
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'Are we the baddies?'
Yes, both of those would be racist. The second example is almost worse, as you don't even believe what you are saying but know the harm it could cause.
Think it’s time to move on tbh. Taking the knee has done all its can but where does it stop? Do they have to do it every single game and week till the human race ends. Don’t have a problem with BLM thing in general or the reason behind. My friend keeps bitching about it and it drives me nuts. It is good for solidarity between the players and the sport.
How so?
Maybe I am out of touch but I would argue things are much better than they were in the 80s, equality laws have benefited all, how are things still so bad?
I don't think it's for you to decide if racism is still enough of an issue for black players and their team-mates to decide if they want to protest against it.
Man, is this a serious post?
I think this thing has run its course already. The idea was to bring attention to the cause and I think it has been reasonably done.
But next season would be a good time to stop this. Yes, we must actively fight against racism and systemic oppression based on race, but this is symbolism and it can have an impact only to an extent.
It is not a question of "Can't you take a knee fore few seconds, when actual people are suffering from the abuse by those in power". Yes, anyone can. But mere symbolism will not change anything. There are no policemen out there changing their racist ways, just because their favorite sport stars are taking the knee.
But next season would be a good time to stop this. Yes, we must actively fight against racism and systemic oppression based on race, but this is symbolism and it can have an impact only to an extent.
It is not a question of "Can't you take a knee fore few seconds, when actual people are suffering from the abuse by those in power". Yes, anyone can. But mere symbolism will not change anything. There are no policemen out there changing their racist ways, just because their favorite sport stars are taking the knee.
"A millionaire footballer won't help end child poverty in the UK"
Yes. If you think it's a thing of the past then you've been living under a phenomenally large rock.
You're totally out of touch and showing a startling amount of ignorance to modern society.
That’s more a remberance of those who served and died defending our rights and freedoms, they don’t campaign to end wars. So not very similar at all.
Agree.
I've been saying this for years but there's a ton tories who are happy to watch a bunch of doctors mud wrestle for 80 minutes. Rugby is here to stay, unfortunately.
Nice post, appreciate the insight on how it's opened up the discussion.
Carcrash of a topic
The PL stopped using the BLM logo a while ago. It's an anti racism movment at the moment, so not sure how you are still afiliating it to a political movement.
I think the impact is decreasing and it largely exists as a token gesture now, same as the NHS clap. The FA showing solidarity is all well and good to score points for PR but what are they actually doing about it?
Although the fact you are still associating this with just a 'problem in the United States' and using terms like 'wokeness' and 'why not make all lives better' show that you are a bit out of touch and part of the problem.
I think the impact is decreasing and it largely exists as a token gesture now, same as the NHS clap. The FA showing solidarity is all well and good to score points for PR but what are they actually doing about it?
Although the fact you are still associating this with just a 'problem in the United States' and using terms like 'wokeness' and 'why not make all lives better' show that you are a bit out of touch and part of the problem.
Just because something was worse in the past doesn't mean it's no longer a problem.
Modern medicine is immeasurably superior to what we knew even forty years ago but that doesn't mean it's time to stop medical research.
They're not technically kneeling for BLM anymore.
And yes, you're right BLM the organisation does have specific political goals, which would have been cause for re-consideration but the players are now kneeling for the PL's own initiative No Room for Racism, which is politically neutral so I don't see any potential conflict in the action.
And yes, you're right BLM the organisation does have specific political goals, which would have been cause for re-consideration but the players are now kneeling for the PL's own initiative No Room for Racism, which is politically neutral so I don't see any potential conflict in the action.
Same with woke. So being alert and open to what is actually going on is bad now?
They've stopped using BLM and are using the banner of Kick It Out from what I can see, so don't get what the OP is on about. The racial abuse people are getting demonstrates that the message needs to be delivered
Do you not see any issue with our players being racially abused on social media? Let alone going into structural inequalities in society (ask yourself for example why there is a much higher covid death rate among ethnic communities).
Or because it's not you personally it's fine?
Don't get your point.
Are you saying people should be allowed to abuse with racial words as long as they don't really mean it?
Greater efforts by social media companies would help.
Either immediate punishments for racist posts or some form of genuine identity verification would help despite it being an unrealistic goal.
So many cretinous parasites spouting hate online behind the veil of an anonymous account safe in the knowledge nothing will come of it.
This wouldn’t cure the root cause either but would help to limit its’ exposure in the public domain.
If you truly believe that then that just further invalidates your opinion on this matter.
And by the way, it is racist if, to annoy or "unsettle" someone, you choose to make derogatory marks about their race.
I genuinely can't believe what I'm reading here.
Racism is a thing of the past and if someone chooses to insult someone's race, they're just doing it to unsettle them.
But that's the point,
Players clearly are not being afforded the right to refuse if they want to.
The Premier League are pushing this, all the on screen graphics on Sky are pushing this.
If anything the whole thing has been commercialized.
Id rather the players chose to do this of their own free will, or not if they so decided.
I think it does more damage than good and puts off a lot of people, especially when you see what the BLM actually stands for in the US and its links to other things.
From 1990 to the present day, the breakdown of deaths of people of black, Asian and minority ethnicity (BAME) in custody or following other police contact and as the result of police shootings in England and Wales are as follows:
Between 1990 and 2015, an average of one person a week died following contact with police or whilst being held in police custody.
One African, Caribbean or South Asian person dies in police custody every two months.
No police officer has been charged with the death of a BAME individual since 1971.
| Total BAME deaths in police custody or otherwise following contact with the police, England & Wales 1990-2020 | |||
| Type | Metropolitan Police | Other Forces | Total |
Custody | 84 | 79 | 164 |
Shooting | 15 | 5 | 20 |
All custody and shooting deaths | 99 | 84 | 184 |
Between 1990 and 2015, an average of one person a week died following contact with police or whilst being held in police custody.
One African, Caribbean or South Asian person dies in police custody every two months.
No police officer has been charged with the death of a BAME individual since 1971.
I actually thought the best thing to do was to either do it for the Charity shield, or first game of the season then stop it.
I fully support the whole BLM stuff, but I just don't see the point of continuing it
I fully support the whole BLM stuff, but I just don't see the point of continuing it
If taking the knee is, at the very least, a symbolic gesture stating that there is no room for racism in football, what is the harm is keeping it as a gesture of support?
Letting kids see their favorite players taking a knee or taking an anti-racist stand surely won't do any harm.
Letting kids see their favorite players taking a knee or taking an anti-racist stand surely won't do any harm.
Imagine being triggered by someone else's small act of symbolism and solidarity.
If they don't really mean it AND they have a specific goal in mind that they could achieve with racist abuse. Then it's somehow not racist.
This thread has got to be one of the most ignorant ones i've read on this website. Its shocking, but again not too surprising that folks think like this. The fact that (subtle) racism is given a voice on here is rather disheartening in itself, but it is the world we live in now.
You're so horribly misinformed I don't even know where to begin.
Rashford is actually doing something that helps though,
Has bending the knee actually helped anyone?
I'm not aware of any player being arrested for refusing to take the knee.
There's his thoughts on players being racially abused online. It isn't actually racism.
Problem solved. Someone tell Tuanzebe that so he can move on please.
Yep, me. I've even said how in this thread.
This is honestly insane to me. Crazy rationale.
Can't say for the Wales v Ireland game as I didn't see it but in the game at Twickenham I think there was a possibility of it being a wee bit from ignorance, but also there just seemed to be a haphazard approach to taking the knee. It seemed like a few of the England players did it, then when a few of the Scottish players saw the England players kneeling they did it also. It didn't look great and was all over the place, but I think it was possibly being from a sense of un-preparedness (if that's a word, and naive I know considering football and other sports have long incorporated the knee into their pre-match routines) and an un-sureness rather than a straight out unwillingness to take the knee.
But I digress, maybe I am being too kind and some of the players did point blank refuse to do so. Will see what happens this weekend in the fixtures.
But I digress, maybe I am being too kind and some of the players did point blank refuse to do so. Will see what happens this weekend in the fixtures.
Wait. People have an issue if players.kneel for 3 seconds before the match? So that kids who watch can ask their parents why and get a reasonable answer? Or can be discussed by youngsters who play regularly?
When the most common answer to stopping institutional racism is education and discussion early in someones life, what did people think it looked like?
When the most common answer to stopping institutional racism is education and discussion early in someones life, what did people think it looked like?
I'm a firm believer in education to hopefully one day, eradicate racism.
My point is, bending the Knee won't stop online trolls, we need far more radical things to do this, Twitter, Instagram, etc need to take more direct action.
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